Black & White Battle Subway Records (now with gen. 4 records!) - Page 69

RiggyRob · May 17th, 2012, 8:03:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Pikiwyn

@RiggyRob

~Switcheroo
~Leech Seed
~Charm
~Flash

Switcheroo could be replaced by Cotton Spore, they've each got their advantages, like with Lax Incense I don't need to worry about the opponent raising their speed or setting up Trick Room, while Cotton Spore lets me have Focus Sash but Dragon dance for example would make it so Butterfree can't set up. Without Switcheroo Whimsicott could have Memento, but I didn't really find a lot of situations where I wished I could use Memento.
EDIT: I somehow forgot about Switcheroo stealing the opponents Lum/Chesto berries and other items. Which makes it way better than Cotton Guard.
Charm works great with QuiverDance letting Butterfree easily set up on physical and Special attackers, I think Charm is the most important move after Switcheroo.
Flash is the only thing I can do to special attackers, except for maybe Light Screen, Flash helps against physical attackers too especially Rock types.
Leech Seed I used for things that could use Substitute and on some weather inducers so that Butterfree could still set up on them. If I had to replace a move it would be Leech Seed, but I can't find a move that would do better except maybe Toxic, if I try Dragonite on the team i would probably replace Leech Seed with Sunny Day so that Abomasnow doesn't destroy me.

Is that the moveset that you've been using?

Switcheroo stealing Quick Claw was the main draw for me :D

The set I was thinking of using was Switcheroo/Taunt/Charm/Sunny Day - since you can't use Memento to get Butterfree in safely, you need to be attacked, so Taunt's a necessity. It stops Substitute so they can't avoid Sleep Powder, stops Roar/Whirlwind so you don't immediately lose everything you've set up and stops Calm Mind/Cosmic Power/Amnesia boosts too.

I think Leech Seed would the least useful move since the idea is that you keep the Pokemon you use Switcheroo on alive so you can set up, plus Abomasnow is immune to it anyway, so I'd say you're better off with Sunny Day anyway.

Pikiwyn · May 17th, 2012, 9:27:43 AM

Even though I don't really have time I started playing the team again yesterday and what I've noticed is that Leech Seed isn't needed. With Sunny Day, Poliwrath which is one of the worst Substiuters can be beat with Whimsicott and Butterfree by Charming on the first turn and then using Sunny Day and switching and attacking at the right times. I wouldn't switch Flash for Taunt though, Taunt is great except that it only lasts 3 turns (2 if you count the switch), Butterfree really can't do much with 2 boosts.
I also noticed that even with Quiver Dance speed is still important for when you have Butterfree as your last Pokemon, so I was wondering if with no SpA investment and Bug Buzz's low PP can you still knock out things like Emboar, Chandelure and Drifblim?

Manveru123 · May 17th, 2012, 2:35:03 PM

3 turns should be enough. Taunt>switch>sleep powder, back to whimsi to charm if physical attackers, start setting up if not. I personally fell in love with Taunt on my leads, but that might be because stat boosters used to give me trouble.

RiggyRob · May 17th, 2012, 2:39:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Pikiwyn

Even though I don't really have time I started playing the team again yesterday and what I've noticed is that Leech Seed isn't needed. With Sunny Day, Poliwrath which is one of the worst Substiuters can be beat with Whimsicott and Butterfree by Charming on the first turn and then using Sunny Day and switching and attacking at the right times. I wouldn't switch Flash for Taunt though, Taunt is great except that it only lasts 3 turns (2 if you count the switch), Butterfree really can't do much with 2 boosts.
I also noticed that even with Quiver Dance speed is still important for when you have Butterfree as your last Pokemon, so I was wondering if with no SpA investment and Bug Buzz's low PP can you still knock out things like Emboar, Chandelure and Drifblim?

It's do-able, but you'll want to max out Bug Buzz's PP anyway for the legendaries that resist it AND have Pressure. If it turns out you can't beat them anyway, that's what the third member is for.

The only options other than Taunt that Whimsicott could use are Encore (since Light Screen isn't necessary with Quiver Dance - could be useful though) or Tailwind (for your third member), but overall I'd say Taunt is the best option; it's the option I'm going to use on my Whimsicott anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Manveru123

3 turns should be enough. Taunt>switch>sleep powder, back to whimsi to charm if physical attackers, start setting up if not. I personally fell in love with Taunt on my leads, but that might be because stat boosters used to give me trouble.

You don't want to switch Butterfree in unless it's definitely safe, it won't survive even moderately powerful hits because it's so frail. It'd be Taunt>Switcheroo>Charm until Whimsicott dies/Taunt runs out>Taunt/Set up in most cases.

Chinese Dood · May 17th, 2012, 3:01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat RiggyRob

The only options other than Taunt that Whimsicott could use are Encore (since Light Screen isn't necessary with Quiver Dance - could be useful though) or Tailwind (for your third member), but overall I'd say Taunt is the best option; it's the option I'm going to use on my Whimsicott anyway.

Encore is not legal with Switcheroo. I think Taunt or Lightscreen are probably the best options (well, they're sort of the only viable options left in Whimsicott's movepool hehe). If you're going to Tailwind, you might as well Cotton Spore I think, but Taunt is probably more useful.

ANNHILATERfrank · May 18th, 2012, 10:58:39 PM

Hey, I am new to this am not sure how to do a few things.

1) I recently obtained a streak of 113 on Doubles and have a post on page 68. How do I get on the front list on page 1?

2) I am not sure how to add a picture to my post like I see most other people are doing. Could someone briefly instruct me on how to do this?

**R Inanimate** · May 18th, 2012, 11:11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat ANNHILATERfrank

Hey, I am new to this am not sure how to do a few things.

1) I recently obtained a streak of 113 on Doubles and have a post on page 68. How do I get on the front list on page 1?

2) I am not sure how to add a picture to my post like I see most other people are doing. Could someone briefly instruct me on how to do this?

1. Just be patient, Peterko updates the first page with new records periodically every 2 or 3 weeks or so

2. you can just upload a picture to a image hosting site, and post a link to the picture, instead.

Superpowerdude · May 19th, 2012, 4:05:40 AM

Well as soon as i get my pokesav working again i will use my team of Cloyster, Scrafty and Latias again except with Latios over Latias and 31 attack eves on scrafty which is the only reason i lost my last streak. also thinking of trying a rain team later with DRizzletoed SpecsTornadus and ????? Cloyster maybe?

ashez · May 19th, 2012, 5:06:01 AM

Pokesav created teams aren't allowed.

Great streaks lads :)

Superpowerdude · May 19th, 2012, 5:23:52 AM

oh i didnt know that! thanks for that anyway i still look foreword to posting my Battle subway stories and trying to give out advice!

atsync · May 21st, 2012, 8:37:00 AM

I have started playing again after a short break (well, I say break but I was actually doing some RNG stuff). I'm using Zoroark/Suicune/Dragonite, but now Dragonite is Jolly with 84hp/252att/172speed. This allows it to outspeed Jolteon after 1 Dragon Dance and gives him extra bulk (plus hp isn't divisable by 4 so that means 4 substitutes from full health), in exchange for some power.

