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I'm making another call for typing profiles! We're still in the development process, and haven't gotten very far, so please feel free to shoot your ideas here.
On another note, with Avnomke gone and Gem of the Day having sporadic activity, we now have slots open in the development group! If you want to have a bigger say in the process, just PM myself and Eternal Drifter for a spot on the committee.
this one is basically taking every fairy-type move i felt like a trainer should get, plus aromatherapy, and dividing it based on approximately how I felt the power levels lined up with the dark-type sample.
acidphoenix I like it! This is what I personally am wanting from these type profiles: Lots of options, but they scale in power. Main thing I would change is maybe put in a different ability than Frisk? It's kinda good for a 5 Point Free ability imo.
Either way, we're still looking for possible profiles for the following types!
Normal
Rock
Fighting
Once we have at least a rough draft of these, Eternal Drifter and I can get started tweaking them and then finally releasing them. Once we do, we can move onto the next stage of the process (suffice it to say, we're a wee bit behind schedule). Even if you don't think you're too good at this sort of thing, even a little bit of help will be of immense value to us. So get cracking! :)
Ugh... my absence from ASB really got me distracted. I would have recommended Double-Edge as a Normal move for the 20 Point cost, and Reckless for free at 5 Point costs. However, your suggestion looks good.
Apologies for not giving the attention this deserves.
Thank you all for helping us with the typing profiles. Currently the GMs, Canis, and phoenix are working hard to get these type profiles edited to how we want them to be. We should have the next topic up this week.
Well, due to some conversations I've had on this roleplay, I've decided to open up a new topic I was not going to earlier.
Available Types
Basically, the debate is, which types should be available for trainers to build based on? When this roleplay was first built, it was built with an eye for "What can a trainer feasibly do?" As we've seen in the thread so far, it seems a number of you have said that they can do just about anything. Thus, quite a few of you have requested that all types be made available for trainers to choose from.
Arguments For:
Maxim: On the one hand, this does open up a LOT of options for the trainers, giving them even more flexibility. With such a huge amount of types, we can even get a good estimate on how types that currently do not exist work! One idea I had to prevent the sheer number of types from overflowing new players would be to lock them in "Typing Challenges": Special Adventure Battles that, if completed, allow that user to create trainers of that typing. This would only be for the new types that are currently not being worked on, with the possible exception of Fairy. Overall, this could be an improvement for the system...
Arguments Against:
Maxim: Or it could be a rather terrible solution. I do have a few concerns with this idea. The main one being variety. If we open up Dragon, Ground, and other such amazing typings, would everyone just go for the exact same build? I imagine that a lot of Dragon/Steel type trainers would exist. Second, it does kill most of the realism we have left, as we will have Fire breathing trainers and Druids everywhere.
Frosty: Given how long it took to just get the baseline typings together, doubling the workload my delay the revamp even further.
Canis: Agree with Frosty. Typing Challenges may be a good idea for a later date however.
acidphoenix: Adventure Battles should be started as soon as possible, so we can't wait to churn out so many types. Typing Challenges are a bad idea, as they can restrict what a person has access to early on in a not good way.
I'll put your arguments up here as I see them. Please discuss, as I think this is a fairly important topic. If there is not discussion on this, then we will most likely stick with the original typings.
adding 10 more typing will more than double the work needed. Considering this is taking around 50 days for 8 types, adding all types will add more than 2 months of work into it for...well not that much different result. I suppose being able to use all typings is funky, but it isn't necessary, nor is a major part of this RP. It seems too much work for a little outcome.
If you are to include all typings, include the remaining ones as extras/prizes and do them one by one when people get close to them. But as stuff necessary for the revamp/reopening I don't feel it is the best option.
One thing I forgot to mention: This discussion will only take place until we have our act together on the other typings, which might be more or less than a week.
While the idea of a Fire/Ice type trainer entices me (Frostfire: Blizzard + Heat Wave), it is a lot of work, and right now, not necessary.
I do like the idea of Typing Challenges, though. Special Adventures that if completed allow the user(s) to create trainers of that type would be a lot of fun. I could see something like a hard Kanto adventure leading to the core Fire/Water/Grass types (for example) being a lot of fun. You do a bunch of puzzles ala LoZ and not only is the reward... rewarding (sorry) but the beating of the adventure is as well.
personally, I feel like while trainers should have access to every type, just because arbitrary points of realism well leave both people who are stringent realists, and people who want to be a less realistic type, it would stall the opening even longer.
In my opinion, start AB back up now, and if a vocal group is unhappy, then add them, but keep going.
