NOC Dragon Ball Z NOC - Day 4

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Based on everything I just went through, I'd probably want to at least put pressure on Yeti. For that matter, Vote Yeti.

Beyond that, DLE really needs to do something soon or I would want pretty strongly want to lynch him. Super lazy DLE has normally been mafia from what I can remember. I feel like Internet is probably just noobtown despite his completely lack of useful posts. I'd be decently ok with a Twin lynch as well as mentioned in my post. I guess those would be my preferences for now until I am able to finish going through everybody else.
 
I don't agree with Mithril's Yeti vote, but I like his twin analysis.

I actually think one of Blazade/LW might be scum. Twin isn't looking so good with what he's posted and then throw in Haruno (maybe Asek?) and then ??? for the last one. BT I guess would make sense with LW, or maybe neutral, IDK.

I don't think there's much sense in going after neutrals now when the mafia is the more pressing threat, but since I find neuts to be more low-key in NOC, maybe billy/macle/rssp1? Or Mithril for billy? maybe not macle. Flyhn's posts have been very town but I'm taken aback at how present he's been so lol maybe neutral? Nah, I'll keep him town. internet/macle/king_ i'm leaning town for all of them, if my hypothesis on the mafia is right, if i'm totally wrong then he's scum I guess. mithril/rssp/yeti for town. OFC throwing in neutrals complicate things and I don't really know. Players who are being town-like but not too active/too confrontational would be my best for neuts, maybe more towards the low posting side if they are a newer NOC player. I guess in that regard maybe Haruno/Asek is neutral?

I like looking at the 5 I've mentioned for today: B_T/Twin/LW/Asek/Blazade/Haruno. Hardest for me to read Blazade since I can't really place his playstyle since I have no past NOC experience to read him on.
 

Yeti

dark saturday
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
Sam doesn't vote inactive players he mislynches noobtowns D1 who can't defend themselves against him or don't understand the meta even when there is clear evidence they are missing a vital noobscum slip.

I voted acidphoenix for being idle af just like he was last game to fly under the radar. It wound up being too late in the day by the time the wagon on him got rolling to change it if I wasn't willing to lynch Sam (imo anyway, a third lynch wouldn't have gotten off the ground) and his defenses of himself were sort of poor.

I would've rather gone after DLE cause iDLE is his mafia play but for some reason he has plot armor. What DBZ character is immune to dying from their own foolishness?

I don't kill Sam. I don't need to. He's never going to lynch me early in the game. You COULD frame this as me knowing he's not on my mafia team and taking the guess he isn't one of the three neutrals I don't know, so I save him from the lynch then kill him and now look clean for defending him. But it is known my scumtell is buddying my scumbuddies and just like I tried to save HD from the lynch I saved Sam. Surprise surprise when we are all village ayy lemao. However it's pretty clear I can get him to townread me or at least feel like I am a sub-optimal lynch over other people even when he questions WHY everyone townreads me so hard. MAYBE he has scumread all 3 of my mafia buddies and I am too afraid he will go after them, so I consent to killing him.

But... I actually thought he was Buu (or scum) rofl hence the "save my boo <3" line so I never kill him even if I'm mafia cause I think it's a waste of a kill. Whoops. I convinced myself the only reason he says something as dead stupid as "the BPV should claim to be a town voice and not absorb a kill" alongside Vegeta which wasn't a terrible suggestion is he IS Buu and he is waiting for everyone to pat him on the back for this grand suggestion so he can say "okay it's me" and THEN go on his full-town speech. Now cleaned by his claim and immune to 1 kill which likely won't be aimed at him anyway, he proceeds to dominate the game.

BUT IT IS NO GOOD.

It took me a while to tell how to feel about him because he changed his playstyle. I trollvoted him at first then his play was off but I eventually reconciled it he was just trying to change up an unsuccessful playstyle before since the game always winds up orienting around him and he pushes a D1 mislynch. Mostly because it would be extremely stupid to play so riskily as scum.

"where she would point out both positives and negatives of everyone."

I enjoy how critical thinking is a scumread to you. Nobody is 100% scummy or 100% towny. Some of that is intentional (like when I have to yolo scum move to look scummy enough to survive nights lmao) and some is unintentional. Fleshing out what seems town and seems scum in posts and determining where the actual motivation behind both attributes lies is the way to scumhunt, not tunneling on a read of good or bad. My D1 reads are always mild because D1 can be too inconclusive and often leads to mislynches. Except Blazade the obvious overly-tryhard-townie was kind enough to reveal himself.

You can vote me until the cows come home but anyone seriously trying to push a lynch on me is resigning themselves as scum.

jalmont raises an interesting point that the neutrals might be low-key. I think we should look at which inexperienced players are trying to slip under the radar the most. Since this playerlist was RNGed it is possible someone could've gotten one of the neuts and not had anyone to guide them so they tried to lay low and avoid drawing attention. A mafia newbie would have 3 other people to offer advice in their scumchat but a newbie neutral would struggle to fit in if they were active. Possible TIK/Twin neutral?

