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I am playing at the ORAS Battle Maison, and will like to say that clerics are really good actually. I used a Bold cleric Sylveon, which pull through flinch hax with Wish+Protect, successfully stored out PP for the flinch hax inducing Rock Slide. It can also provide Heal Bell support as status rans rampant and actually packing quite a punch with Pixilate
Hyper Voice. :3
Set: Standard OU Cleric :D
Sylveon@Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
IV: 252HP/220Def/36Sdef
Moves: Wish
Protect
Hyper Voice
Heal Bell
It is hard to kill, provide team support, and hit pretty good too, combined with Hyper Voice getting through Subs :o This little cutie totally destroyed Nita and her Thundurus/ Tornadus/ Landorus!
Hi guys, I've been having a thought. What do you think if all mons (yes including Ubers and all evolved mon) would ever be allowed in future iterations of the Battle Maisons? It should open up a whole new wave of strategic thinkings. I'm not sure about the balance though if for example a mon is too powerful (Mega Ray anyone?). Just wanna share this with everyone and see what everybody's opinions are on this concept. Cheers guys :)
Hi guys, I've been having a thought. What do you think if all mons (yes including Ubers and all evolved mon) would ever be allowed in future iterations of the Battle Maisons? It should open up a whole new wave of strategic thinkings. I'm not sure about the balance though if for example a mon is too powerful (Mega Ray anyone?). Just wanna share this with everyone and see what everybody's opinions are on this concept. Cheers guys :)
I think the Maison doesn't include the "Ubers" because Nintendo doesn't want the battle facilities to require you to have more than one cart to be successful within. Xerneas, for example, is basically unchecked by any of the pokemon available in Alpha Sapphire. (The best response I can figure would be MegaGross, which is merely a check, not an outright counter. MegaRay would win if it was already set up, but Moonblast scores a OHKO without Geomancy and Xerneas is faster before the Mega-Evolve, so you'd lose if the AI opened with Xerneas.)
It might be a cool idea for a future Battle Factory-like facility, where your team is randomized in some fashion. Maybe you bring 3 of your 4 team members for doubles, and the fourth you pick from a set of 3 "Ubers?" That could be fun.
I think the Maison doesn't include the "Ubers" because Nintendo doesn't want the battle facilities to require you to have more than one cart to be successful within. Xerneas, for example, is basically unchecked by any of the pokemon available in Alpha Sapphire. (The best response I can figure would be MegaGross, which is merely a check, not an outright counter. MegaRay would win if it was already set up, but Moonblast scores a OHKO without Geomancy and Xerneas is faster before the Mega-Evolve, so you'd lose if the AI opened with Xerneas.)
It might be a cool idea for a future Battle Factory-like facility, where your team is randomized in some fashion. Maybe you bring 3 of your 4 team members for doubles, and the fourth you pick from a set of 3 "Ubers?" That could be fun.
It's always been (and continues to be) about power. Gamefreak has made a pretty hard line between the cover/event legendaries and everything else for basically forever. Cover legendaries have just been on a totally different power level than everything else, while event legendaries create an uneven playing field. While Mega Evolutions have bridged the gap between the cover legendaries and "ordinary" Pokemon, and I think some Maison-legal Megas are more effective than any cover legendary would be in the Maison, most "conventional" battles would be heavily skewed in their favor.
With regards to Singles: I think, if the player could use them but not the AI, the Ubers (i.e. the Ubers we can't already use) would result in many more 200-600 win streaks. I don't know if the upper limits would be pushed that hard. I think the best candidates are Mewtwo (speed + efficient use of Sub + can use Calm Mind), Mega Rayquaza (basically a better Dragonite), and Primal Groudon (for the immunity to both burn and T-Wave), but neither Mewtwo nor Primal Groudon immediately seem AS amazing at plowing through teams as, say, a fully set-up Drapion or Mega Kangaskhan. That said, a full "overwhelm" team of something like Mewtwo, P-Don, and M-Ray could probably win tons of battles without any defensive synergy (minus M-Ray's Ground immunity), just because of the stat advantage.
If the AI could also use them, I think we'd be pretty screwed (except for Durant). Zekrom is a terrible choice for us to use due to Bolt Strike's awful accuracy, but the AI sure as hell doesn't care, and it will happily fry any team lacking Gliscor, P-Don, or an appropriate Arceus. The real problem with the cover legendaries is their bulk; if you lack a super-effective move, it's extremely hard to OHKO. And if they outspeed you, good luck taking them down with Mega Kangaskhan's Sucker Punch. It all depends on the movesets, though; sufficiently awful sets could be quite beatable.
But yeah, it'll never, ever happen. It would be interesting, but ultimately, way too restrictive (IMO).
Hi guys, I've been having a thought. What do you think if all mons (yes including Ubers and all evolved mon) would ever be allowed in future iterations of the Battle Maisons? It should open up a whole new wave of strategic thinkings. I'm not sure about the balance though if for example a mon is too powerful (Mega Ray anyone?). Just wanna share this with everyone and see what everybody's opinions are on this concept. Cheers guys :)
It's always been (and continues to be) about power. Gamefreak has made a pretty hard line between the cover/event legendaries and everything else for basically forever. Cover legendaries have just been on a totally different power level than everything else, while event legendaries create an uneven playing field. While Mega Evolutions have bridged the gap between the cover legendaries and "ordinary" Pokemon, and I think some Maison-legal Megas are more effective than any cover legendary would be in the Maison, most "conventional" battles would be heavily skewed in their favor.
With regards to Singles: I think, if the player could use them but not the AI, the Ubers (i.e. the Ubers we can't already use) would result in many more 200-600 win streaks. I don't know if the upper limits would be pushed that hard. I think the best candidates are Mewtwo (speed + efficient use of Sub + can use Calm Mind), Mega Rayquaza (basically a better Dragonite), and Primal Groudon (for the immunity to both burn and T-Wave), but neither Mewtwo nor Primal Groudon immediately seem AS amazing at plowing through teams as, say, a fully set-up Drapion or Mega Kangaskhan. That said, a full "overwhelm" team of something like Mewtwo, P-Don, and M-Ray could probably win tons of battles without any defensive synergy (minus M-Ray's Ground immunity), just because of the stat advantage.
