(Beginner) Returning to Our Roots NOC Mafia - GAME OVER: The Mafia Wins

[Metal Bagon]

Hey guys, why the vote on me? Quickly doing something I don't think takes an hour because that's how long it took me to decide on my vote. I'll withhold my vote for now but I may not for much longer.

Also, just wondering about something. Is the say period ending today or tomorow? Just wondering because I won't be able to be online at deadline tomorow.

[nEsp]

Originally Posted by Fat auramaster

About Empoof, I don't think either NJiggly or nEsp has a very convincing argument. NJiggly's doesn't make any sense, with him describing Empoof as a great player and a newb in the same sentence, and why does that make you think Empoof is clean? nEsp makes a little more sense, but just because Empoof has played well in a previous OC game, doesn't make him a good NOC player.

I agree with you saying that because he's played well in an OC game, he doesn't necessarily have to be good at NOC. However, I expected someone who have the brains to play mafia well to be able to realise that a no lynch day 1 is no good option (should it even be considered an option?), or at least look up other NOC games before posting a no lynch.

But the point of my post wasn't trying to prove Empoof mafia, it was trying to get NJiggly to explain how he finds Empoof to be clean when the logic he presents give us that Empoof most likely is mafia...

With all that said, I think Empoof is village, and just want NJiggly to explain his/her reasoning.

[nEsp]

Originally Posted by Fat Aura Guardian

No sensible mafia member would step up for the one-on-one, meaning our chances of mafia lynch go down to 0. Overall, that would be worse than a no lynch because then we'd lose a villager guaranteed and our mayor would be out in the open - thus meaning the mafia only has to rand OTHER villagers until they hit the BG. Overall, bad strategy, there.

Yes, a one-on-one would be just stupid. But, he could be cleaned by having two ppl who claim vanilla vote against him, and him vote against one of them. If he's mayor and none of the other are vote-modifiers, no-one dies, and we've got a cleaned villager. Or rather, as clean as we probably can get him without revealing the inspect to the mafia.

The only cases in which he would die are if he's not mayor, or if at least one of them who claim to be VT are in fact mafia with a negative vote. If he's not mayor, then we lynched a mafia. If he's mayor, then we hopefully are able to figure out which one of the two who is mafia.

I'm not saying that we should do this though, it's just a possibility.

[Spiffy]

The problem is that no one else is claiming mayor so that scenerio probably won't happen.
And it still really worries me how our claimed mayor has the most votes at this time. And Metal Bagon please explain to me what you meant by this?

Quickly doing something I don't think takes an hour because that's how long it took me to decide on my vote.

[zorbees]

I voted Aura_Guardian because I want to change the topic. This NWO business is nonsense. How about, instead of lynching someone normally, who the majority thinks is scum, we have NWO and this scummy individual do a vote-off? This seems to make the most sense to me.

Additionally, Aura_Guardian seems to be playing similarly to the last time he was mafia in a NOC game.

[New World Order]

Originally Posted by Fat zorbees

I voted Aura_Guardian because I want to change the topic. This NWO business is nonsense. How about, instead of lynching someone normally, who the majority thinks is scum, we have NWO and this scummy individual do a vote-off? This seems to make the most sense to me.

Additionally, Aura_Guardian seems to be playing similarly to the last time he was mafia in a NOC game.

It seems that Metal Bagon is acting pretty suspicious. I would be willing to do a vote off with him.

[Metal Bagon]

You voted Ditto out of blue, I was simply following what (at the time) I thought was a good lynch. So all I can is at best you are a HYPOCRITE, and at worst your mafia.

EDIT: Why is 900'ths post so negative. O well, waiting for 1000!

[TalkingLion]

NWO, you keep saying that you can prove your role as mayor. Would you mind showing us this proof? You are acting quite suspicious at the time so it would be in your best interest to prove to us that you are village.

[New World Order]

Originally Posted by Fat TalkingLion

NWO, you keep saying that you can prove your role as mayor. Would you mind showing us this proof? You are acting quite suspicious at the time so it would be in your best interest to prove to us that you are village.

Like I said, I would be willing to do a vote off with anyone. Name somebody who you guys think is scum and I'll do a vote off with them. Assuming no member of the mafia has a double vote, I am guaranteed to kill them. As well, even if they manage to tie me, when I die, my role PM as mayor will be revealed, which would confirm beyond a shadow of a doubt that the person who tied me is mafia.

Originally Posted by Fat Metal Bagon

You voted Ditto out of blue, I was simply following what (at the time) I thought was a good lynch. So all I can is at best you are a HYPOCRITE, and at worst your mafia.

Not really, currently you are being hypocritical as well, as I too am following through with what I believe at this moment is a good lynch.

Lynch Metal Bagon

[nEsp]

According to the rules, a tie in votes result in a no lynch. So your PM isn't revealed if the vote is a tie, and we don't know if it was tied because your claim is fake or because it was a mafia with a double vote.