So far, the power drop has not been that noticable. There was one moment where 2+ Earthquake failed to OHKO Rhyperior (I still won easily) but other than that Outrage still KOs the world. I did face 1 Jolteon (backup, bot lead) and the extra speed was great, though it was annoying because it chose to Charm me first (so I was faster but I was at -1 attack lol). That meant another Dragon Dance so I ended up taking Thunder anyway but it didn't do that much. I killed it when I was at 2+ speed and 0 attack, but the follow up was a Dragonite which died to Outrage.

Still, I don't regret changing to Jolly. The benefits outweigh the downsides in my opinion.

Oh, and I faced Choice Band Archeops early on. Oh god I hate that thing. This would be one of the few things that Focus Sash Zoroark would be good for. Head Smash OHKOs Zoroark and the recoil is conveniently not enough to activate Defeatist. So in goes Suicune who takes over 50% from Head Smash (if it crits then I better hope that Dragonite can solo the rest of the team though I'm guaranteed 1 Dragon Dance at least). Of course, Suicune could set up on Defeatist Head Smash if it weren't for the fact that it kills itself before I can get any boosts!

This time I chose to Calm Mind after the first Head Smash. I think from now on I'm just going to Rest straight away. The problem is that full power Head Smash + Defeatist Head Smash left me with 7 hp. I'm pretty sure the first hit was a high damage role (it seemed to do more damage than when I faced it in the loss in my last streak), but the point is that one crit is enough to kill Suicune and Rest would allow me to survive relatively healthy. Then I just have to hope that Suicune or Dragonite can beat the rest of the opponents team. Not ideal, but it's the best I've got with this current team.

The only alternative would be to give Zoroark 116 HP EVs. This guarantees that Archeops activates Defeatist after the first Head Smash, giving Suicune more time to boost up a bit before Archeops kills itself. But I don't like the sound of taking that much power or speed (or both) away from Zoroark since it needs as much as it can get. I think I'll just leave it as is for now and just hope I don't face it too often. Who knows, maybe it'll miss the first Head Smash some time lol.

So yeah I'll see how far this goes. I do feel that the change to Jolly is an improvement so I would like to at least get close to 182 wins...

EDIT: Actually, I'm also starting to wonder whether I should get rid of Substitute on Dragonite, maybe for Fire Punch, Extremespeed or even Roost. It is a good move but I have very rarely used it because Multiscale + Lum Berry provide good hax protection anyway. It is still nice to be able to set up on status spammers though and I'm sure I'll come across a situation where Substitute saves me.

Biosci · May 22nd, 2012, 2:11:54 AM

Ok I'm back after a good 1000 battles in the super doubles train to try and top my previous record. After trying a multitude of teams from my previous team I made my record with, a mash up TR team with my some of my favorite Pokemon, and the latest team I've been tweaking and messing with. Here's the team(along with previous changes/changes I should've made that would've helped a lot):

...

I got to a streak of 124 with this team, and all I want to say is fuck Quick Claw :( Pretty much throughout the entire run there past 2 days Quick Claw nearly ended my streak by activating 3-4 times in a match it had a part in. This match that I lost Quick Claw activated twice on a Leafeon to make an end to Terrakion t1 and to hurt my Zapdos the next turn after t1 Zapdos missed Heat Wave on it. This meant it was Gengar and Ferrothorn to fend off the other 3 Pokemon, two at full health on at half. In the effort to kill the at half health Gengar got double targeted leaving Ferrothorn to fight off an Electivire and Tyranitar. It didn't end well when I scouted and found they both carried moves that Ferrothorn was weak to(Fire Punch and Superpower)

I had some pretty good battles along the way, some of which I should've lost if not for the AI being stupid. For example, I was facing a Hail team. Terrakion and Zapdos made easy work of their leads(I believe it was Abomasnow and some other Ice-type.) Next set to come it was Walrein and Glaceon. I go in to try and Rock Slide and Heat Wave to win the game, they hit and made the Walrein half health, but missing Glaceon each time. Glaceon then Blizzards which OHKOs Zapdos and leaves Terrakion roughly half health. I send in Gengar and proceed to Rock Slide and I believe Shadow Ball the Walrein. That takes care of Walrein and I managed to hit Glaceon, sadly only leaving it half health for some reason. Glaceon Blizzards once more and KOs Terra and Gengar due to hail recoil. I switch in Ferrothorn thinking I can still pull it off. Next turn I go in to Gyro Ball and it misses. To make matters even worse Glaceon managed to crit Blizzard leaving my Ferrothorn as about 50 HP out of 181. I'm just sitting there think "game over game over" thinking it would Blizzard once more and win........ Until I see some deciding words. "Glaceon used Ice Shard" My jaw drops, it does about 20 HP, takes Iron Barbs damage and I Gyro Ball to win.

Anyway, I'm gonna try out this team some more. Changing Tailwind out on Zapdos, and I'll see where that takes me. Sorry I'm not one to keep battle videos :/ Thanks for reading and I'll be back later with a better streak(hopefully) next time. Hoping to finally have a good run with my TR team that doesn't get haxed at ever instance I try and set up TR -__-

See ya later!

Stay Gold · May 23rd, 2012, 3:25:20 PM

@Biosci

After seeing your post, I'm tempted to try a Zapdos team as well. Just out of curiosity and for my own use, was there any specific reason for 140 Speed EVs, or would you reccomend a full 252 EVs for Speed if your were to do it again?

I can't get over how great Zapdos seems, especially since I'm always looking for a good Flying type/Levitater that can be used in tandem with a Rock Slide+EQ user such as Terrakion. I think on my team i'll use CB Terrakion to lead along with Zapdos, with Life Orb Latios and Scizorr in the back.

Biosci · May 23rd, 2012, 3:40:32 PM

I ran that Zapdos spread because I'm a lazy bum and just took the set from the VGC 2012 analysis on-site. Although I have started a new run with the same team, but I changed the moveset on Zapdos. Dropping HP Ice and Tailwind for HP Flying and Protect, seeing how I have HP Ice to handle Dragon-types(That was the only thing Zapdos was specifically hitting with HP Ice) on Gengar and Protect would've been so useful in some situations in my last run over Tailwind.

I guess you could run 252 Speed EVs, but I enjoyed having my Zapdos tank so neutral and super effective hits, for example Stone Edges never OHKOd and Rock Slides never 2HKOd. One thing I found interesting about using Zapdos was no matter what against a Fake Outer, Zapdos would be the target for the Fake Out.

Anyways, good luck with your team hope you do well!

mhybear · May 23rd, 2012, 10:55:12 PM

My Super Single Battle Subway streak ended at 119 wins!

