Gen VII: Pokémon Sun and Moon (New info Post #5834)

Status
Not open for further replies.
As a big breeder that will probably still IV breed even in Gen 7 (unless the bottlecaps are super common), I think the REAL problem is that it now devalues a lot of my breeding reject boxes on Pokemon Bank. During my shiny hunts or attempts to breed for like a 5 IV female starter/Eevee/fossil, I would get multiple 5/6 IV Pokemon that I'm not planning on using so I store them away for potential trading.

Now with this Hyper Training, they're all practically worthless. On the other hand, I can now freely Wonder Trade all of them.
 
This thread moves faster than a bullet train.

Reflecting on it, Mudsdale is my favourite Gen VII Pokemon rn, just beating out Rowlet. It's hard for me to sum up but I just feel that this Pokemon is amazing. It might be due to how I like horses or its ability but I really hope it was decent base stats to make it usable competitively.
 

Xen

is a Community Leaderis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnus
Wi-Fi Leader
1st off mimikyu is awesome and i want 6 of them and mudsdale has a signature move (hoof attack in video)

I think tapu koko (unique name btw) is part of a legendary team all with terrain abilities. Grassy Terrain (Grass / Fairy), Misty Terrain (Fairy), and some new terrain probably Fire to fit the volcanic aspect of aloha.

I love the fact we're getting dozens of new abilities instead of seeing Swarm and Big Pecks everywhere

Does anyone thing they'll still have secret bases? The part about grinding too 100 will be all the more exasperating with access to Blissey Bases
Even if secret bases don't return, there will probably still be some kind of way to easily grind to lv 100, kinda like how X/Y had Restaurant Le Wow.

For non-Gen VII mons, you can always level them with Blissey bases in ORAS, then transfer them.
 
It's not like breeding will suddenly become irrelevant. What happened to egg moves and, to a lesser extent, fishing for the right nature?
I can just tell that there'll eventually be a generation where you'll be able to teach Egg Moves through Tutors and be able to change your Natures whenever you want.

New Pokemon:
Mimikyu:
I was wary about Mimikyu, but with such a gimmicky ability like Disguise (voids one attack against you), it sounds like this will not be a very good Pokemon, which is quite discouraging, as Ghost/Fairy is a really good type. There's only 1 Pokemon in the entire game as of Gen 6 that resists it (Normal/Fire), but Pyroar is pretty much irrelevant even in-game, so it would have great coverage with just its STABs. Having 3 immunities to common attacking types (Normal, Fighting, Dragon) is pretty good as well, that 4x resistance to Bug could be potentially useable. The official website says that after this Disguise is worn off, its appearance will change. Hopefully this means a BST change (preferably an increase, as that type is too good to waste).

Bewear:
I originally said that I didn't think this Pokemon would be beary good (ha ha ha), just by virtue of being a Bear. However, maybe I was just being a bit cynical that day. Halving contact damage is great, since 2 of its 3 weaknesses (Fighting and Flying) have moves that almost always make contact. But it also makes you weak to Fire. This will not be good, as most of the game's Fire and Fighting-Types are in the lower tiers, where this thing likely will end up. Then again, this is all dependent on whether or not this is a first stage or a second stage form.

Mudsdale:
Great design, and an actually great ability! The website doesn't clarify on what kind of attack activates Stamina, but hopefully anything does. I can definitely see this thing having high HP and Attack just by its description, and maybe even high Defence to combo with its ability.

Comfey:
Triage adds priority to healing moves. Naturally, this means that Comfey is going to get a lot of them (Recover, Wish, etc), but it's all up to its stats as to whether or not it'll be any good. Alomomola has terrible anything except for HP, which is all it really needs, but it still ended up being useful for healing purposes.

Bounsweet:
This thing hardly looks good. Mono Grass isn't a very good typing, and Leaf Guard is just bad. At least Oblivious has its uses, though.

Wimpod:
A Pokemon with an ability referencing of Edward of FF4? I don't disagree with making references to other RPGs, but I don't think Edward is the right character to be represented in your game... If this ability is carried on through it's entire family, if it has one, then this family will be useless unless they have super good stats, kind of like how Archeops has Defeatist but still has really good stats.. Its design makes it look based off of the trilobite, and personally, it'd be quite a disappointment for it to not be worth using, considering how good Kabutops is.


