SM OU CDUMAS MAGEARNA OFFENSE, PEAKED #4 AND 93%GXE

[Kickasser]

> MAGEARNA OFFENSE <

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Introduction

Hey there, today I'm making a RMT of this team that u have probably faced many times on the ladder, it was build by my friend Cdumas and was stolen by many people due to the amazing records that cd pulled off with (40-3 in the dug's suspect test, and 53-1 on the regular ladder,+made final of a suspect tour). I used it myself and managed to peak pretty high on the SuMo OU ladder, it's a very funny and competitive team that can perform amazing results if played correctly. So with that being said, let's get into it.

peak and records

Cdumas's 50-1, 93%GXE https://snag.gy/Rbc1wx.jpg
Proof of my peak as "be rasp my berry": https://snag.gy/SV2rlz.jpg

Teambuilding Process

Cdumas wanted to build around z-move magearna. With good support, it can sweep many teams because of it's incredible movepool and it's really good typing/bulk that gives it many set-up opportunities.

After looking the things that could take magearna on, he realised that it had a very slicy amount of checks: celesteela, chansey, toxapex, tangrowth, metagross, AV magearna, ferrothorn,heatran. Bar celesteela, all these mons are grounded, so he picked landorus-t+greninja, they can easily set up stealth rock+spikes, and bring momentum to the team w/ landorus's u-turn. Greninja's movepool can also be used to lure some magearna's checks, and the synergy is pretty solid considering both magearna weaknesses (fire and ground) are resisted by our other 2 mons.

After that, he decided to add a mon that shares the same checks with magearna to weaken them for a late-game sweep, so he chose to add tapu lele. It hits stupidly hard with it's psychic's move boosted by the terrain, and can punch huge holes into the opponent's team after a uturn from landorus.

Then he realised that the team was pretty slow, and was pretty weak to hazards too. Pheromosa fils into the spot as a hazard removal/revenge killer with it's stupid speed and great offensive stats, it's also a great lead and takes advantage of the psychic terrain to ignore opponent's priority moves. It's uturn can also give lele a free kill if ur opponent decide to switch his toxapex/tapu fini into it, and it can sweep in late-game if you've killed it's common checks.

Last but not least, mega metagross. It's easily for me the most busted mon in SuMo right now (with greninja and duggy kek), and brings so much to the team. It can pivot into many mons due to it's excellent 80/150/110 defensive stats, working as a huge fairy resist and hits extremly hard with though claw boosted 145bs Atk meteor mash and can also revenge kill some things w/ it's priority move.

The Team

Magearna @ Steelinium Z
Ability: Soul-Heart
EVs: 252SpA / 252Spd / 4Def
Timid Nature
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt
- Aurasphere
- Shift Gear

This set has been created by Leftiez in the beggining of SuMo, and god it is powerfull. Flash Cannon is the main stab that hits decently hard, only resisted by steel (and fire/elec but kek) mons that can be hit super effectively by Aurasphere. Tbolt completes the coverage by hitting Celesteela/Skarmory, Tornadus-T and Toxapex, and can be very useful in some tricky situations against Gyarados. The idea is simple: you set up a Shift Gear with Mag (witch is pretty easy because of it's 80/115/115 bulk and it's NINE RESISTS WTF), you nuke something with your 160bp Z-Flash Cannon, get a +1 SpA boost with Soul-Heart and sweep the opponents team. This set is VERY good to clean teams, if you use it you'll get use to 1v5 things with this mon after you have weakened the opponent's team+hazard spam him. A very very underestimed mon in my opinion.

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4Spa
Naive Nature
- Spikes
- Gunk Shot
- Ice Beam
- Low kick

One of the greatest, if it's not the best mon in SuMo tho, nothing checks it because it basically has 0 switch in depending of the moves it carries. Here we use a physical greninja to kill the most present hazard remover in the meta, aka Tapu Fini, witch is also one of the initial switch-in of greninja, to help the hazard spamming. Getting ride of Fini also helps Pheromosa to sweep so there is that. Spike is one of the best move in the meta right now, Low Kick OS Heatran from full and does about half to Celesteela and 80% to ferrothorn. Ice beam compeletes the coverage by hitting landorus-t, garchomp and zygarde. It's also our only water resist, but it's frail as fuck so don't rely on that too much lol

Landorus-t @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248HP / 228Def / 4SpD / 28Spd
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Hidden Power Ice
- U-turn

The great Landorus-T, helps the team to not lose against double dance Landorus-T, Mega-Mawile and Charizard-Mega X. It can set up rocks against almost everything, and the intimidate and rocky helmet can help mag so set-up w/ the Atk drop and chips. Speed creep for Tapu Fini, Eq is the main stab that still hit pretty hard cause of it's 145bs Atk, Hp Ice for other Landorus-T and of course Zygarde, that can be very annoying for the team if it carries e-speed and if Lele is dead. U-Turn helps for the momentum, to sometimes give to Tapu Lele a free in to weaken Magearna's check.

