np: BW OU Suspect Testing Round 6 - Enter Sandman - Page 3

FateFellShort · Sep 13th, 2012, 8:44:33 PM

Garchomp is going to be everywhere again lol (presuming it returns to OU).
Hopefully it won't overcentralise the metagame like it did before, but this could be fun indeed.

bwburke94 · Sep 13th, 2012, 8:53:56 PM

I'm actually going to have to ladder for the first time in a long time.

Tabuu · Sep 13th, 2012, 9:23:12 PM

YES! CHOMP IS COMIN BACK :D
Although I really could care less haha.
Sand Veil is honestly not that broken anyhow.
I can't wait to try him out

Jukain · Sep 13th, 2012, 9:32:14 PM

Word is that evasion items are unbanned from the suspect ladder... Leftovers is better on Chomp but I swear my good luck might just run out with this.

Ruyjiin · Sep 13th, 2012, 9:53:15 PM

Sub SD Chomp with a Metagross. All you need, regardless of weather.

***Aldaron**** · Sep 13th, 2012, 10:30:42 PM

SUSPECT LADDER IS FINALLY UP, GO PLAY!

cornYBird · Sep 13th, 2012, 11:59:39 PM

Not to whine prematurely, but this sh*t happened my first game on the reset ladder... (skip to turn 30 if you just wanna see the hax). This is going to be a long 2 weeks...

...

Anikrahman1995 · Sep 14th, 2012, 12:17:53 AM

It isnt all that bad, I could show you one of my logs where Garchomp didnt even do much in the match.

Here:

...

Scarfwynaut · Sep 14th, 2012, 1:05:13 AM

... people on the suspect ladder are good, Ive lost like the past 8 battles in the row, there go my hopes of voting

Garchomp isn't as amazing as made out to be though, even with sand veil, in fact I keep on losing to Doexs-D offense and sun teams for the most part and I was somewhat prepared for them to, I doubt though there will ever be a motivation to ban them until they dominate the ladder

but what do I know, I can't win a fucking game

yee · Sep 14th, 2012, 1:38:41 AM

Already been haxed by a sub sd Chomp, missed 2 Dracos on it, who hasn't been there? It's a really interesting bulky thing to have to worry about it when it's not haxing you though so I'm still very warm to the idea of just banning Sand Veil.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Scarfwynaut

Garchomp isn't as amazing as made out to be though, even with sand veil, in fact I keep on losing to Doexs-D offense and sun teams for the most part and I was somewhat prepared for them to, I doubt though there will ever be a motivation to ban them until they dominate the ladder

I actually think theres no valid argument to keep Deo-D or Drought at this point :P

XKnightX · Sep 14th, 2012, 1:57:25 AM

I've lost my first 3 three battles already. Two of which came down to Garchomp being their last Pokemon and me missing Ice Beam/Outrage against them.

deluge · Sep 14th, 2012, 3:14:31 AM

Great decision!
Should be fun and vigoroth supect test. :)

Anyway, I think the initial focus should be on whether Garchomp is overpowered not whether there's some rule that can make it easier to manage.
I'm afraid some might be going into the test with that mindset (given the discussions that came before). However, that is not consistent with how other Pokemon are tested.
That is we didn't say "but for Serene Grace, Shaymin-S is not broken/more manageable" or "but for Sand Rush Excadrill isn't broken/hard to manage" and start suggesting surgical remedies before the test was even done.
If that discussion occurs at all it should occur after it's established that a given Pokemon gives TOO MUCH of an advantage in battles between otherwise similarly matched opponents.
Anything else is putting the cart before the horse.

Anyway, this should be a great test.
Good Luck to everyone!

malomyotismon · Sep 14th, 2012, 9:51:26 AM

sub SD chomp + magenezone = epic combination

UltiMario · Sep 14th, 2012, 11:10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat yee

Already been haxed by a sub sd Chomp, missed 2 Dracos on it

You could've missed both those Dracos anyways. You don't know if you rolled inside of the normal miss zone or in the Sand Veil only miss zone.

"omg misshax bs ban snad veil" is a wonderful argument when using non 100% accurate moves, isn't it?

**PK Gaming** · Sep 14th, 2012, 12:28:55 PM

Garchomp is good :o

SubSD Garchomp + Hippowdown + Spinblocker (Jellicent) annihilates teams.

Chillarmy · Sep 14th, 2012, 12:38:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat PK Gaming

I'm still going to use Rough Skin Garchomp, I have my honour.

This, and deterring U-turn spam before I get SR up is also pretty cool.

free my nikka Chomp

edit: CB Chomp is amazing, btw

toshimelonhead · Sep 14th, 2012, 8:18:12 PM

I only needed one battle to determine the annoyance of sand veil hax is not worth bothering with in OU.

log for proof

undisputed · Sep 14th, 2012, 8:29:25 PM

yeah, man... i've had 2 battles so far where missing vs. garchomp's continual subs has put me at a severe disadvantage

Scarfwynaut · Sep 14th, 2012, 8:37:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat yee

I actually think theres no valid argument to keep Deo-D or Drought at this point :P

I think a drought ban might be to harsh honestly, the main issue I am having is mother fucking Venusaur, giga drain put it over the top in my opinion, but that's just me.

HabibsHotDogs · Sep 14th, 2012, 9:35:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat toshimelonhead

I only needed one battle to determine the annoyance of sand veil hax is not worth bothering with in OU.

log for proof

Lol I just versed you, I was the guy with the bulky chandelure, then PS! bugged up and I couldn't do anything.. dced..

I guess your mamo would have won anyway though

Keikari · Sep 14th, 2012, 9:45:46 PM

I don't understand why people want Garchomp back in OU. Am I missing something here? Is there some sort of niche that Garchomp must fill in order to balance out the metagame? If there's a Pokemon which is so broken it needs the likes of Garchomp to be reintroduced into OU to quell it (which there isn't), why not ban that Pokemon itself? But, as I just said, such a Pokemon doesn't exist.