Hyper Training:
Being able to increase your IVs is amazing by itself. Even if I hated all of the new Pokemon, I would still get the games specifically for this feature. Being able to wash away the painful memories of wasting our lives grinding for Shiny Legendaries with perfect IVs is also a plus. However, as others have said, I hope that we'll be able to lower our IVs as well for Hidden Power purposes.
 
I dunno Watcher, Disguise seems like it has potential use. that typing alone makes it's ability a boon since stuff like Fake Out will not effect it, it can punish a Choice mon and is able to freely switch in on Outrage(OK well I don't think anyone really uses that anymore but you get what I mean.)
At the end of the day it's BSTs will make or break it but from I see so far I am liking it.
 
I can just tell that there'll eventually be a generation where you'll be able to teach Egg Moves through Tutors and be able to change your Natures whenever you want.
I doubt it, they're not gonna make it that easy unless they get really desperate eventually.

EDIT: What a lame waste of my 200th post. Oh well, hooray for me I guess.
 

Karxrida

Death to the Undying Savage
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
Wait people actually opposed Unlimited TMs? That. Makes. Zero. Sense.
Unlimited TMs actually affected the difficulty of story runs somewhat since you can now slap Earthquake or whatever on everything, plus there's that exploit in Gen VI to refill your PP for free.

They were probably better off being a postgame thing.
 
Hmm, could someone please care to remind me why IVs are a thing to begin with? And why are some people so damn attached to it? I swear it feels like some
stockholm syndrome kind of crap. Wasting countless hours of your life soft resetting for that one pokemon just because some bullshit system forces you to is no longer something worth writting home about, boo fucking hoo; I'm so sorry for you /s.


If anything I'm really, really, really mad at the fact that I deleted most of my event exclusive stuff not too long ago since thought I'd never get to use them and my boxes were getting all clogged up. Who knew that Sludge Bomb Zoroark I had on the back of my PC could someday become usable? Or that one Shiny Rayquaza!? But of course, as luck would have it, I got rid of them all. I swear on the holy baby Jesus that I feel saltier than the dead sea right now.

Anyways, I think it's step in the right direction and my only wish is that they had announced it just a couple of weeks earlier... Also, yeah I swear a lot ik, sorry about that.
 
Last edited:
Hmm, could someone please care to remind me why IVs are a thing to begin with? And why are some people so damn attached to it? I swear it feels like some
stockholm syndrome kind of crap. Wasting countless hours of your life soft resetting for that one pokemon just because some bullshit system forces you to is no longer something worth writting home about, boo fucking hoo; I'm so sorry for you /s.


If anything I'm really, really, really mad at the fact that I deleted most of my event exclusive stuff not too long ago since thought I'd never get to use them and my boxes were getting all clogged up. Who knew that Sludge Bomb Zoroark I had on the back of my PC could someday become usable? Or that one Shiny Rayquaza!? But of course, as luck would have it, I got rid of them all. I swear on the holy baby Jesus that I feel saltier than the dead sea right now.

Anyways, I think it's step on the right direction and my only wish is that they had announced it just a couple of weeks earlier... Also, yeah I swear a lot ik, sorry about that.
I don't mind IVs existing but the old system was dumb as rocks. They exist to make every Pokemon unique! which I swear is done for flavour purposes half the time.

It's actually leaps and bounds in the right direction.
 
10 pages! Four new 'mons! Six new abilties! New Mechanics! This is what I get for sleeping in.
Hyper Training:
While I have hope that the complaints about IVs will end, I have a feeling that people will STILL complain about it (oh, bottle caps are too rare, etc.).
Also, Pokémon/Fallout confirmed. And maybe I won't be the only person with level 100 Pokémon.

Wimipod:
While I kinda like the design, that ability isn't that great.
Also, please GF, reveal a Water-type I want to use!

Bounsweet:
An even cuter Cherubi. That is all.