Tapu Lele @ Choice Specs
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252SpA / 252Spd / 4SpD
Timid Nature
- Psyshock
- Psychic
- Hidden Power Fire
- Moonblast

Tapu Lele is arguably the most powerfull offensive menace in the meta right now. It hits stupidly hard with it's Psychic-Terrain boosted stab, and does even more stupidest damages coupled with a choice specs. It's here to do massive damages to Magearna's checks, like ferrothorn, scizor or celesteela. It also helps the team with it's psychic terrain giving Pheromosa an immunity to priority moves, and by boosting Metagross's Zen-Headbutt. Psychic is the main and most spammable stab, Psyshock is here for Chansey but can also be use in some situations against Celesteela, Hp Fire help for Ferrothorn and to revengekill Mega-Scizor, while Moonblast is another powerful stab that can hit dark types such as Greninja or Hydreigon. It pretty much gets a kill everytimes it comes on the field after a u-turn if your opponent doesn't run Celesteela or Metagross, which both take one million eitherway. Timid nature to tie with the other 95bs Spd mons but mainly to outspeed every non-scarf landorus.

252 SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Metagross-Mega: 107-126 (35.5 - 41.8%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Psychic vs. 248 HP / 128 SpD Scizor-Mega in Psychic Terrain: 145-171 (42.2 - 49.8%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Celesteela in Psychic Terrain: 143-168 (35.9 - 42.2%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Psyshock vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey in Psychic Terrain: 390-460 (60.7 - 71.6%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Psychic vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn in Psychic Terrain: 126-149 (35.7 - 42.3%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Psychic vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Heatran in Psychic Terrain: 156-185 (40.4 - 47.9%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Psychic vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Heatran in Psychic Terrain: 156-185 (48.2 - 57.2%)

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Though Claw
EVs: 252Atk / 252Spd / 4Def
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Bullet Punch
- Zen Headbutt
- Hammer Arm

Metagross is an insane pivot/wallbreaker, the speed boost t1 in SuMo and the raise of the tapus definitely make of it the greatest mega right now. It hits REALLY hard, Meteor Mash is the main stab, Zen Headbutt can be spammed too w/ the psychic terrain, also does huge damages to Toxapex that can help Phero/Magearna in end game. Hammer Arm hits steel-types, 2HKO's ferro, OHKO's heatran and does about 45% to Celesteela, Bullet Punch is crucial in order to not lose against double dance lando, because landorus's hp ice plus bullet punch kills it.

Pheromosa @ Item Choice Scarf
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252Atk / 252Spd / 4SpA
Naughty Nature
- Ice Beam
- High Jump Kick
- U-turn
- Rapid Spin

Pheromosa is our spinner, revengekiller, a great pivot and a potential wincon in end game if you'v killed it's checks. It's also a great lead because it can U-Turn on absolutely everything (besides Pinsir or Specs Ash-Greninja) and gives to Tapu Lele some free heavy hits if your opponent decides to send his Toxapex/Tapu Fini on a U-Turn. Choice scarf makes it the mon with the highest speed in the tier, besides Jolly Sand Rush Excadrill, being able to revengekill almost every offensive threats. It outspeeds adamant +2 Spd Landorus-T, Kingdra in the rain and every Scarf mons in the game except Pheromosa itself. High Jump Kick and U-Turn are the main stabs, it gives Pheromosa a powerful attack and a crucial move for momentum, Ice Beam completes the coverage by hitting Landorus-T, Zygarde and Garchomp. Rapid Spin to get ride of hazards because our team is pretty weak to spikes/tspikes. It's typing allows it so switch into some things if you predict correctly your opponent's move, like defensive Landorus-T, Tangrowth and non-band Zygarde, which helps to regain momentum/spin hazards away. It also can take advantage of the Psychic Terrain in some late-game situations, to avoid priority moves because it's frail as fuck.

Threats

Specially defensive Celesteela

By far the biggest threat because nothing on the team can OHKO it and it sets up leech seed against everything, we have to deal around with this by making doubles to avoid that it recovers too much health and hit it hard everytime we can.

Scarf Keldeo-Resolute

As I said our water resist is Greninja, which takes one million damages from scarf keldeo (46.3 - 54.7% with Hpump). It outspeeds most of the team and 2HKO every single mon, and is even a bigger threat than Kingdra because Pheromosa fails to kill it with U-Turn into High Jump Kick. Definetly a big threat that has to be played perfectly around, a bad lead against it can make you lose the game turn 1.

Metagross-Mega

With the the good coverage it can be very annoying, and even more of a threat because Greninja and Metagross can't hit it strongly. You have to pivot into your own Metagross then sending Landorus-T to avoid the 2hko by Meteor Mash, rocky helmets damages are crucial in order to revengekill it with Pheromosa/Metagross or to end-game sweep with Magearna. Rock polish variant are a HUGE threat if Landorus is dead, you pretty much need to sack the half of your team to it if it carries EQ so yeah this thing is kind of a problem.

Charizard-Mega Y

It OHKO's every member of the team with Fire Blast except Greninja, it outspeeds Magearna, Tapu Lele and Magearna and Metagross fails to OHKO it with Zen Heabutt so does Pheromosa with U-Turn+High Jump Kick. I generaly lead Greninja, Gunk Shot it which does about 90% then go Pheromosa and get a "free" U-Turn. Luckily, most of the builds based around Zard-Y are pretty frail, I never lost to it but you have to pressure it enough to the point it can't come easily on the field by hitting it and setting up rocks asap, leading Pheromosa against it can put you in a very bad position and make you lose the game t1.

