And what about the dragon that does not learn it ? Garchomp is the first one I think and Flygon ?
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Pokémon Movepool Oddities & Explanations
- Thread starter Kurona
- Start date
dialganet
Banned deucer.
Not giving Garchomp DD was one of the few wise moves they probably made to not create completely broken stuff. It doesn't make sense from a typing, lore (see pseudo-legends super large movepools (aka learn everything!) as Tyranitar, Dragonite, Salamence, Hydreigon... which hironically does not get DD too) or design point of view, but it does (or at least it did) make a lot of sense game-wise.
Garchomp in itself was beyond broken in DPP, since they created a mon with what was allegedly the best offensive typing, one of the best defensive ones, had huge offensive capabilities and the bulk of an average-good wall. In addition to that, it had that absolutely non-conventional speed that let our beloved landshark screw over 99% of other mons. Now, imagine giving that dragon dance.
Despite having witnessed a sizeable speed creep from gen IV to gen VI (especially with ORAS), in which Garchomp's speed is not what it used to be, dragon dance Garchomp would still be a complete terror to face because all the aforementioned points still stand bar speed, which would be patched after a DD.
And now try to imagine the power and speed combined of Dragon Dance Mega Garchomp... GF created things like Megamom and ShenronRay, but I actually have to give them credit for not overpowering Garchomp over the boiling point (it was still overpowered at that time, though).
For Flygon I don't have any actual explanation, unless it's typing it's only a refuse and it is meant to be the most buggish possible.
dialganet:
If anything they tried to balance or even depower Garchomp a bit with its Mega Evolution. Want that 170 Base Attack, boosted defense, and Sand Force for more power? Well you gotta sacrifice some Speed making it I say above average fast.
Actually looking through Smogon's recommended movesets for Garchomp none of them suggest using Mega Garchomp. Don't know if that's funny or concerning.
If anything they tried to balance or even depower Garchomp a bit with its Mega Evolution. Want that 170 Base Attack, boosted defense, and Sand Force for more power? Well you gotta sacrifice some Speed making it I say above average fast.
Actually looking through Smogon's recommended movesets for Garchomp none of them suggest using Mega Garchomp. Don't know if that's funny or concerning.
I feel that Mega Garchomp was again made for Doubles. There speed is less of a huge issue and it can easily have an ally set up Sandstorm either on the switch in or while Protecting
Salamence and Kangaskhan though. What ultimately hurt Mega Chomp the most wasn't the speed drop, but opportunity cost. (One wonders what a DD Mega Chomp would look like.)
It is going to make any Sinnoh remakes fun, though, since you know Cynthia's going to get a Garchompite.
Well, I can see Salamence as making up for Mega Garchomp's faults...and overcompensating. Mega Garchomp still does a hell of a good job on my Sand Doubles team on Battle Spot if the opponent DOESN'T have Mega Kangaskhan. A nice spread Earthquake with that attack and Sand Force is pretty nice.
dialganet
Banned deucer.
To be honest, as I love wallbreakers, Mega Garchomp is criminally underrated, even in singles. It packs such a punch, and it pairs so well with Tyranitar and Excadrill, relieving him of some duties and allowing him to clean and clean alone. And no one expect it, as the normal form is so good.
Btw, this is a bit too competitive and OT, so I'll mention something I've always found funny.
How in the hell is Seaking allowed to have lightningrod? Deflecting with its horn, seriously? It's like they had to give a weak mon such a good ability (turning a weakness into an immunity with a free and automatic Sp. Attack boost), it must be a joke. It's like giving Swampert Sap sipper,
Mega Mom isn't the K in CHALK for nothing, you know.
Anyway, moving on to another dance, Teeter Dance. Previously Spinda's signature move, three other mons can learn it by level-up (Grumpig, Liligant, and Meloetta). Meloetta's entire shtick is song and dance, Liligant's designed partially off a dancer, and Spinda's entire shtick is this move (and a weaker Contrary Superpower), while Grumpig is known as the Manipulator Pokemon and could use Teeter Dance to manipulate other mons into potentially punching themselves in the face. Alright. Now, for the breeding:
- Oddish. Bellossom is at least partially based off a hula dancer. What's Vileplume doing?
- Mr. Mime. Sigh. Have I mentioned how creepy that thing is in Amie? At least it makes sense.
- Lotad. It works because Mexican Pineapple (who also incorporates elements of Mexican folk dance).
- Cacnea, who is the middle link in a chain breed to get it onto Oddish or Lotad. How is a cactus/scarecrow dancing, much less confusing people?
- Buneary. Actually a stroke of brilliance considering its basis.
It has a horn. Hence why it has Megahorn as a starting move and Peck and Horn Drill in its level-up movepool. The former makes excellent early coverage for a Goldeen, what with it hitting Grass-types. The real joke is that you give a +SpA boost to a physical attacker, much like Iron Fist Ledian in that regard as well.
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I don't understand what you mean about Seaking. It fulfils the specification of Lightningrod perfectly. All Pokemon with the ability have a long point, with Rhydon and Rhyperion also having a horn on their head, while Mega-Sceptile's tail is also horn shaped.
Ledian's whole shtick is it being a punching bug. There's no reason why it wouldn't get the elemental punches and Drain Punch; weirder things get it, like the Gloom line and the Trubbish line.
dialganet
Banned deucer.
It's not a phisically-biologically-oriented thing, it's just that it's so strange for such a weak mon to have such an ability, it could literally turn the table on better mons, whereas on the other side Rhyhorn/don both are immune and Sceptile is x4 resistant (still useful in both cases, but not as on a water type). But I guess that's why they allow themselves such creativity to such weak mons (this apply to Ledian as well), since they cannot go in that direction with stronger mons lest completely unbalance them (this is more potential wishlisting than everything else). Drain Punch in itself has an odd distribution, as it probably requires some sort of energy draining managing capability that some fighting types cannot perform (hence why Machamp line doesn't have access to it, whereas Togekiss does).