If the AI could also use them, I think we'd be pretty screwed (except for Durant). Zekrom is a terrible choice for us to use due to Bolt Strike's awful accuracy, but the AI sure as hell doesn't care, and it will happily fry any team lacking Gliscor, P-Don, or an appropriate Arceus. The real problem with the cover legendaries is their bulk; if you lack a super-effective move, it's extremely hard to OHKO. And if they outspeed you, good luck taking them down with Mega Kangaskhan's Sucker Punch. It all depends on the movesets, though; sufficiently awful sets could be quite beatable.
But yeah, it'll never, ever happen. It would be interesting, but ultimately, way too restrictive (IMO).
The other thing is it's pretty much always about the movesets. It's not like every set 4 Pokemon has an optimized competitive set - if there were a sufficient number of things like DD Dragonite/Salamence, BD Azumarill, and SS Cloyster, a lot of teams would be screwed well before stuff like Mega Rayquaza and Ekiller came into the picture.
So, I've finally achieved a 1,000 win streak in Super Triple Battles!
This has been a long time coming, getting a streak this long takes FOREVER. Admittedly, the team isn't very unique, but I have refined it bit by bit. I posted about the team I was using HERE, but I have made some tweaks to some of the team members since then, even switching out one of them, so I'm going to go over what the team looks like now, and give a more in-depth look into how the team managed to survive so many wins.
Mia Fey (Dusclops) (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Frisk
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 132 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 31/31/31/x/31/00
- Trick Room
- Night Shade
- Foresight
- Brick Break
Her name is Mia Fey because she's female, a ghost, and amazing at defense. Plus the scarf like tendrils from Dusclops' sides.
Dusclops is a great TR setter. She tanks anything that comes her way like nobody's business. Night Shade and Brick Break are her attacks of choice to finish off Endeavor-weakened Pokemon. Brick Break is even able to finish some Sitrus Berry Pokemon, such as Rampardos and Bastiodon. Foresight allows Ghosts to be hit with Endeavor, as well as clear out Double Teamers like Cresselia. Frisk Ability uncovers what set the AI is using for each Pokemon, an extremely useful tool. EVs give relatively even defenses. It's a pretty simple set that everyone is familiar with.
His name is Mr. Wright, because he makes miracles happen, no matter how bad the odds are.
Level 1 Aron is a popular choice in Maison Doubles and Triples, so it's no secret how well he does. Sturdy plus Endeavor breaks any wall down, no matter how powerful they are. What most Aron users don't use, however, is Magnet Rise. Magnet Rise is a very fun move to use, because even though he's a Lv. 1 Pokemon, the AI still favors moves that do the most damage to their target. For Aron, that means LOTS of Earthquake users. Whenever there are 2+ EQ users on the field, or on the second turn, the AI is stupid enough to KO one of their own Pokemon, Magnet Rise lets him escape from harm. This either lets the AI KO themselves, or change the move of choice against Aron to create a more advantageous situation. Examples include Thick Club Marowak switching to Outrage and Garchomp switching to Dragon Claw. Some Pokemon, however, aren't so simple, such as when they switch to a Rock move, which isn't much better. Still, it is one of the best "filler" moves for Aron in this team. Swagger is my last move of choice simply because of its ability to possibly buy Aron another turn of survival.
Apollo (Togekiss) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 132 Def / 124 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 31/x/31/31/31/00
- Air Slash
- Sunny Day
- Follow Me
- Heal Bell
He was originally nicknamed Edgeworth, but I changed his name to Apollo, because of Sunny Day, and because he's one of Wright's best partners.
Togekiss has a pretty specific job on the team, but he does it extremely well. Keep Aron alive. Follow Me redirects lots of attacks from hitting Aron, giving him the chance to go another turn unscathed. Thanks to Togekiss's amazing bulk and complimentary typing with Aron, he can tank many attacks like Grass, Dark, Dragon, and Fighting moves. He can even redirect moves that can hit across the field, like Flying Press and Dragon Pulse. Follow Me also helps with pesky priority attacks like Extreme Speed. When the AI is using spread attacks, or powerful attacks that Togekiss can't tank, Air Slash comes into play. A move with no immunities and a 60% chance to flinch helps immensely, even in the Maison. Air Slash also helps preventing opponent Trick Room setters from disrupting the whole strategy. It sounds shaky relying on a chance based move, but it is not necessary to success, it only pushes the battle a little closer into our favor. It's also useful for its damage to finish weakened enemies and to hit targets across the field. Sunny Day has several benefits, both for the lead line up and for Camerupt. It helps Togekiss tank Water attacks such as Hydro Pump, decrease Thunder and Hurricane's accuracy, and even prevents freeze hax from happening. Heal Bell is the last move on the set to further increase the team support. It can't really get rid of burns on Aron too well, depending on the turn order, unfortunately, but it has other viable uses. For starters, it clears poison and burns from Dusclops and Togekiss from Pokemon such as Weezing. It also gets rid of paralysis to minimize parahax. Finally, if I predict a possible freeze coming on the first turn due to Blizzard, I use this when Dusclops sets Trick Room to ensure she can still use it. The chance of the Blizzard user being in the center, and freezing both Dusclops AND Togekiss is extremely low, even for Maison. I used to have Roost instead of Heal Bell, but Roost is unnecessary in winning a match. Togekiss can keep a reasonable amount of health most all of the time.
Gumshoe (Camerupt) (M) @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock -> Sheer Force
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 31/00/31/31/31/00
- Eruption
- Earth Power
- Ancient Power
- Protect
His name is Gumshoe because if Gumshoe was ANY Pokemon, it'd be this one.