Comfey:
It's a lei. That's a fairy. Oooookay. Triage is a cool abilty. The question is if Triage applies to moves like Heal Pulse or even better, things like Draining Kiss or Giga Drain?
(Five minutes later)
The design is growing on me. It is fairly cute. And to be fair, I didn't get a close look when I first saw it, so I didn't see how it's holding one end of its tail, which alleviates my biggest problem.

Mudsdale:
Okay design, really cool ability.

Mimikyu:
They didn't name it Pikaboo. Well, that's what I nicknaming mine. Also, Disguise sounds awesome and has the cutest animation.

Bewear:
That's a great name. Fluffy is an interesting ability.

Friendly Competitions:
FINALLY! We can finally hold our own tournaments! Also, it seems to confirm that some form of the pentagram will be available and it will be limited to Generation VII (and won't include Red, Blue, Green, or Yellow, sparing VGC players from No Guard Fissure Machamp). Which doesn't bother me as much as others since I always breed new 'mons, even if I could just use the previous generation's. It allows those games to remain battle ready in case I play eariler gens for fun. I mean, I already have two, nearly identical Gliscor and it seems like I'm going to breed another one for Generation VII (Gliscor tends to be a major part of my main, competitive team).

Individual Trailer Moments:
Vikavolt continues to be awesome.
It seems like Mudsdale is getting some exclusive move with that horseshoe animation.
Mimikyu is in some sort of graveyard, which gets me pumped since I'm a horror obsessed weirdo.
I like the new stat screen, though I wish it had numbers for EVs instead of those bar spike things. Wait, is that a six digit ID number? It looks weird and now the PokéLottery has gotten even more difficult!

They already changed the HA of Zapdos, Scolipede and Chandelure from gen 5 to 6. So why not?
As they didn't get a HA ability release in Generation V, that's not a noticeable change, so GF might have felt justified in changing them.

I really hope Wimpod gets Belly Drum.
Wow, I didn't know you were a sadist, Cod. Good to know.

Looking at the Bewear, its ability is a shittier version of Fur Coat... Why even bother and just not give it Fur Coat? It's not like Normal/Fighting needs more weaknesses?
With a weaker ability might come better stats.

But he will lost his max attack if he was swaped.



We also don't know HOW rare Bottlecaps will ACTUALLY be (though I hope you can buy it with BP since Pokemon Bank showers me in it). For all we know there might not even be any way to get any in-game and will instead be what's given out as event hold items all the time now.
Considering that they are promoting it, I highly, highly doubt it will be event exclusive as a group. Maybe the higher value ones (Magearna is holding a SILVER Bottle Cap), but not all of them.

Destiny Knot breeding for 5IVs is still probably faster for non-legendaries. Especially since we might not have Lv100 Blisseys to farm.
Agreed. Any bottle caps I get will be saved for five groups of Pokémon:
Legendaries
Imperfect Shinies
Event 'mons with good moves (Sludge Wave Gengar, etc.)
Mixed attacking 'mons
"(10 hours later): WHY ARE YOU ONLY FOUR IVS?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!" 'mons.

Comfey has priority Healing moves always higher than others that's really cool until now Talonflame was the only one with priority in healing but only because Roost was flying type.
Sableye has both Prankster and Recover.

I'd like to get back to bewear's ability. It's not really Fur Coat with a weakness added. Fur Coat halves the power of moves which use the defense stat. Fluffy halves the power of contact moves (by the way I read it). So, earthquake is only halved by Fur Coat while Grass knot is only halved by Fluffy. I don't say that's better, but it's different.
People thought the same about Fur Coat early on.

Mudsdale's new move is called "High Horsepower". It's shown in the video on the website. I'm worried they are revealing too much to be honest unless there are a huge number of new mons and they maybe kept some Gen 6 designs for Gen 7 to explain the difference in the numbers? I'm not so sure.

EDIT: About Fur Coat, I'm pretty sure I remember this being translated oddly as well and we didn't know for sure how it interacted with moves until the games came out. Sames like the same ambiguity could be applied here.
Shedinja'd

That would just break the cart, allowing you to PPwast anything by continuously switching between two Mimikyu. I'm pretty sure it works only once, and not for status moves (unless it also breaks the disguise).
Which is why species clause is a thing for competitive (both Smogon and VGC).
Though if this is the case, two or more 'mons with Disguise might need to be added to the Endless Battle clause so it covers Anything Goes, Almost Any Ability, Hackmons, etc.

