Lol SPL is gonna be crazy with a bunch of big names gone
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Finals World Cup of Pokemon XI - Finals [Won by Team USA East]
- Thread starter M Dragon
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Sorry but this doesn't relate to what I said. Smogon is a big forum and right now, it's rewarding criminal actions. While you're not a court, you're losing all your integrity and basically tell people to just start hacking once they've lost. Is that what you call a fair tournament? If you want something to be fair, start by observing the law yourself.
It's not like they're giving the hacker a prize they're just using the evidence
The only reward is maybe a little bit of self satisfaction
When you're extremely motivated and already prepare for wcop 2017 https://www.google.de/search?q=how+to+hack+skype+accounts #TheGrindContinues #PumpedUp #GermanMut
How is other people getting tournament banned a reward for the hacker, it literally has no effect positive or negative on that person (Germany didn't win so it's not like they're getting the trophy). Should the hacker be punished as well? Possibly, there is definitely a good argument for doing so, but why the fuck should Germany not be punished for cheating?
They didn't get tour banned cause they got hacked, they got your banned because they cheated. If you don't want to get tour banned don't get ghosted / ghost (that way you're good regardless of whether or not you're hacked!). Is that actually a hard concept for people to understand?
The fact that hacking is not okay doesn't suddenly make the cheating okay.
I feel very conflicted about the TD team moving forward with this evidence. On one hand ghosting should not ever be condoned, but on the other the evidence for this action was gained in a criminal manner. I feel like, while the hacker is still free it just encourages more hacks in the future, since now potential hackers know that the TD team will still take action on evidence that was gained maliciously. I don't actually know how you can potentially solve this issue, but I think maybe going to the players that were implicated and soft banning them behind the scene might have been better. At the same time this still runs into issues with people questioning why the members of team Germany are no longer signing up to tournaments like SPL. Either way, I'm disgusted that someone would go to such criminal lengths to affect a Pokemon tournament and then go forward with blackmailing the information. This is a super delicate situation, so I can understand the direction the TD team decided to go, I just find the fact that we even have to go there horrible.
just to follow up on this because you're right it does feel scummy...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exclusionary_rule
At the same time however, Lohgock, how else do you expect TDs to get info to make these decisions? They're not actual police. They can't get a warrant to search your team chats lol.
you just wasted the opportunity of life, buddy... you're supposed to find a fancy picture of the show "Orange is the New Black" and edit it to look like "German is the new Italian". Bonus points if you manage to find some low quality photos of the players straight from the bonafide thread. I'd do that myself, but I don't feel making memes about this whole deal considering that it's a little too sad
While this case does seem parallel to a common application of the exclusionary rule irl, there's one notable flaw in this logic. When the exclusionary rule is invoked, it is usually because the prosecutor (or the police often) are the ones who did something illegal to get the evidence. So, yea, if a police officer breaks into a home with no warrant or probable cause to obtain evidence, then it can probably be thrown away. However, this ghosting case is more similar to one where one criminal robs another and then hands evidence over to the police. The TDs (police), did not do anything illegal. I'm personally curious to know the details of the hacking here but either way I think the TDs should not discard the evidence, and thus should go forward in punishing the users.
Also the hacking user should 100% be banned as well.
Mazar
Banned deucer.
everything important was already said.
i just want to add that the hacker must be german or have a partner in crime who is german or atleast knows the language fluently. in addition it needs to be someone who values ranks on pokemon showdown high and has something personal against bluri (i know there was also sending gayporns to friends involved for example) -> all in all it needs to be a complete retard..
all in all its just sad that someone is ready to break laws for something in pokemon forums. that shouldnt be an excuse tho
i just want to add that the hacker must be german or have a partner in crime who is german or atleast knows the language fluently. in addition it needs to be someone who values ranks on pokemon showdown high and has something personal against bluri (i know there was also sending gayporns to friends involved for example) -> all in all it needs to be a complete retard..
all in all its just sad that someone is ready to break laws for something in pokemon forums. that shouldnt be an excuse tho
You do realize that person is turobautistic enough to hack someone's skype account and take 20 selective screenshots after obviously reading huge parts of the conversation just to prove a point on the internet. Just imagine he didn't like the kid who he hacked, which is a fair assumption considering that that kid got tormented over it by the hacker then. It did affect them positively because they wanted to do it, they wanted to prove a point and expose this team. And they got there. edit: might want to add there that it is affirming him for commiting a crime.
Nobody is saying the hacking makes the cheating ok, but I don't think I'm the only one who thinks that hacking someone and tormenting them is a bit more radical than breaking the rules of a pokemon tournament.
Can I have my Grand Slam trophy now
Lol are you serious? That's obviously exactly what the hacker was going for; how the fuck is seeing his intentions fulfilled not a reward?
Acting on illegally acquired evidence means encouraging people to illegally acquire more evidence for future cases. That's unacceptable. It's pretty simple. It sucks that you can't punish the cheaters, but it's a necessary evil.
On another note, you can't just ban the entire community for ghosting. Structures of team tournaments inherently encourage ghosting; it's basically always going to happen as long as your bad players know they're bad and still want to win. I know for a fact that aldaron witnessed ghosting in SPL channels and chose not to act; why didn't he just ban all 120 SPL players? Guess we'll never know, haha.
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Why not? - Dekzeh
I mean the obvious ideal would to be punish both the ghosters and the hacker, (the hacker more harshly).
I'm relatively certain that the entire community isn't participating in ghosting, maybe I'm wrong, but if that's the case what's even the point of tournaments.
Actually just to clarify for some people, imagine this happens to you in the US:
Coworker looks through your desk without your permission and finds evidence that would get you convicted of a crime and steals it.
Coworker brings this evidence to the police, who did not ask for it or direct him in anyway.
Police then uses evidence to try to convict you of a crime.
It would be legally admissable evidence.
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/256/465/case.html
Not gonna speak to other countries' law lol but let's not act like this is such a travesty of law. If you can literally go to jail in the US over evidence someone stole from you, I think you can get banned from playing tournaments on a Pokemon forum.
Coworker looks through your desk without your permission and finds evidence that would get you convicted of a crime and steals it.
Coworker brings this evidence to the police, who did not ask for it or direct him in anyway.
Police then uses evidence to try to convict you of a crime.
It would be legally admissable evidence.
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/256/465/case.html
Not gonna speak to other countries' law lol but let's not act like this is such a travesty of law. If you can literally go to jail in the US over evidence someone stole from you, I think you can get banned from playing tournaments on a Pokemon forum.
Team tournaments can be competitive and fun with or without ghosting. While most players are too self-respecting to get ghosted, I'd still say that hacking every team's logs throughout an entire season of SPL (which is apparently a reasonable means of acquiring evidence) would result in damning evidence against most teams.
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