Mega Camerupt is an absolute beast. Eruption nukes anything on the field, especially under the sun. That's what he does 90% of the time, really, just click Eruption and win. As for other situations, Earth Power serves as his secondary STAB, and gets rid of Rock types and Flash Fire Pokemon, and does neutral damage to a lot of things. Ancient Power is very useful in taking down Flying types that resist Eruption, such as Moltres, as well as Volcarona, which can be bothersome after a couple Quiver Dances. Protect lets him Mega Evolve for free, when he needs to buy a turn for Dusclops to refresh Trick Room. I've never needed Solar Beam on Camerupt, because Aron breaks down Water types or other Fire-resistant Pokemon before Camerupt has to come in.
Franziska (Conkeldurr) (F) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Iron Fist
Level: 50
EVs: 108 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 144 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 31/31/31/x/31/00
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch
Her name is Franziska because she's so violent and physical.
To be honest, I just copied this set from Eppie's Super Doubles team. But she has pulled her weight on this team as a physical sweeper. All of her attacks have massive power, letting her pick up the scraps after Aron's destruction of the opposing team. She's pretty simple to use, just click the proper attack against the enemy. Mach Punch is very useful outside of Trick Room, taking weakened Pokemon out before they have a chance to do anything. Thanks to Assault Vest, she can tank Special attacks very well, too.
Godot (Clawitzer) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Mega Launcher
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 31/x/31/31/31/00
- Water Pulse
- Dark Pulse
- Aura Sphere
- Ice Beam
I named him Godot, just because he's really cool
I ended up replacing my physical Aegislash for a mixed Aegislash, but I then replaced it since Aegislash didn't work too well in Trick Room. I've only used him from battles 900 onwards, but he's been a great help.
Clawitzer is a really good Trick Room sweeper and a Triples teammate. Mega Launcher gives him powerful pseudo-STAB attacks, which also has amazing coverage. Water Pulse helps get rid of Fire types when the opposing team is riddled with them. Dark Pulse hits the slow Psychic and Ghost types for tons of damage. Aura Sphere is a very potent attack to have as well. All of these attacks can hit across the field, letting Clawitzer pick whichever target that can easily be taken out. Ice Beam takes care of Grass and Dragon types. Clawitzer has pretty decent bulk too, taking a few hits here and there
All of the team members work together extremely well, taking on most teams in the Battle Maison without much trouble.
Almost all of the time, I lead off with Trick Room, Protect, and Sunny Day on Dusclops, Aron, and Togekiss, respectively. The only time I don't use Sunny Day is when the team has a Fire type on Togekiss's side of the field, there is a Trick Room setter on the other team, or there is a specific problematic Pokemon. In the first two situations, I use Air Slash, which can get prior damage and flinch the opposing TR user. In the last, I switch out to a different Pokemon depending on what it is. After Trick Room is set up, it's all about identifying the situation. In the best case scenario, Dusclops and Aron take out the leftmost Pokemon, while Togekiss uses Follow Me to wall the center and right Pokemon, and repeat until it's a 6-0 victory. In special cases, like Lax Incense Lati@s, which use Dragon Pulse, I can have Dusclops and Aron take out the center Pokemon while Togekiss uses Follow Me to tank the left and right Pokemon's moves. This does happen somewhat often, but not all battles can be easy. When one or more Pokemon has spread moves or moves that hit Togekiss hard, I have Dusclops and Aron KO one Pokemon while Togekiss Air Slashes one of the other Pokemon, trying to get a flinch. This lets Aron get away with only taking one single hit. Alternatively, if only one Pokemon uses a spread move, Togekiss can still use Follow Me and tank the other Pokemon's hit, if it's something harmless. If there are EQ users, Aron can Magnet Rise and avoid the attacks, and possibly turn those Pokemon into Follow Me fodder for Togekiss, like Flygon and Garchomp. If the opposing team can't be walled very well with Follow Me, Aron can Protect on the third turn and give Togekiss a free switch in to another party member as a more offensive presence, such as Mega Camerupt using Eruption on the center and right Pokemon while Dusclops and Aron handle the left Pokemon. When Aron has been KO'd, the opposing team is usually left with 3 Pokemon at most, and from there, it's a pretty simple matter for the other teammates to clean up the rest.
The team is very good, but there are a few threats to keep in mind.
Hex Maniacs
One opponent Trick Room setter is manageable thanks to a combination of AI's aggro towards Aron and Togekiss's 60% flinch rate Air Slash, but if there is two or even three TR users, things can get very ugly. Thankfully some Pokemon almost always seem to opt for an attack, such as Dusknoir and Shadow Sneak, and Trevenant and Focus Blast, but even still, it can get very ugly for Aron. If Aron ends up fainting early, the other Pokemon will have to pick up the slack, which is doable, thanks to how powerful the sweepers are.
Choice Band Tyrantrum and Life Orb Aurorus
These two Pokemon aren't much of a threat on the left side, but if they can attack Togekiss, they may just OHKO Togekiss on the first turn. In Tyrantrum's case, I switch to Conkeldurr, who can tank a Head Smash decently and regain the health with Drain Punch. As for Aurorus, I switch to Clawitzer to take the Refrigerate Hyper Beam, and if I want to, KO back with Aura Sphere. If Aurorous has Snow Warning, instead, though, it's a simple matter of using Sunny Day, since it can't OHKO Togekiss.
Mold Breaker
These Pokemon can break through Aron's Sturdy in one hit. They gain priority for Aron to take out. The exception would be Hawlucha, which Togekiss can forever wall its Flying Presses from any of its positions, or even do massive damage with Air Slash.
Rampardos
It can potentially have Mold Breaker and can KO Togekiss on the first turn. If it attempts to EQ, I use Magnet Rise with Aron on the second turn and switch Togekiss out on the third turn while Protecting with Aron. If it Head Smashes Togekiss, I can use any of the other Pokemon to OHKO it.
