Welcome to the Smogon thread of the Pokemon Community-wide "Pokemon Amethyst Project" which attempts to create a fan-fueled Pokemon RPG with Wichu at the helm. The sister thread on Serebii, run by Aquakip, can be found here. Although it hasn't been too active recently, therefore this thread will be the one to check for updates and such.
Whilst Wichu focuses on the coding of the game, he has left the creation of a sprite resource for the game to a number of members on different forums. Although the overarching goal is to create a resource for this game in particular, I believe that a sprite resource such as this can have many other uses in banners and backgrounds and the like. Naturally, you are welcome to use these sprites as long as you adhere to our simple fair use policy: give credit.
An example of credit would be this, where *Sprite* and *Spriter* are replaced with the appropriate names.
Naturally, a project of this magnitude requires rules and guidelines to avoid confusion. There is no real punishment if you do not read these rules (despite my annoyance), but your sprite will simply not be accepted and it will have been a wasted effort on your part.
If you have any queries about the spriting side of Pokemon Amethyst, please PM either myself or another member of the Pokemon Amethyst spriting team on Smogon.
Rules
The sprites must be in a canvas with size of 160x160 with a transparent background
The sprites should fill this canvas as best they can so that sufficient detail can be shown
Pokemon which are very small must be, at least, as large as the official Pokemon Black/White sprites
Sprites must be in the centre of the canvas and be grounded if they are not airborne in their pose
The sprites should be in proportion to the Red sprite (shown at the bottom of these rules), but staying within the above limits.
The sprites have to be 100% scratch (i.e. no parts of other sprites can be used, Pixel Overs are acceptable)
The sprites can have a maximum of 15 colours; these can be the colours used in the official sprites, but can also be custom or edited
The sprites must follow Pokemon Black/White guide lines in terms of shading and outlining
You are allowed to do a sprite which has already been done; however, it's recommended that you do one which has not. Alternate sprites might be useful at some point
Treat action-filled artwork with discretion, it's discouraged if it 'looks like it's falling over'
Important: Backsprites and shiny pokemon are NOT needed just yet.
http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/n...r/Amethyst.gifSprites should be in proportion with this sprite of Red. For example, if we wanted to sprite a Nidoking in proportion to Red we would look at the 'Size' Pokedex tab for Nidoking and see that they are similar sizes (We're working on Red being 4'8"). Thus, in a program such as Photoshop or GIMP, we should resize the Nidoking artwork so that it is around the same size and then continue with the Pixel Over. Several sites such as the Ultimate Pokemon Centre, Serebii or Bulbapedia provide very handy references for sizes.
User Scepticallistic has provided a very useful method of calculating size:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Scepticallistic
(Post 2451882)
Well hello there everyone! *crickets chirp*
I have constructed a crafty creation that cuts the crying about crazy sizes (hopefully).
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o.../Reference.png
Here is a nifty 160 x 160 size scale. A black bar represents 1 foot, and each gray bar is just half of that, or 6 inches for real. The tallest Pokemon that can fit in 160 x 160 to scale is about 6' 5".
I will be using this method to estimate whether or not sprites are correctly sized or not. Sizes are rarely able to be exact, therefore we are not extraordinarily strict with this, it can be a few pixels under/over if it needs to be; but as close as possible is better.
Online Sprite System
Jungle Boy has very kindly set up an online spriting system to reserve, upload and work on your sprites. It has many nifty features, which include a timeline to show the latest activity, filters for any peer edits and QCers to see what needs doing, an automatic sprite validation script which can detect if it has too many colours and if it has a 160x160 transparent canvas and much more! We encourage you to give it a go, we will check both this forum and the system regularly, so don't worry, we'll notice if you do decide to take part. Commenting is also possible on unfinished sprites, so go ahead and help us out!
Newly added is a very nifty palette finding tool, in which you just enter the link of the sprite (good places to go include places such as Bulbapedia or Serebii) and out comes a small copyable palette containing all of the colours on the sprite in a (hopefully) methodical way. After logging in, click on the palette at the top of the page to start using it!