Hachiko
Stoutland
@ Focus Sash
Ability: Intimidate
IVs: 31/31/31/1/31/31
EVs: 252HP/6Sp.Def/252Spe
Nature: Jolly
Moves:
- Thunder Wave
- Snarl
- Sand-attack
- Charm

This is the same set as Chinese Dood's Stoutland. Very bulky Crippler with a free -Atk from Intimidate.Intimidate also cancels out White Herbs which is good. Snarl is a very good move where you can have more than -2Sp.Atk (Memento) before he faints. My Strategy for Explosion users is to thunder wave then spam sand-attack and hope they miss (which happened around 3 times lol) or maybe I should have gone with Charm since there is no defense drop unlike 4th gen. Same problem with Clear Body Pokemon (Especially Regis) had to PP stall using my other 2 pokes just to get the show going which is really tedious, I'll try Worry Seed Whimsicott next. My strategy for Yawn users is after I hit them with Thunder Wave and they start using YawnI switch until they get FP'ed then Sub or Sand-attack. For Belly Drum users, I follow Chinese Dood's Strategy-use Thunder Wave then spam Sand-attack until dead.

Odahviing
Dragonite
@ Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale
IVs: 31/31/31/31/31/31
EVs: 206HP/252Atk/20Def/28Sp.Def/4Spe
Nature: Adamant
Moves:
- Dragon Claw
- Dragon Dance
- Substitute
- Roost

Jumpman's Dragonite set. Multiscale is incredibly Broken! Dragonite can survive non-STAB crit Blizzards without -Sp.Atk. I like going to Dragonite unless I'm not sure whether he would survive Ice attacks from the crippled mon. Only Ice attacks can KO Dragonite (Other than crit Outrage without -Atk). I also hate being Frozen had a battle with Lapras which Froze me for 4 or 5 turns, good thing it was Paralyzed and FP'ed.

Alucard
Drapion
@ Black Sludge
Ability: Battle Armor
IVs: 31/31/31/13/31/31
EVs: 252HP/58Def/196Sp.Def/4Spe
Nature: Careful
Moves:
- Acupressure
- Crunch
- Substitute
- Rest

Jumpman's 4th gen Drapion. Drapion can tank Special Attack like a boss even if I had got 1 Snarl from Stoutland. I usually go to Drapion when I know the enemy uses Ice attacks (especially Blizzard) to stall out. If I'm lucky and I got a Sp.Def boost from Acupressure, then I stick with setting-up with Drapion. Although Drapion can get up to +6 Atk it still isn't as strong as a +6 Dragonite so as much as possible I go with Dragonite on Crippled Steel types. When I'm cornered Drapion delivers good boosts most of the time (except for 3 Sp.Atk boost on the first 3 uses which nearly killed it) like evasion,Def and Sp.Def. I like how I don't need to worry crits while setting up thanks to Battle Armor and just press A until I get full boost (I always go 21 uses since I don't keep track of my boosts).

Notebale Battle:
(only one since I'm too lazy to go out and upload all other videos)

Veteran Leron:
Video no.: 96-00890-16107

Most of the other notable battles are when I survived being Frozen for 5+ turns and PP stalling Clear Body Pokes

How I Lost:
Psychic Boldbat
1) Stoutland tries using Thunder Wave, Jynx uses Fake Out (Breaks Sash)
2) Jynx uses Blizzard crit
(Pretty much lost by this time)
3) Use Drapion, Jynx uses Lovely Kiss, Drapion is asleep
some more moves then I use dragonite which dies from blizzard

Maybe I will try next a team consisting of Whimsicott/Dragonite/Volcarona. Do you think It would be effective?

Level 51 · May 24th, 2012, 8:50:36 AM

On another note, I've gone back to HeartGold for a while.

HeartGold Battle Castle Singles Streak: 79

Togekiss@rented item: Leftovers
Nature: Calm, Ability: Serene Grace
|Thunder Wave|Aura Sphere|Air Slash|Wish|
ivs: garbage except 31 Spe. No, really.

Typical tank + flinchhax. 'Nuff said.

Garchomp@rented item: Persim Berry (battles 8-about 28), Yache Berry (battles 29+)
Nature: Jolly, Ability: Sand Veil
|Earthquake|Outrage|Stone Edge|Crunch|
ivs: garbage except 31 Att/Spe. Like, 4 HP ivs.

Typical uber sweeper.

Gengar@rented item: Focus Sash
Nature: Timid, Ability: Levitate
|Thunderbolt|Shadow Ball|Energy Ball|Destiny Bond|
ivs: absolute trash. Its best IV was 30. In Attack.

Takes out one Pokemon with its 3 attacks, Destiny Bonds another one.

Death Details

If my write-up looks shoddy, it probably is because I'm really kinda tired.
I'll probably update and put up a picture here sometime soon for proof.

Chinese Dood · May 24th, 2012, 6:39:02 PM

EDIT: Woops haha, misread, sorry.
@mhybear: Whimsicott / Dragonite / Volcarona will probably work better than Stoutland/Dragonite/Drapion. Actually, I think Whimsicott / Dragonite / Suicune will work even better haha (but Volcarona is definitely more fun in my opinion). With Dragonite, you really do want an ice resist as your other sweeper if possible.

Props for using Stoutland! Yeah it's quite a bulky pokemon.

Unfortunately I haven't been playing much. I do kind of feel like using Volcarona as a set up sweeper again for some reason. Maybe I'll have time to try that again sometime. Last crippler I tried recently was Togekiss@Sash with Twave / Charm / Flash / Roost (i.e. the trick-Latias moveset without trick but with both Flash and recovery). Outside of crits and freezes, it was able to pp-stall out a lot of ice and rock moves with Roost, so that was cool.

I also tried this Landorus set as set up sweeping -> Jolly @ Leftovers - Swords Dance / Substitute / Smack Down / Earthquake
Always (at least always so far) 2HKOs anything after set up. Usually OHKO if weak to Smack Down or at least neutral to Earthquake. But yeah, sometimes not fast enough. Maybe I'll try a timid Nasty Plot Thundurus sometime... maybe. ... if I get a hold of a good Thundurus.

NoCheese · May 24th, 2012, 7:00:03 PM

Super Singles Streaks have been growing like mad here. Good show, all!

I haven't done anything particularly special of late, put together a couple of Cloyster streaks of around 100, but nothing worth writing up when the strategy has been so well discussed already.

However, in playing around with Cloyster, one thing I definitely realized is how much I despise Rock Blast, as it has a knack for missing at the worst possible times. Now that Naughty/Surf is preferred over Adamant/Razor Shell, I'm sorely tempted to take the next step in accuracy boosting and replace Rock Blast with HP Fire. No more miss chance on any of your moves, and you can fight Bug/Steels much more effectively. Cloyster looses game against bulky Waters, but usually a teammate like Suicune is much better positioned for that job anyway. And the Passho Berry Fire types which Rock Blast helps against are typically set up bait for Suicune too.

You do have to drop to 121 speed, which puts you behind a few pokes pre-Shell Smash, but it doesn't push you behind anything new post-Smash (Choice Scarf Manetric and Entei outrun you either way). And so long as there's no flinch chance involved, it's typically better to be hit before the Smash anyway, so you take the hit with full defenses.

