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Hearthstone [IRC Channel #Skillstone]
- Thread starter LonelyNess
- Start date
Hey, I've been doing fairly well (89% win rate at rank 15 barely means anything but hey) with a modified netdeck, and was hoping you guys would be willing to take a look at it and see how I can improve it.
It's a Paladin Zoo deck, aiming to gain board control and go on the aggressive before the opponent can drop too many huge minions. The original deck didn't have that many deathrattles and was running the Wonder Twins, which I don't have, so I swapped out the Leper Gnomes for Worgen Infiltrators and dumped in Scarlet Purifiers, which so far have been incredible against aggro and really effective at helping dudes to pop open Shredders and the like. Also yeah those are Echoing Oozes, it was in the original deck too so I'm not totally insane. I feel like they're actually pretty strong in this sort of deck since they're great buff targets and can put a couple bodies out early that are annoying for slow decks to remove separately, as well as getting additional Knife Juggler triggers.
Anyways, once I get my hands on Gormok I'm gonna try that out, but for now I'm not sure what I could improve on atm.
It's a Paladin Zoo deck, aiming to gain board control and go on the aggressive before the opponent can drop too many huge minions. The original deck didn't have that many deathrattles and was running the Wonder Twins, which I don't have, so I swapped out the Leper Gnomes for Worgen Infiltrators and dumped in Scarlet Purifiers, which so far have been incredible against aggro and really effective at helping dudes to pop open Shredders and the like. Also yeah those are Echoing Oozes, it was in the original deck too so I'm not totally insane. I feel like they're actually pretty strong in this sort of deck since they're great buff targets and can put a couple bodies out early that are annoying for slow decks to remove separately, as well as getting additional Knife Juggler triggers.
Anyways, once I get my hands on Gormok I'm gonna try that out, but for now I'm not sure what I could improve on atm.
pretty sure creeper > ooze unless you have blessing of might / gormok / sea giant. experiment with nerubian eggs / BoM / argent protector / arcane golem. generally pally rush decks work a little better with some reach and ways to snowball a threat like a blessing'd argent squire or minibot. for the most part your gameplan is to control the board early, then start going face mid to late-game and making a few choice trades when your card quality can't match up and you want to close out the game.
if you make changes for more burst then i would recommend lepers > worgens. lepers are an almost guaranteed 2 face damage, and 4 most of the time, whereas a worgen is only an almost guaranteed 2, with the upside of being stickier for a t2 buff.
if you make changes for more burst then i would recommend lepers > worgens. lepers are an almost guaranteed 2 face damage, and 4 most of the time, whereas a worgen is only an almost guaranteed 2, with the upside of being stickier for a t2 buff.
Hey all, decided to try an open tournament today and strapped to figure out a lineup in time I threw these together last night. I wanted to play patron cause I'm comfortable with it and because it's great all around. The other two decks are there because whether you want to build around patron or counter it, I see a ton of druid in lineups. Plus in a really big tournament I wanted to homebrew a little and stand out. A bit of reasoning:
Warlock - everyone's playing handlock, so I wanted to try my hand at an all in fast zoo ala the old days, especially since people don't seem to have standardized that list yet. Doesn't run the Voidcaller package, but still keeps eggs and creepers for early board control.
Priest - I really wanted to go in with a tempo priest build that counters dragon priest, druid, and other midrange/aggro decks while straight up losing to handlock and control warrior. Gives me a fighting chance against patron too. Probably the most controversial changes this deck makes to more standard priests are the two injured kvaldirs, the smite, and the Fjola. The kvaldirs make circle drawing while developing a board incredibly consistent, and the Fjola is that 3rd dark cultist with a decent upside.
Anyway, I'm curious what you all think. I'll update later with results if people are curious.
Edit: Bricked pretty hard in the tournament but that was actually a result of my patron games and queue decisions. The zoo and priest did their job very effectively as druidkillers and could get free wins agains tons of other midrangey decks with a fighting chance against nongreedy control. I'll be testing those more over the course of the week.
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got legend playing cancer pally deck with like an 80 percent win ratio, its disgusting how the deck requires no decision making. you just play shit thats in your hand and go for the face most of the time.
whatever at least i can play rogue again until season reset
whatever at least i can play rogue again until season reset
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seriously i have tried the finalized mid-range deck and it shouldn't be as good as it is. For a deck that is so poorly fucking crafted (I mean that) it just rolls over everything. It's dumb to a huge point.
yeah secret pally
literally just copied this https://tempostorm.com/hearthstone/decks/hybrid-secret-paladin and facerolled my way to legend. i havent tried the secretkeeper version with divine favors but i doubt i will anytime soon
Gotcha. Yeah that deck is disgustingly good. I run the same thing except -1 Competitive Spirit and -1 Kings for two Secretkeepers. Comp Spirit is pretty consistently horrible for me and 2 Kings is pretty clunky sometimes, I like the consistency of faster starts with SKeeper
And yes it's quite the brainless deck.