It is very easy to use, and don't worry about messing things up, it can all be reversed! If anyone needs any help, feel free to leave a message either here or in either of our PM boxes.
If there's anything you want to see on this site, or if you don't think anything is labelled clearly enough, please leave us a message and we'll see what can be done. However, it will NOT check the scale or how central your sprite is, so it is still preferred that you use Scepticallistic's grid.
So what are you waiting for? Sign up now (preferrably with your Smogon name!) and give it a go! Please give us feedback, we want this tool to be as good as it can be, and we need your help for that to happen!
Points on Pixel Overing (From a conversation between Alchemator and BlackHawk11)
...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Blackhawk11
Hey, I've been observing the spriting done in Smeargle's Studio recently (WSC, Amethyst, other stuff) and I kinda want to get into it. I decided to try and make a Zubat sprite for the Amethyst thing. I searched online and found a guide, sort of, and proceded to make a rough sketch of the Zubat picture I'm pixeling over.
The picture I'm using is here (yeah I'm a sucker for the old time Pokemon cards) and my line art so far is here.
I'd be great if you could give me some advice as to where to go next with my sprite (I'm not certain it's the right size btw). Also, I'm colorblind so picking a color from a random pallette on my own pretty much isn't possible.
Thanks in advance for your guidance. I'm terrible at art but this seems like its easy to learn and has pretty cool results, so I can't wait to get better at it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Alchemator
Hi, I'd be glad to help :)
Your lineart is actually very good for your first ever try, but it is missing some details such as parts of the wing and the ears. Although you may know otherwise, I'd like to go through the general way to do a pixel over.
- Grab the artwork from somewhere (I like that artwork though, it's very cool)
- Resize it. This is most easily done in a program like Photoshop or GIMP where you can have the Red sprite (which is in my original post) to compare the artwork to as you resize. I think GIMP is a free download. To see what you should resize the artwork to go to Marriland's Pokedex - there should be a size comparison there.
- Outline the artwork with a colour not already present (such as Paint's stark green)
+ This may be where the problem has arisen, as although you have to outline it (as in the edges) you have to do every feature of the sprite, not just around the edge.
+ I can see in your lineart, when comparing it to the artwork, isn't particularly smooth; try to keep it as smooth as possible.
I would recommend that you go over these stages again, as if the size is incorrect then it is virtually an auto-turn down by Quality Control [QC]. If you get the lineart right, nothing else major can go wrong - I know from experience that it's the most boring and laborious part, but every goes much quicker after these first few stages.
- Once you have outlined the artwork, erase everything within the outline (as you have in your lineart).
- Grab the official Pt/HG/SS sprite and have it next to your lineart.
Unfortunately this will be the point at which you being unfortunately colorblind could become a hindrance. If it is impossible for you to complete these next stages I would still be happy for you just to do lineart, and would count it as 1/2 a sprite done (I hope that's fair). Best case scenario, however, is that you can manage this.
- Using the eye dropper tool (looks like a Pasteur Pipette thing) in Paint (or wherever you're working, I always use paint) and take what seems to be the main colour for different body parts from the sprite. For example, Zubat's body is mainly a regular blue and the wings are a dark purple. I cannot emphasise enough that these must actually be taken from the sprite. Fill in these body parts.
- Take the eyedropper to the light shade, and begin shading the artwork. With Pokemon Sprites it is always assumed that the light comes from the top left, so therefore the lightest part will be the top of its left ear. Depending on how similar the sprite pose is to the artwork you could just copy the shading across (which is generally easier). Don't worry if you get the shading wrong - I do all the time and it won't be turned down if it isn't anything major.
- Repeat for the darker shade.
Now comes the trickiest part for a novice spriter - the outlining. If you look closely at a Pokemon sprite you will notice that the outline is a different colour depending on how light that part of the Pokemon's body is. You need to use the eyedropper tool to take the light outline colour and apply it to the outline of where the lightest shade is on your sprite (careful, because the lightest outline colour is usually the darkest body shde). Repeat this with the medium and dark [usually black] outline colours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Blackhawk11
Here's my second try at lineart. Just by looking at the two in Paint I can see how much better this one is. This one is (properly? I just grabbed the corner and made it smaller) scaled down to size (31 inches ~ 55% of Red's height ~ 65 pixels in height), and I've outlined in a bit more detail than before. I'm not sure if it's 'smoother', so any advice on how to do so would be appreciated.
