SPOILERS! Mysteries and Conspiracies of Pokemon

[Pikachu315111]

Uh, super necrobump for another ghost post...
I know we've already gone over a couple of ghostly gals, but in Phoebe's room in OR AS, there is a ghost child that appears right when the challenge screen comes up. It's on the armchair behind her to her right. After the battle, when the camera is facing your right shoulder, the ghost can be seen behind your left side.

Why is it there? Does Phoebe have some ghosts in her past? Or did she summon it using some paranormal power to mess with your mind? According to bulbapedia, the ghost child's gender is the opposite of yours...

(Sorry if we discussed this and I missed it)

In the Special manga Phoebe has a dead sister, but if the child changes gender depending on your character then it's probably not a reference to that. It also busts the theory that it could be the spirit of her grandmother. Hmm, maybe I can spin a creepypasta from this. The dead child is actually your fraternal twin that died in the womb. Though they died, they're spirit lived on and has helped guide you though you never knew it. When you went on your journey your twin spirit followed you, that is until they spotted Zinnia disguised as a grunt (the cutscene in Petalburg Woods where the player leaves and Zinnia is seen is from the perspective of your twin). Realizing something is wrong and it can threaten you, mom, and dad, your twin leaves you and follows Zinnia and learns about her plans. The twin goes to Mt. Pyre to see if it could do something... which is when it meets Phoebe who can communicate with it. The twin tells her about itself and Zinnia's plan though Phoebe knows there's nothing they can do to stop Team Magma/Aqua from stealing the but can prepare a plan to stop the Legendary. Phoebe tells the plan to her grandparents as your twin goes back to help guide continue guiding you. At Mt. Pyre the villain team steals the orb as expected though thanks to your twin and Phoebe's plan you're there to take the other orb that sets up you stopping the Legendary; which you do. After so your twin continues guiding you though when you face Phoebe in the Elite Four, but to thank the spirit for helping save Hoenn Phoebe makes it so that the you're able to see each other face-to-face (though the player doesn't seem to know this and focuses on the battle which at that point the twin becomes invisible again).

BUT anyway the game provides no explanation so I think you should just take it as spookiness for spooky sake. ;)

NEW MYSTERY: So in Alpha Sapphire if you go into Shelly's room she has a picture of her, Archie, and Jirachi. Do you think there's any significance to this?

 

[Karxrida]

NEW MYSTERY: So in Alpha Sapphire if you go into Shelly's room she has a picture of her, Archie, and Jirachi. Do you think there's any significance to this?

I think it's just a Mythology Gag (look it up on TV Tropes, too lazy to turn the words into a link) to Adventures.

 

[Codraroll]

Uh, super necrobump for another ghost post...
I know we've already gone over a couple of ghostly gals, but in Phoebe's room in OR AS, there is a ghost child that appears right when the challenge screen comes up. It's on the armchair behind her to her right. After the battle, when the camera is facing your right shoulder, the ghost can be seen behind your left side.

Why is it there? Does Phoebe have some ghosts in her past? Or did she summon it using some paranormal power to mess with your mind? According to bulbapedia, the ghost child's gender is the opposite of yours...

(Sorry if we discussed this and I missed it)

My pet theory: The approach to Phoebe's room is so ghastly and scary, and the player so nervous for the Elite Four battles, that he/she is hallucinating. After defeating the Elite Four once, though, they know the drill a little better, relax more, and the hallucinations never appear again.

 

[stage7_4]

Posting this from the unpopular opinion thread, since it got relevant there. I had a running theory that the reason that guns and weapons and similar tech don't show up in Pokemon games (err, that is besides the obvious reasons of ESRB and tone) was because pokemon are so easy to obtain, use, and find that the tech just never developed. Without necessity, what's the point? This could also apply to private cars, boats, and other transportation too. We see some examples of each, but most are either commercial, mass transit, or for freight. And despite some roads, the layout of each region encourages pedestrians.

But another reason came up in my big Platinum replay: society didn't invest heavily in weapons tech because if they did pokemon would abandon them. Or worse, turn on them.

The source is the Veilstone Myth in the Canclave library, where a young man pleads with pokemon for forgiveness after slaying several of them. The pokemon threaten him with violence, until the man breaks his sword. They leave, but don't necessarily forgive him either, since it states they go somewhere he can't see them.

