Scyther [GP 1/3]

Scyther

[OVERVIEW]

<p>Ever since
the introduction of Scizor in generation 2, Scyther has been living in the shadows of its evolution. In generations since, Scyther has been penalized first by its lack of bulk and then by the introduction of Stealth Rock, which stripped away half of its health just for entering the battlefield. Even the blessing of Technician went mostly unnoticed. However, while Generation 5 did not bring Scizor anything of value, it blessed Scyther with the Eviolite.</p>

<p>With this new item, Scyther has
better defenses than its evolution. Despite this, Scyther is still relegated to UU due to its worse typing,lack of a powerful coverage move or STAB priority move, and the need to rely on Eviolite to be defensive—not to mention that it still loses half of its health when switching in to Stealth Rock. Despite these flaws, its base 110 Attack, base 105 Speed, Technician, and Eviolite allow Scyther to perform many different roles, making it a viable choice in UU.</p>

[Set]

name: Bulky Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Roost
move 3: Aerial Ace
move 4: Baton Pass / Brick Break
item: Eviolite
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 216 HP / 40 Atk / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>
While most sweeping sets attempt to boost a maximized attack to astronomical levels, with the goal of overpowering opponents after one turn of setup, this set plays a bit differently. The goal here is to get multiple boosts. Eviolite, along with the HP investment, makes Scyther quite hard to bring down. This allows Scyther to boost multiple times, after which you can use Roost to recover health. Aerial Ace is the main STAB move, and gets a boost in power, thanks to Technician. With its bulk, Scyther can use Baton Pass quite effectively. The idea is to switch in on something that does not threaten it much, such as Gallade, and then set up.</p>

<p>Eviolite gives Scyther 294
in both defenses, making it quite vital to this set. With the given EV spread, Scyther's HP hits 335 (one less than a multiple of 16)—a magic HP number, it allows Scyther to survive two switches into Stealth Rock and/or an extra turn of weather damage. Maximum Speed of 339 is mandatory and the rest of t he EVs are dumped into attack, which reaches 528 after a Swords Dance. Roost allows it to survive longer and perhaps get an extra boost.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Brick Break can be used in place of Baton Pass for
coverage, and has a handy side effect of breaking screens. Watch out for Rotom, Rotom-S, and Zapados, as they all resist both Aerial Ace and Brick Break. Scyther also hates Trick, as Eviolite is the only thing that makes it moderately bulky. Despite its bulk, Rapid Spin support is greatly appreciated to get rid of Stealth Rock. For a recipient of Baton Pass, Rhyperior is a great choice, as it shares almost perfect synergy with Scyther, save for a shared Ice weakness.</p>

<p>You could use Bug Bite for an additional or different STAB
move; however this provides less coverage, making it less effective. Substitute can be used to block status, but Scyther loses either coverage or recovery this way. You could move some of the EVs into the defenses, but you would lose vital speed or end up more vulnerable to passive damage. Taunt and Encore both ruin this set.</p>

[Set]

name: Swords Dance Sweeper
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Aerial Ace
move 3: Brick Break
move 4: Bug Bite / Quick Attack
item: Life Orb
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>
A classic set—Scyther is still a great sweeper, even without bulk, and is quite powerful when equipped with a Life Orb. The EV spread attempts to hit quickly and powerfully by maximizing Speed and Attack. Jolly works well with Swords Dance, boasting 339 Speed and 319 Attack (which hits 638 after a Swords Dance) allowing Scyther to hit extremely hard. Aerial Ace is the main attack and is a reliable STAB move, while Brick Break provides good coverage. Bug Bite provides another powerful STAB attack.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Quick Attack is a viable option
for a priority move, and hits hard after a Swords Dance. Entry hazard support is appreciated for securing KOs, and the ridding of Stealth Rock on your side of the field prevents Scyther from being crippled on the switch-in. Donphan and Hitmontop are two partners that stand out for Rapid Spin support, as they both have resistances to most of Scyther's weaknesses and are good at dealing with its counters. You should always make sure that Scyther's HP is odd so that it can survive two switches into Stealth Rock. Roost can be used to heal off Life Orb recoil, but coverage is preferred in this situation.</p>