It's like the "Nidorina/Nidoqueen can't breed" joke.
Cacnea actually sort of dances in the gen VI sprite
Also, good job on pointing out the SpA boost by LRod. I didn't think about that trolling side of the matter.
Regarding Seaking, AIM FOR THE HORN!
Meanwhile, there's Rapid Spin. As I'm sure you know, all of the Hitmons get it. Top is pretty obvious, and one can imagine Lee breakdancing, so it kinda makes sense. But then there's Chan. How is he spinning?
Rapid Spin has some odd distribution to other mons as well. Some of which are just plain weird. Namely, Anorith/Armaldo, Kabuto(ps), and my favorite, Delibird.
Meanwhile, there's Rapid Spin. As I'm sure you know, all of the Hitmons get it. Top is pretty obvious, and one can imagine Lee breakdancing, so it kinda makes sense. But then there's Chan. How is he spinning?
Rapid Spin has some odd distribution to other mons as well. Some of which are just plain weird. Namely, Anorith/Armaldo, Kabuto(ps), and my favorite, Delibird.
Maybe he does a spinning uppercut like Little Mac?
I'm now imagining Hitmonchan spinning his arms around like how we used to pretend to be helicopters as children.
Similarly to how Sucker Punch in Japanese is Surprise Attack, Rapin Spin in Japanese actually means Rapid Spin. This explains why the distribution may seem weird to us--the flavor was just lost in translation.
That doesn't make any sense. I get the Sucker Punch one, but you're just comparing apples to oranges here.
Grass Knot is the user summoning or controlling plants / using it's own vines / tail to tie the opponents feet to make it fall (thus why it causes damage base on weight). That's why most Psychic pokemon and other pokemon with powerful mental powers can learn it. It's also why it's contact move even thought it's special, some pokemon use contact (Venusaur for example) and some don't (Psychic pokemon) but since you can't have a move change on a per pokemon basis then GF decided that all Grass Knots would make contact.
I've always wondered how Pokemon like Rhydon, Furret, Nidoqueen, Weavile, etc. learn Surf... Like wtf. But, I do understand how Pokemon like Lickilicky and Snorlax could learn surf.
Cresselia~~
Junichi Masuda likes this!!
Especially when you'd imagine Rhydon would totally sink into the water instead of floating around with a human.
Wring Out is a move I would like to discuss today. It involves squeezing the opponent, and inflicts more damage the more HP said opponent has. Quite unusual conditions. However, if we look at the Pokémon with the highest HP, barring Legendaries, we can see that there is somewhat a correlation between their HP and their size. Pokémon like Blissey, Wobbuffet, Snorlax, Slaking and Hariyama all have very high HP base stats, and are especially bulbous in shape. Perhaps the larger their size, the more painful it would be for them to be squeezed, as a very large force would be required to do so.
However, I don't believe this is everything to it. We can also see that there are a lot of water types with high HP stats, such as Wailord, Alomomola, Lapras, Vaporeon and Lanturn. By squeezing them, it's possible that they drain water, like how a sponge loses a lot of water when squashed. As such, they would lose more HP the more their life force is squeezed away.
This may be why Pokémon with high HP stats are either large in size, or water types. Their high HP is represented by their high fat or water content, and in the case of Drifblim and Wigglytuff, their gas. In conclusion, I believe that Wring Out works by either greatly compressing the body of a Pokémon, by which the larger their size, the more painful the squeezing would be, or by squeezing the water or gas out of them, thereby draining their life force.
However, I don't believe this is everything to it. We can also see that there are a lot of water types with high HP stats, such as Wailord, Alomomola, Lapras, Vaporeon and Lanturn. By squeezing them, it's possible that they drain water, like how a sponge loses a lot of water when squashed. As such, they would lose more HP the more their life force is squeezed away.
This may be why Pokémon with high HP stats are either large in size, or water types. Their high HP is represented by their high fat or water content, and in the case of Drifblim and Wigglytuff, their gas. In conclusion, I believe that Wring Out works by either greatly compressing the body of a Pokémon, by which the larger their size, the more painful the squeezing would be, or by squeezing the water or gas out of them, thereby draining their life force.
Makes sense. Note the distribution as well: everything that learns it possesses tentacles of some sort, or some means of wrapping the foe in the case of the snakes. Except for Kabuto(ps). That I'd want to see.
It's time for a scythe hug!
I think Seaking has Lightningrod because in the Anime, it deflected Pikachu's Thunderbolt with Horn Drill (Wallace's Seaking, at least).
But by that point the species was already given Lightningrod, it's not the reason why they have it. Unless you're pointing out it has a horn thing which everyone mentioned and that you can thank Blaine's Rhydon for... despite that's being how it was defeated but I guess someone liked the idea of a Pokemon's horn attracting electricity.
The first one is because of her tail, Infernape and Bisharp because of their Mischievous nature (and how swift they are as a monkey and a ninja respectively), as I said, you're tying your opponent to make it fall, think tying somebody's shoes, this is another thing I forgot to say, Grass Knot is also the equivalent to a sneaky prank, so it's available to plenty of naughty / prankster pokemon (see most Ghosts and Baby pokemon). Empoleon is the hardest to explain but I don't see much problem to putting it with Piplup being an annoying little thing.
Meanwhile it's clone, Low Kick is the opposite, ramming into the opponent to kick it's joints and make it fall.