I dislike the idea of typing challenges, just because for things other than equipment, a "unlock as you progress" system seems inappropriate, and will probably leave new players who want to be the types unhappy with our arbitrary selection of which types are allowed from the beginning and which aren't.
tl;dr we're fine with nine, if people are unhappy, we can add them in later
Hmm...all right. It looks like the consensus is "we can talk about this later, but right now it'd take too much time." Thus I'm going to bring it up at a later date after Adventure Battles have been booted up again.
Final Drafts:
At any rate, we have all of the final drafts for our typing profiles for each of the nine types that we will be opening with! Special thanks go to acidphoenix and Canis Majoris for helping to get these out there. They have been inducted into the ranks of devolopers. Give them a round of applause!
With that out of the way, let me show you the profiles. We have tried to make them as similar in power to each other as possible. I'll leave this open for some time in case any of you have any questions or concerns about these drafts. The current plan is to have this open for a week, but if a few days go by without anything brought up we'll probably move on.
Apologies for double posting. acidphoenix brought up a potential point of issue with the type profiles as they stand. Namely, that 5 points can be kinda cheap for a typing like Steel. Thus he has proposed that we raise the threshold of each tier by 5 points. For reference, that means we'd be moving from a 5/10/15/20 point system to a 10/15/20/25 system.
As the person who did poison... I have to agree with Eternal Drifter about Poison Fang. Flavor-wise, it doesn't make much sense for a human to use that move 'naturally'. Not making it a Sword Move was an oversight.
With respect to the suggestions of point changes, I actually like that list a fair bit. My only concern is that it might be a little confusing for a new player building a trainer if the tiers aren't all the same for each type. Thoughts on Eternal Drifter's list?
For Poison Fang, I think the point there is just to have a second spammable Poison type move, but I can see where you're coming from. Come to think of it though, Poison Sting is plenty strong thanks to that silly ASB "auto-crit" effect it has going for it. I'll likely remove Poison Fang from the list, as I intend for the Sword moves and the like to be a separate list.
All right, I haven't heard any complaints about Eternal Drifter's proposed system. As he is the owner of Adventure Battles, I'll go ahead and implement it. Remember, silence is consent! :)
That means the type profiles we're going with on opening day are:
15 Points:
Sturdy (Free)
Clear Body (Free)
Metal Claw
Magnet Bomb
Iron Defense
Autotomize
20 Points:
Magnet Pull (Free)
Heavy Metal (Free)
Overcoat (Free)
Light Metal (Free)
Bullet Punch
Shift Gear
King's Shield
Flash Cannon
Iron Head
25 Points:
Filter (5 points)
Heatproof(5 points)
Iron Barbs (Free)
Metal Burst
Gear Grind
Heavy Slam
Gyro Ball
Credit to: Gale Wing Srock
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Next up!
Items:
Our next topic is to determine how the items should be organized in the new thread. In the past, a lot of items were pretty much useless and most of the people I saw used one of the sword variants. My current idea is to split each type of item into a different class. Each class of item would fit a different build, such as damage per second or tanking, then the items themselves would offer strategies on how to complete each role. Currently this topic is to discuss the former. Here's my rough draft of the situation.
Maxim said:
Hello, and welcome to the Adventure Shop, for all of your dungeoneering needs! Let me explain some of the items you can find around here, and which aisle you can find them in!"
"Here they are:
1st: Melee Weapons: These are your bread and butter weapons, designed for stat based damage builds. They often come with physical typed moves and some even have minor stat buffs to make yourself a force to be reckoned with. However, you often pay the price in not having enough points left over for amazing abilities. Recommended for beginners!
2nd: Ranged Weapons: For the tactician in all of us, designed for ability based builds. These weapons are often designed around certain combinations of abilities, such as Skill Link, to do damage, even more damage than the Melee Weapons are usually able to hit! However, since you are spending so much on abilities, most builds turn into glass cannons, and are relatively weak stat wise.
3rd: Defensive: I know what you're thinking, if I can't get as good of stats as my Pokemon, why should I bother attacking? Well this is for those who want to tank instead of fight. These are shields or pieces of armor designed give defensive buffs, rare defensive moves (such as Grassy Terrain). Most models come with Taunt, to ensure that the enemy is attacking you instead of your teammates.
4th: Tools: This is where things get really interesting. Special attacking isn't usually a trainer's forte, but if you really want to do it we have the tools to get your started! These are items that grant the user special attacks, allowing for quite a bit of coverage. They come in two types, the Unlimited types have lower end moves, but you never have to worry about running out! Limited types allow for far stronger moves, but the reckless trainer will find them empty when they need it most.
5th: Support: As you might expect, we also have a line of items for those who wish to make their teammates happy. Typically these contain moves that can really help a party in need, but almost no offensive capability.