It will certainly require playing the team differently with the shift in what Cloyster can handle, but I think there's potential. Or am I missing something big?

mhybear · May 24th, 2012, 8:06:08 PM

@Chinese Dood:
Yeah I think Suicune would be a better complement to Dragonite due to neutrality to Rock and better overall bulk, but I'm not yet capturing my Suicune in HG so that's going to wait.

I've been trying a team with Whimsicott/Dragonite/Stoutland since I can only use Focus Sash on one Pokemon I tried Sitrus Berry on Stoutland and it is great! I use a Whimsicott set with Taunt/Worry Seed/Charm/Memento but I think using Cotton Spore or Stun Spore would be better than Charm since it would be redundant with Stoutland, but I can't decide which one to use...
I hate Hail Blizzard teams if I can't get enough -Sp.Atk so I'm trying out two cripplers while keeping Stoutland (thanks for opening my eyes on how much of a boss Stoutland is ^_^)

Yeah I think Landorus is too slow to be a set-up sweeper since alot of other stuff is faster than it. Thundurus would be cool but I'm kind of worried that It wouldn't be bulky enough if I can't get enough Charms/Snarls on the enemy.

atsync · May 24th, 2012, 8:17:38 PM

@ NoCheese: Well HP Fire could be an ok option. Going through Peterko's guide Rock Blast doesn't get used for that much, but if you are using Cloyster + Suicune then you need to be careful around Lapras (and also Regice I guess) with Thunderbolt/Thunder (or use something that doesn't care about them). If you use Garchomp as well then you may have to try the "switching back and forth" trick (electric attack against Garchomp, ice attack against Suicune) which will usually work but the AI likes to be tricky and do something random sometimes (my Dragonite still gets Earthquake used against it quite frequently for some reason).

I'm currently at 91 wins with Zoroark/Suicune/Dragonite but I would be further if I'd had more time to play. I have been purposely conservative about how many streaks I do a day though to make sure I don't overdo it and start to play recklessly. Like, if I have a bad set of 7 where I make bad decisions, I'll just stop playing for the day because it seems like a bad omen to me. I'm starting to Memento in almost every battle though, which has me thinking that maybe I should use Focus Sash again lol. But then I can't kill anything. I can't have everything I want no matter what I pick though ugh. I'm sticking with Life Orb for now because I hate changing things partway through streaks.

Chinese Dood · May 24th, 2012, 9:48:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat atsync

my Dragonite still gets Earthquake used against it quite frequently for some reason.

Same here when I use Dragonite. I noticed that that was especially true right after the turn Dragonite uses Roost, but that isn't always the case (i.e. sometimes it EQs even when Dragonite has only ever used sub and DD in the battle). I'm not sure why that is too, but certainly not complaining I guess.

atsync · May 24th, 2012, 10:39:24 PM

:(

I just lost at 98 wins. The opponent lead with Ursaring which protects to activate its Toxic Orb. I Memento to Dragonite. I Dragon Dance while Facade doesn't do that much (it was probably not a Guts version). Outrage kills. In comes Milotic. Outrage gets a crit and kills (it probably would have killed it anyway). Last pokemon is Lapras who just survives Outrage and kills me with Ice Beam, and then Suicune wasn't able to survive long enough to stall out Thunderbolt's PP. I probably should have tried to Scald it just in case it didn't have Water Absorb though knowing my luck it probably did. Actually why didn't I do that? Duh. I guess I should have set up Suicune instead. Obviously I didn't know Lapras was a back-up but Suicune would have beaten it with Calm Minds under its belt, and Suicune is safer because it can beat more stuff. I just couldn't be bothered though hahaha. Too slow. Oh well.

It should be noted that I would have won if I was Adamant since Lapras would have died to Outrage. There were more times where the power drop was noticable, the most amusing of which was when +1 Outrage failed to kill Unfezant 1 (it killed me with Aerial Ace but Suicune finished it off). Still I like killing Jolteon more easily.

I think I'll stop using this team for now.

Level 51 · May 24th, 2012, 11:20:58 PM

@Chinese Dood: It's mhybear, not me. Just saying.

Chinese Dood · May 25th, 2012, 4:01:53 AM

Sorry about that, haha, fixed!

@atsync: Did your Suicune Calm Mind when facing Lapras? I would have thought that Suicune should beat Lapras one on one. Like, Lapras Tbolt doesn't its sub after 2 calm minds. Better to hope for no crit in two turns I think. Or, if crit happens first turn, then you can rest and hope it doesn't crit again for next 7 turns. I dunno. I use Lum Suicune and so far it seemed to be able to pp stall most non-STAB Tbolts aside from crits.

@mhybear: Between Stun Spore and Cotton Spore, I'd definitely pick Cotton Spore due to Stun Spore's inaccuracy. Also Stun Spore is basically same as Twave most of the time anyway. VS Volt Absorbers you should be worry seeding before memento, so Stoutland can twave those. It's mainly just ground types that Stun Spore will be useful for, but then you'll miss once every 4 tries. That's not that good.

atsync · May 25th, 2012, 7:45:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Chinese Dood

@atsync: Did your Suicune Calm Mind when facing Lapras? I would have thought that Suicune should beat Lapras one on one. Like, Lapras Tbolt doesn't its sub after 2 calm minds. Better to hope for no crit in two turns I think. Or, if crit happens first turn, then you can rest and hope it doesn't crit again for next 7 turns. I dunno. I use Lum Suicune and so far it seemed to be able to pp stall most non-STAB Tbolts aside from crits.

I confess that I didn't Calm Mind. I've never faced this Lapras with Suicune before so I had no idea how much damage it could do to me or how I should handle it. I subbed first turn and it was around that time that I realised that I was screwed (well I probably could have used Calm Mind after that but using sub first put me in an even worse position than before). I must say I wasn't really thinking as I was clicking that much. At that point in my streak I was kind of just clicking a move and just seeing how it went haha.

I should say that that was hardly my first misplay, but Suicune is so amazing that you have plenty of room for error most of the time which is why I managed 98. I just found it difficult to remember how to deal with specific things and I kept making the same mistakes against things I had already faced. Maybe I should do what Peterko does and get logs for every battle (or at least make a note of how I played against particular threats for later)? I can definitely see the use of going back and checking whether past approached were successful or not.

98 is fine though. At least I proved to myself that it wasn't a fluke last time!

Anyway, I'm currently constructing a Tailwind team for doubles (my doubles record is still crap), since I recently RNGed a Tornadus. This is what I have so far:

Tornadus @ Flying Gem
Acrobatics
Taunt
Tailwind
Substitute

Infernape @ Focus Sash
Fake Out
Close Combat
Flamethrower
U-turn

Hydreigon @ Life Orb
Dark Pulse
Dragon Pulse
Flamethrower
Protect

Gyarados @ Wacan Berry (or something else IDK)
Waterfall
Double-Edge
Ice Fang
Protect

Anyone willing to critique it? I put Gyarados on there even though I have used it before and found it kinda lame. Someone talk me out of using it please lol.