Shuckle
More of an annoyance than an actual threat, but its extremely slow and can clear out Sunny Day for Sandstorm, which while beneficial for Aron, isn't pleasant on Dusclops and Togekiss
Mandibuzz
An odd Pokemon to have as a threat, but this thing has a tendency to Swagger on the first turn against Dusclops. This forces Togekiss to use Follow Me on turn 1 to take the Swagger to get Trick Room set up. It's a pain, but can be worked around with careful planning.
Blizzard users
Most notorious users are Focus Sash Glaceon and Focus Sash Cryogonal. To avoid a freeze on Dusclops, I preemptively use Heal Bell with Togekiss so that it can heal the freeze before its Dusclops' turn.
Sitrus Berry Bastiodon
Rock Slide can possibly flinch Dusclops and prevent it from using Trick Room, but thanks to its low Speed, Togekiss can outspeed it outside of Trick Room and get a flinch on it with Air Slash
Taunt users
I've only experienced two or three times Dusclops was Taunted, and only one of those times which prevented it from using Trick Room on the first turn. That Pokemon was Vanilluxe. Like with Mandibuzz, it's best to have Togekiss use Follow Me and have it absorb the Taunt for Dusclops.
I believe that covers just about all of the threats to this team. Now it's time for replays!
Battle #1000: RXWG-WWWW-WW2C-EYZ6
The proof that I did it! Not a terribly exciting match, but the other replays will show off how the run went.
These two show off how Dusclops, Aron, and Togekiss do in the best scenerio. Veterans tend to be the easier Trainers to face because the Genies like to use Focus Blast, Pokemon like Regirock uses Drain Punch, and Lati@s with Dragon moves. This was before I knew that Dragon Pulse was affected by Follow Me even from across the field.
Battle #681: HWVG-WWWW-WW2A-TSVB
I made some stupid mistakes in this match, like not using Foresight and using Swagger on Gengar when I JUST saw that it had Lum Berry. Heal Bell from Togekiss saved me in this match, though.
Battle #828: LHAG-WWWW-WW2C-EK4L
This is why I have Magnet Rise on Aron. Without it, Aron would've only made it to 2 or 3, but it was able to make it through the entire team
Battle #862: DEZG-WWWW-WW2C-ELXJ
Multiple TR users throughout the entire team. It can really screw with the entire strategy if the AI is able to and decides to use TR. This match was also when I started to want to switch Aegislash out.
Battle #876: 5THG-WWWW-WW2C-F68D
By far the closest match in my entire run. Trick Room users screwed me over, and Absol wanted to spread Swagger instead of using Punishment. I switched out Aegislash for Clawitzer a little while after this match happened, at the 900 mark.
I'm so glad I finally did it. Trying to do a 1000 win streak takes so much time, especially since this team is relatively slow going. I'll probably still continue this streak, but won't be grinding out wins nearly as much.
The other thing is it's pretty much always about the movesets. It's not like every set 4 Pokemon has an optimized competitive set - if there were a sufficient number of things like DD Dragonite/Salamence, BD Azumarill, and SS Cloyster, a lot of teams would be screwed well before stuff like Mega Rayquaza and Ekiller came into the picture.
Yeah, the relative absence of effective set-up sweepers is a huge boon for us. Most Calm Mind/Quiver Dance users don't have SpAtk EVs (and even one of them that doesn't, Volcarona4, is still a huge nightmare). Dragon Dance is a rarity, and is usually accompanied by mediocre coverage (e.g. Feraligatr4) or a lack of power (e.g. Gyarados4). I think the "off-set" Dragon Dancers (Feraligatr2, Gyarados3) are some of the most threatening Singles mons in the Maison, but their rarity reduces most teams' need to deal with them. Swords Dance is even more threatening, but it's extremely rare, with Talonflame4, Drapion4, and Garchomp4 being the most common users (and Talonflame and Drapion generally don't pose much of a threat before a Swords Dance). If there were more effective set-up sweepers, the bulky Pokemon that hold standard goodstuffs teams together (Aegislash, Suicune, Gliscor, Chansey, Mega Scizor) would be pretty screwed.
Yep! It is extremely gratifying being able to give the Maison a taste of its own medicine with Togekiss. It doesn't have the greatest speed as a Trick Room Pokemon, but it is low enough to make it work.
Its speed is compromised by needing the Leftovers to fully serve as a sponge for Aron, but power item Togekiss with an offensive build and moveset was really fun to use on a TR team. Power items in themselves are kinda undervalued for those teams, IMO, since there aren't enough specially-oriented pokes to fit them aside from the psychics, whose movepools rarely venture outside a short list of staples.
Prior to ORAS, Heatran was everything I could have asked for in a special fire type with the tools needed to function on such a team. Mega Camerupt didn't fully render Heatran obsolete, but it did bring more to the table.
IIRC I had both the standard TR Clawitzer plus Togekiss on a team together, and they were as versatile as they were strong. Thanks to the AI pokes all having 31 IVs, even on their TR-capable pokes, power item Base 80 Spd pokemon are still able to outspeed the majority of the opposition.
Without any sort of speed-cutting item, I think 70 is the best cutoff with very few exceptions.
Power item TR sweepers does sounds interesting. I bet there's a lot of untapped potential with that kind of set up, and the extra Pokemon available. Chandelure comes to mind. Togekiss definitely has as much of an offensive presence as defensive with a great 120 Base Special Attack and nice coverage moves.
The Base 80 Speed does give it a niche outside of TR at least. It lets it flinch the slower Pokemon like Bastiodon before it can cause trouble for example.
Candelure was actually part of one of my longer TR randoms streaks! It does indeed function really well, though not so much in a versatile sense; the team it was on had two 4x fire weaknesses and access to Helping Hand, so a Flash Fire variant brought a lot to the table.
The little speed differences between some pokes and their mega forms, as well as the turn order mechanic has made some pretty appreciable circumstances before. For example, a purposely weighted Mega Camerupt is slower than Escavalier4, but on the turn it evolves, that same build is still faster than it, so it's able to go first and OHKO. Little things like that come up just often enough to please.