If I'm just picking colors from the sprite I should have no problem. I was worried I might have to create my own colors, which would mean I would probably end up with a green and brown zubat lol.
Oh, and you are correct in saying that this is the second time I have ever tried to make a sprite, the first obviously being yesterday.
--Later--
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Blackhawk11
I actually tried to do a little more work on my lineart cause I was bored lol. It's really coming along nicely I think. Here's the most recent version. I found the HGSS sprite and put it in there as well, along with the Outline (O), Body (B), and Ear and Wing (E) colors taken out and put on a 'palette' of sorts.
Some of the things I'm having trouble with are (directions as if left is the western part of the sprite, right is the eastern part, so when I say right wing / side / ear / whatever, it would technically be Zubat's left wing / etc.) the left-side ear, the long bit of skin that comes down into the middle of the left-side wing, the right-side 'leg' or whatever that thing is, and the intersection of the left-side wing, left-side ear, left-side side of mouth, and left side of the head (it's four things that all come together practically in the same place for crying out loud!).
I'm going to bed now, and based on your previous PM time and the fact that you spell '-our' > '-or' I'm assuming that you're somewhere either near Australia's time zones, (of course that could be horribly wrong, idk) so I hope to hear back from you by morning :). Thanks a lot for your help so far, and you should definately post that reference to pixel-overing in the thread, because it will probably help several people.
~BH11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Alchemator
That lineart is soooooo much better, and I'm not even being nice here - that's probably the exact lineart that I would produce from the same artwork. And yes, I'm from ye olde England so I'm a good five hours ahead of you if you're American ;)
Firstly, just talk as if you were facing the sprite - it's much easier and no-one takes it from the sprite's perspective anyway. Secondly, I think you're just having difficulty on where the shades should go? So I've done some images for you (*crowd gasps*). I've actually done the basic colour of each part for you. http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/n...ZubatLight.png
This is where the light is coming from, as you can see the left wing is lighter than the right, but shaded parts such as the ear are dark. When applying the basic colour, it is generally the colour that takes up the most space on that part. Since seeing the HG/SS pose, I would personally just shade from scratch noting where the light is coming from. I also touched up the lineart ever so slightly, really it's not that important and spriting is very subjective but I think there will be other circumstances in which these tips might be useful. http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/n...atWIPFixes.png
It would probably be best to copy this into Paint and look at it zoomed up. Basically where I've badly ringed in red is where I've changed a couple of things. Most of it you will be able to glean just by spotting the difference, but I'd like to bring up a few anyway. First of all, as a general rule, try not to have the lines two pixels thick in any place, as you had on the right wing. However, if you make it all one pixel thick the wings aren't connected, so I've went back as far as possible with losing the connection. Secondly, try to never have Z kind of shapes as you did between the top two teeth - I can't really give you any solid justification on why but I hope you see that it looks better.
Once again, if you have any questions about Project Amethyst or making pixel-overs/spriting in general, most contributors to this project will be willing to help out.
Sprites will be checked over by a smaller number of Quality Control Spriterswho will make any small changes to shading or lineart necessary to make the sprites perfect. This does not mean that you can put together a lazy and shoddy sprite with the intention that the Quality Control will simply fix it for you. Optimal effort is required, as you are only harming your own potential resource if you do not put work in. Edits from other spriters is encouraged although it is not a requirement to get into QC status.
Limbo is a sort of Quality Control state where the sprite is good, but still needs Quality Controlling. Sprites in Limbo may be done by other spriters and will be considered as if the sprite has not yet been done (therefore it can go into Quality Control and eventually be accepted). Should this happen, the sprite in Limbo will be deleted.
