Open The Floodgates
Open The Floodgates
A BW2 OU Rain Team by andreds
Politoed @Choice Scarf
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
- Ice Beam
- Hydro Pump
- Perish Song
Who would've thought Politoed would be one of the most popular pokemon in OU. Politoed! At first I wanted to go with the defensive set with Politoed, but this version works out even better. My Politoed is now a revenge killer somewhat and out speeding a good amount of pokes is a blessing (thanks to ganj4lF). Perish Song has turned into one of my favorite moves for Politoed believe it or not. Forces the switch out. Especially good for those who like to setup. I myself forget that Choice Scarf Timid Politoed can outspeed a good amount of pokemon. And others might as well, as they keep in their pokemon. I don't always lead with him and I try to keep him alive, because winning the weather war is extremely important.
Ability: Flame Body
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
- Quiver Dance
- Bug Buzz
- Fire Blast
Volcarona is a pokemon who does exceptionally well in almost every aspect. But "DAT STEALTH ROCK WEAKNESS" is what keeps people from using him. There were so many times that I wanted to scrap using him, but I took the chance. Wanted to go with the bulky quiver dance set, but I saw that it's mostly used on sun teams. So this was my second choice, and Politoed's Drizzle benefits Volcarona, with Hurricane getting that 100% accuracy. I admit I have kicked him off before, but he's back again. He does extremely well against sun teams as well.
Dragonite @ Choice Band
Evs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 200 Spd
Man, have I had a back and forth between choosing Haxorus and Dragonite. As of now Dragonite is in this spot, because I truly need the bulk (and I've been playing smarter when it comes to stealth rock). Plus, ExtremeSpeed has truly saved me in a close battles. I miss the Dragon Dance/Lum Berry version but I was in need of more revenge killers and needed a Dragonite who could hit hard from the get go.
Tentacruel (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Rain Dish
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 20 Spd
- Rapid Spin
Foretress was in this spot, but with the addition of Jirachi to take care of Stealth Rock. Tentacruel is just a much better rapid spinner. Especially in the rain. Substitute with Leftovers and Rain Dish, what a combination. Tentacruel's job is to inflict status problems on the opposing pokemon. Toxic usually or take a chance with Scald and hope to cut the opposing pokemon's attack with a burn.
Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 244 SDef / 16 Spd
- Iron Head
- Body Slam
- Stealth Rock
Jirachi is RUDE. If you want a pokemon that can inflict status just cause it feels like it then here it is. Though I enjoy using Jirachi more the fact of it's move Wish as it's used more to heal other pokemon than itself. Volcarona has taken stealth rock damage? Switch in Tentacruel at a good time, rapid spin. Switch in Jirachi time to move of Wish right and switch Volcarona in on the next turn. And this works with anyone that I need to help out. My team was never really focused on support back when I had Genesect in this slot (good times, man) but it was vital.
Breloom @ Life Orb
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
- Mach Punch
- Low Sweep
- Bullet Seed
Can I say Breloom with Technician is better than Scizor? Is that allowed? Breloom took the place of Rotom-W (he will be missed). While I no longer have the U-turn/Volt Turn combo that was done with Genesect and Rotom, Breloom is just as (if not more) valuable. He loses his fire weakness. Spore slows down the momentum. Predicting a switch in with Low Sweep to lower speed and get a chance to attack again in a row. Really fun pokemon to use.
As of now the team is sitting in the 1600s. I'm sure it can do better, but I'm not a top tier battler and learning something new everyday. Hopefully you guys can give the team a try and see how high you can rank with it!
Import the most current version
Well, that's the team. It has gone through TONS of changes and this may very well be the final version. Special thanks to gang4lF, PK Gaming, The Great Mighty Doom, CTC, GaryTheGengar and everyone else who's helped me out with this team.