I think people want Garchomp back in OU because, well it's Garchomp. Why being Garchomp is so attractive to battlers will be explained below. It's probably going to banned again, even without Sand Veil. Yeah, sure, there's Ice Beam from Scarfed Genesect and Ice Shard from Mamoswine, but just look at Garchomp's stats, typing and moveset. Dragon / Ground. Excellent offensive typing. Of course, that's not THE reason why Garchomp's banned as evidenced by Flygon. Not only does it have that typing, but access to SD, EQ and Outrage. Garchomp just needs a Fire move and nothing resists it's attacks. Same with D-Nite, but he gets no STAB on EQ. Stat wise, also just...wow! With a 102 base speed stat, he outspeeds a lot of the OU metagame. Also, his 130 base attack stat with STAB EQ and Outrage is madness. Garchomp also isn't just a dog who can only bite, his 108 / 95 / 85 give Garchomp some natural bulk close to Dragonite! Of course, Dragonite's Mutiscale gives it more bulk than Garchomp, but it's more bulk than the average Dragon.

But who knows? Maybe Garchomp might end up fitting in with the OU crowd, but then there's the whole Sand Veil thing. Banning Sand Veil just to let a Pokemon back in OU who's the only one who can abuse it I think is dumb. It's not like Swift Swim where it can make junk into gods. If it were, I'd see people having major problems with Gliscor or Sandslash. All of this I think is unnessary and I'm sure Chomppers will just be banned again.

HabibsHotDogs · Sep 14th, 2012, 9:55:17 PM

I think Garchomp's defences is what pushed it over the edge.. not only is it absolutely mandatory to use an ice or dragon move to ohko it but often a key supereffective miss can mean you now need two pokemon to knock it out.

I've only played about 5 games in the new ladder so far, but based on what I've seen so far, even sand veil isn't necessarily a problem, albeit I wouldn't mind if it was gone.

Jukain · Sep 14th, 2012, 9:59:51 PM

My opinion on hax, Sand Veil or otherwise, is that if it happens it happens I don't give a shit. But of course that's just me.

Anyway, Garchomp is so dang fun to use. It's great that it's not broken, because it's been so long since Chomp was available and I'm realizing the great effect Chomp has on the metagame. It tones down the dominance of a lot of rain threats, which is really nice, and its sweeping capabilities aren't so bad that you can't beat it. The one thing I'm seeing is that people are way too reliant on Sand Veil. Sand Veil is only a 20% chance, and so many people are relying on it. A tip: don't rely on Sand Veil, it doesn't turn out well 80% of the time (pun may or may not have been intended).

SubSD Garchomp is the best set by far, not because of Sand Veil but because provided the opponent's checks/counters to Chomp are removed it will demolish. Not that it's broken, but it's definitely top-tier.

**PK Gaming** · Sep 14th, 2012, 10:01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat toshimelonhead

I only needed one battle to determine the annoyance of sand veil hax is not worth bothering with in OU.

log for proof

Obviously you weren't prepared for chomp. You needed more contingency plans, you silly, silly guy. For instance, have you thought of running Choice Scarf Haxorus? Haxorus' mold breaker ability prevents garchomp from gaining evasion under sand, so you can smash it with outrage!?! What? Running Choice Scarf Haxorus on every team isn't feasible? I beg your pardon...

---

I'm pretty sure Sand Veil is still the stupid, crutchy, and broken (not the literal term) ability it was before.

Lavos Spawn · Sep 14th, 2012, 10:34:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat PK Gaming

Choice Scarf Haxorus

trying this, sounds anti-meta and most importantly anti-haxchomp

edit: and dual chop beats the sub version...

Sep 13th, 2012, 8:44:33 PM	#51
FateFellShort Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 13 England	Garchomp is going to be everywhere again lol (presuming it returns to OU). Hopefully it won't overcentralise the metagame like it did before, but this could be fun indeed. __________________ In a world of Rain Teams, all you need is an umbrella... Rating teams. message me if you want me to rate yours! :)

Sep 13th, 2012, 8:53:56 PM	#52
bwburke94 Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 182	I'm actually going to have to ladder for the first time in a long time. __________________ Founder (and only member) of the Free Cacturne movement.

Sep 13th, 2012, 9:32:14 PM	#54
Jukain rip numeros Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 1,704 somewhere could be anywhere Mentor	Word is that evasion items are unbanned from the suspect ladder... Leftovers is better on Chomp but I swear my good luck might just run out with this. __________________ C&C Work \| 1k RMT \| Contribute! \| VM for an OU Rate! \| gp member: vm/pm for a check \| previously pokemon0078 / aka jew-cane

Sep 13th, 2012, 10:30:42 PM	#56
*Aldaron Don't tell me what to do. Super Moderator** Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,374	SUSPECT LADDER IS FINALLY UP, GO PLAY! __________________ beast mode