I don't think there are enough dragons in there to support the dragon synergy you have, especially the early game champions, maybe add 2 more midrange dragons. Plus it's kinda strange to give up on Corrupters when you're running dragon synergy, I'd usually see them over belcher here. You can cut belcher for harrison if you want, but you don't really need to run harrison in a deck that makes most weapons awkward by playing guardian on 4. If you want to counter patrons, you want harrison, but also likely a second brawl and justicar. Chillmaw is kinda hard to run too, I think Nefarian might get more use in a longer game. But the 7 slot not being boom is a huge weakness of this being a dragon deck.
Hope this helps. I usually like to cut dragon synergy if a deck is this close to regular control warriors but something like this can be viable.
Hope this helps. I usually like to cut dragon synergy if a deck is this close to regular control warriors but something like this can be viable.
Varian is trash and you should remove him along with Chill, the Belchers, the acolytes, and both Shield Blocks imo. The Twilight Guardians are basically your substitute for the Belchers anyway.
Add in two Azure Drakes, Nefarian, two Blackwing Corrupter, two Blackwing Tech, and another bash. Dragon Warrior is more tempo based and a lot of those cards you've included are way too slow.
Anyway I've been having a blast playing OTK Mage
Since the ladder is just full Warrior right now it's basically just giving me the win (assuming I can go through all the animations :P)
Add in two Azure Drakes, Nefarian, two Blackwing Corrupter, two Blackwing Tech, and another bash. Dragon Warrior is more tempo based and a lot of those cards you've included are way too slow.
Anyway I've been having a blast playing OTK Mage
Since the ladder is just full Warrior right now it's basically just giving me the win (assuming I can go through all the animations :P)
how do you get off the OTK without multiple thaurissan activations, which is almost impossible to do reliably without duplicate.
TheValkyries
proudly reppin' 2 superbowl wins since DEFLATEGATE
that deck is silly. You're silly.
nonono you gotta go full extreme otk druid or bust
I mean, every class theoretically has OTK. Some are good, some are not, but all are extremely fun. I personally love Freeze Priest because nobody sees it coming and Priest is typically not known for burst damage.
(I have also had a Priest play Velen+2x Flash Heal on turn 7 when I was about to kill him as Face Hunter. Fuck Thaurissan.)
I mean, every class theoretically has OTK. Some are good, some are not, but all are extremely fun. I personally love Freeze Priest because nobody sees it coming and Priest is typically not known for burst damage.
(I have also had a Priest play Velen+2x Flash Heal on turn 7 when I was about to kill him as Face Hunter. Fuck Thaurissan.)
Either if the OTK Mage is silly or not this is the deck I'm going to run to Legend (it's gotten to me to rank 5 without much trouble currently at about a 65% win rate with it)
I call it a homebrew but I'm sure there is a Dragon Warrior that is card-for-card out there. It plays as a midrange deck and has handled Druid (both the cancer and combo versions), Mage, Dragon Priest, and other Warriors (both Patron and Control) rather easily. The only cards I'm considering to cut are the Shield Slams, but they pair so well with the Bash it's really hard to give them up. I was considering cutting them for more card draw but the Drakes have been doing a pretty good job.
I call it a homebrew but I'm sure there is a Dragon Warrior that is card-for-card out there. It plays as a midrange deck and has handled Druid (both the cancer and combo versions), Mage, Dragon Priest, and other Warriors (both Patron and Control) rather easily. The only cards I'm considering to cut are the Shield Slams, but they pair so well with the Bash it's really hard to give them up. I was considering cutting them for more card draw but the Drakes have been doing a pretty good job.
trumpW DansGame
http://www.hearthpwn.com/blue-tracker/topic/13973-upcoming-balance-change-to-warsong-commander
Well this certainly shakes things up.
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Patron, go home! You're drunk!
In all seriousness though, I'm actually fine with this change. It obviously wasn't my first choice, but people at the subreddit are really throwing a hissy fit over something they can't do anything about lol. Same thing happened with Buzzard, though. My stance regarding the deck as a whole has always been that 1) it limits design space: the main reason Blizzard did this nerf and, if you think about it, every nerf since the game came out of beta and 2) it stifles deckbuilding: you are forced to consider Patron if you are considering a new deck idea/concept. It's why Control hasn't been very good outside of Control Warrior among other reasons, IMO. You can't really go late when you're dead by turn 8.