[Set]

name: Choice Attacker
move 1: U-turn
move 2: Aerial Ace
move 3: Brick Break / Pursuit
move 4: Quick Attack
item: Choice Band / Choice Scarf
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>As a
utility Pokemon or late-game sweeper, Scyther is viable with a choice item. A Choice Band makes it hit extremely hard off the bat, while a Choice Scarf allows Scyther to pick off weakened foes. U-turn is a fantastic scouting move, providing a reliable STAB attack with the ability to switch out. Aerial Ace provides another solid STAB attacks, while Brick Break hits hard Steel-types and Rock-types. Quick Attack has priority, which can be crucial to stopping an opposing sweeper. Pursuit can be used over Brick Break to hit hard Pokemon attempting to switch out.<p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>
Without the ability to change moves, the freedom to switch in multiple times is essential. Thus, Rapid Spin support is mandatory and again, Donphan is a solid choice, as it deals with Rock-types and Electric-type attacks well and has access to Ice Shard to deal with other troublesome sweepers—Staraptor in particular. The EV spread provides maximum Speed and Attack, and Jolly is preferable in all cases, as it makes Scyther faster than Jolly Staraptor. With a Choice Band, Scyther hits 478 Attack and 339 Speed. With a Choice Scarf, Scyther hits 319 Attack and 508 Speed. Entry hazard support is appreciated, as it makes the opponent's switches more costly.<p>

[Other Options]

<p>Scyther has many viable options to choose
from, but they are usually outclassed.Pursuit can be used in tandem with Brick Break for almost perfect coverage, but this is not recommended, as Scyther does not like losing out on a STAB attack. Technician-boosted Double Hit can break through Focus Sash, Sturdy, and Substitute, but it lacks coverage and priority, making it very situational. Night Slash might have more power than Pursuit, but Pursuit is preferred for its ability to punish switches. Agility can be used to boost Scyther's already stellar Speed, but Scyther prefers the Attack boost granted from Swords Dance. Using Agility and Swords Dance together requires too much setup time, and makes Scyther's four move slot syndrome even worse. A set utilizing Focus Sash, Reversal, and Swords Dance is quite powerful; however, with the abundance of weather, Stealth Rock, and priority, it is not such a good idea. An Adamant nature can be used to boost Scyther's Attack, but it prefers Jolly due to the demand of in Speed this generation.</p>

[Checks and Counters]

<p>
With a double Rock weakness, Stealth Rock will take away half of Scyther's health. That said, Rock-type moves in general usually knockout Scyther in one hit. Locking Scyther into Swords Dance through Encore or Trick can easily shut it down, but be careful of giving the Swords Dance Sweeper variety a Choice Scarf—it can then perform like the Choice set.</p>

<p>
For specific Pokemon, Cofagrigus has amazing Physical bulk, access to Will-O-Wisp, and the ability Mummy, all of which can shut down Scyther. Rotom, Rotom-S, Zapdos, and even Emolga resist Fighting, Flying, and Bug moves, and can hit Scyther with STAB Electric moves. Raikou and Jolteon can outrun Scyther and also take it out with STAB Electric attacks. It should be noted that event Rash Raikou with 252 Speed EVs is still slower than Jolly Scyther with 252 Speed EVs. Sharpedo is another counter—after using Protect, it is faster than Scyther, thanks to its ability Speed Boost.</p>

[Dream World]

<p>From the Dream World, Scyther
receives the ability Steadfast. Despite being a decent ability, Technician is what makes Scyther shine—without it, Scyther would not be very threatening. It is best to skip out on that Scyther (unless you really want the Dream Points).</p>
 
Brick Break is infinitely better than Rock Smash, even with Technician as it also shatters dual screens. Mention Substitute in OO or AC to block status.
 

AccidentalGreed

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Are there any notable attackers in particular Scyther can set up on (with Eviolite)?

I also know from a few battles that Life Orb isn't a bad item due to being more immediately effective than any other boosting item. Perhaps an Offensive Swords Dance set should be considered, and is worthy of it's own spot on the analysis.
 
Maybe you should spell Aerial Ace correctly. :)
Its Aerial, not Ariel.

This is the classic suicide lead from Gen IV UU. I don't know if its any good, but I've tried it a few times in B/W OU, and it caught some people by surprise.

Scyther @ Focus Sash
Technician
4Hp/252Att/252Spe
Adamant/Jolly

Swords Dance
Aerial Ace
Reversal
Bug Bite

Swords Dance, survive the attack with a sash, then use the approriate attack.
 

Moo

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I don't think Agility is needed on the Life Orb set. Scyther is already plenty fast and needs the attack boost to do any serious damage. Also you've got too many slashes on the set, maybe just put Bug Bite and Quick Attack in the last slot.

You need to mention Rapid Spin support on the Bulky SD set too.
 