Volcarona

Z-Move Volcarona 6-0's the team on the paper but luckily we can play around it. It can't set up on anything except Magearna or Pheromosa locked into Ice Beam/Rapid Spin, every member of the team can 2HKO it otherwise. Pressure it with rocks and never give it a free QD. Bulky variants are even more dangerous because it can set up on Landorus-T/Metagross if it gets the burn with Flame Body. Once you see the leftovers, hit it and then hardswitch to Lele, Psyshock OHKO's every Volcarona and Lele can take a hit from +1 bulky Volc. Pressuring the opponent's defoger/spinner is a absolute necessity, it makes the game a million times easier if it dies but yeah thought match up.

Greninja

I basicaly have zero switch in to this thing, Pheromosa leads correctly against it because even specs variants need 4hits with Water Shuriken in order to OHKO, Metagross can take a hit from non-specs Greninja, and my Greninja from full can live a hit and do massive damages but the trade is worth considering who painfull this mon is for the team. It also gives Magearna a "free" set up because HP-Fire doesn't put Mag in the range of BP Gross.

Ash-Greninja

Specs variants aren't that of a threat because it's easier to deal with it if it locks itself into a move, Pheromosa RK if it's lock on a move that's not Water Shuriken and Lele does it if it decides to lock on that. Water Plate versions are way harder to deal with, especially considering the unpredictability factor, because if I think it's lock on Dark Pulse for exemple, decide to revengekill it with Pheromosa and die to Water Shuriken, my opponent is in a great situation tho.

Pheromosa

Pheromosa in general is annoying to deal with but not really a big menace for the team, leading Phero is fine because it can't do a move that OHKO's me, and I can just U-Turn into Gross/Magearna. Quiver Dance is more annoying because it sets up on a switch, gets a kill and then I need to win at least one tie with my Pheromosa to revengekill it with Metagross, and two ties if Metagross is dead so yeah you basically need to not switch against this thing. Scarf versions still outspeed Mag at +2Spd, I think that important enough to notice it.

Gengar

Pretty annoying considering the fact that it can't get revengekilled by Pheromosa due to it's typing and because Ice Beam doesn't even 2HKO, but it can 2HKO's all my team with the correct move (except for Mag but you don't hardswitch the wincon like that lol). Leading Landorus can be fine but some LO variants pack Icy Wind, so yeah tricky mon to deal with. Scarf variants can easily sweep me in end game, but specs are even worse because I can't revengekill them safely with Metagross and they can just spam Shadow Ball so yeah massive threat.
Replays

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-543223116 Vs Celesteela Balance, dealing around celesteela by making hot doubles
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-547216180 Vs Omfuga's BO. Going for game after a SpD drop, Mag can punch holes by it's own
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-539277891 Vs Stall. After he lets chansey take damages and consumed trio's sash, Mag was ready to go


Conclusion

Shoutout to cdumas , Simiatic , Raspberry, Dlanyer, le grand Weshbien and Baltos ;)

importable

http://pastebin.com/611dEhem

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[3d]

hi cool team. i noticed this team doesn't really have a solid answer for tapu koko, especially since pheromosa doesn't have poison jab and magearna isn't assault vest. it also outspeeds the remaining mons and only fears bullet punch from meta metagross but it still pressures that very well. opposing pheromosa could also be annoying since it can freely spam hjk vs this team and only needs to catch the landorus-t one time before it actually just spams u-turn which is very annoying for this team to deal with. with that being said, here are my suggested changes.

firstly, i would suggest replacing rapid spin on pheromosa with poison jab. in my opinion, scarf rapid spin pheromosa isn't really that good since you have to predict every turn and if you go for spin you're locked into it giving say opposing pheromosa free setup potentially winning the game. poison jab hits tapu koko which i stated before to be a huge threat, and also gives you a more reliable way of beating it rather than getting bp damage with metagross, some u-turn damage and then ice beam, rather just koing it with poison jab. rapid spin isn't really needed on this team imo since hazards aren't too much of an issue because you can pressure almost all rockers, mainly garchomp excadrill and landorus-t with mega metagross, pheromosa and tapu lele, but this does make your team a bit weaker to spikes so making sure greninja or magearna is in vs skarmory could save your life in these situations.

next, i suggest making greninja more specially oriented with water shuriken. water shuriken gives you another way to hit pheromosa instead of giving it a free kill which eases the matchup quite a bit. say greninja comes in and kills tapu fini with gunk shot, their initial reaction might be to go pheromosa and try to setup(qd phero + fini is often a core since fini gets rid of hazards for pheromosa) but you just kill them with water shuriken. losing out on low kick won't be too bad since you still have ways to beat ferrothorn, heatran, and celesteela mainly with pheromosa, mega metagross and magearna. water shuriken also hits tapu koko in case you need to which could win games. the biggest downside to this is that you no longer OHKO tapu fini with gunk shot, so before you spike up on the incoming tapu fini, gunk shotting straight away might be a better play.

 

[3d]

Kickasser, here are some ideas:

Psychic----> Shadow Ball

Running two psychic STABs on the same set is redundant given how psyshock already does everything you need it do, with the bonus of hitting chansey really hard. Shadow ball is a nice replacement as with choice specs, it lures in and smacks in its usually switch ins such as Mega Metagross, Bronzong, and Mega Slowbro for Huge damage, if not outright OHKOing them.

