Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat cim
So I wrote a great post on why Victini is clearly better than Slaking could ever hope to be, but I closed the tab so now I have to rewrite it. The comparison isn't even fair. Victini has one super strong attack that has the drawback of lowering Defenses and Speed, making it hard to stay in for more than a turn if you happen to be using it. Slaking is guaranteed to do nothing every other turn it is in, with no real way around it. Victini's STAB has VERY few immunities, especially with Chandelure running Flame Body to beat P2. Slaking's STAB has a common immunity. His coverage moves have more common immunities, except for Dark, which isn't powerful enough to spam, especially with Heracross on every team.
The fact that you talk about "2HKOs" at all just speaks to your ignorance here. 2HKOs as a concept exist because getting the 2HKO means you beat the opponent before it does anything to you. Slaking can never 2HKO a Pokemon, because it can never do the second hit before the opponent gets a free turn to do something. Say you sacrifice a Pokemon and bring in Kingdra or Raikou for free. Guess who gets to boost in your face with zero consequences? Yup, the most threatening sweepers in the metagame do love one free turn. At least with Victini, if you can secure the KO with Zen Headbutt, you have the *option* of hitting again.
You can't break any walls with Slaking, because walls get free recovery every other turn, and you can't beat a sweeper team with Slaking, because a smart player will just switch in an immunity or sacrifice something and then bring in their set up sweeper. So what is it useful against?
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I have to disagree with you that 2HKO's (by which I mean >53.125% damage) on walls without recovery is a drawback in any way. It just means that there's another thing in your team that now loses a hard counter. For example, the case with Blastoise: Darmanitan's Flare Blitz does <30% to it, but can outspeed obviously, so Slaking essentially removes it as a counter. Denting nonresisting walls with Slaking works like with any other heavy hitter: smash, then GTFO. It's not meant to sweep, damn it, Truant doesn't let it obviously. It's there to provide a Normal STAB to smash things with and scare stuff out. Heck, nobody said that you had to actually attack. Just use it to threaten stuff if you must. If you're really concerned about damage output and really want to stay in after an attack then run Giga Impact or something.
About boosting sweepers: Both Raikou and Kingdra are OHKO'd by Return so provided that either of them don't Sub (and Kingdra SubDD sets are being replaced, as far as I've seen, by LO ChestoRest) it's going to eat Slaking's fist. A +1 Kingdra handily 2hkos but that just doesn't matter because it's going to get owned if it attacks. Raikou is more threatening but only if it carries Aura Sphere, but variants that do are outsped by some crucial threats: Mienshao, Cobalion, Virizion, DURANT... It's not a given that the Slaking has to swap out. I will, however, agree that it loses against Sub+Boost sweepers.
You CAN beat a sweeper team with Slaking. It relies on hitting something then giving the opponent a free turn, but then the opponent's now down a Pokemon, which can make a large difference. In addition, as shown by the examples above, it can be surprisingly hard to set up on Slaking.
Victini is in the same boat against Kingdra, you know... what with quad resist and all, and the SR weakness is really exacerbated by the multitude of bulky waters in the tier. Immunities be damned, simply resisting V-Create allows bulky waters like CroCune and Milotic to come in free of charge and phaze or 1HKO. Victini can't even beat Physically Defensive Blastoise with Fusion Bolt as it fails to 2hko. Rhyperior is an even more solid counter because all Victini can do in return is use a piss-weak Brick Break while it sets up SR or Rock Polish. At least Slaking can put dents in the bulky waters and Rhyperior with the appropriate coverage move.
The point is, Slaking IS a 1 trick pony but that doesn't mean it can't keep repeating that trick over and over again.
Also, don't bring personal insults to an argument. It's unbecoming of someone who is clearly a veteran at this. I am not ignorant of the pitfalls surrounding Slaking usage, but this is a thread not to bash Slaking (we've got those) but to figure out what niche role it can play.
OK, rant over.
Neeext!
@evillocke, I have no idea what you mean to do by cutting his stats in half. Attack makes sense (not base attack though) but why speed? He's still going to outspeed most of UU. Bulk is actually more impressive than you give him credit for because nobody says that he'll be forced to stay in (though that does leave PerishTrapping Mismagius as a problem) so he can afford to take a hit.
@Pocket, there's a good idea. Gimmicky as heck but it's SLAKING. Damn, that's going to troll so many people!