Sep 13th, 2012, 11:59:39 PM	#57
cornYBird Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 13	Not to whine prematurely, but this sht happened my first game on the reset ladder... (skip to turn 30 if you just wanna see the hax). This is going to be a long 2 weeks... ... Gelatin joined. CornyBird joined. Format: OU Suspect Test Rated battle Rule: Sleep Clause Rule: Species Clause Rule: OHKO Clause Rule: Evasion Clause CornyBird's team: Rotom-Wash / Alakazam / Scizor / Breloom / Jirachi / Heatran Gelatin's team: Garchomp / Tyranitar / Terrakion / Keldeo-Resolution / Gliscor / Deoxys-Defense Battle between Gelatin and CornyBird started! Gelatin sent out Deoxys-Defense! CornyBird sent out Jirachi! The foe's Deoxys-Defense is exerting its pressure! Turn 1 The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Magic Coat! The foe's Deoxys-Defense shrouded itself with Magic Coat! Jirachi used Trick! Jirachi switched items with the foe's Deoxys-Defense! The foe's Deoxys-Defense obtained one Choice Scarf! Jirachi obtained one Red Card! Turn 2 The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Stealth Rock! Pointed stones float in the air around your team! Jirachi used Iron Head! The foe's Deoxys-Defense lost 21% of its health! Turn 3 Gelatin called Deoxys-Defense back! Gelatin sent out Garchomp! Jirachi used Trick! Jirachi switched items with the foe's Garchomp! The foe's Garchomp obtained one Red Card! Jirachi obtained one Leftovers! Turn 4 The foe's Garchomp used Earthquake! It's super effective! Jirachi lost 100% of its health! Jirachi fainted! CornyBird sent out Rotom-W (Rotom-Wash)! Pointed stones dug into Rotom-W! Turn 5 Gelatin called Garchomp back! Gelatin sent out Tyranitar! The foe's Tyranitar's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm! Rotom-W used Will-O-Wisp! The foe's Tyranitar was burned! The sandstorm rages. Rotom-W is buffeted by the sandstorm! Rotom-W restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Tyranitar was hurt by its burn! Turn 6 Rotom-W used Will-O-Wisp! The attack of Rotom-W missed! The foe's Tyranitar used Stone Edge! Rotom-W lost 33% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Rotom-W is buffeted by the sandstorm! Rotom-W restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Tyranitar was hurt by its burn! Turn 7 Rotom-W used Pain Split! The battlers shared their pain! The foe's Tyranitar used Stone Edge! Rotom-W lost 37% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Rotom-W is buffeted by the sandstorm! Rotom-W restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Tyranitar was hurt by its burn! Turn 8 Rotom-W used Volt Switch! The foe's Tyranitar lost 25% of its health! CornyBird called Rotom-W back! CornyBird sent out Breloom! Pointed stones dug into Breloom! The foe's Tyranitar used Stone Edge! It's not very effective... Breloom lost 23% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Tyranitar was hurt by its burn! Breloom's Toxic Orb activated! Breloom was badly poisoned! Turn 9 Breloom used Substitute! Breloom put in a substitute! Breloom lost 25% of its health! The foe's Tyranitar used Superpower! Breloom's substitute faded! The foe's Tyranitar's Attack fell! The foe's Tyranitar's Defense fell! The sandstorm rages. Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Tyranitar was hurt by its burn! Breloom restored HP using its Poison Heal! The foe's Tyranitar fainted! Gelatin sent out Garchomp! Turn 10 CornyBird called Breloom back! CornyBird sent out Scizor! Pointed stones dug into Scizor! The foe's Garchomp used Dragon Claw! It's not very effective... Scizor lost 21% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Turn 11 Gelatin called Garchomp back! Gelatin sent out Gliscor! Scizor used U-turn! It's not very effective... The foe's Gliscor lost 29% of its health! CornyBird called Scizor back! CornyBird sent out Alakazam! The sandstorm rages. Turn 12 Gelatin called Gliscor back! Gelatin sent out Deoxys-Defense! The foe's Deoxys-Defense is exerting its pressure! Alakazam used Psychic! A critical hit! It's not very effective... The foe's Deoxys-Defense lost 44% of its health! The foe's Deoxys-Defense's Special Defense fell! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Deoxys-Defense is buffeted by the sandstorm! Turn 13 CornyBird called Alakazam back! CornyBird sent out Breloom! Pointed stones dug into Breloom! The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Spikes! Spikes were scattered all around the feet of your team! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Deoxys-Defense is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom restored HP using its Poison Heal! Turn 14 The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Spikes! Spikes were scattered all around the feet of your team! Breloom used Substitute! Breloom put in a substitute! Breloom lost 25% of its health! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Deoxys-Defense is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom restored HP using its Poison Heal! Turn 15 The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Spikes! Spikes were scattered all around the feet of your team! Breloom used Substitute! Breloom already has a substitute! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Deoxys-Defense is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom restored HP using its Poison Heal! Turn 16 The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Spikes! Breloom used Seed Bomb! The foe's Deoxys-Defense lost 10% of its health! The foe's Deoxys-Defense fainted! The sandstorm rages. Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom restored HP using its Poison Heal! Gelatin sent out Gliscor! Turn 17 The foe's Gliscor used Substitute! The foe's Gliscor put in a substitute! The foe's Gliscor lost 25% of its health! Breloom used Spore! The attack of Breloom missed! The sandstorm rages. Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom restored HP using its Poison Heal! Turn 18 The foe's Gliscor used Acrobatics! The Flying Gem strengthened Acrobatics's power! It's super effective! Breloom's substitute faded! Breloom used Seed Bomb! The foe's Gliscor's substitute faded! The sandstorm rages. Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom restored HP using its Poison Heal! Turn 19 The foe's Gliscor used Substitute! The foe's Gliscor put in a substitute! The foe's Gliscor lost 25% of its health! Breloom used Seed Bomb! The foe's Gliscor's substitute faded! The sandstorm rages. Breloom is buffeted by the sandstorm! Breloom restored HP using its Poison Heal! Turn 20 CornyBird called Breloom back! CornyBird sent out Heatran! Heatran is hurt by the spikes! Pointed stones dug into Heatran! The foe's Gliscor used Acrobatics! It's not very effective... Heatran lost 23% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Turn 21 Heatran used Dragon Pulse! The foe's Gliscor lost 21% of its health! The foe's Gliscor fainted! The sandstorm rages. Gelatin sent out Terrakion! Turn 22 Heatran used Dragon Pulse! The foe's Terrakion lost 28% of its health! The foe's Terrakion used Substitute! The foe's Terrakion put in a substitute! The foe's Terrakion lost 25% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Turn 23 Heatran used Dragon Pulse! The foe's Terrakion's substitute took the damage! The foe's Terrakion used Substitute! The foe's Terrakion already has a substitute! The sandstorm rages. Turn 24 CornyBird: lol dat dmg variatin Heatran used Dragon Pulse! The foe's Terrakion's substitute faded! The foe's Terrakion used Substitute! The foe's Terrakion put in a substitute! The foe's Terrakion lost 25% of its health! The foe's Terrakion ate its Salac Berry! The Salac Berry raised the foe's Terrakion's Speed! The sandstorm rages. Turn 25 The foe's Terrakion used Swords Dance! The foe's Terrakion's Attack sharply rose! Heatran used Dragon Pulse! The foe's Terrakion's substitute faded! The sandstorm rages. Turn 26 The foe's Terrakion used Close Combat! It's super effective! Heatran lost 40% of its health! The foe's Terrakion's Defense fell! The foe's Terrakion's Special Defense fell! Heatran fainted! The sandstorm rages. CornyBird sent out Scizor! Scizor is hurt by the spikes! Pointed stones dug into Scizor! Turn 27 Scizor used Bullet Punch! It's super effective! The foe's Terrakion lost 22% of its health! The foe's Terrakion fainted! The sandstorm rages. Gelatin sent out Keldeo-Resolution! Turn 28 Scizor used Bullet Punch! It's not very effective... The foe's Keldeo-Resolution lost 30% of its health! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution used Substitute! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution put in a substitute! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution lost 25% of its health! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Keldeo-Resolution is buffeted by the sandstorm! Turn 29 Scizor used Bullet Punch! It's not very effective... The foe's Keldeo-Resolution's substitute faded! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution used Calm Mind! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution's Special Attack rose! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution's Special Defense rose! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Keldeo-Resolution is buffeted by the sandstorm! Turn 30 Scizor used Bullet Punch! It's not very effective... The foe's Keldeo-Resolution lost 31% of its health! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution ate its Salac Berry! The Salac Berry raised the foe's Keldeo-Resolution's Speed! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution used Secret Sword! Scizor lost 29% of its health! Scizor fainted! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Keldeo-Resolution is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution fainted! Gelatin: QQ my own sand has turned against me Gelatin sent out Garchomp! CornyBird sent out Rotom-W (Rotom-Wash)! Pointed stones dug into Rotom-W! Turn 31 The foe's Garchomp used Substitute! The foe's Garchomp put in a substitute! The foe's Garchomp lost 25% of its health! Rotom-W used Hydro Pump! The foe's Garchomp's substitute faded! The foe's Garchomp held up its Red Card against the foe's Garchomp! The sandstorm rages. Turn 32 Alakazam used Psychic! The foe's Garchomp lost 69% of its health! The foe's Garchomp used Substitute! It was too weak to make a substitute! The sandstorm rages. Turn 33 Alakazam used Psychic! The attack of Alakazam missed! The foe's Garchomp used Earthquake! Alakazam lost 100% of its health! Alakazam fainted! The sandstorm rages. CornyBird: ... CornyBird: dat sht Gelatin: sand veil da bess CornyBird: this is is why CornyBird: we hold this sh*t Gelatin: haha CornyBird sent out Rotom-W (Rotom-Wash)! Pointed stones dug into Rotom-W! Turn 34 Gelatin: i like rough skin chomp The foe's Garchomp used Dragon Claw! Rotom-W lost 14% of its health! Rotom-W fainted! The sandstorm rages. CornyBird sent out Breloom! Pointed stones dug into Breloom! Breloom is hurt by the spikes! Turn 35 The foe's Garchomp used Dragon Claw! Breloom lost 26% of its health! Breloom fainted! Gelatin won the battle! Ladder updating... Gelatin's rating: 1180 → 1225 (+25 for winning, +20 from bonus pool) CornyBird's rating: -26 → 315 (-142 for losing, +483 from bonus pool) __________________ hgss fc:2794 4929 8312 b/w fc: coming soon I DO use legal hacks: Legal Pokesav sets