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Metagross-Mega: 266-314 (88.3 - 104.3%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Bronzong: 252-298 (74.5 - 88.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 28 SpD Slowbro-Mega: 334-394 (84.9 - 100.2%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

Bullet Punch----> Thunder Punch

First of all, Double Dance lando doesn't run a Z-Crystal so Landorus Therian easily stops it cold, making Bullet punch unnecessary as your team isn't weak to Weavile, but your team lacks coverage against Celesteela and Skarmory, which forces you to either chip your stepup sweeper (magearna) or simply lose. Thunder Punch easily 2Hkoes Celesteela and Skamrory after stealth rock, and paired with Hammer arm and Shadow Ball tapu lele, they form an extremely formidable psychic spam core with Metagross dealing with Skarmory, Celesteela, and Ferrothorn, and Tapu lele dealing with Mega Scizor (Specs HP fire cleanly OHKOes) and Slowbro with shadow ball.
252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Celesteela: 226-266 (56.7 - 66.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 132-156 (39.5 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

And thats pretty much it. In conclusion, your team should abuse Psychic Terrain to the fullest, and my above changes provide that. Taking full advantage of the
support Tapu lele gives your team is quite important, not only to your team, but to support Magearna as well by wearing down its usual checks (such as Chansey and Haze Toxapex) the most.

psyshock helps with hitting chansey and he has hp fire for zong.
thunder punch just makes him a lot weaker to pheromosa since water shuriken from normal greninja doesn't actually kill it.

 

[Colonel M]

Kickasser, here are some ideas:

Bullet Punch----> Thunder Punch

First of all, Double Dance lando doesn't run a Z-Crystal so Landorus Therian easily stops it cold, making Bullet punch unnecessary...

Is that so? Majority I have seen run Continental Crush unless the team is using the Z Slot. Maybe to... oh, I don't know, bypass Skarmory, Celesteela, and opposing Landorus-T?

Like Amoonguss said he needs BP or the team can get reamed by opposing Pheromosa. He has to risk a Speed tie with Scarf.

Also double Psychic Lele is fine. HP Fire should do sufficient when catching a Mega Metagross switch-in and Psychic + Psyshock is hard to switch into if you're not a Dark-type.

I think, on that note, Spin Scarf is fine. Hazards can be an annoyance for this team since it lacks a Poison-type and a lot of mons are naturally grounded. I do think, for what it's worth, Ash-Greninja is a good start, but I feel it doesn't solve the Keldeo issue (lesser extent Celesteela). I'll think of something in the backburner for that. Thunderbolt on Magearna kind of helps that a bit.

To be fair Celesteela is annoyed by that specific Greninja, though. You could also forego Spikes altogether and use Water Shuriken over it, but I feel there are better solutions.

 

[Empo]

lol ok
Why would he replace Rapid Spin? He needs it so much especially for some magearna setup and stuff. Hazards kinda hurt the team so there is no point in removing the spin dude, lol. Also, that greninja set is fire. I dont get why he would put some random water shuriken move while he needs that coverage + spikes slot much to destroy balance teams and shit.

 

[Colonel M]

lol ok
Why would he replace Rapid Spin? He needs it so much especially for some magearna setup and stuff. Hazards kinda hurt the team so there is no point in removing the spin dude, lol. Also, that greninja set is fire. I dont get why he would put some random water shuriken move while he needs that coverage + spikes slot much to destroy balance teams and shit.

The other reason to suggest Water Shuriken (which I was about to edit the post) is because he is very weak to Firium Volcarona and has to really put forth a lot of effort to keeping Stealth Rock and Spikes up (Pheromosa gives a free switch-in if Stealth Rock is not down). To be fair min SpA Water Shuriken doesnt solve that since I didnt realize he was using Low Kick Gren until about halfway through my post. He is able to pressure Volc most of the time to deny a setup, which is a big reason why he's probably not listed it as a threat, though.

I also did say "there are better solutions to it." I mainly wanted to respond to the ridiculous notion of Lando-T not carrying a Z Crystal.

 

[Empo]

The other reason to suggest Water Shuriken (which I was about to edit the post) is because he is very weak to Firium Volcarona and has to really put forth a lot of effort to keeping Stealth Rock and Spikes up (Pheromosa gives a free switch-in if Stealth Rock is not down). To be fair min SpA Water Shuriken doesnt solve that since I didnt realize he was using Low Kick Gren until about halfway through my post. He is able to pressure Volc most of the time to deny a setup, which is a big reason why he's probably not listed it as a threat, though.

I also did say "there are better solutions to it." I mainly wanted to respond to the ridiculous notion of Lando-T not carrying a Z Crystal.

Yeah colo i was talking to amoonguss about the rapid spin especially.
Also, referring to the water prio, he is max atk ninja so using water shuriken is just a waste tbh. i wouldnt feel like replacing some move for shuriken too.