6th: Utility: For everything not covered above. Usually a random mishmash of items used for exploring, not fighting. Unlike the others, this takes up utility slots instead of Trainer Item Slots.
7th: Items: From potions to ethers, we have everything a budding adventurer could ever want. That said, if you want the higher end stuff, you'll have to find it, you can't get them here.
8th: Item Carrying: Of course, you hardly expect to carry all this stuff in your own two hands do you? These are items designed to let you carry everything in a convenient pack. It doesn't even take up the item slot, so go nuts! We have three models for you to choose from, the Chansey set, which lets you carry plenty of healing, the Runner Set, for the Pokemon catchers, and the Warrior Set, those interested in having a wide arsenal of weapons.
9th: Set Items: These are items that are adventure specific, you aren't going to find these in the store. However, our agents have come up with the descriptions for these if you wish to hunt them down."
I believe this may need a bit of work however. This was primarily built with the idea that trainers wouldn't have access to Special moves in their typing profiles. Since that is no longer the case, this is a touch outdated. Any suggestions you all can give would be appreciated.
Currently, I'm considering the following tree:
1. Melee Weapons-Physical DPS (Coverage, buffs to physical attacks)
2. Ranged Weapons-Special DPS (Coverage, buffs to special attacks)
3. Defensive-Tanking (Defensive moves, buffs to defenses and/or hp)
4. Support-Support (Healing and Support type moves)
5. Tools-Limited use Attacks (Unusual Coverage and Support Coverage)
6. Utility-Roleplay helpers (Roleplay Items)
7. Item Carrying-Backpacks (Three types: Battle (Warriors), Utility (Runners), Berries? (Baskets), and Loot (Bags))
8. Set Items-Adventure Specific Items (Swords of Plot Advancement and the like)
I think that most of the suggested item categories are good. However, I am a little worried about how we are going to go about setting up items for 1 and 2. Swords are no brainers for Melee Weapons, but I am thinking that guns, bows, and such would likely fit under Ranged Weapons. Perhaps 'Contact' weapons, Ranged Weapons, and another category for special attacks?
I like the original idea that Maxim proposed of ranged weapons requiring certain kinds of builds to work effectively.
All right, I'm going to keep Items open for one more day, then we'll take a detour towards discussing Abilities.
Eternal Drifter right now I'm considering just making some items of both Melee and Ranged Weapons of the specific build to work category. If you think we need a third category for those though, we can probably work something out. Possibly make the Ranged Weapons the build based items and then a category of "Magic" items for the Special Attacks?
For everyone else, I really need you guys to start contributing to this discussion. If this happens again where there's barely any posts for a particular topic, I'm probably going to move the discussion to a private PM, and then use this thread solely for announcements. If you want to have a say in how we go about this, I suggest you start posting please. Thank you.
Uh, are humans really going to tank? I doubt this can really happen unless you use a VERY specialized set (even more specialized than an offensive one) because of human's low stats. Or you would have to give the defensive items pretty good stats, while having a lot of care with not making them OP. Just my opinion, I didn't really think about it much.
Also also also, as I said in IRC a while ago, I REALL like the idea of Tools. And we don't really need to make them act as already existing move: we can make up stuff! (as long as it is not OP and has a function obv).
For example, we could have a tool that blocks sounds for a while, effectively giving everyone Soundproof for some actions, or Fresh Water that cures burns and gets rid of stat drops caused by Sand Attack / Mud Slap / Mud Bomb. Or maybe (just MAYBE) rapid grow berry plants that feed an Oran Berry to all the team once per round / 5 actions / whatever. I mean, this category is full of possibilities. PLEASE don't get rid of it.
I would also like to propose making different melee weapons and not just swords. You could have polearms and maces, giving different attacks to the trainer (a lance allowing the use of, I dunno, Bounce (gogogo FF dragoons), while a mace allows the use of hard hitting moves like Heavy Slam (give the mace a WC and calc the move using the WC of the mace and not the trainer's) while lowering speed and evasion).
As I said, this RP is FULL of possibilities. Please don't waste them. If you want to brainstorm ideas, contact me as I would LOVE to do so. Not going to write a lot here as I have not given them much thought and I would end up making a wall of text.
please please please we need to put a lot of effort into the previously-ignored utility items category. In tabletop RPGs one of the cooler and more creative aspects of inventory is non-combat items - from basics like shovels, ropes, lockpicks, torches, and telescopes to more unique and 'powerful' items like crystal balls, strange engineered steampunky devices, fun loot even if its just going to be sold or passed on for story purposes, and other weird seemingly useless enchanted items (or their scifi equivalents haha). Its always a great high moment for the players when their dedicated preparedness in bringing a whole bunch of exploration items ends up opening a shortcut or making an rp task a lot easier, and its a great way to spend lesser amounts of money when weapons are too expensive or undesirable for the character build. I'd just like that we don't brush over this as much as the last iteration (iirc old adventure battles had like a catch-all adventure pack and that was pretty much it), and I'll work on it if nobody else wants to.
