Favorite non-ubers you use in ubers.

[Poppy]

i said almost impossible for a reason

cb metagross is outclassed because as soon as it locks itself into something an easy resist can be switched out into, not to mention ho-oh is an almost perfect counter. if you want a mewtwo check that can absorb hits use jirachi.

[locoghoul]

Unoriginal as it is nowadays, I like Tentacruel. I used it on my sun teams though, so that I have another switch-in to Kyogre (I usually paired it with Dialga or specially defensive Gira).

I remember using LO Excadrill in the beginning of BW and it kicked ass.

IMO, Gen V is less appealing to "non-ubers", I remember testing/using stuff back in Gen IV like Shiftry, Scizor, Primeape, Mamoswine.

[Gates]

If you want to use an original Tentacruel build, try Mirror Coat Tentacruel.

Tentacruel @ Black Sludge
Ability: Rain Dish
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 Spe
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Toxic Spikes
- Rapid Spin
- Mirror Coat
- Ice Beam/Scald/Surf

This guy survives stuff that he shouldn't like Timid Full Health Specs Kyogre Water Spout in rain, Scarf Palkia Thunder, etc. and then usually OHKOs with Mirror Coat. Mewtwo and physical attackers are obviously a problem, but as far as beating rain teams goes I've seen only a handful of things that are more effective.

[mtr]

Originally Posted by Fat locoghoul

Unoriginal as it is nowadays, I like Tentacruel. I used it on my sun teams though, so that I have another switch-in to Kyogre (I usually paired it with Dialga or specially defensive Gira).

I remember using LO Excadrill in the beginning of BW and it kicked ass.

IMO, Gen V is less appealing to "non-ubers", I remember testing/using stuff back in Gen IV like Shiftry, Scizor, Primeape, Mamoswine.

Yeah, I remember a lot of teams used to exploit stuff like Shiftry, Scizor, Heatran, Qwilfish, etc, but things aren't the same anymore. With Arceus formes and the sheer power of the newer Ubers, those are often more attractive picks for a team than niche OUs.

[jackm]

Jirachi, hands down. In rain, it gets in Mewtwo's way and paralyzes it with Thunder Wave. I typically use the following set:

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SDef/ 8 Spe
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Iron Head
- Protect
- Thunder Wave
- Wish

In addition to helping against Mewtwo, it can check Darkrai (Sleep Clause in effect) and switch into Kyurem-W and a variety of other hard hitters.

[Hiddenfreezer]

Blissey

252 HP|| 252 Special Defense|| 4 Special Attack/Defense
@Leftovers
~Psych Up
~Wish/Softboiled
~Heal Bell
~Icy Wind/Ice Beam/Seismic Toss

Special Set in a "Stall" Team (not really stall, because me haz pursuit pokemon)

It wins against all latias/latios variants which want to set-up, due to copying stats, icy wind with pursuit support to rape them, ice beam without

Alternative I tried is Seismic Toss to fight CM Kyogre, however, i find it somewhat underwhelming, but it would be reliable

Softboiled vs. Wish is an old story, prefer latter for stalling teams.

[mtr]

And ScarfChomp kinda blows now. He used to be good in Gen IV when Palkia and Rayquaza were everywhere. His Dragon STAB and Base 102 speed let him be fairly strong in a speed-oriented meta. But now, you see less Palkia and Rayquaza, and way more Arceus. Hell, less Dragons in general. Right now, ScarfChomp just doesn't have the power or the coverage to be a good Scarfer.

[Splendiferous]

I doubt there is a fall in dragon usage as latias/os and the new kyurems are all strong picks. Garchomp is still a decent choice as it is still faster than the new dragons and as well as being able to chase off steels like steelceus and jirachi as they should be getting quite popular.

[shrang]

Originally Posted by Fat mtr

And ScarfChomp kinda blows now. He used to be good in Gen IV when Palkia and Rayquaza were everywhere. His Dragon STAB and Base 102 speed let him be fairly strong in a speed-oriented meta. But now, you see less Palkia and Rayquaza, and way more Arceus. Hell, less Dragons in general. Right now, ScarfChomp just doesn't have the power or the coverage to be a good Scarfer.

I think it's mainly because Terrakion is overall a better utility Scarfer and can revenge pretty much all the threats that ScarfChomp can and more that makes ScarfChomp kind of crappy now. Terrakion can revenge Rayquaza and Salamence just as easily while not being complete Ferrothorn bait, as well as being able to revenge ExtremeKiller, SD Ray (which Garchomp had trouble with last gen), kind of took that fast Scarfer niche away from Garchomp.

[Electrolyte]

TentaMory is the new SkarmBliss:


Tentacruel @ Black Sludge
252 HP / 32 Def / 224 SpD
Calm
~Toxic Spikes
~Toxic
~Rapid Spin
~Protect


Skarmory @ Leftovers
252 HP / 224 Def / 32 Spe
Impish
~Stealth Rock
~Spikes
~Roost
~Whirlwind

Sure, completely shut down by Taunt, but not many people use Taunt these days. This is the ultimate non-weather hazard core, setting all 3 hazards, phazing, spinning, and Roost/Protect stalling. This is also an extremely effective defensive core.