You have some good ideas here. I would go with the banded Scizor and specs Rotom-W as they together form a very deadly U-turn and Volt Switch combination popular in this generation. They have great synergy and can punch holes in unprepared teams. I would then use Politoed in the last slot. It provides a boost to Rotom-W and Jellicent's water moves, takes away Scizor fire weakness, and provides your Volcarona with 100% accurate Hurricanes. Using Hurricane on a team without Drizzle is not very good, as it is fairly useless without the accuracy boost.
I remember when having three pokemon with the same type used to raise a flag for me,lol. But nowadays that doesn't matter. Is it possible that this could be a very well done rain team then?
And Volcarona's Hurricane hadn't crossed my mind. That's awesome. Thanks for the help! Looking forward to giving this a try.
Hello there and welcome back! At first of all, I don't like Volcarona using without spinner / magic bounce user, because as you know, it takes 50% damage from Stealth Rock. I'd use Donphan in place of Jellicent because it doesn't synergize with the team. Also, it can set the Stealth Rock and gives you a resistance from Electric. Finally, I suggest you to use HP Ice in place of Will-o-Wisp on your Rotom-W to revenge kill some dragon types like Dragonite or No-Choice Scarf Salamence.
Hope it helped, good luck!
I agree, that stealth rock will be a huge problem and a spinner is needed. One thing I noticed is my team's huge weakness to grass. Which is normal, I guess with it being a rain team. Donphan, Politoed and Rotom will have a problem with Ferrorthorn, Celebi etc. Can Volcarona alone take care of these guys?
Okay, here I am. Interesting team you got there, but there's still room for improvement.
First of all, your Rotom is itemless at the moment. Please fix that, since it's quite hard to give a full rate without knowing if it's Scarf or Specs (I assume it's one of the two since it runs Trick).
Second. There are two main flaws behind the design of this team: lack of Stealth Rock and lack of a Spinner. You can't use TWO SR weak pokes like Volcarona and Dragonite without proper support, and not using hazards at all is just asking to be torn apart by all those Flying threats that infest BW2 meta right now (just to name a few, Thundurus-T, Tornadus-T, Dragonite). You could solve both problems with Donphan, as Alexander suggested, but I think Forretress is more useful here (in place of Jelli). While it doesn't hit as hard as Donphan does, it's still a safe switch in for Scizor, and can take advantage of Rain to weaken its Fire weakness. Also, being able to Volt Switch means it's hardly a momentum killer, if you can predict decently. Donphan has indeed one advantage over Forretress, since it can cushion Stone Edges that are otherwise a huge problem for your team. However, Forretress can do it too, since Choice Band Terrakion's Stone Edge still requires hazards to 2HKO, and Forry OHKOs back easily with Gyro Ball. Forretress also gives you an additional Grass resist, which may be useful, while Donphan's typing will bring you another weakness, which can be dangerous.
Third. Your team is weak to Tornadus-T at the moment. Offensive Rotom can switch in only once (if it's Specs) or twice (if it's Scarf and doesn't get confused), then Tornadus sweeps if it's not in KO range for Scizor. You also completely lack revenge killers that can outspeed him, which is quite a problem if it manages to catch Scizor with Hurricane on the switch, or if it goes down somewhat. I suggest switching to a Choice Scarf Politoed, that can outspeed and OHKO all unboosted OU except from some very rare things (Accelgor, Jolteon, and Aerodactyl, if I'm not wrong). This will fix your lack of revenge killer somewhat. Also, using a Specially Defensive Rotom-W gives you a safe switch-in to Tornadus-T, and allows you to spread burns more effectively, since you're not locked into WoW by the Choice item you're using. Rotom-W is very handy in today's metagame, checking perfectly opposing Rain teams and being an awesome specially bulky pivot in general.
Also, a little less important, but I don't like Dragon Claw on offensive DNite. Doing so makes you easily walled even at +1, and forced out in various ways. Protect Politoed is not even 2HKO'd by +1 Dragon Claw factoring in Lefties, not to even mention a random Steel type, that resists everything and can force you out easily. If you want to use Dragon Claw, the way to go is SubDD Dragonite in my opinion; it's much harder to force out thanks to Roost / Substitute and much better overall bulk; if you don't want to give up priority, though, I'd suggest a full attacking set with Lum Berry and Outrage.