So if the in-universe myth is to be believed, if man developed and/or used weapons tech, pokemon would either leave entirely or become aggressive and violent in turn (instead of the weird territorial/friendship-seeking attitude of wild pokemon). Since pokemon seem to greatly outnumber humans, and can command the powers of the elements themselves, this could be a weird enforced harmony with nature theme. Prevent forest fires or Smokey the Ursaring will eat you. So to speak.

One point of clarification is that the myth speaks of using weapons on pokemon, not "do no war." Since war has been mentioned on occasion (Lt. Surge, Kalos, etc). So a pokemon only war is entirely possible, I guess. And the only confirmed and explicit use of a weapon in pokemon was the "ultimate weapon" where the user (AZ) did have his pokemon abandon him for over 1000 years. He later got a few others, but that might have taken 1000 years of community service to smooth over too.

Lysandre also attempted to use the weapon, but his pokemon never turned on him. So that's a snag in the theory, unless pokemon only respond after the act. Or they sensed his intentions were... misguided?... instead of flat-out malicious like the Veilstone swordsman.

Lastly, yes I know guns were used a few times in the Anime. But I'm talking about the games so I'm ignoring that.

 

[Norne]

Take it with a grain of salt, Canalave is also relevant to some for yiffing purposes... Another of the problems that come with GF going full rainbow Llama.

 

[stage7_4]

Take it with a grain of salt, Canalave is also relevant to some for yiffing purposes... Another of the problems that come with GF going full rainbow Llama.

...uh yeah... I guess so? (please don't clarify that, I don't want to know).

But you're right in that we're talking about a myth within an already fictional world. But when told to make house and only given hay, you get a house made of hay (or a weak theory based on limited evidence).

Especially when the hard evidence has Magcargo's hot enough to ignite the atmosphere and Wailord's made out of helium. But the pokedex is pack of scandalous lies made by fifth graders that dropped out of school.

 

[Karxrida]

I tend to believe anything mythology related in Pokemon, because the stuff with the Legendaries is often shown to be true. The Beasts were found in the bottom of the Burned Tower as statues, Giratina is trapped in another dimension, Kyogre and Groudon can and will screw with the weather, etc.

The Pokedex might be full of BS but the myths are always right.

 

[Fire-breather Richard]

Pokemon hatched from Egg at Lv 5 (later changed to Lv 1 ). In order to increase in levels, they need to battle other Pokemon to gain EXP (and also gain EV) so they become stronger in the process. However, the Wild Pokemon you encounter always have 0 EVs despite being at a high level.

 

[DHR-107]

Pokemon hatched from Egg at Lv 5 (later changed to Lv 1 ). In order to increase in levels, they need to battle other Pokemon to gain EXP (and also gain EV) so they become stronger in the process. However, the Wild Pokemon you encounter always have 0 EVs despite being at a high level.

Maybe they just happened to get the exact XP required to obtain that level...

stage7_4 I made a post referencing the technology of Pokemon here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...racies-of-pokemon.3514991/page-2#post-5681066 Similarly, I could not come up with a reasonable solution to the issues that this makes. Adding in your ideas about the warfare, and a sprinkling of the "Kanto War" story, you end up in a rather odd position.

Either: In the relatively close past, a massive war ravaged most of the continents of the "Poke World", mostly in Kanto as there is a direct lack of Males of any form (especially in positions of power, Surge/Koga are the only "Middle aged" male leads who aren't involved in crime). We can use Surge as evidence of there definitely being a war within the last 15~20 years. This causes laws about weapons technology to be massively restrained, only then used by "baddies" such as TR or Galactic etc. This pushes most technology manufacturers into looking at personal devices/power technology/environmental controls etc.
Or: As you say, Pokemon themselves fought back against the creation of weapons technology in the first place. This meant that they themselves were used as weapons in a war which must have happened.

As such, the "Old War" which is talked about in XY, where Pokemon of various types are used, the warfare in Pokemon Conquest and then onwards to the mentions of war from Surge, "Poke World" has a violent past. Whether or not it is due to Pokemon or not, who knows.

 

[Roseguardin]

Posting this from the unpopular opinion thread, since it got relevant there. I had a running theory that the reason that guns and weapons and similar tech don't show up in Pokemon games (err, that is besides the obvious reasons of ESRB and tone) was because pokemon are so easy to obtain, use, and find that the tech just never developed. Without necessity, what's the point? This could also apply to private cars, boats, and other transportation too. We see some examples of each, but most are either commercial, mass transit, or for freight. And despite some roads, the layout of each region encourages pedestrians.