It does make sense to me that they increased the Trainer ID digit number. With the expansion of playable languages, the risen popularity from Pokémon Go - albeit something that couldn't have been very accurately predicted on the scale it's popularity actually reached - and the fact this is the 20th Anniversary, it's likely they expect more players than usual, hence them making a larger number of Trainer IDs so people are less likely to have the same ones.
We always had the secret ID number as well.

So basically getting an event mon nicknamed went from 1/1 million to 1/10 billion?
Unless they pull a Bank Celebi again, which is nicknameable (mine's The Doctor because of course it is).

3- even though VGC 17 will prolly be Alola Dex and Alola born, for VGC 18, ORAS legends will be back so I'm happy I can stop with my SRs now.
VGC '16 using Box Legends will likely not happen again for sometime since it has happened only one other time, and that was 2010. It seems like it only happens if nothing new is added in-game (HGSS didn't add anything new for VGC, nothing came out last year) and the previous year wasn't "New Regional Dex Only!".

I hope they don't remove tripple and rotations. I honestly never used them, but removing features always bugs me. Hopefully more options will be added, since I don't see the new mode they announced a few weeks ago on that image anyway
Them not having it be an option for tournaments doesn't mean that it will be removed period.

I swear, people are way to quick to jump to the conclusion that GF is going to remove something when the number of times that has happen is so low, it's amazing. And I think it's mostly either straight replacement berries, a few, random items in Generation II, and random, Gen/Region exclusive things like the Dream World and Walking Pokémon.

Now I remember another thing this "collect bottlecaps" for the new mechanic reminded me of:

"Remember ALF? He's back. In Pog form."

Are you sure? It reminded me of James personally.
My first thought was the Fallout games, which is funny since I've never once played one.

But, much like Ability Capsules, Bottle Caps can just be hacked in.
Which defeats the purpose behind them.

If we can raise IVs, I really hope we can lower them as well. We have items that lower EVs, so it would be cool to have an item to lower IVs as well. It might not make sense to voluntarily lower your inner strength, but it would be insanely helpful for Hidden Power. Like if you were using Hidden Power Fire and suddenly wanted to use Hidden Power Ice, you could raise/lower your Pokemon's IVs appropriately to match what you want. I doubt this will happen, since the only other advantage to lowering IVs is lowering Attack for special attackers to reduce confusion and Foul Play damage, but I really hope it's possible nonetheless.
One idea is to breed perfectly imperfect 'mons and raise they IVs up to useful HPs.

Reflecting on it, Mudsdale is my favourite Gen VII Pokemon rn, just beating out Rowlet.
You've entered the wrong neighborhood.

Unlimited TMs actually affected the difficulty of story runs somewhat since you can now slap Earthquake or whatever on everything, plus there's that exploit in Gen VI to refill your PP for free.

They were probably better off being a postgame thing.
Because Pokémon is such a difficult game. I mean, it's not like I've beaten it with underleveled Pokémon in two days...oh wait, I did.
Also, that's why many really good TMs are only found late to post game since Black and White.

Hyper Training ruins all the effort people use to put in!
Then Horde Training ruined all previous EV efforts, Destiny Knot ruined RNGer's efforts, Everstone ruined all the effort that people put in to getting good natures, nail guns ruined hammer effort, you see where I'm going with this?

Or as someone else elegantly put it:
these are the kind of people who are mad that Unlimited TMs are a thing.

We call them psychos.
Eugenics, eugenics, eugenics
I have two comments on this. For starters, humanity have been doing things similar to IV breeding since before written words with dogs. Secondly, every single time any of you brings up the word eugenics, this is what I immediately think of:

Now excuse me, I'm going to watch "Space Seed".
 
Hmm, could someone please care to remind me why IVs are a thing to begin with? And why are some people so damn attached to it? I swear it feels like some
stockholm syndrome kind of crap. Wasting countless hours of your life soft resetting for that one pokemon just because some bullshit system forces you to is no longer something worth writting home about, boo fucking hoo; I'm so sorry for you /s.