The little speed differences between some pokes and their mega forms, as well as the turn order mechanic has made some pretty appreciable circumstances before. For example, a purposely weighted Mega Camerupt is slower than Escavalier4, but on the turn it evolves, that same build is still faster than it, so it's able to go first and OHKO. Little things like that come up just often enough to please.
That speed drop upon Mega Evolution, and how many Trick Room Pokemon fall in between the two Speeds, is one of my favorite things about Mega Camerupt. So lovely that when (under Trick Room) Dusclops uses Sunny Day on the turn that Camerupt Mega Evolves, Dusclops goes first, giving Eruption the sun boost.
So, I've finally achieved a 1,000 win streak in Super Triple Battles!
This has been a long time coming, getting a streak this long takes FOREVER. Admittedly, the team isn't very unique, but I have refined it bit by bit. I posted about the team I was using HERE, but I have made some tweaks to some of the team members since then, even switching out one of them, so I'm going to go over what the team looks like now, and give a more in-depth look into how the team managed to survive so many wins.
Mia Fey (Dusclops) (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Frisk
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 126 Def / 132 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 31/31/31/x/31/00
- Trick Room
- Night Shade
- Foresight
- Brick Break
Her name is Mia Fey because she's female, a ghost, and amazing at defense. Plus the scarf like tendrils from Dusclops' sides.
Dusclops is a great TR setter. She tanks anything that comes her way like nobody's business. Night Shade and Brick Break are her attacks of choice to finish off Endeavor-weakened Pokemon. Brick Break is even able to finish some Sitrus Berry Pokemon, such as Rampardos and Bastiodon. Foresight allows Ghosts to be hit with Endeavor, as well as clear out Double Teamers like Cresselia. Frisk Ability uncovers what set the AI is using for each Pokemon, an extremely useful tool. EVs give relatively even defenses. It's a pretty simple set that everyone is familiar with.
Mr. Wright (Aron) (M) @ Berry Juice
Ability: Sturdy
Level: 1
EVs: None
Jolly Nature
IVs: Too broken to need perfect IVs
- Protect
- Magnet Rise
- Endeavor
- Swagger
His name is Mr. Wright, because he makes miracles happen, no matter how bad the odds are.
Level 1 Aron is a popular choice in Maison Doubles and Triples, so it's no secret how well he does. Sturdy plus Endeavor breaks any wall down, no matter how powerful they are. What most Aron users don't use, however, is Magnet Rise. Magnet Rise is a very fun move to use, because even though he's a Lv. 1 Pokemon, the AI still favors moves that do the most damage to their target. For Aron, that means LOTS of Earthquake users. Whenever there are 2+ EQ users on the field, or on the second turn, the AI is stupid enough to KO one of their own Pokemon, Magnet Rise lets him escape from harm. This either lets the AI KO themselves, or change the move of choice against Aron to create a more advantageous situation. Examples include Thick Club Marowak switching to Outrage and Garchomp switching to Dragon Claw. Some Pokemon, however, aren't so simple, such as when they switch to a Rock move, which isn't much better. Still, it is one of the best "filler" moves for Aron in this team. Swagger is my last move of choice simply because of its ability to possibly buy Aron another turn of survival.
Apollo (Togekiss) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 132 Def / 126 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 31/x/31/31/31/00
- Air Slash
- Sunny Day
- Follow Me
- Heal Bell
He was originally nicknamed Edgeworth, but I changed his name to Apollo, because of Sunny Day, and because he's one of Wright's best partners.
Togekiss has a pretty specific job on the team, but he does it extremely well. Keep Aron alive. Follow Me redirects lots of attacks from hitting Aron, giving him the chance to go another turn unscathed. Thanks to Togekiss's amazing bulk and complimentary typing with Aron, he can tank many attacks like Grass, Dark, Dragon, and Fighting moves. He can even redirect moves that can hit across the field, like Flying Press and Dragon Pulse. Follow Me also helps with pesky priority attacks like Extreme Speed. When the AI is using spread attacks, or powerful attacks that Togekiss can't tank, Air Slash comes into play. A move with no immunities and a 60% chance to flinch helps immensely, even in the Maison. Air Slash also helps preventing opponent Trick Room setters from disrupting the whole strategy. It sounds shaky relying on a chance based move, but it is not necessary to success, it only pushes the battle a little closer into our favor. It's also useful for its damage to finish weakened enemies and to hit targets across the field. Sunny Day has several benefits, both for the lead line up and for Camerupt. It helps Togekiss tank Water attacks such as Hydro Pump, decrease Thunder and Hurricane's accuracy, and even prevents freeze hax from happening. Heal Bell is the last move on the set to further increase the team support. It can't really get rid of burns on Aron too well, depending on the turn order, unfortunately, but it has other viable uses. For starters, it clears poison and burns from Dusclops and Togekiss from Pokemon such as Weezing. It also gets rid of paralysis to minimize parahax. Finally, if I predict a possible freeze coming on the first turn due to Blizzard, I use this when Dusclops sets Trick Room to ensure she can still use it. The chance of the Blizzard user being in the center, and freezing both Dusclops AND Togekiss is extremely low, even for Maison. I used to have Roost instead of Heal Bell, but Roost is unnecessary in winning a match. Togekiss can keep a reasonable amount of health most all of the time.
Gumshoe (Camerupt) (M) @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock -> Sheer Force
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 31/00/31/31/31/00
- Eruption
- Earth Power
- Ancient Power
- Protect
His name is Gumshoe because if Gumshoe was ANY Pokemon, it'd be this one.