[barry4ever]

Originally Posted by Fat Electrolyte

TentaMory is the new SkarmBliss:


Tentacruel @ Black Sludge
252 HP / 32 Def / 224 SpD
Calm
~Toxic Spikes
~Toxic
~Rapid Spin
~Protect


Skarmory @ Leftovers
252 HP / 224 Def / 32 Spe
Impish
~Stealth Rock
~Spikes
~Roost
~Whirlwind

Sure, completely shut down by Taunt, but not many people use Taunt these days. This is the ultimate non-weather hazard core, setting all 3 hazards, phazing, spinning, and Roost/Protect stalling. This is also an extremely effective defensive core.

j/s before you get all hyped and stuff about this core, anything remotely powerful carrying an electric move can wreck this core with consumate ease. Zekrom, Thunder Latias, Palkia etc etc. Also running both Stealth Rock and Spikes on Skarm is a total waste of a moveslot. You should ideally run Toxic or Taunt and run SR on some other supporter unless you really cant help it.

[CrackinSkulls]

Originally Posted by Fat Electrolyte

TentaMory is the new SkarmBliss:


Tentacruel @ Black Sludge
252 HP / 32 Def / 224 SpD
Calm
~Toxic Spikes
~Toxic
~Rapid Spin
~Protect


Skarmory @ Leftovers
252 HP / 224 Def / 32 Spe
Impish
~Stealth Rock
~Spikes
~Roost
~Whirlwind

Sure, completely shut down by Taunt, but not many people use Taunt these days. This is the ultimate non-weather hazard core, setting all 3 hazards, phazing, spinning, and Roost/Protect stalling. This is also an extremely effective defensive core.

I do not see how this is a good core at all. Other than having max hazards and spinning it has absolutely nothing else going for it. So many things simply smash through it, in fact im pretty sure if you look at the top 15 usage list 90% of them will break this. If you are using this core i strongly suggest a small but very effective change to it and that is to simply replace Skarmory with Ferrothorn. Ferrothorn is much better suited to the Ubers environment with his mixed bulk and has very useful grass typing. Although this core is not new in the least i promise you, you will have far more success with it. Give it a shot and i highly recommend scrapping this core on any team that you are currently using.

[Electrolyte]

Yeah, it's not perfect. Still, I've had a ton of success with it- pair it with something like Grassceus or Giratina and you're good to go. Latias is a problem, but it can be handled with some other pokemon. I originally had Ferrothorn, however it couldn't spin / phaze so I didn't like it. Thanks for the advice though!

[CrackinSkulls]

Honestly simply pairing up Tentacruel and Ferrothorn with a Gira-O would be more effective as you have a bread and butter stall which will make for an infuriating inability to spin and leave your opponent watching in helpless despair as there team is slowly ripped apart by the residual damage. In fact a bit of personal advice, you may want to try out run of the mill stall because with the speedier meta it has become far more effective albeit tough to pull off. I have been using stall to great success because of how unprepared teams are for it. Anyway enough of my ranting.

On to the topic itself I have really enjoyed using...



Choice Scarf Mamoswine
He is actually really great at what he does. Choice Scarf lets him revenge kill a plethora of Top Tier threats like Groudon, Mewtwo, Dialga and a stack of Arceus formes. While it seems a little counterproductive to run Priority on a Choice Scarf user Ice Shard also sets him apart from the other scarfers as it lets him pick of faster scarfers like Zekrom or Garchomp. It also lets him revenge Ray without e-speed. If your in need of a revenge killer give him a shot he wont disappoint.

[mtr]

Just posting to say that the Showdown staff have implemented Snatch, so our lovely


Blissey @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 6 HP / 252 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
- Snatch
- Toxic
- Seismic Toss
- Softboiled


and


Chansey @ Eviolite
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 6 HP / 252 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
- Snatch
- Toxic
- Seismic Toss
- Softboiled


are viable again! So you can use either depending on what your team needs. Blissey is better at taking weaker attacks and residual damage, but Chansey is better at taking strong attacks. Therefore, IMO Snatch Blissey is better because you will be dealing with initially weak attacks (that won't be weak once they get to +6 tho!). But you can make an argument for Snatch Chansey I guess, since it can also take strong hits from Kyogre/Latias/Reshiram/Kyurem-W.

[ZetoTarken]

Originally Posted by Fat CrackinSkulls

On to the topic itself I have really enjoyed using...



Choice Scarf Mamoswine
He is actually really great at what he does. Choice Scarf lets him revenge kill a plethora of Top Tier threats like Groudon, Mewtwo, Dialga and a stack of Arceus formes. While it seems a little counterproductive to run Priority on a Choice Scarf user Ice Shard also sets him apart from the other scarfers as it lets him pick of faster scarfers like Zekrom or Garchomp. It also lets him revenge Ray without e-speed. If your in need of a revenge killer give him a shot he wont disappoint.