Here is a list of Pokemon that have already been sprited here on Smogon. I will try to keep this thread updated with Pokemon that have been completed/reserved, but just be careful anyway.
You are free to make reservations through the forum, but please refer to the Pokémon Amethyst Sprite Site for the most up date situation.
HAPPY SPRITING EVERYBODY
TVboyCanti
Dec 23rd, 2009 4:30:28 PM
Sure, I'll be a Quality Control Artist.
BTW, dynamic poses are popular so you shouldn't really be discouraging them. Check the CAP sprite polls and you'll see what I mean, action poses tend to do better than static ones.
Alchemator
Dec 23rd, 2009 4:34:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat TVboyCanti
(Post 2381427)
Sure, I'll be a Quality Control Artist.
BTW, dynamic poses are popular so you shouldn't really be discouraging them. Check the CAP sprite polls and you'll see what I mean, action poses tend to do better than static ones.
Wichu actually directly told me not to use a Kangaskhan I did (it looked as if it was falling over apparently) so that's the only reason I included it. I'd approve of them otherwise.
Here's Chikorita, Bayleef and Meganium for checking. I thought I may as well post my existing contributions here. I'll happily be a regular spriter, though I can't make any promises as to the one-a-week schedule. But I'll do my best.
Its amazing how simply seeing this thread got me motivated for this again. I haven't sprited in a while, so its the perfect opportunity. I'll probably wait a bit just to get an idea of whats been done so far before I charge off spriting something thats already been done. Also, a thought, I think Wichu posted a list of the regional dex somewhere (maybe Serebii's version of this thread) to provide a selection of Pokémon for people to focus on. It may be beneficial to post that here. Just an idea.
Alchemator
Dec 24th, 2009 6:01:26 AM
Thanks for those Wizwum! And the one-a-week thing is really just something to aim for, no big deal if you don't get it done.
I've actually searched Serebii for the corresponding thread there and I can't seem to find it, when I do I'll definitely include that list of priorities.
Originally Posted by Fat TVboyCanti
(Post 2381427)
Sure, I'll be a Quality Control Artist.
BTW, dynamic poses are popular so you shouldn't really be discouraging them. Check the CAP sprite polls and you'll see what I mean, action poses tend to do better than static ones.
Dynamic poses are great, as long as the sprite doesn't look like it's about to fall over :P
That Kangaskhan sprite would have looked awkward in-game; a simpler pose would be better. I personally disliked some of Platinum/HG/SS's 'action' poses, such as Purugly's, for that reason.
But yeah, Alchemator, I don't think that should be a rule; a guideline perhaps, but not enforced.
Reserving Heracross and Lickitung, if that's cool :)
Arch
Dec 27th, 2009 12:45:47 AM
Well if Black can reserve then I just wanna reserve Charmander and Skarmory. >:D
TEA_DEMON
Dec 27th, 2009 1:02:28 AM
I did a few of these, and they're sitting in the spriting thread. Whoever wants to can grab them and touch them up to the quality needed if they want to.
http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o...KCSLSNCmew.gif
Especially this.
I forgot the eyes.....but then I realized I am teribble with eyes so I might as well leave it to quality control.
It doesn't help that mew has big eyes either..so...meh.
Alchemator
Dec 28th, 2009 9:15:23 AM
Arch that Mew is basically 3/4 done, do the eyes please. Quality Control, as I said in my post, is for shading tweaks and refinement of the sprite, not doing bits for you. I'd also like everyone to refer to the priority list please, rather than just do relatively random ones. I have some misgivings about that Pidgeot, but I'll leave that to QC - the Pikachu looks good though.
EDIT: I still think those on the list are worth bearing in mind =/
Wichu
Dec 28th, 2009 9:56:30 AM
The 'priority list' isn't really applicable; that list is just the first few Pokémon in Amethyst's regional dex. However, the game will eventually have all 493 existing Pokémon in it, and I'm not planning on releasing it unfinished :P
The list was from when I was still planning on releasing a demo first; however, after thinking it through, saving it until it's done seems a better choice.