[Aura Guardian]

Originally Posted by Fat zorbees

I voted Aura_Guardian because I want to change the topic. This NWO business is nonsense. How about, instead of lynching someone normally, who the majority thinks is scum, we have NWO and this scummy individual do a vote-off? This seems to make the most sense to me.

Additionally, Aura_Guardian seems to be playing similarly to the last time he was mafia in a NOC game.

One: My name DOES NOT have an underscore - except on IRC, because that doesn't seem to allow spaces.

Two: All I'm doing is applying reason, intuition, and gut feeling to the problem of finding the mafia, which is what everyone should be doing. I am 100% village, thank you very much.

Three: So what if I'm playing similarly to the last time I was in a NOC game?
a) How do you know this isn't just my style for all NOC?
b) Last time I played NOC, I swapped votes for the shallowest of reasons. This time, I actually am putting thought into my votes.
c) This strategy seeks to emulate/perfect the strategy billymills used in Peace NOCed, and the village almost won that one (well, came closer than I'd ever seen before)
d) We are on a time limit - one day remaining for D1. We need to be quick and decisive.

[zorbees]

Unvote
Vote TalkingLion
stop bashing on NWO

[TalkingLion]

What? I wasn't "bashing" on NWO, just saying that he was a bit suspicious. I'm pretty sure that not all of us here are 100% trusting NWO yet so I wanted to see how he wanted to prove it. I didn't try to lynch him at all, so I have no idea why you think I was "bashing" him.

[Engineer Pikachu]

Originally Posted by Fat New World Order

As well, Engineer Pikachu's strategy for a mayor off is prone to Stealth Lynches, if me and the fake mayor each vote on each other, then suddenly two mafia members vote on me last minute, then I die early game. (although this might reveal 2 mafia in the Stealth Lynchers)

The phrase in the parentheses is exactly why this strategy works. If the mayor is stealth lynched, then while we're not absolutely certain as to the identity of the "false" mayor (who is almost guaranteed to be mafia, though), we are sure of two new mafia that we may not have expected before. Sounds pretty good, right? Anyway, I'll stop with this as nobody else has claimed mayor.

That being said, Metal Bagon's swift bandwagon (edited out) and this post seem pretty suspicious, so I guess pressuring him is good? I'm not going to lynch him now since I'm not sure if I'll be able to edit it out in time if we need to do so.

[pokémaniac 212]

As far as I'm concerned NWO is clear, the lack of another mayor claim seems relatively strong proof in my book, at least until another mayor cc's him.

Metal bagon on the other hand strikes me as very suspicious, since he jumped very quickly on someone else's lynch, which to me smacks of at best buddying, at worst mafia attempting to start a bandwagon. However I'm going to think some more before voting, so for the time being this is simply a fos.

[Orcinus Duo]

Originally Posted by Fat Aura Guardian

One: My name DOES NOT have an underscore - except on IRC, because that doesn't seem to allow spaces.

Two: All I'm doing is applying reason, intuition, and gut feeling to the problem of finding the mafia, which is what everyone should be doing. I am 100% village, thank you very much.

Three: So what if I'm playing similarly to the last time I was in a NOC game?
a) How do you know this isn't just my style for all NOC?
b) Last time I played NOC, I swapped votes for the shallowest of reasons. This time, I actually am putting thought into my votes.
c) This strategy seeks to emulate/perfect the strategy billymills used in Peace NOCed, and the village almost won that one (well, came closer than I'd ever seen before)
d) We are on a time limit - one day remaining for D1. We need to be quick and decisive.

Damn that was very defensive. Aura guardian, why the panic under a single vote?
Unvote: Vote AG

[kingofkongs]

Alright, I'm finally back, will read through the read more closely later. As of right now, all that i've seen is that Orcinus Duo linked us to mafia terms like we didn't know what they were. Not only do I want to lynch him, I want to punch him in the face. So for now Vote: Orcinus Duo. Will be looking at people to determine scum levels in a sec

[Ditto]

ATTENTION THEANGRYSCIENTIST AND MAXIM!

Is there anything either of you would like to share with us? Both of you have yet to post outside "Good luck".

[Aura Guardian]

Originally Posted by Fat Empoof

whoa whoa whoa, I was just waiting for sound reasoning to decide a vote.

Clearly we can't have two aura's in the same game. This is an outrage. We'd constantly get confused about which one is whom and who did what when where why how!

Lynch Aura Guardian to make things easier for us.

Originally Posted by Fat zorbees

EDIT: unvote Spiffy from earlier

Lynch Aura_Guardian

Originally Posted by Fat Orcinus Duo

Damn that was very defensive. Aura guardian, why the panic under a single vote?
Unvote: Vote AG

1) That was two votes then (back up to 2 now)
2) In this stage, that is a lot, since votes are all over the place and ~half the game hasn't ever voted.
3) I felt best to nip that one in the bud.
4) When dealing with experienced players, like zorbees, I feel that in-depth is one of the only ways to go.
5) I prefer to give as much reasoning/reasons/explanation of my actions/etc. as possible since this is NOC and such information could possibly be important.