The only stuff in your 'plethora' that CS Mamoswine Revenges that LO Mamoswine can't are Arceus formes weak to Ice or Ground(you don't do nearly enough damage to stop ones that aren't), and weakened Mewtwo. You outspeed Dialga and Groudons without a scarf except you don't do crap damage to them because you have a LO.

[CrackinSkulls]

Argh your missing the point first off he does in fact have coverage moves O.o second the point of CS Mamo is that he maintains his same ubers niche (albeit a little weaker without LO) and he also has some additional perks like the extra revenge kills and Ice Shard. Anyway im not saying that he is perfect he has just worked for me.

[ZetoTarken]

What Coverage? Stone Edge is redundant with Ice forcing you to use Superpower. Arceus can Recover through Superpower or just KO you with Extreme Speed if it's weak to it. Meaning your coverage is only hitting for Kyurem-W/B while it leaves you leaving you setup bait for practically every setup poke. Ice Shard is pathetically weak without LO and you don't need a scarf to use it effectively.

[Hack He Must]

Forretress, Ferrothorn and Latias are surely the non-uber mons I use the most.

Forretress is the best spinner in Ubers that has access to T-spikes, which is always a good thing to have on sun-stall or any semi-stall/balanced team in general. Ferrothorn is way harder to beat and has the Leech Seed+Protect combo which screws up a lot of switch-ins because in the rain, Ferrothorn is darn hard to OHKO, since it actually has a lot of special and physical bulk compared to Forretress.

However, my favorite out of the three is Latias. She is the glue that fits on so many teams! Sun, sand, rain- all of them need a solid answer to the number the #1 Uber, Kyogre. Since I don't like playing full stall with stuff like specially defensive Giratina+Tyranitar to beat it, Latias almost always finds a place on my teams simply because it doesn't even need to run much bulk to be one of the best defensive pivots in the game!

That is because of Soul Dew, which makes Latias is an astonishing check to pretty much all variants of Kyogre. It needs Psystrike or Thunder to beat CM variants, in a CM war though.

[Anikrahman1995]

Soul Dew Latias is Uber. This thread is about non-ubers.

[Hack He Must]

It's still technically not uber. You have a point though, personally I just wanted to mention its newfound viability to others because the usage stats are simply unfair to it.

[Furai]

Please provide actual reasoning or I'll start infracting. Me and the other Ubers mods have told you to do so many times in the past. If this begins again, be sure to receive a PM from me, with the title "You have received a warning at Smogon Community".

[Pokémon Trainer R]

My favorite non-Über Pokémon to use in Übers is Espeon, simply due to its amazing utility. It can reflect entry hazards, provide the team with an immunity to all forms of status, counter Smeargle's Shell Smash + Baton Pass strategy by using Yawn, completely counter numerous walls such as Lugia and Chansey, force people to switch their Pokémon around and rack up entry hazard damage with Yawn, revenge-kill weakened Pokémon due to its high Speed and Special Attack, and if it still happens to have its Focus Sash intact lategame, it could be a life saver in some desperate situations.

[Darkerones]

Ive used the following Scrafty set in Ubers to surprisingly great effect:

Scrafty@Leftovers
252 HP 252 SDef 4 Atk
Careful
Shed Skin

Bulk Up
Rest
Crunch
Drain Punch

His typing and dual STABs are absolutley godly in ubers,he has decent special bulk by Uber standards and after a couple Bulk Ups its Drain Punches become unbearingly annoying to the likes of Dialga and Steelceus and Crunch murders the Psychic types in the tier. Statusing isnt effective against it due to the combination of Rest and Shed Skin,meaning Giratina cant shut it down as easily as it does other physical attackers in Ubers,and takes a chunk from Crunch as it tries to Dragon Tail it away.
Scrafty may not get as much chances to set up as it would like,but with proper team support it can become a real threat.

[Electrolyte]

Espeon seems like a good pokemon; as it's worst nemesis, Scizor/TTar, are not as common as they are in OU. Since hazards are becoming a pretty big part of Ubers (especially SR, now that Ho-Oh has Regenerator) having a reflector is really useful. However, Espeon's severe frailty in Uber standards mean that it can be easily disposed of by EKiller Arceus; unless you have a sash, and ywan, but then that leaves you with either a fainted Espeon and a sleeping Arceus for your opponent, or an Espeon with 1 HP and your opponent with a revenge killer switch in. Shaky.

As for Scrafty, I don't even see the point of Rest; you have shed skin so fuck status and Drain Punch to heal off of the pretty massive HP stats of most Uber pokemon (looking at you, arceus, Blissey, and Chansey) You could have Ice Punch to deal with Groudon, but still you're barely denting it until you get to the likes of +3.