Sep 13th, 2012, 9:23:12 PM	#53
Tabuu Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 280 East Blue	YES! CHOMP IS COMIN BACK :D Although I really could care less haha. Sand Veil is honestly not that broken anyhow. I can't wait to try him out

Sep 13th, 2012, 9:53:15 PM	#55
Ruyjiin Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 1	Sub SD Chomp with a Metagross. All you need, regardless of weather.

Sep 14th, 2012, 12:17:53 AM	#58
Anikrahman1995 Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 355 In my bedroom	It isnt all that bad, I could show you one of my logs where Garchomp didnt even do much in the match. Here: ... Anikrahman1995 joined. Gelatin joined. Format: OU Suspect Test Rated battle Rule: Sleep Clause Rule: Species Clause Rule: OHKO Clause Rule: Evasion Clause Anikrahman1995's team: Abomasnow / Heatran / Starmie / Genesect / Gliscor / Kyurem Gelatin's team: Garchomp / Tyranitar / Terrakion / Keldeo-Resolution / Gliscor / Deoxys-Defense Battle between Anikrahman1995 and Gelatin started! Anikrahman1995 sent out Genesect! Gelatin sent out Deoxys-Defense! Genesect's Download raised its Special Attack! The foe's Deoxys-Defense is exerting its pressure! Turn 1 Genesect used U-turn! It's super effective! The foe's Deoxys-Defense lost 39% of its health! The foe's Deoxys-Defense held up its Red Card against the foe's Deoxys-Defense! The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Stealth Rock! Pointed stones float in the air around your team! Turn 2 The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Spikes! Spikes were scattered all around the feet of your team! Heatran used Stealth Rock! Pointed stones float in the air around the foe's team! Turn 3 Anikrahman1995 called Heatran back! Anikrahman1995 sent out Starmie! Starmie is hurt by the spikes! Pointed stones dug into Starmie! The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Spikes! Spikes were scattered all around the feet of your team! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 4 Gelatin called Deoxys-Defense back! Gelatin sent out Tyranitar! Pointed stones dug into the foe's Tyranitar! The foe's Tyranitar's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm! Starmie used Rapid Spin! It's not very effective... The foe's Tyranitar lost 1% of its health! The spikes disappeared from around your team's feet! The pointed stones disappeared from around your team! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 5 Starmie used Hydro Pump! It's super effective! The foe's Tyranitar lost 57% of its health! The foe's Tyranitar used Pursuit! It's super effective! Starmie lost 56% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 6 Starmie used Recover! Starmie regained health! The foe's Tyranitar used Pursuit! It's super effective! Starmie lost 52% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 7 Starmie used Hydro Pump! It's super effective! The foe's Tyranitar lost 30% of its health! The foe's Tyranitar fainted! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Gelatin sent out Deoxys-Defense! Pointed stones dug into the foe's Deoxys-Defense! The foe's Deoxys-Defense is exerting its pressure! Turn 8 Starmie used Recover! Starmie regained health! The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Night Shade! Starmie lost 31% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Deoxys-Defense is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 9 Starmie used Recover! Starmie regained health! The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Night Shade! Starmie lost 31% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Deoxys-Defense is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 10 Starmie used Recover! Starmie regained health! The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Night Shade! Starmie lost 31% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Deoxys-Defense is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 11 Starmie used Recover! Starmie regained health! The foe's Deoxys-Defense used Night Shade! Starmie lost 31% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Deoxys-Defense is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 12 Starmie used Hydro Pump! The foe's Deoxys-Defense lost 23% of its health! The foe's Deoxys-Defense fainted! The sandstorm rages. Starmie is buffeted by the sandstorm! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Gelatin sent out Garchomp! Pointed stones dug into the foe's Garchomp! Turn 13 Anikrahman1995 called Starmie back! Anikrahman1995 sent out Abomasnow! Abomasnow's Snow Warning whipped up a hailstorm! The foe's Garchomp used Substitute! The foe's Garchomp put in a substitute! The foe's Garchomp lost 25% of its health! The hail crashes down. The foe's Garchomp is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Garchomp restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 14 The foe's Garchomp used Dragon Claw! Abomasnow lost 58% of its health! Abomasnow used Wood Hammer! The foe's Garchomp's substitute faded! Abomasnow is damaged by recoil! The hail crashes down. The foe's Garchomp is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Garchomp restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 15 Gelatin called Garchomp back! Gelatin sent out Keldeo-Resolution! Pointed stones dug into the foe's Keldeo-Resolution! Abomasnow used Ice Shard! It's not very effective... The foe's Keldeo-Resolution lost 11% of its health! The hail crashes down. The foe's Keldeo-Resolution is buffeted by the hail! Turn 16 Abomasnow used Protect! Abomasnow protected itself! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution used Secret Sword! Abomasnow protected itself! The hail crashes down. The foe's Keldeo-Resolution is buffeted by the hail! Turn 17 Anikrahman1995 called Abomasnow back! Anikrahman1995 sent out Gliscor! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution used Substitute! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution put in a substitute! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution lost 25% of its health! The hail crashes down. The foe's Keldeo-Resolution is buffeted by the hail! Gliscor is buffeted by the hail! Gliscor's Toxic Orb activated! Gliscor was badly poisoned! Turn 18 Anikrahman1995 called Gliscor back! Anikrahman1995 sent out Starmie! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution used Calm Mind! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution's Special Attack rose! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution's Special Defense rose! The hail crashes down. Starmie is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution is buffeted by the hail! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 19 Starmie used Psychic! It's super effective! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution's substitute faded! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution used Hydro Pump! It's not very effective... Starmie lost 58% of its health! The hail crashes down. Starmie is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution is buffeted by the hail! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 20 Starmie used Psychic! It's super effective! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution lost 27% of its health! The foe's Keldeo-Resolution fainted! The hail crashes down. Starmie is buffeted by the hail! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Gelatin sent out Terrakion! Pointed stones dug into the foe's Terrakion! Turn 21 Starmie used Hydro Pump! It's super effective! The foe's Terrakion lost 94% of its health! The foe's Terrakion fainted! The hail crashes down. Starmie is buffeted by the hail! Starmie restored HP using its Leftovers! Anikrahman1995: nice try Gelatin sent out Gliscor! Pointed stones dug into the foe's Gliscor! Turn 22 Gelatin: hehe Gelatin: should have sub'd one more time Anikrahman1995: why? Gelatin: actually Gelatin: no Gelatin: i'm not sure if that would have made a diff Gelatin: SubSalac keldeo Starmie used Hydro Pump! The attack of Starmie missed! The foe's Gliscor used Acrobatics! The Flying Gem strengthened Acrobatics's power! Starmie lost 11% of its health! Starmie fainted! The hail crashes down. The foe's Gliscor is buffeted by the hail! Anikrahman1995: revenged by ice shard Gelatin: yeah Anikrahman1995: sub one more time = death from hail Anikrahman1995 sent out Kyurem! Kyurem is exerting its pressure! Turn 23 Gelatin: haha that's true Gelatin: this team is pretty janky Gelatin: 4 sub attackers lol Kyurem used Ice Beam! It's super effective! The foe's Gliscor lost 81% of its health! Kyurem lost some of its HP! The foe's Gliscor fainted! The hail crashes down. Gelatin sent out Garchomp! Pointed stones dug into the foe's Garchomp! Turn 24 Gelatin: anyway gg Anikrahman1995: dragon claw doesnt KO iirc The foe's Garchomp used Dragon Claw! A critical hit! It's super effective! Kyurem lost 90% of its health! Kyurem fainted! The hail crashes down. The foe's Garchomp is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Garchomp restored HP using its Leftovers! Anikrahman1995: damn it Gelatin: LOL... Anikrahman1995: that would not KO Anikrahman1995 sent out Abomasnow! Turn 25 Gelatin: he's pretty bulky Gelatin: pretty sure it shouldn't have Abomasnow used Ice Shard! It's super effective! The foe's Garchomp lost 63% of its health! The foe's Garchomp fainted! Anikrahman1995 won the battle! Ladder updating... Anikrahman1995's rating: 498 → 876 (+133 for winning, +245 from bonus pool) Gelatin's rating: 1225 → 1214 (-32 for losing, +21 from bonus pool) Anikrahman1995: Kyurem? Gelatin: yeah Gelatin: anyway Gelatin: gg Gelatin left.

Sep 14th, 2012, 1:05:13 AM	#59
Scarfwynaut Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 2,100 PA	... people on the suspect ladder are good, Ive lost like the past 8 battles in the row, there go my hopes of voting Garchomp isn't as amazing as made out to be though, even with sand veil, in fact I keep on losing to Doexs-D offense and sun teams for the most part and I was somewhat prepared for them to, I doubt though there will ever be a motivation to ban them until they dominate the ladder but what do I know, I can't win a fucking game __________________ I am not Scarf Wynaut on Pokemon Showdown. I am PrincesoBubblegum

Sep 14th, 2012, 1:57:25 AM	#61
XKnightX Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 12	I've lost my first 3 three battles already. Two of which came down to Garchomp being their last Pokemon and me missing Ice Beam/Outrage against them. __________________ SS FC: 3481 6335 0165 White FC: 1635 4350 9443 I use legal hacks.

