[Rackham]

Originally Posted by Fat Moo

Hey, nice team you have there. It's looking pretty solid, and I'm not seeing any major weaknesses, but I can see the team having problems with certain special attackers. Special attackers that can beat your specially defense Pokemon (Heatran and Jellicent) can be a problem. Examples of these are Thundurus and Rotom-W. I suggest changing your Celebi set to fix this weakness:

Celebi @ Leftovers Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 240 HP / 252 SAtk / 16 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Nasty Plot
- Recover
- Giga Drain
- Psychic

This bulky Nasty Plot set will allow you to switch in safely on the likes of Thundurus and Rotom-W. You might be a bit slower, but the extra bulk is appreciated, and you still have great power. Thanks to Recover and Giga Drain, Celebi can stick around, and won't be crippled by statuses thanks to Natural Cure. Hidden Power Fire is an option over Psychic for Scizor and Ferrothorn, but you have Heatran for those so you don't really need it.

Psyshock is really not needed on Deoxys-S. Its only merits are hitting Blissey and Chansey harder, which you have Superpower for. Psyshock puts you at a disadvantage with Pokemon like Gliscor and Bulk Up Conkeldurr. I suggest replacing it with Psycho Boost, a 140 base power Psychic-type attack, which is almost twice as powerful as Psyshock. Think of it as Draco Meteor for Deoxys.

Good luck with the team, hope I helped

Thanks, Moo. You're totally right about Thundurus and Rotom-W. Anyway, I've tested out your bulky Celebi and I really like it. I decided to opt for HP Fire over Psychic though, because the only time that I tend to not use Giga Drain is against Scizor/Ferrothorn. Psycho Boost is another really nice option, since I tend not to use Psyshock much anyway, so I've added that in too.

Originally Posted by Fat backflip

Hey. Not much to offer for constructive change, but just a few things to mention as another guy who runs and loves his SD Luke team. I've encountered several offensive Gliscor (only three of them tbh, but thats a lot in comparison to how predictable his move-sets have been in the recent past) as an effort to replace the Garchomp void. Luke is out sped and Extremespeed 3HKO's with Poison Heal. He also beats your Gliscor and can cause some grief switching in at +2 if he nets a solid predict. Nothing that you need to change the team to fix, just something to be mindful of when preparing a sweep against Gliscor.

I would also keep Celebi as is, as a Thundurus at +2 is probably going to kill something to allow your revenge killer in, unless my calcs were wrong.

Lastly, if you ever find yourself craving a revamp, I highly recommend exploring Memento Latios, who is stupidly effective at setting up Lucario sweeps.

The Gliscor variants that run enough speed to outrun Lucario tend not to have enough bulk to effectively counter Excadrill. That said, you are right and they do pop up occasionally, so I do need to make sure I know what set they're running, however this isn't too difficult as the damage difference between the two types of set is fairly noticeable and also, offensive Gliscor sets will tend to reveal themselves fairly early because the way they are played tends to be different to normal Gliscor sets. Moreover, they tend to be easier to kill and so aren't that much of an issue so long as I perform the necessary scouting. I've actually tried Dual Screens Memento Latios before, but I really don't like having to lose one of my pokemon to set up a sweep, especially has Lucario tends to get plenty of opportunities as it is with all these Tyranitars running around. The thing with Lucario is that against some teams, he can come in more than once with +2, so Latios, although good a opening up a sweeping opportunity is largely unnecessary when using Lucario.

Originally Posted by Fat Heist

Lucario is definitely an underestimated threat and I think you have built a team that really helps it sweep. I think the biggest issue with this team is that the two best counters, and most common counters, to that set are Jellicent and Reuniclus and you have no real out-and-out way of removing them. With Lava Plume, Heatran can weaken Jellicent with a burn, but you honestly have no decent switch-in to Reuniclus. Celebi is your best switch-in at the moment and all Celebi can do is hope that it can get lucky and beat Reuniclus in the NP/CM war. Your other sweeper, Deoxys-S, cannot really threaten Reuniclus either. I suppose Jellicent does a decent job against Reuniclus, although it really needs a ton more special-defense and Cursed Body so Reuniclus cannot hit you with Psychic. If you move those defense EVs into special defense you will easily be able to defeat the Bold Reuniclus and should come out on top against the Modest Calm Mind variants most of the time.