Darkmalice

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An EV spread of 16 HP / 120 Def / 120 SpD / 252 Spe can be used for defences of 340 but you lose out on HP recovery
Why would you use this spread? Durability is all about how well the Pokemon takes hit, not aiming to have stats at a random number (HP is sometimes an exception thanks to Leftovers, entry hazards etc. Also bonus points sometimes). This spread gives worse durability than the current EV spread thanks to the HP loss whilst also losing out on Atk. This should be removed.
 

shrang

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I really don't see what's so good about the bulky SD set. I mean, the Pokemon that will normally beat you will end up beating you anyway (Rhyperior, Steel-types, etc), so what's the point of running it? Scyther is much better as just a pure attacker anyway.

IMO, if you want to use Eviolite, it is probably better running something like a Baton Pass set, something like:

name: Baton Pass
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Baton Pass
move 3: Aerial Ace
move 4: Roost / Agility
item: Eviolite
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly / Adamant
evs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Spe
 

breh

強いだね
use jolly even on the scarf set; you outspeed Jolly Scarfraptor.

In fact, I'd argue you should always be using Jolly when investing 252 EVs in Speed.
 
Scyther @ Focus Sash
Technician
4Hp/252Att/252Spe
Adamant/Jolly

Swords Dance
Aerial Ace
Reversal
Bug Bite
Too much of this metagame uses priority, I'll put this in Other Options unless someone higher up tells me so.

I don't think Agility is needed on the Life Orb set. Scyther is already plenty fast and needs the attack boost to do any serious damage. Also you've got too many slashes on the set, maybe just put Bug Bite and Quick Attack in the last slot.

You need to mention Rapid Spin support on the Bulky SD set too.
Did that and put Agility in Other Options. As for the slashes, I'll take away Baton Pass but Pursuit works well for perfect coverage. Mentioned Rapid Spin Support.

Why would you use this spread? Durability is all about how well the Pokemon takes hit, not aiming to have stats at a random number (HP is sometimes an exception thanks to Leftovers, entry hazards etc. Also bonus points sometimes). This spread gives worse durability than the current EV spread thanks to the HP loss whilst also losing out on Atk. This should be removed.
I'll mention putting EVs into the defences and the drawbacks instead.

I really don't see what's so good about the bulky SD set. I mean, the Pokemon that will normally beat you will end up beating you anyway (Rhyperior, Steel-types, etc), so what's the point of running it? Scyther is much better as just a pure attacker anyway.

IMO, if you want to use Eviolite, it is probably better running something like a Baton Pass set, something like:

name: Baton Pass
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Baton Pass
move 3: Aerial Ace
move 4: Roost / Agility
item: Eviolite
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly / Adamant
evs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Spe
I'll slash Baton Pass on the first set and Scyther needs Roost to work well.

use jolly even on the scarf set; you outspeed Jolly Scarfraptor.

In fact, I'd argue you should always be using Jolly when investing 252 EVs in Speed.
Okay, I'll mention Adamant nature in Other Options.

Bad news: I'm going to Italy for summer vacation in 2 days...wait, that's excellent news. Anyways, either you help me finish this up by then or you'll have to wait 2 weeks until I come back (I want to keep this analysis).
 
I don't think Pursuit is worth a slash on the first set, it is ridiculously weak unless someone is switching, and it leaves you without a STAB move. Aerial Ace has nice neutral coverage with Brick Break and is at 135 Base Power after STAB, stronger than a neutral Pursuit on a switch.
 
I don't think Pursuit is worth a slash on the first set, it is ridiculously weak unless someone is switching, and it leaves you without a STAB move. Aerial Ace has nice neutral coverage with Brick Break and is at 135 Base Power after STAB, stronger than a neutral Pursuit on a switch.
I understand and have mentioned that in the analysis. I'll wait for a QC member and see what they have to say.

Leaving for Italy in 12 hours, I want to keep this analysis. If you don't notice a change for a while (2 weeks) this is why.
 
The Choice sweeper should look like this:

[Set]
name: Choice Band
move 1: U-turn
move 2: Aerial Ace
move 3: Quick Attack
move 4: Brick Break / Pursuit
item: Choice Band
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

Choice Scarf is a little too weak for my taste and there are much better scarf abusers. Choice Band is the way to go as it hits like a truck. Since only Choice Band is being used now, I made Quick Attack one of the main moves and slashed Brick Break and Pursuit, depending on what your team needs. Also, I would mention Donphan as a teammate as it resists everything but Ice and Fire and can spin away the deadly Stealth Rock. Since Choice Band Scyther will be spamming U-turn a lot, spin support is essential.