Hope it helped. Good luck for your team.
The Rain core I use consists of Espeon/Dragonite.
Espeon keeps SR/spikes away and baton pass CMs to boost incredible bulk of dragonite, while Dnite abuses its access to thunder and hurricane.
no proper healings-heal bell, aromatherapy-means that your team could be totally crippled by paralysis.
so ganj4lf covered your teams main issue, and I agree with majority of the changes for the most part, though i'm going suggest some alterations to the suggestions he's made. Instead of using Scizor, you should use Choice Scarf Genesect instead. With as good of a Pokemon Genesect is in BW2, you really have no reason not to use it, and it more or less does what Scizor does for this team, but better.
With Genesect, you now have more checks to Tornadus-T (which always a good thing) and pretty much the rest of the OU metagame covered, but it's less effective against Terrakion than Scizor is (don't be fooled into thinking scizor is a fool proof stop to Terrakion, it can't switch in) and your team is kind of weak to Terrakion as is. With smart play, Forretress, Scarf Politoed & a Healthy Rotom-W should act as decent check to Terrakion, though if Terrakion is still a pain in the ass, consider using physically defensive Rotom-W instead of the Specially defensive variant and Iron Head Genesect (it works heh) to effectively curbstomp most Terrakion.
A little less troubling is your nature on Volcarona. Modest was acceptable in BW1, but with the existance of Genesect and rise in Scarf Salamence, it would be in your best interests to run a +spe nature. The former can't really touch you, but getting an attack in before it can hurt you is useful, especially if you've taken damage. Speed tying with Salamance is just crucial. That should do it, from here on out it's all you man.
Hope I helped!
I have gotten a great amount of help! Where to start?
@gang4lF - My mistake! The Rotom is holding Choice Specs. Fortress will help greatly with the team and help with the grass weakness like you said. And giving Politoed the extra speed with Choice Scarf will help a lot. You mentioned my two pokes being weak to Stealth Rock (Volcarona and Dragonite), now would switching Dragonite for Haxorus be too big of a change to the team if I wanted to guarantee less pkmn being weak to SR?
@bkt0731 - Espeon and Dragonite sound like they'd work well together. Is paralysis common nowadays?
@PKGaming - That Genesect setup looks amazing. Regarding Iron Head, which move from Choice Scarf Genesect could I remove for it?
Thanks again immensely for the help, guys. Looking forward to tweaking this team.
Hey there, andreds, I got your PM, seeing that you needed advice, so I'm here to see what I can do. Like you said, you have two Pokemon that take damage from Stealth Rock (D-Nite takes 25% and Volcarona takes 50%). You say that replacing Dragonite with Haxorus will make your team have only one Pokemon being weak to SR, that one being Volcarona. So, let's take a look of what will change if you replace Dragonite with a Haxorus. Firstly, you will lose a ton of bulk, but Haxorus makes up for that loss in bulk with a ton of offensive power. Honestly, that's the only real downside to replacing Dragonite, besides the nuumber of resistiances that you have, as you have a whole ton of them. In conclusion, replacing Dragonite with Haxorus is a very good idea, and if you're having trouble coming up with a set, I'd use the Standard DD set with Aqua Tail as a coverage move. Aqua tail provides coverage against Gliscor and some other OU threats. I hope this helped a bit. Have fun and good luck with the team!
Thanks for the suggestion, Ciel! Aqua Tail has not only helped me with Gliscor, but Hippowdon, Landorus etc. Haxorus is a tough pokemon to stay in against, but for the few people that I've gone against that took that chance did not expect him to be running that move.
It's also a relief to only worry about one pkmn when it comes to SR.