Originally Posted by Fat kingofkongs

Alright, I'm finally back, will read through the read more closely later. As of right now, all that i've seen is that Orcinus Duo linked us to mafia terms like we didn't know what they were. Not only do I want to lynch him, I want to punch him in the face. So for now Vote: Orcinus Duo. Will be looking at people to determine scum levels in a sec

Actually, that was because I (and maybe some others, don't know) were unfamiliar with the abbreviations and asked him to explain... he was just going a little overboard.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Side note: I'll probably change my vote to MB (esp. since his reasoning was one of the shakiest I've seen ... though it was early game) from NWO, just not yet... (or a better target if one appears)

[kingofkongs]

Actually, I'm sticking with OD, mainly because of the fact that he acts like he knows everything, and then

Scum doesn't usually sub out in my experience

[/paraphrasing]
For someone who acts so confident, it seems to me like he's just using that to lead the village to their doom like the fucking pied piper of hamlin. Am I overexaggerating? I just see this scenario play out again and again in my head.
OD: Lets lynch A because shit reason B
village: seems legit
Walrein: A was village power role
OD: Sorry about that, it's just that he was acting *SO SUSPICOUS* that i had too.
Village: It's k *brohug*

Am I Overexaggerating? Absolutely, yes. But anyoe who claims to be experienced (no you didn't say that, yes you implied that) but says stupid shit looks pretty shaky.

Then again, I could be reading too much into it and OD is actually really dumb.

Carry on.

[khz]

Originally Posted by Fat kingofkongs

Alright, I'm finally back, will read through the read more closely later. As of right now, all that i've seen is that Orcinus Duo linked us to mafia terms like we didn't know what they were. Not only do I want to lynch him, I want to punch him in the face. So for now Vote: Orcinus Duo. Will be looking at people to determine scum levels in a sec

If that's a serious vote and that's your logic, you're an idiot...

In the meantime, unvote until I can read through the thread.

EDIT: On second thoughts, I think Metal Bagon is more suspicious than NWO. I'm more inclined to think NWO's town because:

1) If he was mafia and faking mayor, he probably wouldn't be so willing to test his claim (though that excludes the possibility of mafia having negative votes, secret vote etc)
2) He claimed so early. Slightly counter intuitive, but:
-If he's town and inexperienced he just panicked and didn't want to get killed -> what I think happened
-If he's town and experienced he wouldn't have claimed so quickly
-If he's experienced and scum he wouldn't fake such a common town role
-If he's inexperienced and scum then he'll slip up later on -> also possible, but not likely to hurt us that much

[Spiffy]

Anyone who still has a vote for NWO is either crazy or mafia. He claimed mayor and there has been no counter claim! We can test him to see if he is telling the truth in a future day. (Or the mafia will have killed him by then...) I understand that he isn't automatically cleaned by claiming mayor, but the only person that has claimed a village power role has the most votes as of right now. Really?

kingofkongs would you care to point out what "stupid shit" OD has been saying?

I actually agree with OD about the extreme defensive nature of Aura_Guardian's post in response to zorbees, but I'm not going to rush this day and vote for him.

[khz]

Originally Posted by Fat kingofkongs

Actually, I'm sticking with OD, mainly because of the fact that he acts like he knows everything, and then
[/paraphrasing]
For someone who acts so confident, it seems to me like he's just using that to lead the village to their doom like the fucking pied piper of hamlin. Am I overexaggerating? I just see this scenario play out again and again in my head.
OD: Lets lynch A because shit reason B
village: seems legit
Walrein: A was village power role
OD: Sorry about that, it's just that he was acting *SO SUSPICOUS* that i had too.
Village: It's k *brohug*

Am I Overexaggerating? Absolutely, yes. But anyoe who claims to be experienced (no you didn't say that, yes you implied that) but says stupid shit looks pretty shaky.

Then again, I could be reading too much into it and OD is actually really dumb.

Carry on.

Wait, are you admitting you're logic is unreasonable? He admitted here that it was a weak read, but in lieu of other info early game it's not like we have anything extremely solid to go off. Seems like you're making a big deal over nothing...

EDIT: The quote from your post didn't work. In case he edits it out, it said "Scum doesn't usually sub out in my experience" (referencing what OD said)

[Ditto]

Originally Posted by Fat Ditto

ATTENTION THEANGRYSCIENTIST AND MAXIM!

Is there anything either of you would like to share with us? Both of you have yet to post outside "Good luck".

So they can see it.

Also, we have about 23 hours until deadline. Just letting everyone know.

[Orcinus Duo]

I lol'd at kok's posts. I would like to point out that we don't know A was village power role, and that's probably the whole point behind my argument against NWO? He claimed far too early, and at that point in time (shortly after the claim, so we couldn't know for sure that there wouldn't be counterclaims), his play looked like a scum gambit. After getting more information in the form of no counterclaims, I unvoted NWO. Which part of that reads scum to you?