Well they murdered warsong harder than buzzard, now it doesn't even work as intended. It's clear that cards like Frothing or even screwjank clunker were possibly designed with warsong in mind. Blizzard had always pushed an enrage warrior archetype; Amani and worgen started with less than 3 attack, and buffed to greater than that to reflect this. I would have liked to see at least a cost increase, over a murdering of functionality, there's got to be a better way to give +1 attack to your korkron elite. Charge is dangerous, but you can balance with a scalpel rather than a hatchet.
As for the argument that something like this limits design space, that's absolutely true, but hard to avoid in almost any case because hearthstone is an eternal format. How well did bolster warrior work out? That's most of the warrior class cards right down the drain there. Each expansion we get subtle changes to old archetypes, and as a result we get huge differences. I haven't played handlock seriously in months, and it's a completely different deck now. Why? Because as a control deck it needs to adapt to the tools it's given and the tools other decks now have to beat it. The best way to change the game is with cards like bash and flash heal, cards that are debatable to play, but justifiable under the right context.
I'm sad my patrons are going away but I guess I could see this coming. What I never got is why people always call you a scumbag for playing the deck. Just because most streamers and stream chats are bored with it doesn't mean that the deck itself was bad for the game, easy to play, or even dense on the ladder anywhere but top 100 legend in the off season. I guess it was frustrating to play against, but most people figured out how to do that by this point. I never got bored with it, and I hope that later on we can find a viable deck that's just as interesting in its complexity. Until then, I'll be playing my patrons until the nerf hits.
Although I wonder if it's still possible to compromise, and make a viable deck without warsongs, make it midrange, throw in the non charge patrons, and put grom combo back in for a finisher. But the oppressive removal landscape of the game, and even the stickiness of the minions in slots close to 5 make that unlikely imo.
As for the argument that something like this limits design space, that's absolutely true, but hard to avoid in almost any case because hearthstone is an eternal format. How well did bolster warrior work out? That's most of the warrior class cards right down the drain there. Each expansion we get subtle changes to old archetypes, and as a result we get huge differences. I haven't played handlock seriously in months, and it's a completely different deck now. Why? Because as a control deck it needs to adapt to the tools it's given and the tools other decks now have to beat it. The best way to change the game is with cards like bash and flash heal, cards that are debatable to play, but justifiable under the right context.
I'm sad my patrons are going away but I guess I could see this coming. What I never got is why people always call you a scumbag for playing the deck. Just because most streamers and stream chats are bored with it doesn't mean that the deck itself was bad for the game, easy to play, or even dense on the ladder anywhere but top 100 legend in the off season. I guess it was frustrating to play against, but most people figured out how to do that by this point. I never got bored with it, and I hope that later on we can find a viable deck that's just as interesting in its complexity. Until then, I'll be playing my patrons until the nerf hits.
Although I wonder if it's still possible to compromise, and make a viable deck without warsongs, make it midrange, throw in the non charge patrons, and put grom combo back in for a finisher. But the oppressive removal landscape of the game, and even the stickiness of the minions in slots close to 5 make that unlikely imo.
The hard counter to secret paladin is playing good decks because it's bad.
Yeah I know Warsong "limits design space" but they probably could've just given it the Buzzard treatment and make it cost 5+ mana and it would've been good enough to tone down the insane OTKs Patron is currently capable of, without completely ruining its functionality. Same with the oft-mentioned suggestion to make it an aura instead of a permanent buff on minions entering the battlefield, that still lets it work with Patron but stops 20+ Frothings swinging it. I don't see how that's going to seriously limit their design space in the future other than they can never give Warrior a functional copy of Dreadsteed?
Real problem is/was Thaurissan is dumb but once Blizzard chose the path of even releasing him with that ability, well I don't think anything's happening to him anytime soon even though he's the real enabler of this and so many other ridiculous shit because lolbroken.
Yeah I know Warsong "limits design space" but they probably could've just given it the Buzzard treatment and make it cost 5+ mana and it would've been good enough to tone down the insane OTKs Patron is currently capable of, without completely ruining its functionality. Same with the oft-mentioned suggestion to make it an aura instead of a permanent buff on minions entering the battlefield, that still lets it work with Patron but stops 20+ Frothings swinging it. I don't see how that's going to seriously limit their design space in the future other than they can never give Warrior a functional copy of Dreadsteed?
Real problem is/was Thaurissan is dumb but once Blizzard chose the path of even releasing him with that ability, well I don't think anything's happening to him anytime soon even though he's the real enabler of this and so many other ridiculous shit because lolbroken.