 

[Kickasser]

I rly rly don't see a move that I can change on the greninja's set, yeah zmove volc is a huge threat but it can only set up on pheromosa, and still takes masive damages from hjk. every other mon in the team 2hko's it, the bulky set with leftovers is a bigger issue because u need to attack it and then hardswitch on lele on the roost, and lele has to be neerly at full. water shuriken on a protean set seems kinda trash for me, it only helps against landorus (which isn't a problem as I explained on the team description), koko and volc, but doesn't do that much damages and get canceled by psychic terrain. i mean every single team is weak to something on the paper, but u can play around everything anyway
like empo said, rapid spin is too much important to be remove, and you can play around koko with tapu lele+lando. u don't gain that much by putting shadow ball on lele tho, hp fire easily 2hko's gross and stuff, and I don't think that bronzong is important enough in the actual meta to really care about it imo.

 

[Morsel]

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Celesteela: 154-182 (38.6 - 45.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Bronzong: 140-166 (41.4 - 49.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Your team is extraordinarily weak to bronzong. Bronzong walls Tapu lele. It walls Mega Metagross. It walls Landorus Therian. It walls Magearna. It walls everything on your team except Pheromosa, and even that can't switch in. Thats why its absolute crucial to run shadow ball and Tapu lele, it nearly OHKOes phyiscally defensive variants and also OHKOes Mega Metagross switching into it that haven't gotten a chance to Mega evolve yet (be realistic, Mega Meta doesn't get on the field till mid game). While the metagame can ignore it as a whole, your team certainty can't.

???????

1. Bronzong lacks reliable recovery and just because it "in theory" walls of his Pokemon, it really doesn't in practice. The opponent can't hard switch bronzong into all those mons simultaneously because it'll just get worn down. Plus it doesn't "wall" metagross lmao, it can literally afford to stay in and fish for meteor mash boosts or do a ton with hammer arm.

2. HP Fire does literally the same thing as shadow ball. 2HKOing bronzong with shadow ball doesn't justify using it vs. the pressure dual psychic STAB places on fatter teams.

3. Statements like "metagross can't get on the field till mid game" is literal theorymon and doesn't mean anything, so I don't see what you're getting at.

 

[Leo]

Yo this team is sick, the weakness to Volc kinda bothers me because it kinda wins if your opp realizes your Spikes Gren can't touch it or they start stacking hazards because you can't afford to Spin against it. There isn't much that could be changed that hasn't been said alreadt but something you could try is Giga Impact Pheromosa. Ok, I know this sounds like some hot garbage but I've tried the team a bit and hazards aren't that big of a deal when you can pressure your opp with your own while also beating their Ferros with your Low Kick Gren (haven't faced spikes gren but in theory it shouldn't get too many hazards up). So if you give up Rapid Spin for Impact you have a way of catching your opp off guard and removing the biggest threat to your team which basically throws their momentum away although you're forced to sack Phero after this. This prob isn't an optimal change but it's definitely something worth considering if you fear Volc in ley's say a tour or something.

 

[Colonel M]

Yo this team is sick, the weakness to Volc kinda bothers me because it kinda wins if your opp realizes your Spikes Gren can't touch it...

Unless Gunk Shot misses no Volcarona will attempt to set up on regular Greninja:

252 Atk Life Orb Protean Greninja Gunk Shot vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Volcarona: 292-344 (93.5 - 110.2%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO

Even the Defensive Volcarona wants little to do with Greninja because of the risk of Poison.

 

[Kickasser]

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7oususpecttest-250249
here we have an exemple that shows how much rapid spin on pheromosa is important.
as our landorus is defensive, it can't prevent other landorus/ferrothorn from setting up hazards because it doesn't pressure them enough, while some landorus can with SD+z move for exemple. it also has to switch in front of greninja which gives it a free spike. against those kind of bulky offense w/ bulky mons such as ferrothorn, metagross, or even toxapex, the idea is to set up hazards as soon as possible and get massive hits with lele/gross/greninja to end up cleaning with pheromosa/magearna, while landorus/pheromosa help to keep the momentum. in this game, mag can't win cause it's wall by rotom and has to set up two shift gear in order to outspeed scarf chomp (which I didn't precise in the threatlist, my bad I'll complete it) so the wincon was basically pheromosa. cdumas has to switch many times around in order to break holes w/ metagross and lele, and you can notice that pheromosa came on the field the exact amount of time that it would have taken to kill it with a spike+SR. I don't have replays that show it but mag also takes benefict of hazard-removal in order to live a hit and set-up

252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Meteor Mash+Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Magearna: 184-217 (88.3 - 105,2%)
0 Atk Landorus-Therian Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Magearna: 264-312 (87.7 - 103.6%)
252+ Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Magearna: 216-255 (71.7 - 84.7%)

if mag doesn't take damages from hazards and if you don't let it get it weak, by switching in a weak move like scald from toxapex, it's a lot easier to set up against a lot of mons like pheromosa, metagross or even other magearna.
i'll add the fact that i saw someone saying that the team was wall by bronzong, i'll just say that bronzong hits stupidly not-hard and get easily wall by metagross after I intimidate it with landorus-t and can only recover health with lefties, please try to make a contructive analysis in order to help the team getting better, not by just saying "oh you're bronzong weak af lol"

 

[Leo]