Hey, I got your PM :)
Your team looks pretty solid right now. A lot of the changes suggested really made the team a lot more solid, so I'll just touch up on a few things.
First and foremost, regarding Genesect, I agree that a mixed set would benefit you the most. This allows you to counter both Terrakion and Tornadus-T, two significat threats to your team. Deoxys-D also becomes a lot easier to handle now that your attack receives a bit more investment- turning even nonboosted U-Turns into 2HKO's. This lessens your weakness of hazards substantially.
Genesect @ Choice Scarf
Hasty, 132 Atk / 124 SpA / 252 Spe
U-Turn / Iron Head / Thunder / Ice Beam
The spread may seem weird, but it's tailored to fit the needs of your team. 124 SpA is just enough to OHKO TOrnadus-T with Thunder. 132 Atk is enough to let you OHKO Terrakion after a layer of Spikes with Iron Head, and also 2HKO Deoxys-D without a boost. With a boost, Terrakion gets OHKO'd regardless, and Deoxys-D can be taken down after 3 layers of Spikes. Max speed ensures that you outspeed as much as possible.
I do actually think that Dragonite definitely could still play a good role for your team, especially now that your weakness to Terrakion was dimished greatly. The thing that Dragonite brings that Haxorus doesn't is the ability to handle Sun- which seems a bit more problematic now. Venasaur can do a lot to your team even unboosted- it can OHKO Gene and Forretress with HP Fire, Politoed and Rotom with Giga Drain, and Volcorona and Haxorus with Sleep Powder/Sludge Bomb. Dragonite provides you with an answer to that- with Lum, it can take a Sleep Powder or whatever it has to and then KO back with Outrage/Fire Punch/EQ. Politoed being Scarfed and not bulky also makes the issue of weather wars arise more significantly- making me urge you to re-test Dragonite. With Genesect now hitting Deo-D for the 2HKO, and Volc being able to set up on Forretress/Ferro, as well as your own Forretress able to spin, SR should not be too big of a problem.
Dragonite @ Lum Berry
Adamant, 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Dragon Dance / Outrage / Extremespeed / Earthquake
Jolly can be used to outpace other Dnites. The last two slots can be exchanged for coverage options- I recommend ESpeed for the sake of revenging without boosts and hitting Mamoswine hard when boosted. You could opt for Fire Punch to screw with Steels, but Heatran is already kind of problematic, as although Rotom and Politoed handle it it outright walls Volc and Genesect now. EQ hits decently hard, but doesn't hit Ferro/Forretress/Scizor nearly as hard as Fire Punch, even in Rain.
Just my two cents. Good luck!
When I tell you guys that I switch Dragonite and Haxorus almost every other match, lol. There's pro's and cons to both of them. Currently using Dragonite with the moveset you mentioned though.
Now regarding threats. I'm not sure if the pokemon I have problems with are actually threats or I just make poor choices in battling. But these are the current pokemon I'm having problems with.
Latias/Latios - Comes in and sets up on a few of my pokemon. This is usually after thunder wave has been used on half of my team by another enemy poke.
Breloom - Spore. Drain Punch.
Blissey - No one seems strong enough to take this egg down. I come close and it uses wish.
Venusaur - Sets up on a few guys. Growth and all that.
Actually, come to think of it. I generally have problems with stall teams. Teams where a few of the pokes have Substitute. Teams that focus heavily on causing status problems (toxic, twave, spore). And ocasionally other weather teams (sun, sandstorm).
So it seems like you had a Scizor on this team earlier, and the loss of him seems to have opened yourself a bit more to those threats. You mentioned how Blissey seems really rough to face, and I would agree. Without changing your offensive core, I think the best option would be to run an Offensive ChestoRest Volcarona. This set has a good chance to beat most Blisseys, and subsequently lures them, and if it falls short Blissey will be very heavily damaged leaving it pretty much incapacitated for the rest of the match. This suggestion is more to lure and damage Blissey, who can wall a very large portion of your team, but you can obviously attempt to break through it with Haxorus as well. ChestoRest Volcarona also gives you a pseudo status absorber which can serve as a niche Breloom check. I would definitely recommend trying Electrolyte's Genesect spread as well as it will give you stronger U-Turns, which your team would really appreciate. Hope I helped, GL!