That hard scum first post Asek made that got him jumped on, then people relaxed when "well his mafia team would tell him not to." What if he is neutral? He seems capable of reading the reactions to his post and realizing this was Bad Play after the fact but if he doesn't have anyone to guide him I can see him erring in that first post and then trying to correct behavior. I think pressure should still be applied to him today.

Looking forward to a detailed LightWolf post on the Sam flip and his general reads/feelings.

Also I'd like to note since the game was RNGed there IS the chance that ALL of me/Sam/billy/LW/DLE are village. I know I am and Sam was (RIP baby) and I find it somewhat unlikely not a 1 of the other 3 was in the scum section of the roles but it is possible. I'm just saying, I'm not 100% convinced there HAS to be a scum in us 5 but I'm also not convinced there aren't 3 scums in there, those other 3 scrubs.
 

Haruno

Skadi :)
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
There's not much use talking about who killed who I feel. We're not going to logic our way to a killer. Mafia kills are made by a team, not a single user, and it's hard to tell what the wolves are banking their kill on (could very well be possible they want to play like a vig at least for now). I guess there's a little more merit to doing so in this game, but I'd rather people focus on looking back at Sam/Walrein vs everyone else and their interactions.
This is dangerous as fuck thinking
People not mentioned above who only voted dead townies
billymills, Haruno, internet, twin
Mind explaining the significance behind this? I don't see how this is significant compared to some randlynches which ended up not paying off (mostly talking about acid votes) where mafia could easily disguise themselves to lynch someone of their choosing. I don't see how someone sticking to either acid/US or outright not voting till acid makes someone immediately suspect to be scum.

First of all, sorry for not posting the last day of D1, work was pretty absurd last week and I never had time to write a post. Regardless, I'll start with answering this. If I were mafia, I would have to be a complete idiot to kill off the one person that had been suspecting me D1, especially considering he was pretty vehement on me being suspicious. Now that clearly leads into the whole argument of mindgames and whatnot, but it would just seem like an awful play. On the other hand, mafia killing somebody that only really suspected one person (me) leads to this whole scenario of people pointing out that the person that suspected me died. Circles on circles are stupid, but tbh so is looking into N1 kills for anything outside of the target looking village / not being likely to be protected.

Beyond that, I would love if someone actually gave me something to respond to as to why I am a top read. All we have so far are both Walrein and Billy saying I seem suspicious. That's nice and all, but gives me nothing to refute. In the meantime I will work on reads of twin / yeti / B_T to give Billy the reads he currently wants.
Billy summed up why walrein suspected you, I'm not going to accuse of anything yet without hard proof.
Mithril who do you want to lynch right now
This is probably the first blatant potential android signalling so far xd.

Agreed with twin analysis that mithril stated though. Will refrain from having actual judgment on twin until he says something, or if he chooses not to, then he's leaning towards scumread.
 

Asek

Banned deucer.
people who are asking why im assuming broly got goku - The fact that the kill flavour was so violent in how he died compared to the way sam got killed appears to me that it was broly who is A) the most violent character in this game and B) hates goku are why I'm coming to that conclusion.

My thoughts post lynch : OK I have no idea why acid didn't defend his position a whole lot better or make more posts in the thread to try scout who would be good jail targets from their postings. I feel like twin and some scumbuddies may have got this ball rolling however, sam did help it gain traction. I've gotta say that acid did look susp Regardless the fact that twin was the one who initially proposed this leads to some suspicion on him. Whilst sam did jump onto it just as quickly and (arguably) got the bandwagon going, I think at that point he was (rightfully) worried that he would end up being the lynch target, and was just trying to get the lynch pushed towards someone, which explains why he jumped on so quickly onto an easy target. But twin then switches to unclesam instead, after the lynch was picking up steam. This seems to me like a play that helps cover twin in the case that acid did indeed flip town, as a mafia member would know he would (or be third party but w.e regardless), making him look cleaner. I actually think that it made sense for sam to be killed last night as well if twin is mafia ; in post #420 (weeed number lol) sam asks twin for reads and to justify the vote on him. I feel like sam would of pushed harder on this post today if he was still alive, and would have been putting a lot of pressure out on twin in particular for the lynch result, making him a good target for the mafia to off. So consider me suspicious of twin at this point.

On the other hand internet is the most suspicous person currently in the game. Been very quiet since people have been accusing him, I feel like he won't defend his case until he is pressured into a 'explain yourself or be lynched' scenario, so right now im going to vote internet to put pressure on him to do so. Sam would of also applied heavy pressure to internet today so I think that could also be a likely scenario leading to the sam kill.

I will set out time tomorrow to provide some readings on people, gonna post a lot more this cycle
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Okay this time I will go over what people think before I start a lynch on my suspects.