If anything I'm really, really, really mad at the fact that I deleted most of my event exclusive stuff not too long ago since thought I'd never get to use them and my boxes were getting all clogged up. Who knew that Sludge Bomb Zoroark I had on the back of my PC could someday become usable? Or that one Shiny Rayquaza!? But of course, as luck would have it, I got rid of them all. I swear on the holy baby Jesus that I feel saltier than the dead sea right now.

Anyways, I think it's step on the right direction and my only wish is that they had announced it just a couple of weeks earlier... Also, yeah I swear a lot ik, sorry about that.
IVs existed to make every Pokemon "unique", and the game developers were rather attached to that idea. But as Pokemon's competitive audience grew, and people expressing the system's distaste (with resorting to methods such as RNG Abuse), the system was basically unacceptable.

It still takes a bit of work to max out IVs (by either leveling to 100 + farming caps) or Destiny Knot breeding. I think Knotting with 6IV Dittos will still be preferred for non-legendary Pokemon, but Hyper Training will be superior for legendaries.
 
If anything I'm really, really, really mad at the fact that I deleted most of my event exclusive stuff not too long ago since thought I'd never get to use them and my boxes were getting all clogged up. Who knew that Sludge Bomb Zoroark I had on the back of my PC could someday become usable? Or that one Shiny Rayquaza!? But of course, as luck would have it, I got rid of them all. I swear on the holy baby Jesus that I feel saltier than the dead sea right now.
I almost forgot about some of those... I think i may have a Sludge Bomb Zoro I hadn't picked up... And I know I have a Bacon Bird to claim on one of my carts.

In before you get Bottle Caps by winning the ID number lottery and that is the reason why they've introduced 6 digit ID numbers.
Everyone would rage, i bet.
 
As for the pokemon, I'm really happy to see all the new abilities popping up. Having generic abilities that are shared with a dozen other species can quickly make a pokemon forgettable, but a unique ability can really make a pokemon memorable even if it's not actually that great competitively. Everyone remembers Furfrou and what it does even though it was a total flop. Even garbage like Plusle and Minun are more memorable for their unique gimmick than other pokemon with more practical but boring abilities (oh gee, another electric type with static). Everything revealed so far looks to at very least be interesting, and that bodes well for memorable pokemon that we'll know and love for years to come... even if it's only in a lower tier.
I was about to mention this too and forgot. I really like how creative they're being with abilities this time around.
 
Last edited:

Theorymon

Long Live Super Mario Maker! 2015-2024
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
One really great thing about the bottle cap system is that you can actually breed "perfect" Pokemon more reasonably too. For example, a lot of people don't bother breeding to get a 0 in Attack for Special Attackers, even though that is actually useful against stuff with Foul Play (and Swagger for battle spot hehehehe). However, that was normally a huge pain in the ass that no one bothered with. Hidden Power Breeding is also a bastard, and don't get me started on mixed Pokemon!

With Bottle Caps, you could breed partially perfect Pokemon and aim for certain stuff like 30s for Hidden Power or 0s for Attack, then just fix'em up later with bottle caps.

I've never been a fan of breeding, but I think bottle caps are basically as close as we can get to fixing that without totally killing it.

On a related now, I'm tempted to actually do a Pokemon XD runthrough now. Gamefreak does weird online competitions all the time, and sometimes competitions pop up where XD Pokemon are pretty useful (for example, Helping Hand Dusclops is pretty good in Sinnoh Classic). Getting good ones was absolute hell though. Now, getting a good one with bottle caps actually sounds reasonable!
 
Mudsdale is absolutely amazing and is now one of my favorite revealed Pokemon. That design is solid, draft horses are awesome, and I just really love horse Pokemon.

Wimpod is pretty cool too, although I wish it was a fossil Pokemon.
 
VGC '16 using Box Legends will likely not happen again for sometime since it has happened only one other time, and that was 2010. It seems like it only happens if nothing new is added in-game (HGSS didn't add anything new for VGC, nothing came out last year) and the previous year wasn't "New Regional Dex Only!".
I know it, I'm not talking about the box legends, only the regular legends. I restarted a game on AS to SR the legends so I could give them the names I wanted, but now I can just Synchro for right nature and be happy with them the way they are.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 2)

Top