Hey andreds, nice team!
First of all, I suggest changing Genesect's spread to: 92 Atk / 252 SAtk / 164 Spe. This spread gives you some stronger U-Turns, and the only reason to run max speed on Genesect is to outspeed +1 Jolly Haxorus (Jolly Haxorus dosen't really exist, and it can't ohko genesect anyway), outspeed Choice Scarf Timid Hydreigon (this thing's rare, your Rotom-W is a great check to it, and if it locks itself into Fire Blast then it gives you a perfect set-up oppurtunity for both Haxorus and Volcarona), and to speed tie with opposing Genesect (this is rarely worth the risk, but there are times when it is and so some people run max speed, but you don't have Flamethower, so you can't OHKO it anyway.). Overall, this spread lets Genesect outspeed everything relevant and gives Genesect stronger U-Turns.
Focus Blast is fairly average on Choice Scarf Politoed, a super effective Focus Blast is actually weaker than a Hydro Pump under the rain, meaning the only time you'd use Focus Blast is if the opposing pokemon both resists Hydro Pump and has a weakness to Focus Blast. This means that Abomasnow and Ferrothorn are the only pokemon in OU that you would use Focus Blast against. Neither of which are pokemon you would want to stay in against, and Focus Blast isn't even a 2HKO on Ferrothorn. Because of this, I suggest running Hydro Pump over Focus Blast on Politoed. Hydro Pump is a very poweful STAB move that you'll be using against the pokemon you usually use Focus Blast on, Hydro Pump also provides some much needed power, which will definitely come in handy at times.
Anyway, I hope this rate helped and GL with the team :)
And regarding Politoed it's a relief to get rid of Focus Blast. It's not a favorite of mine. Thanks, Doom!
This team is slowly climbing up the ladder in Pokemon Showdown (They're pretty stingy with the points, ha). I'm not an expert battler but I'm learning as I go. For those who are more hands on when it comes to RMT's, feel free to import the team and do some testing of your own.
If anyone can help me get more in-depth regarding threat lists that would help a lot, as I feel like I've been going against the same few common pokemon , and not others which could also pose as a threat.
Changes in Genesect's EV Spread
Politoed Move Change
Pokemon being tested as of now: (at the suggestion of Neliel)
Some help with the two pokemon's EV spreads listed above will help greatly as well.
Got ur PM. And here I am.
Not read any prev RMT's so I might repeat people But I dont really care :P
On Volc lose Fire Blast. Give Him giga drain instead. In rain Fire Blast is kinda redundant. And giga drain gives you more longativity.
tHIS HOWEVER MAKES STEELS A PRO8LEM.(soz for caps) so.
You need a fighting type move.
Breloom > Rotom W
This gives you a spore and Breloom also Becomes a Bigger threat in rain as it loses its fire weekness, to neutral. (Ill leave a set lower)
Your Hax can deal with certain steels (Jirachi, aswell as opposing Rotoms well)
However, im going to hat emyself for saying this. But i feel DNite would fit in this slot Better. He is immune to ground (more switch opps) gets multiscale (Bulky) and has only slightly lower attack. Ill leave a set lower.
Going to leave you an interesting volc set too as it will patch up proBlems with having to sleep fodder something as Breloom can come in on forretress and you need a spore fodder.
Also more attack Evs on Genesect. (take from speed)
And GL with the team
Volcarona (M) @ Choice Specs
Trait: Flame Body
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Sleep Talk
- Giga Drain
- Bug Buzz
Sleep Talk? An answer to loom. as you tank his hits and hot Back for a powerfull SE move.