May 19th, 2012, 4:05:40 AM	#1708
Superpowerdude A Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 913 Australia Mentor	Well as soon as i get my pokesav working again i will use my team of Cloyster, Scrafty and Latias again except with Latios over Latias and 31 attack eves on scrafty which is the only reason i lost my last streak. also thinking of trying a rain team later with DRizzletoed SpecsTornadus and ????? Cloyster maybe? __________________ #ratemyteam \| Smog Work\| Rater Of the Week \| RMT \| Dogbirds Join #dogbirds on irc!!!

May 19th, 2012, 5:23:52 AM	#1710
Superpowerdude A Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 913 Australia Mentor	oh i didnt know that! thanks for that anyway i still look foreword to posting my Battle subway stories and trying to give out advice! __________________ #ratemyteam \| Smog Work\| Rater Of the Week \| RMT \| Dogbirds Join #dogbirds on irc!!!

May 21st, 2012, 8:37:00 AM	#1711
atsync Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 795 Australia	I have started playing again after a short break (well, I say break but I was actually doing some RNG stuff). I'm using Zoroark/Suicune/Dragonite, but now Dragonite is Jolly with 84hp/252att/172speed. This allows it to outspeed Jolteon after 1 Dragon Dance and gives him extra bulk (plus hp isn't divisable by 4 so that means 4 substitutes from full health), in exchange for some power. So far, the power drop has not been that noticable. There was one moment where 2+ Earthquake failed to OHKO Rhyperior (I still won easily) but other than that Outrage still KOs the world. I did face 1 Jolteon (backup, bot lead) and the extra speed was great, though it was annoying because it chose to Charm me first (so I was faster but I was at -1 attack lol). That meant another Dragon Dance so I ended up taking Thunder anyway but it didn't do that much. I killed it when I was at 2+ speed and 0 attack, but the follow up was a Dragonite which died to Outrage. Still, I don't regret changing to Jolly. The benefits outweigh the downsides in my opinion. Oh, and I faced Choice Band Archeops early on. Oh god I hate that thing. This would be one of the few things that Focus Sash Zoroark would be good for. Head Smash OHKOs Zoroark and the recoil is conveniently not enough to activate Defeatist. So in goes Suicune who takes over 50% from Head Smash (if it crits then I better hope that Dragonite can solo the rest of the team though I'm guaranteed 1 Dragon Dance at least). Of course, Suicune could set up on Defeatist Head Smash if it weren't for the fact that it kills itself before I can get any boosts! This time I chose to Calm Mind after the first Head Smash. I think from now on I'm just going to Rest straight away. The problem is that full power Head Smash + Defeatist Head Smash left me with 7 hp. I'm pretty sure the first hit was a high damage role (it seemed to do more damage than when I faced it in the loss in my last streak), but the point is that one crit is enough to kill Suicune and Rest would allow me to survive relatively healthy. Then I just have to hope that Suicune or Dragonite can beat the rest of the opponents team. Not ideal, but it's the best I've got with this current team. The only alternative would be to give Zoroark 116 HP EVs. This guarantees that Archeops activates Defeatist after the first Head Smash, giving Suicune more time to boost up a bit before Archeops kills itself. But I don't like the sound of taking that much power or speed (or both) away from Zoroark since it needs as much as it can get. I think I'll just leave it as is for now and just hope I don't face it too often. Who knows, maybe it'll miss the first Head Smash some time lol. So yeah I'll see how far this goes. I do feel that the change to Jolly is an improvement so I would like to at least get close to 182 wins... EDIT: Actually, I'm also starting to wonder whether I should get rid of Substitute on Dragonite, maybe for Fire Punch, Extremespeed or even Roost. It is a good move but I have very rarely used it because Multiscale + Lum Berry provide good hax protection anyway. It is still nice to be able to set up on status spammers though and I'm sure I'll come across a situation where Substitute saves me. __________________ Pokemon Dream World Guide RBY In-Game Tiers + Article Hidden Items in RBY Last edited by atsync; May 22nd, 2012 at 1:08:44 AM.