Mega Camerupt is an absolute beast. Eruption nukes anything on the field, especially under the sun. That's what he does 90% of the time, really, just click Eruption and win. As for other situations, Earth Power serves as his secondary STAB, and gets rid of Rock types and Flash Fire Pokemon, and does neutral damage to a lot of things. Ancient Power is very useful in taking down Flying types that resist Eruption, such as Moltres, as well as Volcarona, which can be bothersome after a couple Quiver Dances. Protect lets him Mega Evolve for free, when he needs to buy a turn for Dusclops to refresh Trick Room. I've never needed Solar Beam on Camerupt, because Aron breaks down Water types or other Fire-resistant Pokemon before Camerupt has to come in.
Franziska (Conkeldurr) (F) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Iron Fist
Level: 50
EVs: 108 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 144 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 31/31/31/x/31/00
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch
Her name is Franziska because she's so violent and physical.
To be honest, I just copied this set from Eppie's Super Doubles team. But she has pulled her weight on this team as a physical sweeper. All of her attacks have massive power, letting her pick up the scraps after Aron's destruction of the opposing team. She's pretty simple to use, just click the proper attack against the enemy. Mach Punch is very useful outside of Trick Room, taking weakened Pokemon out before they have a chance to do anything. Thanks to Assault Vest, she can tank Special attacks very well, too.
Gregory (Clawitzer) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Mega Launcher
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 31/x/31/31/31/00
- Water Pulse
- Dark Pulse
- Aura Sphere
- Ice Beam
I ended up replacing my physical Aegislash for a mixed Aegislash named Edgeworth. I then replaced him since he didn't work too well in Trick Room. So I named this guy Gregory in honor of Edgeworth. I've only used him from battles 900 onwards, but he's been a great help.
Clawitzer is a really good Trick Room sweeper and a Triples teammate. Mega Launcher gives him powerful pseudo-STAB attacks, which also has amazing coverage. Water Pulse helps get rid of Fire types when the opposing team is riddled with them. Dark Pulse hits the slow Psychic and Ghost types for tons of damage. Aura Sphere is a very potent attack to have as well. All of these attacks can hit across the field, letting Clawitzer pick whichever target that can easily be taken out. Ice Beam takes care of Grass and Dragon types. Clawitzer has pretty decent bulk too, taking a few hits here and there
All of the team members work together extremely well, taking on most teams in the Battle Maison without much trouble.
Almost all of the time, I lead off with Trick Room, Protect, and Sunny Day on Dusclops, Aron, and Togekiss, respectively. The only time I don't use Sunny Day is when the team has a Fire type on Togekiss's side of the field, there is a Trick Room setter on the other team, or there is a specific problematic Pokemon. In the first two situations, I use Air Slash, which can get prior damage and flinch the opposing TR user. In the last, I switch out to a different Pokemon depending on what it is. After Trick Room is set up, it's all about identifying the situation. In the best case scenario, Dusclops and Aron take out the leftmost Pokemon, while Togekiss uses Follow Me to wall the center and right Pokemon, and repeat until it's a 6-0 victory. In special cases, like Lax Incense Lati@s, which use Dragon Pulse, I can have Dusclops and Aron take out the center Pokemon while Togekiss uses Follow Me to tank the left and right Pokemon's moves. This does happen somewhat often, but not all battles can be easy. When one or more Pokemon has spread moves or moves that hit Togekiss hard, I have Dusclops and Aron KO one Pokemon while Togekiss Air Slashes one of the other Pokemon, trying to get a flinch. This lets Aron get away with only taking one single hit. Alternatively, if only one Pokemon uses a spread move, Togekiss can still use Follow Me and tank the other Pokemon's hit, if it's something harmless. If there are EQ users, Aron can Magnet Rise and avoid the attacks, and possibly turn those Pokemon into Follow Me fodder for Togekiss, like Flygon and Garchomp. If the opposing team can't be walled very well with Follow Me, Aron can Protect on the third turn and give Togekiss a free switch in to another party member as a more offensive presence, such as Mega Camerupt using Eruption on the center and right Pokemon while Dusclops and Aron handle the left Pokemon. When Aron has been KO'd, the opposing team is usually left with 3 Pokemon at most, and from there, it's a pretty simple matter for the other teammates to clean up the rest.
The team is very good, but there are a few threats to keep in mind.
Hex Maniacs
One opponent Trick Room setter is manageable thanks to a combination of AI's aggro towards Aron and Togekiss's 60% flinch rate Air Slash, but if there is two or even three TR users, things can get very ugly. Thankfully some Pokemon almost always seem to opt for an attack, such as Dusknoir and Shadow Sneak, and Trevenant and Focus Blast, but even still, it can get very ugly for Aron. If Aron ends up fainting early, the other Pokemon will have to pick up the slack, which is doable, thanks to how powerful the sweepers are.
Choice Band Tyrantrum and Life Orb Aurorus
These two Pokemon aren't much of a threat on the left side, but if they can attack Togekiss, they may just OHKO Togekiss on the first turn. In Tyrantrum's case, I switch to Conkeldurr, who can tank a Head Smash decently and regain the health with Drain Punch. As for Aurorus, I switch to Clawitzer to take the Refrigerate Hyper Beam, and if I want to, KO back with Aura Sphere. If Aurorous has Snow Warning, instead, though, it's a simple matter of using Sunny Day, since it can't OHKO Togekiss.
Mold Breaker
These Pokemon can break through Aron's Sturdy in one hit. They gain priority for Aron to take out. The exception would be Hawlucha, which Togekiss can forever wall its Flying Presses from any of its positions, or even do massive damage with Air Slash.
Rampardos
It can potentially have Mold Breaker and can KO Togekiss on the first turn. If it attempts to EQ, I use Magnet Rise with Aron on the second turn and switch Togekiss out on the third turn while Protecting with Aron. If it Head Smashes Togekiss, I can use any of the other Pokemon to OHKO it.
Shuckle
More of an annoyance than an actual threat, but its extremely slow and can clear out Sunny Day for Sandstorm, which while beneficial for Aron, isn't pleasant on Dusclops and Togekiss
Mandibuzz
An odd Pokemon to have as a threat, but this thing has a tendency to Swagger on the first turn against Dusclops. This forces Togekiss to use Follow Me on turn 1 to take the Swagger to get Trick Room set up. It's a pain, but can be worked around with careful planning.