But another reason came up in my big Platinum replay: society didn't invest heavily in weapons tech because if they did pokemon would abandon them. Or worse, turn on them.

The source is the Veilstone Myth in the Canclave library, where a young man pleads with pokemon for forgiveness after slaying several of them. The pokemon threaten him with violence, until the man breaks his sword. They leave, but don't necessarily forgive him either, since it states they go somewhere he can't see them.

So if the in-universe myth is to be believed, if man developed and/or used weapons tech, pokemon would either leave entirely or become aggressive and violent in turn (instead of the weird territorial/friendship-seeking attitude of wild pokemon). Since pokemon seem to greatly outnumber humans, and can command the powers of the elements themselves, this could be a weird enforced harmony with nature theme. Prevent forest fires or Smokey the Ursaring will eat you. So to speak.

One point of clarification is that the myth speaks of using weapons on pokemon, not "do no war." Since war has been mentioned on occasion (Lt. Surge, Kalos, etc). So a pokemon only war is entirely possible, I guess. And the only confirmed and explicit use of a weapon in pokemon was the "ultimate weapon" where the user (AZ) did have his pokemon abandon him for over 1000 years. He later got a few others, but that might have taken 1000 years of community service to smooth over too.

Lysandre also attempted to use the weapon, but his pokemon never turned on him. So that's a snag in the theory, unless pokemon only respond after the act. Or they sensed his intentions were... misguided?... instead of flat-out malicious like the Veilstone swordsman.

Lastly, yes I know guns were used a few times in the Anime. But I'm talking about the games so I'm ignoring that.

One source I read (not sure if Bulbapedia) theorized that the Veilstone Pokemon was Giratina, because after the Pokemon sees him break his sword, it flees to a place beyond seeing, and Veilstone is the closest human settlement to Turn back Cave. Of course, Giratina would've been sealed away long before the human came to be. It's also questionable why Giratina would care about a world it was never allowed to see.

Sinnoh in particular has a lot of these myths on Pokemon and their relationship with humans, from the lake guardian myths to the one about "blessing the pokemon's spirit after killing it so that it can rise anew", possibly because it's closer to the point of origin of the whole world. If there was a region where a Poke-war didn't happen on a large scale, I'd probably guess Sinnoh.

My point being is that every region's perspective on weapons tech varied at some point. DHR-107's Kanto War story is a pretty interesting explanation for that region, while the people of Hoenn and Unova where influenced by the sheer power of the weather trio/tao dragons. As for Johto...I'm not exactly sure, but possibly the fates of the twin towers of Ecruteak were involved?

Sorry if this seems incoherent

EDIT: wtf brightobject
totally didn't see the deleted post until now

 

[Codraroll]

My personal theory is that GameFreak makes up backstory to suit the situation at hand, not to have any sort of coherent mythology. If they want a veteran war fighter pilot, they'll write one in, implications be damned. If they want an excuse for filling a Route with tombstones, and tie it to whatever fancy the Evil Team is up to this time 'round, they'll write that too. Remember how both Sinnoh and Kalos have deserts at the same latitude as perpetually snowy routes? GameFreak takes huge liberties with geography depending on what gameplay they want to present, and I'm certain they look at history the same way. If one character said there was war in Region X 100 years ago, and another says that no humans came to Region X until 50 years ago, and a third say Region X has seen 500 years of unbroken peace, while standing outside a temple allegedly 2000 years old, that's no problem. GameFreak has no aversion to contradictions, and trying to make sense of it all will sooner or later end up in a futile mess.

 

[Random Passerby]

Maybe they just happened to get the exact XP required to obtain that level...

While this might be possible, the newly captured Pokemon also has 0 EVs in everything, which is impossible because you will gain EXP and EV as you battle to level up. Unless there is an Infinite supply of Rare Candies around, this might be Gameplay and Story Segregation though.

 

[Codraroll]

^Well, the Rare Candies seem to prove that there are more ways to level up than through experience. Isn't there a meal in Join Avenue, and a juice in the Juice Shoppe, which also levels up Pokémon? It seems like levelling through experience is only one of the ways for a Pokémon to grow, and this is not emulated in nature. Maybe it requires the guidance of a trainer.