Edit: Also, I don't think scarfed Aerial Ace can OHKO Staraptor without Stealth Rock, so there's a bit of my reasoning behind getting rid of the Choice Scarf option.
 
The Choice sweeper should look like this:

[Set]
name: Choice Band
move 1: U-turn
move 2: Aerial Ace
move 3: Quick Attack
move 4: Brick Break / Pursuit
item: Choice Band
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

Choice Scarf is a little too weak for my taste and there are much better scarf abusers. Choice Band is the way to go as it hits like a truck. Since only Choice Band is being used now, I made Quick Attack one of the main moves and slashed Brick Break and Pursuit, depending on what your team needs. Also, I would mention Donphan as a teammate as it resists everything but Ice and Fire and can spin away the deadly Stealth Rock. Since Choice Band Scyther will be spamming U-turn a lot, spin support is essential.

Edit: Also, I don't think scarfed Aerial Ace can OHKO Staraptor without Stealth Rock, so there's a bit of my reasoning behind getting rid of the Choice Scarf option.
You don't OHKO Staraptor but Scyther is faster than it when both hold a Choice Scarf (where you proceed to U-turn out of there). None the less, the demand for Rapid Spin support was already mentioned and I included Donphan in the analysis.

Leaving in 5 hours.
 
I'm not quite sure if the Choice set should be considered a "sweeper." Despite the boosted stat, you are locked into one move, which definitely limits your sweeping potential.
 
Back from vacation and took Rawrchomp's advice and the choice set is now called "Choice Attacker". Going to PM the QC checkers.
 

Oglemi

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OK some things

- Slash Brick Break after Baton Pass on the first set, since BP is so awesome in this meta, and Scyther is really better off doing that. Get rid of the Pursuit slash next to Aerial Ace. Mention Rhyperior as a receiving partner since the two share almost perfect synergy bar Ice-type attacks. Also get rid of Emolga and Toxicroak from the write up. Emolga is never seen and Toxicroak is OU.

- Get rid of the Pursuit slash next to Aerial Ace on the second set and remove Toxicroak from the set comments. Mention either Donphan or Hitmontop as a partner.

- I haven't tried the Choice set, but again get rid of Pursuit next to Aerial Ace.

I will come back later with more thoughts.
 
Slash Brick Break after Baton Pass on the first set, since BP is so awesome in this meta, and Scyther is really better off doing that. Get rid of the Pursuit slash next to Aerial Ace. Mention Rhyperior as a receiving partner since the two share almost perfect synergy bar Ice-type attacks. Also get rid of Emolga and Toxicroak from the write up. Emolga is never seen and Toxicroak is OU.
Did so and I guess I better start training my Vaporeon if you say Baton Pass is as good as it is. I understand why no for Pursuit, Scyther doesn't like losing its STAB so I mentioned it in Optional Changes. Rhyperior, a solid choice...that wasn't funny was it? Forgot about Toxicroak being OU. As for Emolga, just listing off everything but this decision makes sense.

Get rid of the Pursuit slash next to Aerial Ace on the second set and remove Toxicroak from the set comments. Mention either Donphan or Hitmontop as a partner.
(see above)

- I haven't tried the Choice set, but again get rid of Pursuit next to Aerial Ace.
(see above above)

I will come back later with more thoughts.
Think harder!
 

PK Gaming

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  • Make Choice Band the main item on the Choice Scarf set. Also, de-slash pursuit on the Aerial Ace moveslot and slash it alongside Brick Break.
  • Reword the dream world section, Steadfast is a garbage ability that should never see use over technician.

QC APPROVED (2/3)
 
  • Make Choice Band the main item on the Choice Scarf set. Also, de-slash pursuit on the Aerial Ace moveslot and slash it alongside Brick Break.
  • Reword the dream world section, Steadfast is a garbage ability that should never see use over technician.

QC APPROVED (2/3)
I don't find Steadfast to be a poor ability, just in Scyther's case, it hampers it a lot so I made it less positive instead.

Also you sure about Quick Attack with a Choice Scarf? Seems a bit redundant (but I changed it anyways).

The Additional Comments section is now pretty small. Any ideas on how to beef it up?

Ready for grammar!
 

breh

強いだね
but steadfast really is a terrible ability. the only moves that you'll ever encounter that flinch come from togekiss (SE on you; should only matter if it's Scarfed, in which case it'll be max invested and hurt), random dark pulses, cobalion iron head, technitop fake out (but since you're not using AA, you have no way to damage it).... uh... registeel iron head when paralyzed? lol, you shouldn't be using steadfast. that technician is inherently a great ability does not help steadfast either.
 

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