Breloom (F) @ Life Orb
Trait: Effect Spore
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Focus Punch
- Mach Punch
- Bullet Seed
Bring in on summet slow that cant halm. spore the poke or switch. the focus punch. and mach punch. with sr SUPPORT THIS GUY CAN BE A GOD.
Dragonite (F) @ Chesto Berry
Trait: Inner Focus
EVs: 252 HP / 156 Atk / 100 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
Only saw this set today, and its certainly unique, so try it out and see how it goes.
Gave that Dragonite a try and after using rest, I find myself needed to use Outrage and then I'm stuck with the confusion. Great spread though, keeps him alive for a lot longer.
I was thinking about that Breloom and with the Effect Spore Ability, couldn't that give me a free slot for a move other than Spore? I agree with Life Orb on him (so the Poison Heal ability is out of the question) definitely. The most common Breloom's I've gone against have been the SubSeed/SubPunch sets. Troublesome.
A Breloom set that has been giving me success:
Breloom @Life Orb
Evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Mach Punch
- Low Sweep
- Bullet Seed
Not as much safety as the sub Breloom's but the power of this one is crazy. I switched Swords Dance for Low Sweep. When I predict a switch in and lower the pokemon's speed, I will then have a chance for a free attack right after.
Breloom with effect spore is 30%. Spore is 100%. You can try it, and it may work really well, but its not reliable. Go with what works. A 100% acurate move that functions similar to a 1HKO > ability that may work and may not.
Are you using the dragonite??? I havnt tried it or played it, it just looked cool in an RMT haha
Edit: The Breloom in the set is meant to be TECHNICIAN sorry!
@EnterRAYZORS It's no problem! And yeah, I used that Dragonite. He was decent but I switched back to the Dragon Dance version, lol.
Question to everyone: Is there a true counter to Genesect? I've been coming across more of them now.
I've heard that Chansey with Eviolite is better than Blissey? I'll test it out. Though replacing something as amazing as Genesect is tough, lol. I'll give Thunder Wave a try over Toxic. Cutting pokemon's speed is my best bet.
UPDATE: Changes have been made to the import list.
Also, I haven't been doing well with Chansey in the mix. Terrakion has been appearing in almost every other team I've went against.
But I have an interesting question now. Since Genesect is being tested for Uber, my team will probably go through even more changes with him being gone.
Would switching Genesect out for Scizor be an easy cut and paste change? Or would more changes have to be made? I personally don't think Genesect should be banned but we'll see how things go.
Have you considered Choice Scarfed Salamence in place of Haxorus? I have used it a bunch of times and it works great, but Gensect can take advantage of you being locked on Outrage because he can wall it. But keep in mind that Salamence can out speed Gensect with Choice Scarf. Or maybe Landorus (which might seem stupid in rain) if you are having trouble with steel types. It also works awesome against T-tar and Ninetales. I hope I wasn't dumb and able to help.
Salamence @Choice Scarf
Evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpAtk / 252 Spe
- Dragon Claw
- Fire Blast / Brick Break / Hydro Pump (Egg move) / Aqua Tail
Fire Blat will always OHKO Gensect and 2OHKO under rain. If rain is up and you play your cards right you can predict a switch in and 2OHKO since you out speed. You can also use badass water moves like Hydro Pump or Aqua Tail if you can't deal with Gliscor. But keep in mind they do carry Protect which might make it harder to take them out if you're locked on a water move.
Landorus @Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
Evs: 252 SpAtk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest (OHKO's Gensect)/Timid Nature
- Earth Power
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power Ice
- Rock Polish / Substitute
This guy can easily get rid of steel-types especially Gensect. But problem is he can't take him out without Life Orb. Since Gensect out speeds you can set up a Sub crush him when he comes in. I am not sure if Rock Polish allows you to out speed Scarfed Gensect but it might. He is kinda hard to use in rain because I really can't fit him in my own rain team but in case you might like him I put him there.
|All times are GMT -4. The time now is 4:15:01 PM.|