May 22nd, 2012, 2:11:54 AM	#1712
Biosci The Flyin' Wifin' Hawaiian Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 1,332 Hilo	Ok I'm back after a good 1000 battles in the super doubles train to try and top my previous record. After trying a multitude of teams from my previous team I made my record with, a mash up TR team with my some of my favorite Pokemon, and the latest team I've been tweaking and messing with. Here's the team(along with previous changes/changes I should've made that would've helped a lot): ... Terrakion @ Choice Scarf Trait: Justified EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd IVs: 31/31/31/24/31/31 Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Rock Slide - Close Combat - X-Scissor - Earthquake I always wanted to use Terrakion, and I was bored one afternoon making a team. So Wynaut! However it turned out to be one of the best Pokemon I've ever used in the subway. Only times it ever got out sped was if it were paralyzed or once against the subway's own Scarf Terrakion(This ended one of my streaks of like 65 wins) I was reading OU c&c the other day and I started reading the Protect Terrakion thread. It mentioned X-Scissor, but then I noticed what people were saying about it. They'd hardly ever used it when they had it. In every battle that I attempted to use something other than Rock Slide or Close Combat, I would either lose or Terrakion would just serve no purpose at all. On this team Terrakion was the hardest hitter and probably the frailest, but it was no doubt one of the MYPs of this team. Zapdos @ Sitrus Berry Trait: Pressure EVs: 140 HP / 252 SAtk / 116 Spd IVs: 30/10/30/31/31/31 Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk) - Heat Wave - Tailwind(I Should've changed this for Detect -__-) - Thunderbolt - Hidden Power [Ice] When I put Terrakion as the main lead of the team, I wanted a good tankish Special Attacker. Zapdos immediately came to mind when I scrolled over to the next PC box. I admit, I never used Zapdos before and I really hated it due to how common it is in VGC(Almost every team I gave out for spring regionals had this Zapdos set.) Turns out, it does some good work! Covering most of Terrakion's weaknesses, it found a good home as the secondary lead. Lots of games I would just Heat Wave spam with Zapdos and Rock Slide spam with Terrakion. Worked great for quick wins. The only thing I regret about using Zapdos is having Tailwind sit there and waste space. I literally had no use for it whatsoever and I know I'm getting rid of it next run with this team. Everything except for that was great. I'm considering running with my HP Flying Zapdos, but Ice was just great to have. Ferrothorn (M) @ Leftovers Trait: Iron Barbs EVs: 252 HP / 148 Def / 108 SDef IVs: 31/31/31/16/31/0 Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd) - Gyro Ball - Leech Seed - Power Whip - Protect Ferrothorn. omg omg omg I loved this thing. The problems I always had with some teams is that they were broken easily by Pokemon that stall(ie. Minimize Blissey and Dusknoir.) Ferrothorn was also the key defensive 'pivot' for this team. Great defenses, typing, and excellent stalling abilities meant it easily took out threats that Terrakion or Zapdos couldn't break alone. I could usually switch in Ferrothorn safely into a Water- or Ground-type move in place of Terrakion and allow it to wipe them out. He won soooo many battles as the last man standing(Though my last battle it was down to him, and it was Electivire and Tyranitar vs Ferrothorn. They quickly ended my streak with Fire Punch+Superpower ;-;) I'll be testing Ferrothorn out some more, it has lots of potential for success in the subway! Gengar (F) @ Focus Sash Trait: Levitate EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd IVs: 31/30/2/31/31/31 Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def) - Hidden Power [Ice] - Shadow Ball - Counter - Protect This spot was previously Alakazam(See spread below) Acting as the next back up sweeper in replacement for either Terrakion or Zapdos(Most cases it replaced Terrakion) It swept lots during late game, and my favorite part about this gal is Counter. Yes Counter. I was theorymoning for this subway team thinking of possible candidates to replace Alakazam. Well Gengar was slightly bulkier and pretty fast in itself. Along with this I always wanted to try out Counter in VGC, so again, Wynaut! So I went to go ask the best guy for getting Gen 3 exclusives mons, Hozu, to ask if he had it one. He actually had 2, one just 31/31/0/31/31/31 and the one I have listed here. I took this one because I just didn't want to regret not having HP Ice(It did do good against mono-dragon) Gengar just worked for the team waay better than Alakazam. Focus Sash was excellent for using Counter and living stuff that would normally kill it(just like everything killed Alakazam) Gengar was also nice for immunity to Toxic and Levitate ability. Very OP mon and Thank you again Hozu for trading for it. Past teammate: Alakazam (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Magic Guard EVs: 28 HP / 252 SAtk / 228 Spd IVs: 31/31/31/31/31/31 Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Psychic - Protect - Shadow Ball - Focus Blast He was probably the LVP when I played him sadly :( He died to everything, missed at the worst times, and was near impossible to get a safe switch-in. He was great in some games, even OHKOing Haxorus with Psychic, but he just didn't do enough for the team offensively to make me want to fix the team to make him work. So I opted for a better choice, went with Gengar and now here I am with this streak. I got to a streak of 124 with this team, and all I want to say is fuck Quick Claw :( Pretty much throughout the entire run there past 2 days Quick Claw nearly ended my streak by activating 3-4 times in a match it had a part in. This match that I lost Quick Claw activated twice on a Leafeon to make an end to Terrakion t1 and to hurt my Zapdos the next turn after t1 Zapdos missed Heat Wave on it. This meant it was Gengar and Ferrothorn to fend off the other 3 Pokemon, two at full health on at half. In the effort to kill the at half health Gengar got double targeted leaving Ferrothorn to fight off an Electivire and Tyranitar. It didn't end well when I scouted and found they both carried moves that Ferrothorn was weak to(Fire Punch and Superpower) I had some pretty good battles along the way, some of which I should've lost if not for the AI being stupid. For example, I was facing a Hail team. Terrakion and Zapdos made easy work of their leads(I believe it was Abomasnow and some other Ice-type.) Next set to come it was Walrein and Glaceon. I go in to try and Rock Slide and Heat Wave to win the game, they hit and made the Walrein half health, but missing Glaceon each time. Glaceon then Blizzards which OHKOs Zapdos and leaves Terrakion roughly half health. I send in Gengar and proceed to Rock Slide and I believe Shadow Ball the Walrein. That takes care of Walrein and I managed to hit Glaceon, sadly only leaving it half health for some reason. Glaceon Blizzards once more and KOs Terra and Gengar due to hail recoil. I switch in Ferrothorn thinking I can still pull it off. Next turn I go in to Gyro Ball and it misses. To make matters even worse Glaceon managed to crit Blizzard leaving my Ferrothorn as about 50 HP out of 181. I'm just sitting there think "game over game over" thinking it would Blizzard once more and win........ Until I see some deciding words. "Glaceon used Ice Shard" My jaw drops, it does about 20 HP, takes Iron Barbs damage and I Gyro Ball to win. Anyway, I'm gonna try out this team some more. Changing Tailwind out on Zapdos, and I'll see where that takes me. Sorry I'm not one to keep battle videos :/ Thanks for reading and I'll be back later with a better streak(hopefully) next time. Hoping to finally have a good run with my TR team that doesn't get haxed at ever instance I try and set up TR -__- See ya later! __________________ 1st Place Winter VGCS and 2nd Place Long Beach Winter Regionals! Last edited by Biosci; May 23rd, 2012 at 3:31:24 PM.

May 23rd, 2012, 3:40:32 PM	#1714
Biosci The Flyin' Wifin' Hawaiian Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 1,332 Hilo	I ran that Zapdos spread because I'm a lazy bum and just took the set from the VGC 2012 analysis on-site. Although I have started a new run with the same team, but I changed the moveset on Zapdos. Dropping HP Ice and Tailwind for HP Flying and Protect, seeing how I have HP Ice to handle Dragon-types(That was the only thing Zapdos was specifically hitting with HP Ice) on Gengar and Protect would've been so useful in some situations in my last run over Tailwind. I guess you could run 252 Speed EVs, but I enjoyed having my Zapdos tank so neutral and super effective hits, for example Stone Edges never OHKOd and Rock Slides never 2HKOd. One thing I found interesting about using Zapdos was no matter what against a Fake Outer, Zapdos would be the target for the Fake Out. Anyways, good luck with your team hope you do well! __________________ 1st Place Winter VGCS and 2nd Place Long Beach Winter Regionals!

May 17th, 2012, 9:27:43 AM	#1702
Pikiwyn Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 53	Even though I don't really have time I started playing the team again yesterday and what I've noticed is that Leech Seed isn't needed. With Sunny Day, Poliwrath which is one of the worst Substiuters can be beat with Whimsicott and Butterfree by Charming on the first turn and then using Sunny Day and switching and attacking at the right times. I wouldn't switch Flash for Taunt though, Taunt is great except that it only lasts 3 turns (2 if you count the switch), Butterfree really can't do much with 2 boosts. I also noticed that even with Quiver Dance speed is still important for when you have Butterfree as your last Pokemon, so I was wondering if with no SpA investment and Bug Buzz's low PP can you still knock out things like Emboar, Chandelure and Drifblim?

May 17th, 2012, 2:35:03 PM	#1703
Manveru123 Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 150	3 turns should be enough. Taunt>switch>sleep powder, back to whimsi to charm if physical attackers, start setting up if not. I personally fell in love with Taunt on my leads, but that might be because stat boosters used to give me trouble.

May 18th, 2012, 10:58:39 PM	#1706
ANNHILATERfrank Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 30	Hey, I am new to this am not sure how to do a few things. 1) I recently obtained a streak of 113 on Doubles and have a post on page 68. How do I get on the front list on page 1? 2) I am not sure how to add a picture to my post like I see most other people are doing. Could someone briefly instruct me on how to do this?

May 19th, 2012, 5:06:01 AM	#1709
ashez Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 178	Pokesav created teams aren't allowed. Great streaks lads :)

May 23rd, 2012, 3:25:20 PM	#1713
Stay Gold Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 16	@Biosci After seeing your post, I'm tempted to try a Zapdos team as well. Just out of curiosity and for my own use, was there any specific reason for 140 Speed EVs, or would you reccomend a full 252 EVs for Speed if your were to do it again? I can't get over how great Zapdos seems, especially since I'm always looking for a good Flying type/Levitater that can be used in tandem with a Rock Slide+EQ user such as Terrakion. I think on my team i'll use CB Terrakion to lead along with Zapdos, with Life Orb Latios and Scizorr in the back.

