Smogon Community - View Single Post - All Gens The Most Dominant Pokemon in History - #9-10 Position Debate

Slobroking · Oct 12th, 2012, 10:48:28 PM

7 Suicune
8 Celebi
9 Blissey
10 Cloyster
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Suicune is a great phazer and tank in GSC. It's great at what it does, although it's movepool is pretty bland outside of Roar.

It's a beast in RSE with Calm Mind. It can even win against Zapdos if it gets a boost while it switches in, as long as Zapdos doesn't get a crit. Sandstream cripples its ability to take hits though. It can still easily sweep your team if you're not prepared for it.

In DPP it can't really tank as well with higher BP attacks, Life Orb, Stealth Rock in it's way. But it still functions well as a special sweeper with Calm Mind + 3 attacks.
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Celebi is definitely top 3 in RSE. Celebi does not die, ever. It can be very annoying with Leech Seed, and downright devestating with Baton Pass and either Calm Mind or Swords Dance. It isn't really affected by Sandstream thanks to Leech Seed and Recover.

Celebi isn't as good in DPP with physical Pursuit, and Scizor and Heatran dominating the meta, but it has the movepool to work around it's counters if it wants to. Still very usable, especially with new toys like Thunder Wave and Stealth Rock.

Celebi is overall better than Suicune but Suicune edges out Celebi because you could actually use it in GSC.
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Blissey would've been top 3 easily if Chansey was included. Even though Blissey is horrid in GSC, and easily counterable in both RSE and DPP, it still deserves top 10 placing because it's just so centralizing and the reason why all-out special attackers aren't effective.
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Either Cloyster or Forretress for the #10 spot. I'm leaning towards Cloyster but it's really a tossup.

Cloyster is better in RBY by default, and GSC. Forretress is decent in GSC, better in RSE, and much better in DPP thanks to Sandstream immunity and far more resistances. Forretress is a much better physical wall, whereas in RSE and DPP, Cloyster can't really wall for shit. But Cloyster isn't setup bait like Forretress, and can use the common Swampert as an opportunity to setup Spikes. It isn't trapped by Magneton either.

Cloyster wins IMO because it was pretty good in RBY, and DPP is the only gen where Forretress is really better.

Oct 12th, 2012, 10:48:28 PM	#115
Slobroking Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,203	7 Suicune 8 Celebi 9 Blissey 10 Cloyster -- Suicune is a great phazer and tank in GSC. It's great at what it does, although it's movepool is pretty bland outside of Roar. It's a beast in RSE with Calm Mind. It can even win against Zapdos if it gets a boost while it switches in, as long as Zapdos doesn't get a crit. Sandstream cripples its ability to take hits though. It can still easily sweep your team if you're not prepared for it. In DPP it can't really tank as well with higher BP attacks, Life Orb, Stealth Rock in it's way. But it still functions well as a special sweeper with Calm Mind + 3 attacks. -- Celebi is definitely top 3 in RSE. Celebi does not die, ever. It can be very annoying with Leech Seed, and downright devestating with Baton Pass and either Calm Mind or Swords Dance. It isn't really affected by Sandstream thanks to Leech Seed and Recover. Celebi isn't as good in DPP with physical Pursuit, and Scizor and Heatran dominating the meta, but it has the movepool to work around it's counters if it wants to. Still very usable, especially with new toys like Thunder Wave and Stealth Rock. Celebi is overall better than Suicune but Suicune edges out Celebi because you could actually use it in GSC. -- Blissey would've been top 3 easily if Chansey was included. Even though Blissey is horrid in GSC, and easily counterable in both RSE and DPP, it still deserves top 10 placing because it's just so centralizing and the reason why all-out special attackers aren't effective. -- Either Cloyster or Forretress for the #10 spot. I'm leaning towards Cloyster but it's really a tossup. Cloyster is better in RBY by default, and GSC. Forretress is decent in GSC, better in RSE, and much better in DPP thanks to Sandstream immunity and far more resistances. Forretress is a much better physical wall, whereas in RSE and DPP, Cloyster can't really wall for shit. But Cloyster isn't setup bait like Forretress, and can use the common Swampert as an opportunity to setup Spikes. It isn't trapped by Magneton either. Cloyster wins IMO because it was pretty good in RBY, and DPP is the only gen where Forretress is really better. Last edited by Slobroking; Oct 13th, 2012 at 12:32:34 AM.