Lynch Haruno
I do not care if you a made a case yesterday. I do not accept votes like these as its an easy excuse to just not have to say something again people may find off on rereading. That being said:
Solid randlynch n_n any particular reasoning? Or should I say that you killed US/walrein and trying to pin the blame on me. Anyways since this came out of nowhere and suspicious as fuck.

Lynch Jalmont

I do want to hear people's reasonings on who killed US/walrein though since they seem to be rather huge targets.
Fuck this omgus too, way too much overreaction towards a silly vote. Also I really don't want too many discussions on who killed who shit. Best case the killer choose a target regardless of reads, worst their intention was to make us discuss it. If we are to care about the reads of the dead it's because they make sense not because they dead, this is exactly my point why early clears don't matter.
So 2/4 Of the Killing Roles went through, Broly/Goku/Mafia , Possibly Androids. Maybe Sam protected someone that was targeted by one of them? Androids do not have a Signal they can catch onto yet and no one targeted Vegeta. I think we should try and find out who Sam would have protected and who would want either Sam/Walrein dead the most.

Questions I have, Does Reviver revive during day? < If Not, Ignore my next question. Should Reviver Claim and use it incase he/she dies without getting to use it?
Thoughts on who Sam protected?
Thoughts on which combos killed, which I've seems discussed to death is pointless, and will only be relevant if watcher or tracker ever step forward. The only thing relevant now is goku got night axed. Ergo we have to assume broly could double up, and we can't do much against that.

FoSing (in Hungarian fos means shit) king, haruno and yeti for their decent sized pointless discussion.

BT's post: any time some brings up Walrein's as a point against mithril it just muddies the issue one might have with him. I can say I feel similarly to him as jalmont, but just like with him BT you are just as guilty as mithril so this is just more hypocritical blocks coming from some of the fake actives.

On twin, only dropped him as tik because subs. His recent actions have not filled me with much confidence either, what with only a joke lynch till the point on time I'm at. Him jumping between two confirmed town lynches doesn't help either.

With this let me bring up a more relevant thing for people to argue, who were the ones pushing for either lynch in he final hours and who took the time to still go against them.

Probably being stupid here but w/e here goes:

We could try to look for android signaling. There's a high likelihood that they misfired, but assuming they did so seems like careless play to me.

I checked who voted for the killed players since that's the only sort of twin signaling I would notice. It might be too obvious and incriminating to be used, but perhaps it's so obvious that it becomes unlikely, and therefore usable?

LightWolf, Thetwinmasters, internet, Haruno and billymills voted for unclesam. Out of these, twin's (then TIK) first one seems especially haphazard. Perhaps it was a confirmatory reply? The only one who voted for unclesam before then was lightwolf.

I don't think anyone voted for walrein, correct me if I'm wrong though.
This seems very anti village should the twins have failed to kill. This kind of discussion is only worth should we have confirmed twin kill.

lynch lightwolf

sorry guys, i was hit by a silencer on n0 so i couldnt post anything important

now i cant post anything of substance or i will die because dbz only allows 2 minutes of plot development per episode
No idea why I let yeti get away with just trolls sometimes, but for you dle this is just hurting the village and off, what with you not subbing. No idea if you just trying to mess someone up or just busy but play the Damn game.

Dislike that mithril instantly brings up why killing Walrein was something he'd not do. The fact people did point out actual reasons why they dislike you besides that your are suspicious makes it odd to deny. Also I was also busy making a post still wasn't hard.

I like rssp, he has similar shit too me, therefore I suspect him, I feel my views are too controversial to align up like that.

Reads on Twin / Yeti / B_T

Twin:
Subbed for TIK, TIK did nothing of interest tbh
344 - First vote on Phoenix, only points to idling
376 - Switches to Sam b/c he voted to protect himself, poor reason
Too focused on flip results for my taste
417 - Calls out king for terrible post
419 - HL US
425 - Reads, switches back to acid with no reasoning whatsoever
459 - Troll vote on Yeti


Twin has been posting very little (about as much as me :D) and his posts have very little content. Both 344 and 376 are very weird, he votes in both posts with very little reasoning from what I can tell. His comment of prefering a US vote to see the flip bothers me as thats always felt like a cop-out to me. Additionally both of his vote pushes were on villagers and he both started and harmered the Acid lynch. Nothing too concrete, but probably leaning scum here.