Blizzard users
Most notorious users are Focus Sash Glaceon and Focus Sash Cryogonal. To avoid a freeze on Dusclops, I preemptively use Heal Bell with Togekiss so that it can heal the freeze before its Dusclops' turn.
Sitrus Berry Bastiodon
Rock Slide can possibly flinch Dusclops and prevent it from using Trick Room, but thanks to its low Speed, Togekiss can outspeed it outside of Trick Room and get a flinch on it with Air Slash
Taunt users
I've only experienced two or three times Dusclops was Taunted, and only one of those times which prevented it from using Trick Room on the first turn. That Pokemon was Vanilluxe. Like with Mandibuzz, it's best to have Togekiss use Follow Me and have it absorb the Taunt for Dusclops.
I believe that covers just about all of the threats to this team. Now it's time for replays!
Battle #1000: RXWG-WWWW-WW2C-EYZ6
The proof that I did it! Not a terribly exciting match, but the other replays will show off how the run went.
These two show off how Dusclops, Aron, and Togekiss do in the best scenerio. Veterans tend to be the easier Trainers to face because the Genies like to use Focus Blast, Pokemon like Regirock uses Drain Punch, and Lati@s with Dragon moves. This was before I knew that Dragon Pulse was affected by Follow Me even from across the field.
Battle #681: HWVG-WWWW-WW2A-TSVB
I made some stupid mistakes in this match, like not using Foresight and using Swagger on Gengar when I JUST saw that it had Lum Berry. Heal Bell from Togekiss saved me in this match, though.
Battle #828: LHAG-WWWW-WW2C-EK4L
This is why I have Magnet Rise on Aron. Without it, Aron would've only made it to 2 or 3, but it was able to make it through the entire team
Battle #862: DEZG-WWWW-WW2C-ELXJ
Multiple TR users throughout the entire team. It can really screw with the entire strategy if the AI is able to and decides to use TR. This match was also when I started to want to switch Aegislash out.
Battle #876: 5THG-WWWW-WW2C-F68D
By far the closest match in my entire run. Trick Room users screwed me over, and Absol wanted to spread Swagger instead of using Punishment. I switched out Aegislash for Clawitzer a little while after this match happened, at the 900 mark.
I'm so glad I finally did it. Trying to do a 1000 win streak takes so much time, especially since this team is relatively slow going. I'll probably still continue this streak, but won't be grinding out wins nearly as much.
Cool team!
I wonder if something like Amoongus would work in togekiss' place? It has Spore and is considerably slower than togekiss.
Congrats on being the third person to get to 1000 in super triples with trick room!
I'd argue that it doesn't make a suitable replacement for Togekiss, for what he was mainly using Togekiss for. In my experiences with Aron, the AI happily ignores it when it can just as assuredly OHKO another teammate. Amoonguss' weakness to Overheat and Flare Blitz, common STAB moves on Set 4 pokes, as well as a weakness to Brave Bird and some occasional Sky Attacks mean that it'll frequently be forced to choose between Sporing to suit its own needs or Aron's.
Amoonguss worked far better in VGC because you were fighting a drastically narrower pool of possible enemies, and didn't have to account for all the "crummy" final forms that the Maison is able to produce, many of whom possessing the raw strength to land a KO with a supereffective attack.
Cool team!
I wonder if something like Amoongus would work in togekiss' place? It has Spore and is considerably slower than togekiss.
Congrats on being the third person to get to 1000 in super triples with trick room!
Thanks! Amoongus is an interesting idea, though ReptoAbysmal does have a point. If any of the other two teammates can be OHKO'd, that'll draw attention away from Aron. Eviolite Dusclops has insane bulk so it avoids being OHKO'd at all, and as for Togekiss, its limited to Head Smashers and Hyper Beam from Refrigerate Aurorus. Conkeldurr can take any Head Smash and OHKO and heal itself with Drain Punch, while Clawitzer can take a Hyper Beam. Amoonguss does have great bulk, but it does have some drawbacks when compared to Togekiss. I would definitely miss having Heal Bell, and the ability to hit non-adjacent Pokemon with Air Slash
I am curious to how it would work in practice, though. I might put together a set and test it in some mock battles, if I find myself with nothing else to do in the game.
I actually got fascinated by the idea myself and bred myself up an Amoongus last night. It works quite well actually. For the most part I would agree with you, ReptoAbysmal, but I have to say that in the 20 battles or something I've done I greatly appreciate its ability to use spore and its significantly lower speed.
I am currently trying this team:
And well its not as bulky as dusclops it still can take multiple hits and kebia berry patches up its ko against nidoking3 etc. Some might say that odor sleuth would be better, but heal pulse is AWESOME in conjunction with amoongus and octillery
Rage powder goes wonderful with aron. Spore is AWESOME especially in TR. I really like it as a substitute for togekiss. The 30 speed tier is great combined with good overall defenses.
Ampharos might not be your first choice for a TR team but I unfortunately don't have ORAS yet so I have my hands tied to Abomasnow Hail. Mawile. Too inaccurate. Aggron. Yeah just kinda don't like it. So I went with Ampharos. Thunderbolt and dragonulse are its main STABs and power gem is for coverage.
Probably my favorite part of the team. I wanted a spread attacker to take advantage of helping hand so I chose this. Choice specs boosted water spout is actually strong than both M-Camerupts and M-Blastoises eruptions and water spouts respectively. The others are mostly filler.
I wanted another spread attacker so I took VaporeonIce's sylveon. Unfortunately, due to having to run choice specs on Octillery I have to run Life orb.
I actually really like this team and I think I'll keep going and try and make a streak.
I think if I were to try Amoonguss out I would also have to replace Conkeldurr because they share both a Psychic and Flying weakness. I think Eacavalier would work as a replacement, though.