Sep 14th, 2012, 3:14:31 AM	#62
deluge Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 787	Great decision! Should be fun and vigoroth supect test. :) Anyway, I think the initial focus should be on whether Garchomp is overpowered not whether there's some rule that can make it easier to manage. I'm afraid some might be going into the test with that mindset (given the discussions that came before). However, that is not consistent with how other Pokemon are tested. That is we didn't say "but for Serene Grace, Shaymin-S is not broken/more manageable" or "but for Sand Rush Excadrill isn't broken/hard to manage" and start suggesting surgical remedies before the test was even done. If that discussion occurs at all it should occur after it's established that a given Pokemon gives TOO MUCH of an advantage in battles between otherwise similarly matched opponents. Anything else is putting the cart before the horse. Anyway, this should be a great test. Good Luck to everyone! Last edited by deluge; Sep 14th, 2012 at 3:30:13 AM.

Sep 14th, 2012, 9:51:26 AM	#63
malomyotismon Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 288	sub SD chomp + magenezone = epic combination __________________ O - I am an Atheist and proud of it! Copy and paste this if you are too. - O My Links

Sep 14th, 2012, 12:28:55 PM	#65
PK Gaming Being a brain surgeon? So not the drama. Moderator Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 4,527 Middleton	Garchomp is good :o SubSD Garchomp + Hippowdown + Spinblocker (Jellicent) annihilates teams. __________________