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7oususpecttest-250249
here we have an exemple that shows how much rapid spin on pheromosa is important.
as our landorus is defensive, it can't prevent other landorus/ferrothorn from setting up hazards because it doesn't pressure them enough, while some landorus can with SD+z move for exemple. it also has to switch in front of greninja which gives it a free spike. against those kind of bulky offense w/ bulky mons such as ferrothorn, metagross, or even toxapex, the idea is to set up hazards as soon as possible and get massive hits with lele/gross/greninja to end up cleaning with pheromosa/magearna, while landorus/pheromosa help to keep the momentum. in this game, mag can't win cause it's wall by rotom and has to set up two shift gear in order to outspeed scarf chomp (which I didn't precise in the threatlist, my bad I'll complete it) so the wincon was basically pheromosa. cdumas has to switch many times around in order to break holes w/ metagross and lele, and you can notice that pheromosa came on the field the exact amount of time that it would have taken to kill it with a spike+SR. I don't have replays that show it but mag also takes benefict of hazard-removal in order to live a hit and set-up

252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Meteor Mash+Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Magearna: 184-217 (88.3 - 105,2%)
0 Atk Landorus-Therian Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Magearna: 264-312 (87.7 - 103.6%)
252+ Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Magearna: 216-255 (71.7 - 84.7%)

if mag doesn't take damages from hazards and if you don't let it get it weak, by switching in a weak move like scald from toxapex, it's a lot easier to set up against a lot of mons like pheromosa, metagross or even other magearna.
i'll add the fact that i saw someone saying that the team was wall by bronzong, i'll just say that bronzong hits stupidly not-hard and get easily wall by metagross after I intimidate it with landorus-t and can only recover health with lefties, please try to make contructive analysis to help the team getting better, not by just say "oh you're bronzong weak af lol"

Oh, my bad then, I'm just not a big fan of Scarfmosa on a team weak to Volc but it seems to work for you, sorry bout that
ps: Yeah I completely forgot Gunk was neutral on Volc o.o
e: Now that I think of it this was kinda dumb seeing as Volc will never set up unless it burns Pheromosa after the first hjk or is paired with something wild like Memento Dug, definitely not worth giving up Spin I don't know what I was thinking about

 

[vso]

hi there, congratulations with the peak. however, i do not like to have such a massive amount of pokemon that threaten/wall the team.

the first thing that i would do is go with scarf keldeo > pheromosa. yes, i know this removes your hazard removal, but i have a change for that. the thing that scarf keldeo does is providing another water resist, and another way to revenge kill volcarona and charizard-mega-y, while checking stuff like non esens protean greninja(and reliably revenge killing). scarf keld slightly helps vs dual dance landorus-t.

the next change that i am going to recommend is to change landorus-t for sash excadrill. this guarantees rocks against most teams if drill is useless, can spin off entry hazards, and checks tapu koko. scarf keldeo + the team in general can handle the threats that come up as lando is removed. charizard-mega-x is perhaps the scariest one, however it is dropping in popularity, can sometimes be revenge killed by keldeo, and doesn't find any real opportunity to set up, not to mention that if excadrill has its sash intact, it can also revenge kill it. keldeo can force out dd lando as well, both get worn down really quickly but to bypass keld lando needs a rock polish up.

we finally move on to minor changes. the first minor change that i am going to recommend is to go electrium z > steelium z on magearna. Electrium z hits the likes of toxapex, celesteela, and mega scizor(slightly weakened), and charizard-mega y, which are all massive threatens to the team. toxapex walls everything besides mega metagross and tapu lele. creating a way for keldeo to break through it is more than nice to have. celesteela is, of course, a massive threat to the team with either of its sets. mega scizor walls mega metagross, and the only real way to revenge kill it is by using tapu lele, and considering that this team posseses spikes, it can freely defog. charizard-y is also a huge threat to the team.

the next minor change that i will recommend is to run shed shell > choice specs on tapu lele. shed shell allows you to not get trapped by dugtrio on stall, allowing you to have an easier time breaking. a slight moveset change of taunt > psychic will also come in play to beat chansey.

the final thing that i will recommend is a potential consideration. i still feel as if it is a better way to go. it is to run dark pulse > low kick on greninja. i have already added electrium z on magearna to sort of help vs celesteela. dark pulse hits alolan marowak and mega metagross, which are both massive threats to the team.

Tl;Dr

>

>

(Electrium Z)>

(Steelium Z)

(Shed Shell)>

(Choice Specs)

(Dark Pulse) >

(Low Kick)

Importable

Magearna @ Electrium Z
Ability: Soul-Heart
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shift Gear
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt
- Aura Sphere

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Spikes
- Gunk Shot
- Ice Beam
- Dark Pulse

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Hammer Arm
- Bullet Punch

Tapu Lele @ Shed Shell
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Psyshock
- Moonblast
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Keldeo @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Stone Edge
- Hydro Pump
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Secret Sword

Excadrill @ Focus Sash
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
- Earthquake

 

[TheCamelDude]

Good team, a couple suggestions though to help you deal with those threats:

Why not try replacing Zen Headbutt on Megagross with Thunder Punch? You lose STAB sure, but it hits all the same things (Rotom-W, Toxapex, etc), Skarmory, and Sp.def Celesteela. Plus it beats Greninja if it's not Ash-Greninja. All you're losing with it that you really need is damage on Rotom-W (which can be worn down or beaten by Tapu Lele) and some extra Psychic Terrain abuse, which isn't too important as Meteor Mash still hits hard. Also I don't see why you need both psychic STABs. Psyshock I understand for sure, but what's Psychic hitting that Psyshock isn't? Unless I'm missing something, I'd change it to Shadow Ball (for other Leles and Megagrosses) or even Focus Blast (for Heatrans).

