Rotation Battle Play

[Kindrindra]

Originally Posted by Fat SupremeDirt

By the way, as abilities on the sides do not activate, Slow Start doesn't either. Therefore, Gigas can get his act together immediately. Guess he learned about alarm clocks.

Wow. That could be dangerous.

Myself, when I read how exactly Triple battles worked, my mind instantly jumped to UU. You know what I'm thinking. The infamous Azumaril/Arcanine/Venasaur core. Physical Venasaur being able to switch out without losing SD boosts scares me just a little. Never mind the ability to switch in Azumaril and Aqua Jet for a quick KO.


This is gonna be AWESOME. <3

[Emperor]

Originally Posted by Fat SupremeDirt

Random Battle limits you to 4. WiFi and Wireless you can use a full 6.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjmi7...eature=related

found an example battle :)

[SupremeDirt]

Originally Posted by Fat Emperor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjmi7...eature=related

found an example battle :)

He sweeps... with Incinerate. Christ.

[Emperor]

I think he meant it to be fire dance but that's aside the point. That's just an example of a wifi rotation battle.

I've watched a few videos here and there and it seems that having a C item (unless you have u turn or the like) is a very VERY bad idea. It locks you in too much

[Afti]

Originally Posted by Fat SupremeDirt

By the way, as abilities on the sides do not activate, Slow Start doesn't either. Therefore, Gigas can get his act together immediately. Guess he learned about alarm clocks.

Wait, has anyone tested this? If so, holy shit. Regigigas will be everywhere.

Keeping in mind that entry hazards are next to useless in rotation battles (since IIRC they only work if your 4th mon enters the field directly; if it enters a reserve, they do nothing) I think that there are several threats which wouldn't be so scary in standard play. This is all just theorymon due to the lack of a simulator, but:

...

---

Abomasnow

Without Stealth Rock, and with free switching, Hail teams just got a whole lot better. Expect Abomasnow leads to be very common. Furthermore, if things look bad Abomasnow doesn't even need to stay in a single turn; go immediately to Rotom-F and start killing things. And it is of course slower than Ninetales or Groudon- Abomasnow will be getting Hail up. Quiet can minimize speed and exploit Blizzard, or you could have a SubSeeder.

Groudon

Sets up Sun. Furthermore, the ability to bring a +2 Groudon back into play is ridiculous.

Rayquaza

Cancels out weather, avoids Stealth Rock, fairly fast, with two huge attack stats for sweeping. Doesn't even have bad bulk.

Heatran

It's Heatran. Only now it's in the sun, and can dodge Earthquakes for Moltres. Yay?

Yanmega

Hypnosis, Tinted Lens, and a diverse movepool makes this thing terrifying without worry of Stealth Rock. Furthermore, Speed Boost is absolutely abusable.

Urgamoth

This is scary in Singles. In Rotation Battle, where it can leave without losing Butterfly Dances and doesn't have to deal with Stealth Rock? It'll be an absolute monster.

Ho-Oh

130 base Attack, STAB Sacred Fire/Brave Bird, and scary defensive ability. Without being neutered by Stealth Rock. This thing is nuts.

Rotom-H

Should return to its status as the premiere Scizor counter and a killer wall, without SR damage on its limited HP. Spinblocking isn't really an issue when there are no hazards worth a damn.

Reshiram

150 base SpA. STAB Blue Flame, essentially a super Fire Blast, and Draco Meteor. Scary.

Regice

Still lacks recovery, but with SR gone and the ability to switch in and out without losing a turn, Regice just got a whole lot better. 80/100/200 defenses are nuts.

Weavile

Weavile can now exit battle freely and avoid Stealth Rock, making it far less easily counterable. Its movepool could still be better, though...

Rotom-F

100% accurate STAB BoltBlizzard+bulk=insanity

Articuno

The only reasons this birdie isn't everywhere, Calm Minding, soaking up hits, and Roosting off damage, are Stealth Rock and difficulty coming in. Both of these are nullified.

Jynx

115 SpA, STAB Blizzard, decent Speed, and a STAB sleep move. Yikes.

Walrein

Stallrein is an asshole, and with no Stealth Rock it's even more of an asshole. Furthermore, it has a Fire neutrality Hail teams will need. I could also see a Sleep Talker with Thick Fat to soak up Fire moves from things like Reshiram that enjoy Hail.