Yeti:
3, 32, 35 - Troll
77 - Anti Sam, nothing on LW, very anti Blazade, thinks King + Sam
84 - Middle of the road on vegeta, good player not claim
123 - Middle of the road on Vegeta, argues both points
153 - Acid idle mafia, asek noob town, unsure billy, blazade scummy
meh B_T, DLE nothing
178 - Still a bit anti sam, likes asek / flyhn posts, still bad blaz
189 - Unvotes sam, calls out mandatory votes
203 - Calls out King for buddying sam
208 - Anti Buu Claim, sam odd, LW posts serial killer
233 - Tells sam Flyhn tryharding = more likely mafia, still androids
238 - Kinda anti sam lynch
245 - Wants discussion on more than US / LW
248 - Calls out billy's awful 245 sams evil blah blah
254 - Protects B_T, calls out weird Jalmont vote
259 - Likes reads list, against blazade for hating reads
287 - Agrees Billy weird, thinks LW/Billy easily mafia pushing Sam
Pro Sam now
288 - Wants to lynch acid for idling
307 - Thinks B_T being too passive for town B_T
361 - Still pushing acid lynch (inactive) after calling out US for
going after inactives all D1, kinda odd.
373 - Protects sam somewhat, confused by his actions, calls out
haruno / internet for weird sam votes, calls out blazade
for being anti yeti (only yeti scum reads blazade)
378 - Thinks sam learned not to go after inactives, anti Goods lynch
387 - Likes sams combative 385, votes acid
399 - Still anti Sam vote, pushing town to think
400 - Acid too idle, although mafia would be yelling -> scum
Asek = idle -> null, null billy, blazade too good -> scum
B_T mod scum, DLE scum, town flyhm, mild scum haruno,
internet noob, jalmont mod town, king noob, lazy for LW,
macle mild town, mithril null, rssp town
calls haruno / king out for buddying sam
446 - walrein killing sam would be funny, blazade scum
453 - Meta stuff on kills
462 - Still scum blazade, meta kill stuff, votes internet


My biggest issue with Yeti is that she continually brought up US bad habit of voting inactive players and then finished the day with what amounted to a bandwagon vote on Acid, wait for it, for being inactive. While she has posted a lot, there are no strong pushes outside of pushing Blazade as mafia. In fact, a lot of her reads felt very non-confrontational to me, where she would point out both positives and negatives of everyone. She started the day scum-reading US, only to slowly come around enough to convince everyone he is town. This coupled with the death reads a lot like a mafia making themselves look good by "saving" a villager only to have that strong personality unable to ever see the holes in Yeti's game. Also, post 400 reads to me like someone that knew Acid was town and wanted to lynch him anyway. Honestly just seems like a lot of posts with a lot of middle of the road reads trying to seem as if she is assisting the village (obvious things like calling out the stupid US bandwagon). Pretty strong scum read currently.

B_T:
27 - Anti claims (believes mafia won't claim if getting lynched)
wants people to vote (votes jalmont)
108 - Votes asek for something
148 - Anti vegetaish, mad at TL:DRs, not sure on sam, concerned by
yeti, still votes asek for idling
289 - Anti androids, then votes steeledges (Walrein) (android comm?)
290 - Argues he was active maf in ANOC, says just busy
293 - More positive on yeti / asek, anti jalmont / US for votes on
B_T, sees US as too chaotic for town US
297 - Confronts Jalmont for vote on B_T
305 - Somewhat concedes ANOC, asks what town B_T would do
461 - Votes Mithril for inactive / walrein's push + death
doesnt like macle, DLE too inactive, very anti twin,
inactive internet, anti yeti, LW boring, Jalmont going
under the radar.


Not much to work with here. 27 made no sense as there is literally nothing for mafia to lose my claiming as they are getting lynched. He has been very flip-floppy on Yeti from what I can tell. I could see him + Yeti being mafia together, but it doesn't seem likely that one is mafia on their own. On the other hand 289 felt really strongly like an android communication (posts about androids, includes a lynch with little info). 461 also felt like he was taking advantage of the Walrein death too well with the preprepared push on me. I'm honestly all over the board on B_T right now and am not all that sure, but probably also leaning scum here. Just too defensive and making weird plays.

All that being said, I guess I should find some town reads and not everyone can be scum. I'll see what I can do before sleeping, but work in the morning sucks.
Disagree, if anything the only thing twin was right about is that the US lynch would have been superior as a Midlands while the Phoenix one was easy to get on. Also pointing out someone's limited activity being similar to yours when they were a late sub paints you bad not him. Ducking hypocrisy.

I have nothing on yeti, I blame her style

Let me provide my US stuff since yeti asked for it. Fairly disappointed in his death, I had some good shit against him like his extreme focus on the acid lynch so he gets to live being more mafia than village to me and his whole shtick about shouting at the sky about how he will never claim. OH WELL I GUESS IT WAS JUST HIM PLAYING TERRIBLE. Ignoring his terrible plays, he was too selfish and allowed the game to reach this point. Ignoring my point about guesses on kills, I think he got killed to shut up, which would make me a prime suspect, which I don't care about.

So at the end I'm mostly for jalmont, bt, mithril, twin and internet lynches. Second tier would be my foses. But who I'm voting is none other than lynch maple. The guy doing the best at hiding in ain sight. Like how many people remember anything about his posts with going back to check?
 