Huh, I guess it is a good thing I left this open a lot longer than I planned to. Either way, both tavok and Leethoof give very good points. That said, I think tanking should be a thing for humans, it's not very realistic but I've seen defensive players in the roleplay before. Right now I'm considering implementing a command Threaten, which will increase (guarantee?) the chance that the enemy affected will attack them. Obviously you'd only be able to use this when using a defensive item.
As for the topic itself, right now I'm going to fiat the item classes as this for now. If anyone has any objections to this feel free to post on this still, we just need to move onto the next topic if we want this to be released this year. :P
1. Melee Weapons-Physical DPS (Coverage, buffs to physical attacks)
2. Ranged Weapons-Technical (Requires a specific build to function properly)
3. Technology-Special DPS (Coverage, buffs to special attacks)
4. Defensive-Tanking (Defensive moves, buffs to defenses and/or hp)
5. Support-Support (Healing and Support type moves)
6. Tools-Limited use Attacks (Unusual Coverage and Support Coverage)
7. Utility-Roleplay helpers (Roleplay Items)
8. Item Carrying-Backpacks (Three types: Battle (Warriors), Utility (Runners), and Loot (Hunters))
9. Set Items-Adventure Specific Items (Swords of Plot Advancement and the like)
Oh, Leethoof if you can be in charge of making Utility Items, that would be extremely helpful! I actually don't have too many ideas myself for those, so if you can build some that would be awesome.
========================================= Topic: Abilities and Universal Moves
Okay, we're actually taking a bit of a detour from the planned schedule but I feel like we want to get this out of the way. That and I need to make some examples of items that I'm too lazy/busy to do right now.
Anyways, this topic is twofold. First, we need to discuss how general Abilities should work. Which abilities should trainers be able or unable to use. Honestly, due to the slow pace of the revamps and the thread, I'm heavily considering just straight up implementing the General Abilities from the last thread, short of those that are broken.
Of course, this gives a few issues of it's own, namely:
1. Should we have Drawback Abilities? I really like the idea myself, but a few of them, like Defeatist and Slow Start, give a lot of benefit for defensive trainers who don't care about offenses at all.
2. Should we remove abilities that are already in another typing profile? I didn't have the time to go over the point values of abilities fully, but I know Moxie and Inner Focus are in there. They're in the Dark type tree, but it could also be useful to other trainers.
The second topic I want to discuss here is Universal Moves. In the previous thread, every trainer got a slew of moves, most of them probably a bit too strong. Should we keep this mechanic? If so, what should that list look like?
For reference, here's the list from the previous thread.
Universal Moves:
Amnesia
Bulk Up
Calm Mind
Dragon Dance
Growl
Headbutt
Leer
Meditate
Mega Punch
Nasty Plot
Pound
Quiver Dance
Rage
Sing
Slam
Snore
Stomp
Strength
Struggle
Swords Dance
Tackle
Tickle
Bodyblock
Chill
Dodge
Shift
Take Cover
=================================
Finally, we're getting pretty close to the end of this project. All we have to do is this, create items, and then answer some questions about the administrative side of the Adventure Battles (AB Council should be getting a PM from me later tonight with more info).
Because of this, we're looking for NEW Adventure Battles to fill in the gaps. Currently, we have the following:
Adventure Battles:
To Defy the End (By Eternal Drifter)
Wish Upon a Star (By Maxim)
We really need more of these, and we're currently accepting applications for new Adventure Battles! If you're interested, here's how you can get set up!
1. Send a PM to myself and Eternal Drifter with the plot synopsis. All you need for these is a short summary (about a paragraph) for each chapter describing what will happen. You don't have to have any plot spoilers or anything, just something so we know what you're doing.
2. Upon approval, you simply need to create the first chapter of your Adventure Battle in full. We recommend having two or three done by initial release, so that you have plenty of time to make the rest, but you only need one to progress! Once you feel ready to release, PM myself and Eternal Drifter the Chapter idea.
3. When we approve that, all you need to do is make a beta test for that Adventure Battle. Just make an open invitation for some trainers to try it, and run the chapter like normal. Once the initial bugs are fixed, you will be ready to go! That being said, due to the current lack of Adventure Battles we may skip this step for any who submit their chapter summaries before the Discussion Thread closes. So get them in folks!
My goal at this point is to have at least 5 Different Adventure Battle stories up before the end of the discussion.