Glaceon

The game's strongest Blizzard, tied with Kyurem, Ice Body, and good bulk make this thing very very scary.

Kyurem

This thing does it all. 130/130/90 offenses and 125/90/90 defenses. Soaks up hits, breaks down walls with a mixed set, or makes a fantastic Scarfer with Blizzard and Dragon Pulse. Draco Meteor is less viable in Rotation play, though.

Arceus

Ice/Fire forms are perfect for either a Hail or Sun team. It's fast, absurdly powerful, and bulky as hell. Also, it can maintain its Calm Minds when leaving play!

Moltres

125 base SpA, decent Speed, and STAB Fire Blast/Air Slash.

In the sun, this thing is amazing.

Archeos

No SR means it comes in without being neutered by a min SpA Blissey's NFE Flamethrower.

Vultina

Huge defenses. Roost. Decent defensive typing. Dust-proof letting it fit on Hail teams. Tailwind to support slow sweepers like Glaceon. The 100% accurate, no longer easily canceled Fake Tears. This will be a top-notch supporter with a Tailwind/Fake Tears/Roost/Dark Pulse set. Fake Tears, Tailwind, switch to a Special sweeper.

I'm sure I missed some things, but basically I think Rotation Battles will be dominated by offensive weather teams, mostly Sun and Hail- Sun due to raw power, Hail due to the mix of power and the slowest weather lead.

[SMZ]

Triple Battles are worth a shot trying, and they seem to be more fun/predict war than traditional triple battles.

[Coram_Boy]

Originally Posted by Fat SupremeDirt

By the way, as abilities on the sides do not activate, Slow Start doesn't either. Therefore, Gigas can get his act together immediately. Guess he learned about alarm clocks.

I'm afraid to say that it doesn't work like that; Giga's ability activates upon first being rotated in, and for every turn he spends in, the counter goes down one. It sucks, but that's how it works.

[XienZo]

Originally Posted by Fat SupremeDirt

By the way, as abilities on the sides do not activate, Slow Start doesn't either. Therefore, Gigas can get his act together immediately. Guess he learned about alarm clocks.

Did you actually test this (on cart, not on any simulator)?

Given the way everything else works from the research thread, it seems that "abilities not activating on the sides" just refers to field effects (Flower Gift) not working from the sides (because sides =/= field) and switch-in effects (Intimidate) not working on the rotation (because rotation =/= switch). I don't think it means that the ability is neutralized altogether.

[Afti]

All right, then. Removed Gigas from the threat list.

[Karoda Gai]

looks and sounds fun I would like to try this new type of battle. After seeing how it works it becomes apparent that bulky sweepers and sub users have a definite niche in this type of battle

[droidincredible]

Rotation battles are much worse for my strategy, that being:
Step 1: get whichever starter looks coolest
Step 2: level that starter on random lv2 wilds until it's about lv8
Step 3: 1hk everything and only catch stuff to use as HM slaves, never to battle

[Flareon]

I've played a couple of rotation battles in game, and they're an interesting concept. Keeping your sweeper alive got easier, and prediction got much more risky

[Nezumi-chu]

Is it just me, or does it look like Trick/Switcheroo will be a really effective strategy?

I mean, when you look at how people are already talking about how effective stat up boosters will be, and consider the fact that a pokemon stays choice locked when it rotates out...

Not to mention that according to Serebii, Erufuun gets Switcheroo as an egg move, so you can't just use Taunt to counter it.

[Emperor]

Added

Confirmed The Slow Start counter remains constant for an inactive Pokemon. (Philip7086)

No regigigas comfirmed

[CTNC]

Originally Posted by Fat Nezumi-chu

Is it just me, or does it look like Trick/Switcheroo will be a really effective strategy?

I mean, when you look at how people are already talking about how effective stat up boosters will be, and consider the fact that a pokemon stays choice locked when it rotates out...

Not to mention that according to Serebii, Erufuun gets Switcheroo as an egg move, so you can't just use Taunt to counter it.

o_0 Wow... Im going to have a Trick/Switcheroo Pokemon and a Sticky Hold Pokemon on my team.

[DDRMaster]

Originally Posted by Fat Nezumi-chu

Is it just me, or does it look like Trick/Switcheroo will be a really effective strategy?