Sep 14th, 2012, 8:18:12 PM	#67
toshimelonhead cool dude likes melonade Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 879 Snowpoint City	I only needed one battle to determine the annoyance of sand veil hax is not worth bothering with in OU. log for proof VZXT joined. toshimelonhead joined. Format: OU Suspect Test Rated battle Rule: Sleep Clause Rule: Species Clause Rule: OHKO Clause Rule: Evasion Clause toshimelonhead's team: Abomasnow / Volcarona / Forretress / Garchomp / Slowbro / Mamoswine VZXT's team: Tyranitar / Garchomp / Infernape / Roserade / Forretress / Rotom-Wash Battle between VZXT and toshimelonhead started! VZXT sent out Tyranitar! toshimelonhead sent out Mamoswine! The foe's Tyranitar's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm! Turn 1 VZXT called Tyranitar back! VZXT sent out Rotom-Wash! Mamoswine used Earthquake! It doesn't affect the foe's Rotom-Wash... The sandstorm rages. The foe's Rotom-Wash is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Rotom-Wash restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 2 toshimelonhead called Mamoswine back! toshimelonhead sent out Abomasnow! Abomasnow's Snow Warning whipped up a hailstorm! The foe's Rotom-Wash used Will-O-Wisp! Abomasnow was burned! The hail crashes down. The foe's Rotom-Wash is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Rotom-Wash restored HP using its Leftovers! Abomasnow was hurt by its burn! Turn 3 toshimelonhead called Abomasnow back! toshimelonhead sent out Garchomp! The foe's Rotom-Wash used Volt Switch! It doesn't affect Garchomp... The hail crashes down. Garchomp is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Rotom-Wash is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Rotom-Wash restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 4 toshimelonhead called Garchomp back! toshimelonhead sent out Volcarona! The foe's Rotom-Wash used Will-O-Wisp! The attack of the foe's Rotom-Wash missed! The hail crashes down. Volcarona is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Rotom-Wash is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Rotom-Wash restored HP using its Leftovers! Volcarona restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 5 Volcarona used Quiver Dance! Volcarona's Special Attack rose! Volcarona's Special Defense rose! Volcarona's Speed rose! The foe's Rotom-Wash used Hydro Pump! It's super effective! Volcarona lost 70% of its health! The hail crashes down. Volcarona is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Rotom-Wash is buffeted by the hail! Volcarona restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Rotom-Wash restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 6 Volcarona used Bug Buzz! The foe's Rotom-Wash lost 93% of its health! The foe's Rotom-Wash used Volt Switch! Volcarona lost 21% of its health! VZXT called Rotom-Wash back! VZXT sent out Tyranitar! The foe's Tyranitar's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm! The sandstorm rages. Volcarona is buffeted by the sandstorm! Volcarona restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 7 Volcarona used Bug Buzz! It's super effective! The foe's Tyranitar lost 58% of its health! The foe's Tyranitar used Stealth Rock! Pointed stones float in the air around your team! The sandstorm rages. Volcarona is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Tyranitar restored HP using its Leftovers! Volcarona restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 8 VZXT called Tyranitar back! VZXT sent out Rotom-Wash! Volcarona used Bug Buzz! The foe's Rotom-Wash lost 7% of its health! The foe's Rotom-Wash fainted! The sandstorm rages. Volcarona is buffeted by the sandstorm! Volcarona restored HP using its Leftovers! VZXT sent out Infernape! Turn 9 The foe's Infernape used Mach Punch! It's not very effective... Volcarona lost 9% of its health! Volcarona fainted! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Infernape is buffeted by the sandstorm! toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! Pointed stones dug into Slowbro! Turn 10 VZXT called Infernape back! VZXT sent out Roserade! Slowbro used Thunder Wave! The foe's Roserade was paralyzed! It may be unable to move! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Roserade is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Roserade restored HP using its Leftovers! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 11 toshimelonhead called Slowbro back! toshimelonhead sent out Forretress! Pointed stones dug into Forretress! The foe's Roserade used Leech Seed! Forretress was seeded! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Roserade is buffeted by the sandstorm! Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Roserade restored HP using its Leftovers! Forretress's health is sapped by Leech Seed! Turn 12 VZXT called Roserade back! VZXT sent out Garchomp! Forretress used Rapid Spin! The foe's Garchomp lost 4% of its health! Forretress was freed from Leech Seed! The pointed stones disappeared from around your team! The sandstorm rages. Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 13 The foe's Garchomp used Fire Fang! The attack of the foe's Garchomp missed! Forretress used Hidden Power! The foe's Garchomp ate its Yache Berry! It's super effective! The foe's Garchomp lost 27% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 14 VZXT called Garchomp back! VZXT sent out Infernape! toshimelonhead called Forretress back! toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Infernape is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 15 The foe's Infernape used U-turn! It's super effective! Slowbro lost 28% of its health! VZXT called Infernape back! VZXT sent out Roserade! Slowbro used Fire Blast! The attack of Slowbro missed! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Roserade is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Roserade restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 16 toshimelonhead called Slowbro back! toshimelonhead sent out Abomasnow! Abomasnow's Snow Warning whipped up a hailstorm! The foe's Roserade used Leech Seed! It doesn't affect Abomasnow... The hail crashes down. The foe's Roserade is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Roserade restored HP using its Leftovers! Abomasnow was hurt by its burn! Turn 17 VZXT called Roserade back! VZXT sent out Forretress! Abomasnow used Blizzard! It's not very effective... The foe's Forretress lost 43% of its health! The hail crashes down. The foe's Forretress is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Abomasnow was hurt by its burn! Turn 18 toshimelonhead called Abomasnow back! toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! VZXT called Forretress back! VZXT sent out Tyranitar! The foe's Tyranitar's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Tyranitar restored HP using its Leftovers! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 19 The foe's Tyranitar used Stealth Rock! Pointed stones float in the air around your team! Slowbro used Thunder Wave! The foe's Tyranitar was paralyzed! It may be unable to move! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Tyranitar restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 20 Slowbro used Surf! It's super effective! The foe's Tyranitar lost 29% of its health! The foe's Tyranitar used Crunch! It's super effective! Slowbro lost 39% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Tyranitar restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 21 VZXT called Tyranitar back! VZXT sent out Roserade! Slowbro used Surf! It's not very effective... The foe's Roserade lost 13% of its health! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Roserade is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Roserade restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 22 toshimelonhead called Slowbro back! toshimelonhead sent out Forretress! Pointed stones dug into Forretress! The foe's Roserade used Toxic Spikes! Poison spikes were scattered all around the feet of your team! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Roserade is buffeted by the sandstorm! Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Roserade restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 23 VZXT called Roserade back! VZXT sent out Infernape! Forretress used Rapid Spin! The foe's Infernape lost 6% of its health! The poison spikes disappeared from around your team's feet! The pointed stones disappeared from around your team! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Infernape is buffeted by the sandstorm! Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 24 toshimelonhead called Forretress back! toshimelonhead sent out Garchomp! The foe's Infernape used Fire Punch! It's not very effective... Garchomp lost 23% of its health! Garchomp was burned! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Infernape is buffeted by the sandstorm! Garchomp was hurt by its burn! Turn 25 VZXT called Infernape back! VZXT sent out Forretress! Garchomp used Earthquake! The foe's Forretress lost 15% of its health! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Garchomp was hurt by its burn! Turn 26 Garchomp used Earthquake! The foe's Forretress lost 16% of its health! The foe's Forretress used Spikes! Spikes were scattered all around the feet of your team! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Garchomp was hurt by its burn! Turn 27 toshimelonhead called Garchomp back! toshimelonhead sent out Forretress! Forretress is hurt by the spikes! The foe's Forretress used Spikes! Spikes were scattered all around the feet of your team! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 28 Forretress used Rapid Spin! It's not very effective... The foe's Forretress lost 1% of its health! The spikes disappeared from around your team's feet! The foe's Forretress used Volt Switch! Forretress lost 14% of its health! VZXT called Forretress back! VZXT sent out Garchomp! The sandstorm rages. Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 29 toshimelonhead called Forretress back! toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! The foe's Garchomp used Swords Dance! The foe's Garchomp's Attack sharply rose! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 30 The foe's Garchomp used Earthquake! Slowbro lost 63% of its health! Slowbro used Ice Beam! The attack of Slowbro missed! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 31 toshimelonhead called Slowbro back! toshimelonhead sent out Garchomp! The foe's Garchomp used Earthquake! Garchomp lost 34% of its health! Garchomp fainted! The sandstorm rages. toshimelonhead sent out Mamoswine! Turn 32 VZXT called Garchomp back! VZXT sent out Forretress! Mamoswine used Ice Shard! A critical hit! It's not very effective... The foe's Forretress lost 12% of its health! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 33 Mamoswine used Earthquake! The foe's Forretress lost 29% of its health! The foe's Forretress used Gyro Ball! It's super effective! Mamoswine lost 62% of its health! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 34 Mamoswine used Earthquake! The foe's Forretress lost 15% of its health! The foe's Forretress fainted! The sandstorm rages. VZXT sent out Infernape! Turn 35 toshimelonhead called Mamoswine back! toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! The foe's Infernape used Close Combat! It's not very effective... Slowbro lost 17% of its health! The foe's Infernape's Defense fell! The foe's Infernape's Special Defense fell! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Infernape is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 36 VZXT called Infernape back! VZXT sent out Roserade! Slowbro used Ice Beam! It's super effective! The foe's Roserade lost 38% of its health! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Roserade is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Roserade restored HP using its Leftovers! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 37 toshimelonhead called Slowbro back! toshimelonhead sent out Abomasnow! Abomasnow's Snow Warning whipped up a hailstorm! The foe's Roserade used Leech Seed! It doesn't affect Abomasnow... The hail crashes down. The foe's Roserade is buffeted by the hail! The foe's Roserade restored HP using its Leftovers! Abomasnow was hurt by its burn! Turn 38 Abomasnow used Blizzard! It's super effective! The foe's Roserade lost 49% of its health! The foe's Roserade fainted! The hail crashes down. Abomasnow was hurt by its burn! VZXT sent out Infernape! Turn 39 toshimelonhead called Abomasnow back! toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! The foe's Infernape used U-turn! It's super effective! Slowbro lost 28% of its health! VZXT called Infernape back! VZXT sent out Tyranitar! The foe's Tyranitar's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! The foe's Tyranitar restored HP using its Leftovers! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 40 Slowbro used Surf! It's super effective! The foe's Tyranitar lost 26% of its health! The foe's Tyranitar used Crunch! It's super effective! Slowbro lost 42% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! The foe's Tyranitar restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 41 VZXT called Tyranitar back! VZXT sent out Garchomp! Slowbro used Surf! The foe's Garchomp lost 39% of its health! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 42 toshimelonhead called Slowbro back! toshimelonhead sent out Abomasnow! Abomasnow's Snow Warning whipped up a hailstorm! The foe's Garchomp used Earthquake! It's not very effective... Abomasnow lost 38% of its health! Abomasnow fainted! The hail crashes down. The foe's Garchomp is buffeted by the hail! toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! Turn 43 VZXT called Garchomp back! VZXT sent out Tyranitar! The foe's Tyranitar's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm! toshimelonhead called Slowbro back! toshimelonhead sent out Forretress! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Tyranitar restored HP using its Leftovers! Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 44 Forretress used Volt Switch! The foe's Tyranitar lost 5% of its health! toshimelonhead called Forretress back! toshimelonhead sent out Mamoswine! The foe's Tyranitar used Fire Blast! The attack of the foe's Tyranitar missed! The sandstorm rages. The foe's Tyranitar restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 45 Mamoswine used Earthquake! It's super effective! The foe's Tyranitar lost 32% of its health! The foe's Tyranitar fainted! The sandstorm rages. VZXT sent out Infernape! Turn 46 toshimelonhead called Mamoswine back! toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! The foe's Infernape used U-turn! It's super effective! Slowbro lost 25% of its health! VZXT called Infernape back! VZXT sent out Garchomp! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 47 toshimelonhead called Slowbro back! toshimelonhead sent out Forretress! The foe's Garchomp used Swords Dance! The foe's Garchomp's Attack sharply rose! The sandstorm rages. Forretress restored HP using its Leftovers! Turn 48 The foe's Garchomp used Fire Fang! It's super effective! Forretress lost 92% of its health! Forretress fainted! The sandstorm rages. toshimelonhead sent out Mamoswine! Turn 49 Mamoswine used Ice Shard! The attack of Mamoswine missed! The foe's Garchomp used Dragon Claw! Mamoswine lost 38% of its health! Mamoswine fainted! The sandstorm rages. toshimelonhead sent out Slowbro! Turn 50 The foe's Garchomp used Earthquake! Slowbro lost 65% of its health! Slowbro used Ice Beam! It's super effective! The foe's Garchomp lost 25% of its health! The foe's Garchomp fainted! The sandstorm rages. Slowbro is buffeted by the sandstorm! Slowbro restored HP using its Leftovers! VZXT sent out Infernape! Turn 51 The foe's Infernape used U-turn! It's super effective! Slowbro lost 22% of its health! Slowbro fainted! VZXT won the battle! Ladder updating... VZXT's rating: -26 → 461 (+163 for winning, +324 from bonus pool) toshimelonhead's rating: -26 → 136 (-162 for losing, +324 from bonus pool) toshimelonhead: garchomp needs to gtfo VZXT: lol toshimelonhead: gg VZXT: yes it devaluates skill VZXT: gg __________________ 01[21:11] <@toshimelonhead> nova you are one lucky son of a gun [21:11] <@Novaray> hahahahaha [21:11] <@durrr> whys he lucky [21:12] <@Colchonero> maybe he got a date with jason's cousin [21:12] <@Novaray> LOL 01[21:12] <@toshimelonhead> rofl [21:13] <@durrr> HAHAHAHHA gtfo shes mine