Or, well, gameplay and story segregation. I think "let's have an item that levels up a Pokémon" was conceived long before they considered the story-related implications to how this all happened.

 

[MK]

Here's one: how does/would Inkay evolve in the anime?

I only speak of this because Jessie's Pumpkaboo evolved, not sure what they will do with Inkay.

 

[Lady Vader]

Here's one: how does/would Inkay evolve in the anime?

I only speak of this because Jessie's Pumpkaboo evolved, not sure what they will do with Inkay.

I'm guessing that someone will hold Inkay upside down and it will evolve.

 

[Darth Manaphy]

Maybe it'll get knocked upside down by something and it'll evolve that way.

 

[Roseguardin]

Perhaps James will drop it on its head

 

[Cresselia~~]

Here's one: how does/would Inkay evolve in the anime?

I only speak of this because Jessie's Pumpkaboo evolved, not sure what they will do with Inkay.

I don't think it will evolve.
Malamar is a master villain that's more vile than Team Rocket in the anime, and Malamar is a recurring character.
Jame's Inkay apparently was against it.
So I don't think Jame's Inkay will evolve at all.

 

[Pikachu315111]

I don't think it will evolve.
Malamar is a master villain that's more vile than Team Rocket in the anime, and Malamar is a recurring character.
Jame's Inkay apparently was against it.
So I don't think Jame's Inkay will evolve at all.

There was an episode with good Malamar who lived peacefully in a forest with a group of Inkay. That episode had the evil Malamar plus two others appear and Clemont and James (everyone else plus an Officer Jenny following the evil Malamar (who was the Jenny that was hypnotised by it in its first appearance) we captured) had to as the good Malamar to help which they did.

So if anything Inkay could evolve just so it could fight against the evil Malamar. I can imagine that Ash & co. and Team Rocket are fighting against the evil Malamar and an attack caused James and Inkay to fall off a high place. James hold onto Inkay (as they flip upside down) and that's when Inkay would evolve to save James and hold its own against the evil Malamar. I also wouldn't be surprised if this happened at the end of the XY series and James releases Inkay now Malamar so it could continue its battle against the Evil Malamar (maybe even teaming up with the Officer Jenny also working to arrest the evil Malamar).

 

[Karxrida]

I was told the following info on a different forum without a link, so please take it with a grain of salt.

According to the April Nintendo Dream interview with the ORAS director (the one that revealed how Mega Flygon was planned), Aster was the Lorekeeper before Zinnia and had some kind of unspecified power that Zinnia lacks.

Aster being Zinnia's daughter now seems extremely unlikely, if not impossible.

 

[Roseguardin]

I was told the following info on a different forum without a link, so please take it with a grain of salt.

According to the April Nintendo Dream interview with the ORAS director (the one that revealed how Mega Flygon was planned), Aster was the Lorekeeper before Zinnia and had some kind of unspecified power that Zinnia lacks.

I did hear about the Mega Flygon thing and the Aster predecessor. Apparently Aster died before the asteroid came and Zinnia took it upon herself to save the world...I don't remember where I heard that so take it with another grain of salt.

 

[Pikachu315111]

I was told the following info on a different forum without a link, so please take it with a grain of salt.

According to the April Nintendo Dream interview with the ORAS director (the one that revealed how Mega Flygon was planned), Aster was the Lorekeeper before Zinnia and had some kind of unspecified power that Zinnia lacks.

Aster being Zinnia's daughter now seems extremely unlikely, if not impossible.

I kind of had a thought that Aster may have had been a Lorekeeper since it seems implied at some point the Lorekeeper would have to (or at least be willing to) sacrifice themselves. The player help break that cycle by being given the title from Zinnia and not sacrificing themselves because a suit meant to handle underwater pressure would let us survive on the boundaries of the upper atmosphere, right?

It still doesn't reveal much about Aster though.

 

[HelenTheHero]

Like if Aster did die before the meteor, why is she/he a Pokemon now?

*EDIT* Or like Pikachu315111 said, the Whismur could just be named after him/her.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Like if Aster did die before the meteor, why is she/he a Pokemon now?

Because Zinnia's Whismur is not Aster, just named after her.

 

[IcyMan28]

I always suspected that Zinnia was not meant to be the lorekeeper, since there is a missing link between the grandmother at Meteor falls and Zinnia. Interesting that Aster (A) begot lorekeeper Zinnia (Z).