Regarding the two counters. First, Jellicent: To be honest, when played well it can be a pain, although Celebi does a pretty good job of stopping it doing too much and Jellicent can reliably stop it so long as it doesn't come in on a Will-O-Wisp or Taunt and doesn't carry Shadow Ball. However you are totally right about Reuniclus. It and DD shed skin Scrafty are the two big weaknesses this team has. Normally, I have to deal with Reuniclus with Jellicent, through a combination of Taunt and Shadow Ball, although alot of the time Jellicent goes down with it. The main way I have to deal with it is to try to reduce its set-up opportunities to a minimum. +2 Lucario's Close Combat does 50.71% minimum to 252/252 Bold Reuniclus, so it cannot switch in consistently. The main pokemon that it tries to switch in on is Jellicent, who can taunt and Shadow Ball, which is a 3HKO, however, like I say, it is a real pain in the ass because Psychic deals a fair amount of damage back. Unfortunately, I can't afford to take out the Defense EVs because I rely on Jellicent to help check alot of the physical threats that can take Gliscor on. If I really need to, I can try to stall Reuniclus out of its Focus blast pp with lots of sitching and Roar it out with Heatran but if I resort to that I'll lose at least one pokemon. But, like I said, I have alot of difficulty with a well-played Reuniclus.

Originally Posted by Fat Heist

I think your team would really benefit with a Scarf Tyranitar > Deoxys-S. Scarf Tyranitar is a much more reliable Thundurus switch-in than Deoxys and is able to "surprise" your opponent and outrun and KO. Scarf Tyranitar gives you an excellent way of weakening and potentially removing both Jellicent and Reuniclus. Most Jellicent will generally stay in on Tyranitar as they will expect you to be slower, and will stay in to burn so you can do over 75% with a Crunch, or Pursuit it on the switch. This works the same way with Reuniclus, although the most defensively invested will only take 60% minimum from a Crunch. Scarf Tyranitar can also remove those Latias that are bulky enough to live a Extremespeed from Lucario. This goes the same for the rare, but very dangerous, Gengar. I would suggest a moveset of Crunch / Pursuit / Ice Beam or Ice Punch / Stone Edge. If you use Ice Punch you can try Superpower over Stone Edge as Ice Punch can OHKO Thundurus.

If you don't like the Tyranitar suggestion, definitely use Psycho Boost like Moo suggested

I was considering scarf Tyranitar before, actually and I really like the idea. I've used him in a few teams this gen and found him to be really effective, so I'll test it out and get back to you on that. Thanks for the rate.

Originally Posted by Fat Delko

Hi

I also suggest Scarfed Tyranitar instead of Deoxys-S. Not only does this help your team by removing threats as Choice Specs Latios, Thunderus and the likes, it will also help you against opposing Weather teams and most members of your team are immune to Sandstorm anyway. If you make this change I will also like to suggest Surf on Jellicent instead of Shadow Ball.
I also like the Celebi suggestion from Moo, using a Bulkier Celebi will fit your team better. Don't worry about Scizor as Heatran, Jellicent and Gliscor can handle those well enough.

Goodluck

Yeah, see above regarding ScarfTar and Bulky Celebi. I don't see what Surf over Shadow Ball would help with though. Shadow ball gets a SE hit on Latios, Reuniclus and opposing Jellicent, which I know isn't Jellicent's main job, but helps Jellicent maintain an offensive presence against alot of the things that like to switch into it, whereas Surf doesn't have as much utility offensively or defensively, and if I did opt for water STAB, I'd use Scald for the burn chance.

Originally Posted by Fat Raikiri

If you want to help Lucario sweep a team I would suggest using a poke that is prone to being pursuit bait like Latias, Latios, Gengar, ect. The team it self is weak to Latios and Latias unless u keep your Heatran healthy. So I wouldn't use Heatran as a lead in that case because it is the worst thing to lead with right now.

If you want to keep your team similar I would give Celebi the lead role if you can make that work. It doesn't have to have Stealth Rock but Heatran can still carry it if people switch into a Celebi counter that Heatran most likely can handle no problem.

If you want some assurance that the Lati's will be taken out u can probably take out Deoxys for scarf Tyranitar.

Thanks for the rate. Testing Scarf Tyranitar, and, like I say, I do play fairly cautiously with Heatran, though I appreciate your point. As for pursuit-weak pokemon, I find Celebi lures out Tyranitar and Scizor really well as it is. Alot of Pursuit bait pokemon from 4th Gen are not so effective (?) now, because ScarfTar is alot less common.