I mean, when you look at how people are already talking about how effective stat up boosters will be, and consider the fact that a pokemon stays choice locked when it rotates out...

Not to mention that according to Serebii, Erufuun gets Switcheroo as an egg move, so you can't just use Taunt to counter it.

The problem with Tricking a Choice Item in Gen 5 is that the mechanics for Trick have changed. If you're faster than your opponent and Trick a Choice Scarf onto them, they can still choose a different attack next turn. This means that you could have a +2 Scarfed Ononokusu ready to Outrage your team into oblivion.

I still think Choice Scarf will be a very useful item, since fast Pokemon will likely dominate due to being able to immediately come in and get an attack off before your opponent does.

[Afti]

So, a thought-

Abagoora has the highest Attack of all Shell Break users, priority, and Sturdy to help it set up.

I think that, with the ability to immediately respond to potential priority by bringing your nearly-dead turtle out of the battle for a counter, this thing will be everywhere.

With a slow Tyranitar/Hippowdon lead, SS is up (meaning Hail isn't) and Abagoora, without the counter of opposing priority, will be killing EVERYTHING.

Particularly if you can get an opening for ANOTHER Shell Break.

(Unrelated aside, how does Wish work in Rotation play?)

[Emperor]

Originally Posted by Fat Afti

(Unrelated aside, how does Wish work in Rotation play?)

I saw somebody do it in a vid. The wish can be used on anybody. Whoever is in at the time that the wish would enter is the one that is healed

[Afti]

Hoo boy.

I see an interesting combo, then...

Healing Wish on something, Shell Break Abagoora.

Shell Break, switch out to the Healing Wish user, bring Aba back in to take the Healing Wish. Shell Break AGAIN. Sturdy kicks in again.

You now have a +4/+4 STAB priority move. Assuming Adamant max attack...

You're hitting with 1384 Attack and 652 Speed.

With priority, so Lucario/Infernape/etc. are screwed.

Or, if they don't have priority? Stone Edge! With STAB! From a crazy Attack stat!

Think it's worth the sacrifice of one Pokemon?

[DDRMaster]

That could probably work, the only problem I see is that Hail will KO Abagoora after Sturdy kicks in. Hail probably won't be that common, though, and you can always set up Sandstorm. Bullet Seed Chiranchino would screw you up by breaking through Sturdy as well.

I originally thought setting up wouldn't work too well since your opponent can just rotate in a counter and immediately OHKO you but Sturdy could actually allow you to pull Shell Break off with Abagoora.

[glacialcat]

Originally Posted by Fat Afti

Hoo boy.

I see an interesting combo, then...

Healing Wish on something, Shell Break Abagoora.

Shell Break, switch out to the Healing Wish user, bring Aba back in to take the Healing Wish. Shell Break AGAIN. Sturdy kicks in again.

You now have a +4/+4 STAB priority move. Assuming Adamant max attack...

You're hitting with 1384 Attack and 652 Speed.

With priority, so Lucario/Infernape/etc. are screwed.

Or, if they don't have priority? Stone Edge! With STAB! From a crazy Attack stat!

Think it's worth the sacrifice of one Pokemon?

ExtremeSpeed has +2 Priority now, so Lucario/Dragonite/etc could still get you. Has potential vs. +1 priority guys though.

[Bombkirby]

Originally Posted by Fat SMZ

Triple Battles are worth a shot trying, and they seem to be more fun/predict war than traditional triple battles.

Triple battles are more fun than triple battles eh? XD

Its called a rotation battle. And both triple and rotation have a great degree of strategy.

[Afti]

Duh, forgot about +2 ExtremeSpeed.

I actually see Hail being very common, without SR and with free switches. You can't understate the value of letting things like Kyurem have 100% accurate Blizzards; thus, Aba really likes having Tyranitar or Hippowdon on the team.

Wish there was a Rotation simulator...

[Niched]

Regarding the shell break strategy, the way rotation works, the game will immediately switch in you're fourth pokemon to take the healing wish. Unless you don't have a fourth pokemon, in which case it will fail. It doesn't work the way you think it does. Sorry.

[Afti]

Boo.

That's quite a shame.

Speaking of that fourth Pokemon, that seems like an important role; it's your only "surprise" option available.

I could see a backup weather-starter, Eccentric Ditto, and another sweeper (after a bait set on something else eliminates its threats) all being useful there.