Wayan Vistar

formerly Flyhn
Mind explaining the significance behind this? I don't see how this is significant compared to some randlynches which ended up not paying off (mostly talking about acid votes) where mafia could easily disguise themselves to lynch someone of their choosing. I don't see how someone sticking to either acid/US or outright not voting till acid makes someone immediately suspect to be scum.
I'm not saying it makes anyone scum necessarily... just saying that there's almost definitely scum hiding in these groups somewhere, which is why i'm focusing on it. I may come to the conclusion that some people in this group are town after mini-ISOing them, which i'm currently trying to do among other things irl, but i am probably going to vote the scummiest person in this group, as they're very likely scum.

It's extremely unlikely this entire group is scum, but i believe we can find some here.
 
Unvote
Lynch King__

Post some fucking reads

Also Yeti can you flesh out more why you think blazade is scum.

Haruno's reaction to jalmont's vote is way too much overreaction and I still haven't seen a solid reads post out of him and he has only voted for sam which is suspicious imo.
Also I don't like internet bringing up android signalling doesn't seem helpful to the village at all until we get a night where its 100% confirmed androids killed. He also has the same issues as haruno.
Dle hasn't posted at all and he doesn't have an excuse for that since he is on irc all day so I want a reads post from him ASAP.

IMO there is at least 1 scum in the 2 of haruno and internet also considering sam had these 2 as his top mafia reads which could be a reason for sam getting killed.
 

macle

sup geodudes
is a Top Tutor Alumnusis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis an Artist Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Im suspicious of lw lynching me. See my post #284 where i say it could be lw / billy trying to lynch sam to take control of the village. He posts later saying im buddying with sam etc. Then I made post #423, US makes post after saying to suspect me, he dies at night, Wake up in the morning with lw lynchin me

or im just paranoid
 

Wayan Vistar

formerly Flyhn
Seems only using the vote counts as my source for who voted who was a bit shortsighted, there were many votes i didn't catch as a result.. but i still want to iso these 6, as i feel any votes not shown by a vote count weren't really held long enough to really count (excluding twin's because it was there at the end of the day, and we never really got an EoD vote count)

Asek D1
#91: This is the post that everyone jumped on him for. Says US or LW are most likely mafia before voting Jalmont for being the "most likely lynch" when the bandwagon was long over.
#177: Admits it was bandwagoning, unvoting Jalmont, states he's against Vegeta or Buu claiming, elaborates on his US vs LW thoughts a little bit, particularly with US.
#317: States he finds internet and US to be the scummiest players, but steeledges, dle, and acid should be looked at for inactivity, fleshing out these reads as well, seems townie enough
#410: says internet is top scumread, saying acid isn't really a bad lynch either, explains his stance on LW, then voting internet at the end of the post
#421: Switches to acid, stating he wants an internet lynch next cycle
D2
#442: States flavor-wise it looks like Broly killed Walrein, says he'll give more thoughts later
#481: Explains why he believes the flavor on Walrein matches Broly better than maf, says twin is susp for really starting the acid lynch, confused as to why acid couldn't defend himself better, also pointing out how twin switched to US last minute, which was scummy. Proceeds to continue saying internet is his top scumread, voting him.
He says he's going to post a lot more this cycle, and honestly i'm inclined to believe him. He seems consistent in wanting to find scum, and he HAS made at least some contribution, although stumbling at first. Leaning Town

billymills D1
#25: bandwagon rvs on Jalmont
#97: doesn't want Vegeta to claim, except maybe near deadline
#100&106 not game relevant
#112&115: pushes BT to post
#120: votes US because he "doesn't get it"
#134: Gives some reads (US is bogging thread, Yeti is null, Blazade's good, not impressed by BT's non-reaction), voting rssp presumably for pressure
#136: "What's the problem with Vegeta claiming cop?"
#139: Misunderstanding of the confusing af claiming rules
#144: Explains the plan a bit more, saying ignore it if the claim rules work differently
#146: Gives up on this plan because the rules aren't really that clear.
#151: Extremely simplified summary of US vs LW
#159: comment on the shitpost following Yeti's iso post
#161: comment on his #151's response
#162&168: comments on deadline
#179: Says Yeti's #178 is strange, pointing out seemingly random capitalisation
#183: Clarifies he feels nothing about the current argument because it's all regarding meta
#200: votes US, finding it strange he's differentiating between mafia and android play, and US has been distracting from the goal of finding mafia
#204: "stop discussing androids"
#212: Says he's fine pushing US to claim, again expressing frustration over meta discussion
#219: expresses desire to lynch US
#223: points out that Android kills go through protection
#230: says half the game hasn't posted anything relevant, though he COULD iso me or Haruno, but wants to see more people post first.
#234: More reads, BT scum lean, Asek not scum, Jalmont null.
#237: "Can we please lynch Sam?"
#247: Says there's no point in posting currently because US is most susp and had the most votes.
#271: wants deadline moved up
#291: Is convinced US is mafia, saying he'll post closer to deadline
#335: Elaborates more on US, saying he's acting too insecure in his reads, and that US should know LW's play better
#380: Irrelevant
#386: Yup, US is back
#392: Unvotes US finally because "Yeti convinced him", doesn't see what's wrong with acid, points out how susp twin's unvote once acid gained traction was
#407: Explains why he focused on US
#408: Votes twin for reasons statd in his #392
#418: Switches to acid because he "seems to have conceded"
D2
#463: says twin is still susp af, but wants to push Mithril. thinks internet and BT are good, but finds twin, Mithril, and Haruno susp
#464: says he still would've preferred a US lynch over the acid lynch
#465: states he believes the androids misfired, and sam was probably killed for being 100% not Vegeta or Buu
#469: clarifies again why twin's scummy. says he agrees that there's scum within the 6 players i pointed out, suspecting Haruno, twin, and rssp to be it
#473: Response to Mithril, stating he's scummy due to buddying US and being overly safe
After looking over his posts, i do believe my scumread on him was a bit hasty, although early on there wasn't that much beyond "US is scum" and a few reaction tests, he has been giving much more since then. He's boosted himself to a Null