 

[Gimmick]

It's been awhile since I've posted in RMT (like, 3 years), but I lurk and have made this observation over and over so I might as well say it.

First of all, this team is great. Every time I play it on the ladder, it's difficult but super fun because every single turn matters so much. I think this team really encompasses the SM OU metagame right now (at least in terms of offense), insomuch that I think it should be archived for bookkeeping purposes after some fixes to the grammar and spelling. However, like many heavy offensive teams, it nearly auto-loses to Rain. Kingdra OHKOs literally 6/6 of the Pokemon with Hydro Pump. For this reason, I highly recommend using a Hasty nature on Greninja to always avoid the OHKO:

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Greninja in Rain: 263-310 (92.2 - 108.7%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja in Rain: 237-279 (83.1 - 97.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

A very minor change that might completely alter the way a game against Rain is played. Anyway, the only counterplay against Kingdra is Pheromosa, which forces 50/50s with Pelipper anyway (if they predict HJK and go into Pelipper, they get a free U-turn into another Hydro Pump with Kingdra; if they predict U-turn and HJK again you lose another Pokemon). This is the reason I said nearly auto-loses. It is possible to pressure a rain team enough to lose Pelipper or Kingdra, but it's undeniable that you'll probably lose half your team in the process. However, there really isn't much that can be changed to remedy this weakness without completely changing the dynamic of the team. Rain's usage is relatively low, so I don't think slapping a Toxapex or Mantine on there is worth it.

Now I'd like to bring up the observation I talked about above. People in RMT are suggesting either "blanket checks" or completely swapping roles of Pokemon to fit their own idea of the team's goal. It's important to realize that as Pokemon goes on (as in, we get new Pokemon every generation), blanket checking the entire metagame becomes less and less... possible. Unless you're playing full stall, no combination of 6 is going to be able to switch into every single metagame threat, especially now in Gen 7. One rate in particular is the following:

Tl;Dr

>

>

(Electrium Z)>

(Steelium Z)

(Shed Shell)>

(Choice Specs)

(Dark Pulse) >

(Low Kick)

Sash Rocks Excadrill plays a very different role than defensive Landorus-T. Sash Drill's niche is the ability to Spin and set up rocks (also against Mega Sableye), but since it's the spinner, the sash is only useful when one leads with Drill. Defensive Rocks HP Ice Landorus-T is a slow pivot, sets up SR, and acts as a general blanket check to physical attackers (opposing Lando-T, MMawile, Zygarde, Garchomp, Zard-X, etc). Its presence throughout the game also makes Tapu Koko think twice about clicking an electric move, so it adds mindgames just by being there. Pivoting on offense is also extremely important to bring in wallbreakers like Lele and Metagross safely. Excadrill loses all those roles, especially if it's a designated suicide lead. If it isn't used as a suicide lead, then its item will basically be useless.

Pheromosa also plays a different role than Scarf Keldeo. In addition to having access to Rapid Spin, it also has U-turn to, again, bring in other wallbreakers. Also, Scarf Keldeo is slower than Kingdra in Rain, so with this suggestion, he has absolutely no counterplay against Rain. Kingdra can literally just come in and click Hydro Pump and win (Surf, even, with SR and some chip on Magearna). Keldeo also has a significantly weaker fighting STAB. For example, Secret Sword barely 2HKOs Ferrothorn while HJK OHKOs over 50% of the time. Also, Scarf Pheromosa is a pretty solid lead because it can U-turn out against unfavorable matchups or even gain momentum turn 1 as it forces out Landorus-T.

Those were the most drastic changes (that, in my opinion, changed the team completely) that I disagreed with, so I'll stop there. While those changes might fix one thing, they lead to issues elsewhere (i.e. completely unwinnable matchup against Rain, issues with DD Zygarde and anything that has DD really) and change the dynamic of the team. It's important to find suggestions that don't change the way a team is played and covers more weaknesses than it opens.

Case in point, apologies for the rant. Good team tho. It has difficulty with some things, but good playing can definitely remedy that. Like any offensive team, it's not going to be able to switch into everything, but the team is excellent at keeping up pressure to avoid playing defensively. I'm trying to think of a way to help with the water/Celesteela weaknesses, but it's so hard to decide which mon to replace. I personally really love double psychic Lele, but I think it's worth considering Thunderbolt over Psyshock. It prevents Celesteela from coming in on Lele whenever it wants and getting a free Leech Seed. The Stall weakness becomes evident, but without Shed Shell, Lele isn't going to break stall anyway. It's something that's probably better to decide from testing over theorymonning anyway.

Congrats on the peak!

 

[Kickasser]

It's been awhile since I've posted in RMT (like, 3 years), but I lurk and have made this observation over and over so I might as well say it.