There's just a little problem I noticed: there is nothing making sure that people on Serebii and Smogon don't wind up making two versions of the same Pokemon. For example, earlier I submitted a Darkrai; I was browsing through the Serebii thread just now and found that someone else made a Darkrai as well (theirs is much better, IMO). How is this going to be tackled later on?
EDIT: Thanks for clearing that up, Alchemator.
Wizwum
Dec 28th, 2009 12:29:01 PM
The outline of the Pidgeot needs a bit of work, I think, and the shading across the torso needs to be smoother. Pikachu looks a bit... soulless, IMO. Something about the eyes, and that piece of base art in particular. Again, the outline's a bit jagged in places, and with Mew, the shading on one side of the face is a bit off.
Also, sizes. Pidgeot is good, but both Mew and Pikachu are far too big in comparison with the trainer sprite. Both are more than half the height of Red. They need to be about half that size if they want to be to scale.
Alchemator
Dec 29th, 2009 5:54:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Nik S D
(Post 2387902)
There's just a little problem I noticed: there is nothing making sure that people on Serebii and Smogon don't wind up making two versions of the same Pokemon. For example, earlier I submitted a Darkrai; I was browsing through the Serebii thread just now and found that someone else made a Darkrai as well (theirs is much better, IMO). How is this going to be tackled later on?
I'm attempting to keep in touch with Aquakip (the person who is running the project on Serebii) to prevent things like this happening - I also saw that Darkrai but I wouldn't necessarily say it's better. In the meantime, as the Serebii thread is pretty inactive, I will be accepting yours after it goes through QC unless a counterclaim is made (unlikely).
Wizwum, as we are short on active QCs at the moment I'd be happy to make you one if you want.
It's like the harder I work on stuff the crappier it turns out. .-.
Nik S D
Dec 30th, 2009 4:25:34 AM
That Raichu looks pretty good, IMO. The only thing that looks a little off is the mouth, but that's only a small detail.
I'll see if I can get a couple of sprites up soon.
Wizwum
Dec 30th, 2009 6:02:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Alchemator
(Post 2389303)
Wizwum, as we are short on active QCs at the moment I'd be happy to make you one if you want.
I would, but I just won't be able to commit anyway near enough. I may be able to give a bit of critique on the odd sprite now and then, but I'll never have enough time to put in detailed stuff, or actually rework the sprite myself, I'm sad to say. So I'll kindly turn you down, but if you're running out of volunteers in the future, I may offer myself up if I'm needed.
The Lickitung and Heracross, I can't fault, other than maybe that Heracross is a little too shiny... Maybe if you removed the highest highlight on each of the limb segments, and shallowed the shading gradient on the horn, it might look a little better. But otherwise, great job. As to the Raichu, it looks good. The only real issues are the mouth, its left leg (our right) and the curls on the ears. The mouth is a bit lop-sided, and I think the leg is missing a pixel. AS to the ears, remember, you don't have to follow the base art rigorously. I suggest you scratch those curls, rather than trying to pixelover whats there in the artwork. That way, you'll get a more fluid appearence to them, and that should fix the ears. Oh, also the white highlights on the eye should both be on the same side, not both on the inside. At the moment it just looks cross-eyes. Sadly the main issue here though, is height, once again. Heracross and Lickitung are fine, but Raichu is far too big. If you look at it it in comparison to Red, it reaches his mouth. But Raichu is only 2'7", so it should be up to his waist, just about, maybe a little taller. Granted the disparity is smaller than with Pikachu and Mew, but its still too big.
aXl
Dec 31st, 2009 1:35:53 PM
HEY! Nik! I QC'd your Darkrai. Here's the result: http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/n...74310-iaza.png
Made the shadow tips spikier, changed the eye color and collar shading color, and fixed the outline, along with fixing up the shading a bit. Posted it here so that people can critique it more. If no one objects, then I can move onto Cresselia. So, everyone, please comment. Thank you.
Nik S D
Dec 31st, 2009 2:31:36 PM
Thanks! It looks a LOT better. 1 finished sprite for me, yay. I can't wait to see what you do with Cresselia.