Now Jalmont has already ISO'd Haruno, so i'll only be covering posts made since then
Haruno Late D1
#429: Says they'll make a reads list, first to coin one of the veteran players must be maf due to balance
#431-433: NIGHTPOSTS -_-, all useless one liners
D2
#438: an OMGUS on Jalmont
#439: ISO of Walrein to see if they can find why he was killed, saying Mithril is the most likely scum to have lead this due to Walrein pushing him
#445: Goes over all the possibilities of how US and Walrein died. In other words, more meta.
#454: More meta
#479: States Jalmont's way of thinking is "dangerous", objects to the signifigance of my line of thinking about the group, seeming to think i think all of them are automatically scummy for this. Yes, i suspect them slightly, but i'm not calling anyone scum until i ISO them like this and come to that conclusion.
Speaking of which Haruno seems to do nothing but post meta related fluff, and they're playing insanely defensively the moment someone even remotely suspects them (see Jalmont OMGUS, and questioning my list). Scum

internet D1
#126: wants to move away from Vegeta/Buu discussion in favor of discussing the "good player's reads"
#147: points out US vs LW is seemingly normal, though seems to think LW was a bit odd
#185: Votes US, bandwagoning off me, calls out acid to post
#188: States he already believed US was susp, saying he has a "good gut feeling" about me
#190: points to the mandatory lynch rule
D2
#467: Wants to look for android signals, pointing out those who voted US
Okay, internet has barely even posted anything, and what he has posted for the most part is repeats of what others have said, me especially. As such there isn't much TO read. Lean Scum

rssp1 D1
#45: Speculation on how transporter works
#49: Wants clarification of how roles work before any claiming takes place
#51: Agrees with Blazade about how Vegeta claims should be handled, bringing up the problem of if they don't claim they could kill town
#141: says he'll post after a haircut
#149: Agrees mostly with Blazade, but "his math is silly". Says Vegeta should claim if being lynched, iffy on LW, agrees nobody can really "lead" in NOC
#152: Tries to get clarification on what the Vegeta plan is
#154&157: shitposts
#160: wants clarification from LW what the plan is
#231: Admits to being lazy, saying he'll read up and contribute
#252: Thinks we're gonna have Vegeta claim on lynch, pointing out worse-case we're using our revive on him, because maf will 100% claim Vegeta if being lynched
#257: says he'll give some reads, gives some reads, then says he'll elaborate later
#260: gives a stance on reads lists
#264: "I thought deadline was on Sunday?"
#269: NL due to thinking deadline's soon and needing to vote
#270: nvm, deadline is later
#273: still talking about deadline :/
#327: Massive post summarising the game so far and giving a full readslist, votes billy
#329: "the 'everyone dies' setup"
#331: says he posted his thoughts as he read through the game
#358: Points out a votecount mistake
#359: explains to LW his read on him, agrees with billy US should be looked at later, switches vote to acid
#364&367: Host question clarification
#371: Asking questions to acid about his reads
#414: shitpost
D2
#460: Says he'll post later, agrees with Blazade about billy, finds Haruno's OMGUS strange
#472: believes the kills were maf and Broly, reviver shouldn't claim, android signalling is going to be difficult to find
not exactly sure what to make of him... he has a few good points, but a lot of non-content posts as well. Null

THE_IRON_...KENYAN? D1
#9: Says he agrees with Vegeta claiming
#14: Says he feels there's a couple of softs already
#58: shitpost
#59: Votes US for tryharding
#308: Requests sub
Thetwinmasters (post-sub D1)
#340: Says he won't be able to post for a bit, but he's reading up
#344: Votes acid for idling like he did in Fire and Ice
#376: Switches to US for being inconsistent, saying US, internet, and acid are all good lynches
#417: Comments on how king just null read most of the game, also asking US what he wants to hear
#419: tags US
#425: top two town are LW and Blazade, top scum are internet, acid, and macle. Gives additional reads before switching back to acid for majority
D2
#459: votes Yeti
#484: Switches to king so he posts some actual reads, wants Yeti to flesh out reads more, points out Haruno's OMGUS, internet's interest in androids, and dle's current iDLE state
Let's start with TIK. He barely even did anything, though pointing out the fact that he sees softs isn't exactly the towniest thing ever. then as soon as twin subs in, he pushes acid, then abandoning it for US after the US bw had completely died, then switching right back to acid in time to hammer it. Also definitely seems to not like King... maybe I'll look into that, but his D1 was pretty bad, and his D2 doesn't have much yet. Scum