First of all, this team is great. Every time I play it on the ladder, it's difficult but super fun because every single turn matters so much. I think this team really encompasses the SM OU metagame right now (at least in terms of offense), insomuch that I think it should be archived for bookkeeping purposes after some fixes to the grammar and spelling. However, like many heavy offensive teams, it nearly auto-loses to Rain. Kingdra OHKOs literally 6/6 of the Pokemon with Hydro Pump. For this reason, I highly recommend using a Hasty nature on Greninja to always avoid the OHKO:

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Greninja in Rain: 263-310 (92.2 - 108.7%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja in Rain: 237-279 (83.1 - 97.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

A very minor change that might completely alter the way a game against Rain is played. Anyway, the only counterplay against Kingdra is Pheromosa, which forces 50/50s with Pelipper anyway (if they predict HJK and go into Pelipper, they get a free U-turn into another Hydro Pump with Kingdra; if they predict U-turn and HJK again you lose another Pokemon). This is the reason I said nearly auto-loses. It is possible to pressure a rain team enough to lose Pelipper or Kingdra, but it's undeniable that you'll probably lose half your team in the process. However, there really isn't much that can be changed to remedy this weakness without completely changing the dynamic of the team. Rain's usage is relatively low, so I don't think slapping a Toxapex or Mantine on there is worth it.

Now I'd like to bring up the observation I talked about above. People in RMT are suggesting either "blanket checks" or completely swapping roles of Pokemon to fit their own idea of the team's goal. It's important to realize that as Pokemon goes on (as in, we get new Pokemon every generation), blanket checking the entire metagame becomes less and less... possible. Unless you're playing full stall, no combination of 6 is going to be able to switch into every single metagame threat, especially now in Gen 7. One rate in particular is the following:


Sash Rocks Excadrill plays a very different role than defensive Landorus-T. Sash Drill's niche is the ability to Spin and set up rocks (also against Mega Sableye), but since it's the spinner, the sash is only useful when one leads with Drill. Defensive Rocks HP Ice Landorus-T is a slow pivot, sets up SR, and acts as a general blanket check to physical attackers (opposing Lando-T, MMawile, Zygarde, Garchomp, Zard-X, etc). Its presence throughout the game also makes Tapu Koko think twice about clicking an electric move, so it adds mindgames just by being there. Pivoting on offense is also extremely important to bring in wallbreakers like Lele and Metagross safely. Excadrill loses all those roles, especially if it's a designated suicide lead. If it isn't used as a suicide lead, then its item will basically be useless.

Pheromosa also plays a different role than Scarf Keldeo. In addition to having access to Rapid Spin, it also has U-turn to, again, bring in other wallbreakers. Also, Scarf Keldeo is slower than Kingdra in Rain, so with this suggestion, he has absolutely no counterplay against Rain. Kingdra can literally just come in and click Hydro Pump and win (Surf, even, with SR and some chip on Magearna). Keldeo also has a significantly weaker fighting STAB. For example, Secret Sword barely 2HKOs Ferrothorn while HJK OHKOs over 50% of the time. Also, Scarf Pheromosa is a pretty solid lead because it can U-turn out against unfavorable matchups or even gain momentum turn 1 as it forces out Landorus-T.

Those were the most drastic changes (that, in my opinion, changed the team completely) that I disagreed with, so I'll stop there. While those changes might fix one thing, they lead to issues elsewhere (i.e. completely unwinnable matchup against Rain, issues with DD Zygarde and anything that has DD really) and change the dynamic of the team. It's important to find suggestions that don't change the way a team is played and covers more weaknesses than it opens.

Case in point, apologies for the rant. Good team tho. It has difficulty with some things, but good playing can definitely remedy that. Like any offensive team, it's not going to be able to switch into everything, but the team is excellent at keeping up pressure to avoid playing defensively. I'm trying to think of a way to help with the water/Celesteela weaknesses, but it's so hard to decide which mon to replace. I personally really love double psychic Lele, but I think it's worth considering Thunderbolt over Psyshock. It prevents Celesteela from coming in on Lele whenever it wants and getting a free Leech Seed. The Stall weakness becomes evident, but without Shed Shell, Lele isn't going to break stall anyway. It's something that's probably better to decide from testing over theorymonning anyway.

Congrats on the peak!

Thanks a lot for your time and for your great message, I really have no more to say because it was very clear and complete, I just put in bold what I consider being the most importants part. Sorry for my english I hope the rmt was readable anyway :v, and yeah thunderbolt over psyshock on lele is a viable option but stall is so common on the ladder that I exclusively played psyshock during my laddrun
Again thanks a lot for your great message man, I really appreciate that, everyone that would like to comment the team should definetly take a look at it first

 

[LiamTheCursed]

If pheromosa does get banned, what could fill its spot? I was thinking mega beedrill, but then metagross would have to be replaced.

 

[TheCamelDude]

If pheromosa does get banned, what could fill its spot? I was thinking mega beedrill, but then metagross would have to be replaced.

Tapu Koko might be able to do similar things, with a scarf it would outspeed a lot of threats and be able to U-Turn or Volt Switch on them. Hidden Power Ice hits everything Ice Beam was necessary for (namely Garchomp and Landorus-T), and either Wild Charge or Thunderbolt make a powerful and threatening STAB. Dazzling Gleam, Brave Bird, or even Grass Knot if you want to go that route can round off the set. Despite a different typing, ability, and movepool, I feel it's the best substitute. It just can't spin. It can ruin a different item, but I'd still use scarf to fulfill the job of eliminating fast threats and other scarves and being a fast pivot.