May 23rd, 2012, 10:55:12 PM	#1715
mhybear Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 122	My Super Single Battle Subway streak ended at 119 wins! Hachiko Stoutland @ Focus Sash Ability: Intimidate IVs: 31/31/31/1/31/31 EVs: 252HP/6Sp.Def/252Spe Nature: Jolly Moves: - Thunder Wave - Snarl - Sand-attack - Charm This is the same set as Chinese Dood's Stoutland. Very bulky Crippler with a free -Atk from Intimidate.Intimidate also cancels out White Herbs which is good. Snarl is a very good move where you can have more than -2Sp.Atk (Memento) before he faints. My Strategy for Explosion users is to thunder wave then spam sand-attack and hope they miss (which happened around 3 times lol) or maybe I should have gone with Charm since there is no defense drop unlike 4th gen. Same problem with Clear Body Pokemon (Especially Regis) had to PP stall using my other 2 pokes just to get the show going which is really tedious, I'll try Worry Seed Whimsicott next. My strategy for Yawn users is after I hit them with Thunder Wave and they start using YawnI switch until they get FP'ed then Sub or Sand-attack. For Belly Drum users, I follow Chinese Dood's Strategy-use Thunder Wave then spam Sand-attack until dead. Odahviing Dragonite @ Leftovers Ability: Multiscale IVs: 31/31/31/31/31/31 EVs: 206HP/252Atk/20Def/28Sp.Def/4Spe Nature: Adamant Moves: - Dragon Claw - Dragon Dance - Substitute - Roost Jumpman's Dragonite set. Multiscale is incredibly Broken! Dragonite can survive non-STAB crit Blizzards without -Sp.Atk. I like going to Dragonite unless I'm not sure whether he would survive Ice attacks from the crippled mon. Only Ice attacks can KO Dragonite (Other than crit Outrage without -Atk). I also hate being Frozen had a battle with Lapras which Froze me for 4 or 5 turns, good thing it was Paralyzed and FP'ed. Alucard Drapion @ Black Sludge Ability: Battle Armor IVs: 31/31/31/13/31/31 EVs: 252HP/58Def/196Sp.Def/4Spe Nature: Careful Moves: - Acupressure - Crunch - Substitute - Rest Jumpman's 4th gen Drapion. Drapion can tank Special Attack like a boss even if I had got 1 Snarl from Stoutland. I usually go to Drapion when I know the enemy uses Ice attacks (especially Blizzard) to stall out. If I'm lucky and I got a Sp.Def boost from Acupressure, then I stick with setting-up with Drapion. Although Drapion can get up to +6 Atk it still isn't as strong as a +6 Dragonite so as much as possible I go with Dragonite on Crippled Steel types. When I'm cornered Drapion delivers good boosts most of the time (except for 3 Sp.Atk boost on the first 3 uses which nearly killed it) like evasion,Def and Sp.Def. I like how I don't need to worry crits while setting up thanks to Battle Armor and just press A until I get full boost (I always go 21 uses since I don't keep track of my boosts). Notebale Battle: (only one since I'm too lazy to go out and upload all other videos) Veteran Leron: Video no.: 96-00890-16107 Most of the other notable battles are when I survived being Frozen for 5+ turns and PP stalling Clear Body Pokes How I Lost: Psychic Boldbat 1) Stoutland tries using Thunder Wave, Jynx uses Fake Out (Breaks Sash) 2) Jynx uses Blizzard crit (Pretty much lost by this time) 3) Use Drapion, Jynx uses Lovely Kiss, Drapion is asleep some more moves then I use dragonite which dies from blizzard Maybe I will try next a team consisting of Whimsicott/Dragonite/Volcarona. Do you think It would be effective? Last edited by mhybear; May 23rd, 2012 at 11:45:16 PM.

May 24th, 2012, 8:50:36 AM	#1716
Level 51 barely clinging on Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 755 Location: Singapore ^.^	On another note, I've gone back to HeartGold for a while. HeartGold Battle Castle Singles Streak: 79 Togekiss@rented item: Leftovers Nature: Calm, Ability: Serene Grace \|Thunder Wave\|Aura Sphere\|Air Slash\|Wish\| ivs: garbage except 31 Spe. No, really. Typical tank + flinchhax. 'Nuff said. Garchomp@rented item: Persim Berry (battles 8-about 28), Yache Berry (battles 29+) Nature: Jolly, Ability: Sand Veil \|Earthquake\|Outrage\|Stone Edge\|Crunch\| ivs: garbage except 31 Att/Spe. Like, 4 HP ivs. Typical uber sweeper. Gengar@rented item: Focus Sash Nature: Timid, Ability: Levitate \|Thunderbolt\|Shadow Ball\|Energy Ball\|Destiny Bond\| ivs: absolute trash. Its best IV was 30. In Attack. Takes out one Pokemon with its 3 attacks, Destiny Bonds another one. Death Details By the time I finally died, my stock of CP had hit 34. Hence, no healing. Hence, death. Battle 79: [opponent's] Leafeon sent out. [player's] Togekiss sent out. Leafeon Leaf Blade, Togekiss Air Slash. Leafeon faint. [opponent's] Snorlax sent out. Togekiss Thunder Wave, Snorlax Double Edge. Togekiss faint. [player's] Gengar sent out. Gengar Destiny Bond, Snorlax Zen Headbutt. Snorlax faint, Gengar faint. [opponent's] Umbreon sent out. [player's] Garchomp sent out. Garchomp Outrage, Umbreon Curse. Garchomp Outrage, Umbreon Curse. Garchomp calmed down, confused. Garchomp hurtself, Umbreon Moonlight. Garchomp Stone Edge, Umbreon Curse. Garchomp Stone Edge CRITICAL HIT, Umbreon payback. Garchomp faint. Player lost. If my write-up looks shoddy, it probably is because I'm really kinda tired. I'll probably update and put up a picture here sometime soon for proof. __________________ Back to school, gg contribution rate [15:59] <&@chaos\|away> i hence forth make it official: im better than arcticblast [15:59] <&@chaos\|away> spread the word

May 24th, 2012, 6:39:02 PM	#1717
Chinese Dood Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,053	EDIT: Woops haha, misread, sorry. @mhybear: Whimsicott / Dragonite / Volcarona will probably work better than Stoutland/Dragonite/Drapion. Actually, I think Whimsicott / Dragonite / Suicune will work even better haha (but Volcarona is definitely more fun in my opinion). With Dragonite, you really do want an ice resist as your other sweeper if possible. Props for using Stoutland! Yeah it's quite a bulky pokemon. Unfortunately I haven't been playing much. I do kind of feel like using Volcarona as a set up sweeper again for some reason. Maybe I'll have time to try that again sometime. Last crippler I tried recently was Togekiss@Sash with Twave / Charm / Flash / Roost (i.e. the trick-Latias moveset without trick but with both Flash and recovery). Outside of crits and freezes, it was able to pp-stall out a lot of ice and rock moves with Roost, so that was cool. I also tried this Landorus set as set up sweeping -> Jolly @ Leftovers - Swords Dance / Substitute / Smack Down / Earthquake Always (at least always so far) 2HKOs anything after set up. Usually OHKO if weak to Smack Down or at least neutral to Earthquake. But yeah, sometimes not fast enough. Maybe I'll try a timid Nasty Plot Thundurus sometime... maybe. ... if I get a hold of a good Thundurus. Last edited by Chinese Dood; May 25th, 2012 at 3:45:33 AM.