That took nearly all day to do, you're welcome guys. Ranking these players in order from who i personally think is scummiest to who i think is towniest, that gives us:

Haruno
Thetwinmasters
internet
rssp1
billymills
Asek

As such for now Lynch Haruno, they have a slight edge over twin for being waaaaaayyyyy too defensive. If they provide a good enough defence i'll change this
 
Yeti I was forgetful, not revisionist. I remembered the one Walrein post where he said this was consistent with Sam's town game, and the time billymills came around after Sam got boisterous again and voted acid before you. A lot of the posts you brought up are good points and I realize now there was specific convincing going on as well. I know your Day 1 game, and it was mostly similar but I still felt a little off. Whatever I'm pretty sure you're town at this point because your content has gotten a lot better and your accusations against me make less and less sense. The only danger is if you wanted to get townpoints defending Sam while also pushing the mislynch on acidphoenix. Either way Mithril you should probably get your vote off her. Empty pressure votes are not the way you figure someone like that out because it's just going to shit up the thread. If you do vote, make sure you actually pose some questions or arguments.

DLE's LW vote is entirely contentless and that worries me. I let him get away with the busy excuse yesterday but not anymore.

Jalmont normally I'd agree that neutrals aren't as pressing but if there were some way to find Broly specifically we cut off what is likely 2 kills based on the way everything went down which is more important considering our lack of a vig to retaliate with. Doesn't seem like we're getting there though so I'll drop the night kill analysis

Speaking of Jalmont he seems to be proactive, more so than how I'd read him as mafia. If you want previous NOC experience of mine I can link you 3 mafiascum games and a bulbapedia game. I've never rolled scum in a NOC and I'm not interacting with Smogonites but if you think you'll find it useful I'll put up. Alternatively you can ask me questions about anything you find questionable.

I don't think Flyhn goes through this level of VCA as mafia I think this is a clear town sign.

Mills looks better because of what appears to be legitimate uncertainty and caution regarding Sam. I think the people that look worse on the Sam wagon are the ones who appeared to be more certain, which I guess looks like Haruno, internet, and previously acidphoenix.

LW kinda just giving up on his vote at EOD really strikes me as odd. He defends acidphoenix saying it's too late to him him (or I guess anyone for that matter) even though there was 18 hours left. I guess it just screams that it feels like he's detached and doesn't want to be held accountable for whatever lynch does happen. I am dumb for pushing acid but I am not ashamed to say I supported it. I still like his content, though so I'm tempted to townread him for it but I think he's definitely worth looking into today.

Macle is a hard read because he lays this low and makes comments like these as either alignment (see Metagame, LoTR)

I haven't had much to say about rssp1 because I agree with a lot of what he's said thus far and his gameflow seems similar to when we've played Resistance with him.

I looked at a lot of BT's old content and I'm not convinced on him or his current push on mithril. Can you clarify why you now think he's good billymills?

Mithril WIFOMs and pushes Yeti. I don't think SK Mithril attacks literally the only person who casts shade on him even if he's self aware enough to realize this.

Internet's comment on twin signaling seems sketch, like he's trying to scumhunt androids as mafia or pin a mafia kill on the androids.

Asek needs to post more.

twin is doing fine for now, leaning town because I don't find his behavior suspicious and I do find his questions and thoughts natural.

I guess condensed here's what my gut tells me:

LeanTownpool:

Blazade, Billymills, Flyhn, Mithril, twin, Yeti, Jalmont

LeanScumpool:

internet, Haruno, BT, DLE, Asek

Very Unsure:

LW, King_, macle, rssp1

LW can you explain your voting behavior yesterday? Who is the worst looking person on the Sam and acid wagons?

King_ how do you feel about each of unclesam's pas suspects? Internet, Haruno, BT in particular.

macle can you give me a more thorough opinion on LW?

rssp1 what do you think of the newer players in Haruno, mithril, King_, and asek?
 

Haruno

Skadi :)
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
I'm not saying it makes anyone scum necessarily... just saying that there's almost definitely scum hiding in these groups somewhere, which is why i'm focusing on it. I may come to the conclusion that some people in this group are town after mini-ISOing them, which i'm currently trying to do among other things irl, but i am probably going to vote the scummiest person in this group, as they're very likely scum.