Escavalier would shake things up a bit too much. To get kills with its bare bones (but better than previous gen) movepool it NEEDS the Life Orb. STABless Drill Run does shit damage without it and Iron Head is needed to be powered up if it's going to be one of its primary attacks. Also, Escavalier + Amoonguss share a Fire weakness, which Veterans and Punk Girls are rife with, among others. Veterans stand out in particular because of their BSTs and frequent Bug/Steel-resistant typings making them difficult to KO. Conkeldurr is not nearly as easily checked by them.
When I used a Mega Ampharos of my own, Focus Blast was badly needed for coverage and KO-security, and I also had a lead that could activate Gravity to support the team. M-Amphy was pegged early on as a rather underwhelming Mega despite its boons and very solid BST for this reason. Thunderbolt and Dragon Pulse hit hard but generally do not sweep because of their narrow list of coverage coupled with merely moderately high base power. Notice that the other extremely popular megas compensate via boosts (which Amphy does not have; not relevant to TR at least) or better abilities than Mold Breaker, like Mega Launcher or "-ate" abilities which are like life orbs for already very powerful moves.
I'm wondering if Aron would make a suitable deterrent in most cases for Octillery? While I've never used it for more than ten battles, my favorite thing to do with Octillery was give it a Scope Lens and open with Focus Energy (leading with it) and then launching extremely overpowered, buff-ignoring attacks. Supereffective Ice Beam and Energy Ball are able to punch through a lot, and Rain Dance Water Spout at full power will nuke even special walls.
The problem he'd have, which I occasionally had, was the abundance of Grass/Electric types. While a lot of them carry Power Herb-less Solar Beam and will use it stupidly, there are enough things like Ampharos4, Serperior4, Gogoat4, Magnezone4 and so on, pokes that are not rare, which will happily target it instead of Aron and make it a waste.
The thing that stops me from saying he can't reach 100 or 200 wins with that team is the fact that I've done so with worse.
Aron @ Berry Juice
Ability: Sturdy
-Endeavor
-Sunny Day
-Toxic
-Protect
The idea is to go for dual FEAR cheese, with Friend Guard Clefairy buffing Aromatisse's bulk so it can survive every non-CH attack in the Maison, barring OHKO moves. In addition to Friend Guard, Clefairy has Follow Me, which it can use against Walrein on the center or the left to absorb the OHKO move to ensure that Trick Room succeeds. Gravity provides additional utility against evasive foes, and affects everyone for several turns, which is more efficient for guaranteeing accuracy than Odor Sleuth, and allows Aroma to keep attacking.
Aromatisse is EV'd to survive Tyrantrum4 Head Smash and Gunk Shots on the physical side, and Gengar4 Sludge Bomb CH on the special side with a Friend Guard boost. Since Lv16 Clefairy only has 48 HP, the remaining EVs are dumped into Special Attack so that Aromatisse can KO a larger number of 48HP foes with Dazzling Gleam/HP Ground - with given EVs, Dazzling Gleam will deal 48 minimum damage to neutral targets with 81 or less base Special Defense, assuming no investment. HP Ground is needed for Bastiodon, which may otherwise use Wide Guard to block Dazzling Gleam.
Since Aron is on the side, it could attempt to use Sunny Day on Turn 1 against Hail, as it can only be hit by two attacks instead of three unlike center Aron.
Escavalier would shake things up a bit too much. To get kills with its bare bones (but better than previous gen) movepool it NEEDS the Life Orb. STABless Drill Run does shit damage without it and Iron Head is needed to be powered up if it's going to be one of its primary attacks. Also, Escavalier + Amoonguss share a Fire weakness, which Veterans and Punk Girls are rife with, among others. Veterans stand out in particular because of their BSTs and frequent Bug/Steel-resistant typings making them difficult to KO. Conkeldurr is not nearly as easily checked by them.
When I used a Mega Ampharos of my own, Focus Blast was badly needed for coverage and KO-security, and I also had a lead that could activate Gravity to support the team. M-Amphy was pegged early on as a rather underwhelming Mega despite its boons and very solid BST for this reason. Thunderbolt and Dragon Pulse hit hard but generally do not sweep because of their narrow list of coverage coupled with merely moderately high base power. Notice that the other extremely popular megas compensate via boosts (which Amphy does not have; not relevant to TR at least) or better abilities than Mold Breaker, like Mega Launcher or "-ate" abilities which are like life orbs for already very powerful moves.
I'm wondering if Aron would make a suitable deterrent in most cases for Octillery? While I've never used it for more than ten battles, my favorite thing to do with Octillery was give it a Scope Lens and open with Focus Energy (leading with it) and then launching extremely overpowered, buff-ignoring attacks. Supereffective Ice Beam and Energy Ball are able to punch through a lot, and Rain Dance Water Spout at full power will nuke even special walls.
The problem he'd have, which I occasionally had, was the abundance of Grass/Electric types. While a lot of them carry Power Herb-less Solar Beam and will use it stupidly, there are enough things like Ampharos4, Serperior4, Gogoat4, Magnezone4 and so on, pokes that are not rare, which will happily target it instead of Aron and make it a waste.
The thing that stops me from saying he can't reach 100 or 200 wins with that team is the fact that I've done so with worse.
Octillery doesn't have the bulk to survive many super effective attacks so it is pretty likely that it will die first turn if its lacking protect. Meaning it cant run choice specs and non-Specs Octillery is kind of underwhelming and completely out classed by M-Camerupt.
I'm fairly sure you can use level one clefairy with follow me as long as you breed a male clefairy and a female clefairy both with follow me it will pass it down.
I'm fairly sure you can use level one clefairy with follow me as long as you breed a male clefairy and a female clefairy both with follow me it will pass it down
The baby will be Cleffa. Cleffa cannot learn Follow Me as an egg move or by level-up, so it cannot get the move at all. The egg will not hatch into Clefairy, so the only way to get Follow Me is to evolve and level it up to lv16.