May 24th, 2012, 7:00:03 PM	#1718
NoCheese Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 81	Super Singles Streaks have been growing like mad here. Good show, all! I haven't done anything particularly special of late, put together a couple of Cloyster streaks of around 100, but nothing worth writing up when the strategy has been so well discussed already. However, in playing around with Cloyster, one thing I definitely realized is how much I despise Rock Blast, as it has a knack for missing at the worst possible times. Now that Naughty/Surf is preferred over Adamant/Razor Shell, I'm sorely tempted to take the next step in accuracy boosting and replace Rock Blast with HP Fire. No more miss chance on any of your moves, and you can fight Bug/Steels much more effectively. Cloyster looses game against bulky Waters, but usually a teammate like Suicune is much better positioned for that job anyway. And the Passho Berry Fire types which Rock Blast helps against are typically set up bait for Suicune too. You do have to drop to 121 speed, which puts you behind a few pokes pre-Shell Smash, but it doesn't push you behind anything new post-Smash (Choice Scarf Manetric and Entei outrun you either way). And so long as there's no flinch chance involved, it's typically better to be hit before the Smash anyway, so you take the hit with full defenses. It will certainly require playing the team differently with the shift in what Cloyster can handle, but I think there's potential. Or am I missing something big? __________________ Pokemon Black Friend Code 5200 1739 2994 Pokemon Black 2 Friend Code 4728 5907 8630 Jumpman16: Time remains the great equalizer in the Subway

May 24th, 2012, 8:06:08 PM	#1719
mhybear Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 122	@Chinese Dood: Yeah I think Suicune would be a better complement to Dragonite due to neutrality to Rock and better overall bulk, but I'm not yet capturing my Suicune in HG so that's going to wait. I've been trying a team with Whimsicott/Dragonite/Stoutland since I can only use Focus Sash on one Pokemon I tried Sitrus Berry on Stoutland and it is great! I use a Whimsicott set with Taunt/Worry Seed/Charm/Memento but I think using Cotton Spore or Stun Spore would be better than Charm since it would be redundant with Stoutland, but I can't decide which one to use... I hate Hail Blizzard teams if I can't get enough -Sp.Atk so I'm trying out two cripplers while keeping Stoutland (thanks for opening my eyes on how much of a boss Stoutland is ^_^) Yeah I think Landorus is too slow to be a set-up sweeper since alot of other stuff is faster than it. Thundurus would be cool but I'm kind of worried that It wouldn't be bulky enough if I can't get enough Charms/Snarls on the enemy.

May 24th, 2012, 8:17:38 PM	#1720
atsync Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 795 Australia	@ NoCheese: Well HP Fire could be an ok option. Going through Peterko's guide Rock Blast doesn't get used for that much, but if you are using Cloyster + Suicune then you need to be careful around Lapras (and also Regice I guess) with Thunderbolt/Thunder (or use something that doesn't care about them). If you use Garchomp as well then you may have to try the "switching back and forth" trick (electric attack against Garchomp, ice attack against Suicune) which will usually work but the AI likes to be tricky and do something random sometimes (my Dragonite still gets Earthquake used against it quite frequently for some reason). I'm currently at 91 wins with Zoroark/Suicune/Dragonite but I would be further if I'd had more time to play. I have been purposely conservative about how many streaks I do a day though to make sure I don't overdo it and start to play recklessly. Like, if I have a bad set of 7 where I make bad decisions, I'll just stop playing for the day because it seems like a bad omen to me. I'm starting to Memento in almost every battle though, which has me thinking that maybe I should use Focus Sash again lol. But then I can't kill anything. I can't have everything I want no matter what I pick though ugh. I'm sticking with Life Orb for now because I hate changing things partway through streaks. __________________ Pokemon Dream World Guide RBY In-Game Tiers + Article Hidden Items in RBY Last edited by atsync; May 24th, 2012 at 9:04:12 PM.

May 24th, 2012, 10:39:24 PM	#1722
atsync Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 795 Australia	:( I just lost at 98 wins. The opponent lead with Ursaring which protects to activate its Toxic Orb. I Memento to Dragonite. I Dragon Dance while Facade doesn't do that much (it was probably not a Guts version). Outrage kills. In comes Milotic. Outrage gets a crit and kills (it probably would have killed it anyway). Last pokemon is Lapras who just survives Outrage and kills me with Ice Beam, and then Suicune wasn't able to survive long enough to stall out Thunderbolt's PP. I probably should have tried to Scald it just in case it didn't have Water Absorb though knowing my luck it probably did. Actually why didn't I do that? Duh. I guess I should have set up Suicune instead. Obviously I didn't know Lapras was a back-up but Suicune would have beaten it with Calm Minds under its belt, and Suicune is safer because it can beat more stuff. I just couldn't be bothered though hahaha. Too slow. Oh well. It should be noted that I would have won if I was Adamant since Lapras would have died to Outrage. There were more times where the power drop was noticable, the most amusing of which was when +1 Outrage failed to kill Unfezant 1 (it killed me with Aerial Ace but Suicune finished it off). Still I like killing Jolteon more easily. I think I'll stop using this team for now. __________________ Pokemon Dream World Guide RBY In-Game Tiers + Article Hidden Items in RBY

May 24th, 2012, 11:20:58 PM	#1723
Level 51 barely clinging on Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 755 Location: Singapore ^.^	@Chinese Dood: It's mhybear, not me. Just saying. __________________ Back to school, gg contribution rate [15:59] <&@chaos\|away> i hence forth make it official: im better than arcticblast [15:59] <&@chaos\|away> spread the word

May 25th, 2012, 4:01:53 AM	#1724
Chinese Dood Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,053	Sorry about that, haha, fixed! @atsync: Did your Suicune Calm Mind when facing Lapras? I would have thought that Suicune should beat Lapras one on one. Like, Lapras Tbolt doesn't its sub after 2 calm minds. Better to hope for no crit in two turns I think. Or, if crit happens first turn, then you can rest and hope it doesn't crit again for next 7 turns. I dunno. I use Lum Suicune and so far it seemed to be able to pp stall most non-STAB Tbolts aside from crits. @mhybear: Between Stun Spore and Cotton Spore, I'd definitely pick Cotton Spore due to Stun Spore's inaccuracy. Also Stun Spore is basically same as Twave most of the time anyway. VS Volt Absorbers you should be worry seeding before memento, so Stoutland can twave those. It's mainly just ground types that Stun Spore will be useful for, but then you'll miss once every 4 tries. That's not that good. Last edited by Chinese Dood; May 25th, 2012 at 4:14:11 AM.