It's extremely unlikely this entire group is scum, but i believe we can find some here.
I don't mind you saying that since that could be your scumread HOWEVER your reasoning is faulty as fuck. Your reasoning is just, I think they're potential scum and just sticking with that. If anything you're trying to push your own personal agenda especially considering the two requirements you stated are very broad and not really tangible since anyone could vote for (insert random vote here) and switch to acid bandwagon to hide their status which in no way clears them. If anything your voting method would also be suspicious due to initially starting as an US vote and then saying you have a very strong read on him and then proceeding to vote for billy? That isn't exactly helping your case with votes since your voting methods have been sketchy and try to mask that by pinning the blame with broad reasoning that doesn't really work.

Overall as far as scumreading goes, I'm leaning more towards you, jalmont, twin, internet, with a softread on asek. Your latter post just further solidifies what I'm saying.
 

Wayan Vistar

formerly Flyhn
Your reasoning is just, I think they're potential scum and just sticking with that.
Yeah, that's how scumhunting works. And if you notice from my ISOs, I ended with town reads and nulls on a fair bit of that group

If anything you're trying to push your own personal agenda especially considering the two requirements you stated are very broad and not really tangible since anyone could vote for (insert random vote here) and switch to acid bandwagon to hide their status which in no way clears them.
I literally don't understand what you're trying to say here. My requirements are hardly broad, it's people who either a) Only voted acid or b) only voted people who we now know were town. That's very specific. Of course, these people did have other votes, but as I said the vote count didn't pick them up, and that's what I used as my sourse. The whole requirement thing was a starting point.

If anything your voting method would also be suspicious due to initially starting as an US vote and then saying you have a very strong read on him and then proceeding to vote for billy?
Now you're putting words in my mouth. My read on US was NEVER strong and I never claimed it to be, it was always simply the best I had at the time, because there wasn't much to go off of yet.

Overall as far as scumreading goes, I'm leaning more towards you, jalmont, twin, internet, with a softread on asek.
Let's look over these. I pushed on you. Jalmont pushed on you. twin recently called you're Jalmont vote an overreaction, which it was. Internet is probably the most universally scumread player as of right now. Asek is... well beyond his first post (which i read as noobtown), I can't see why people see him as scum... and you said he's a weak read anyway

Give me a better defense then that, this reads a lot like another OMGUS minus the vote
 
My original 'scum' read on BT was just deciding to call someone who hadn't posted much scum.

When I re-read his posts up to twin's hammer I felt BT was town, albeit quiet. This isn't taking into account his day 2 post on mithril, but due to my day 1 changes in reads on BT and mithril, I was willing to push the mithril vote.

One of the main points was that BT was very willing to agree with me on not discussing androids. I think it was a move that potentially puts him in the spotlight, because it was against prevailing wisdom at the time. I guess its partially a case of me buddying him back because he buddied me, but his posts did seem pretty consistent on a second look.
 
One of the main points was that BT was very willing to agree with me on not discussing androids. I think it was a move that potentially puts him in the spotlight, because it was against prevailing wisdom at the time. I guess its partially a case of me buddying him back because he buddied me, but his posts did seem pretty consistent on a second look.
I didn't read much into that because I thought that was obvious but I see where you're coming from. I also see consistency but not a lot of drive behind it.

I don't like this mithril vote at the moment though, so can you clarify it a bit BT?
 
Mithril - Null read for me because I don't know if he is smart enough to Kill Walrein, the only person he pushed on d1 or if Walrein was killed to make it seem like Mithril killed him.
Lightwolf - Leaning Scum on him because of possible android signaling and I feel like he's playing too risky.
BT - Lean Scum for me from D1 Posts.
Yeti - I don't know if Yeti is just good acting like town or I'm being played BIG time. < Town Read
Asek - I feel like he's just posting up anything he can now so he seems active, what I'm reading from his posts doesn't make sense to me. < Lean Scum
Twin - I don't know how he plays but he voted me for a reason he could've voted some other people, but he chose me.( Not posting reads ) < Lean Scum
Jalmont - His early lynch day 2 makes me feel like he could be watcher/tracker or act like one of those. < Null Read
DLE - I don't know his Metagame, feels really weird to me. < Null Read
Macle - I feel like he is playing very low key but I don't know how he's played before. < Null Read
Haruno - I still don't know about Haruno so I'm going to wait for more info. < Null Read
Blazade - Lean Town
Internet - I feel like Internet could possibly be trying to coast through the game, but I will wait until he post his defence to decide my thought on him. < Null Read

Sorry for all the Null Reads, I know you guys hate that. I just try to give a little slack sometimes.
 
King if you can try and take a stronger stance on players that'd be swell, although I can understand if thats hard to do. You also completely forgot me in your newest reads list.
 
Since you guys want a stronger stance,
Mithril < Lean Town
Jalmont < Lean Town
DLE < Lean Scum
Macle < Lean Scum
Haruno < Lean Scum
Internet < Lean Scum
RSSP1 < Lean Scum
 
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