Sep 14th, 2012, 8:29:25 PM	#68
undisputed The greatest oak was once a little nut that held its ground Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 2,032 Came by a fork in the road, and went straight	yeah, man... i've had 2 battles so far where missing vs. garchomp's continual subs has put me at a severe disadvantage __________________

Sep 14th, 2012, 9:45:46 PM	#71
Keikari Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 7 New Hampshire	I don't understand why people want Garchomp back in OU. Am I missing something here? Is there some sort of niche that Garchomp must fill in order to balance out the metagame? If there's a Pokemon which is so broken it needs the likes of Garchomp to be reintroduced into OU to quell it (which there isn't), why not ban that Pokemon itself? But, as I just said, such a Pokemon doesn't exist. I think people want Garchomp back in OU because, well it's Garchomp. Why being Garchomp is so attractive to battlers will be explained below. It's probably going to banned again, even without Sand Veil. Yeah, sure, there's Ice Beam from Scarfed Genesect and Ice Shard from Mamoswine, but just look at Garchomp's stats, typing and moveset. Dragon / Ground. Excellent offensive typing. Of course, that's not THE reason why Garchomp's banned as evidenced by Flygon. Not only does it have that typing, but access to SD, EQ and Outrage. Garchomp just needs a Fire move and nothing resists it's attacks. Same with D-Nite, but he gets no STAB on EQ. Stat wise, also just...wow! With a 102 base speed stat, he outspeeds a lot of the OU metagame. Also, his 130 base attack stat with STAB EQ and Outrage is madness. Garchomp also isn't just a dog who can only bite, his 108 / 95 / 85 give Garchomp some natural bulk close to Dragonite! Of course, Dragonite's Mutiscale gives it more bulk than Garchomp, but it's more bulk than the average Dragon. But who knows? Maybe Garchomp might end up fitting in with the OU crowd, but then there's the whole Sand Veil thing. Banning Sand Veil just to let a Pokemon back in OU who's the only one who can abuse it I think is dumb. It's not like Swift Swim where it can make junk into gods. If it were, I'd see people having major problems with Gliscor or Sandslash. All of this I think is unnessary and I'm sure Chomppers will just be banned again.

Sep 14th, 2012, 9:55:17 PM	#72
HabibsHotDogs Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 240	I think Garchomp's defences is what pushed it over the edge.. not only is it absolutely mandatory to use an ice or dragon move to ohko it but often a key supereffective miss can mean you now need two pokemon to knock it out. I've only played about 5 games in the new ladder so far, but based on what I've seen so far, even sand veil isn't necessarily a problem, albeit I wouldn't mind if it was gone.

Sep 14th, 2012, 9:59:51 PM	#73
Jukain rip numeros Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 1,704 somewhere could be anywhere Mentor	My opinion on hax, Sand Veil or otherwise, is that if it happens it happens I don't give a shit. But of course that's just me. Anyway, Garchomp is so dang fun to use. It's great that it's not broken, because it's been so long since Chomp was available and I'm realizing the great effect Chomp has on the metagame. It tones down the dominance of a lot of rain threats, which is really nice, and its sweeping capabilities aren't so bad that you can't beat it. The one thing I'm seeing is that people are way too reliant on Sand Veil. Sand Veil is only a 20% chance, and so many people are relying on it. A tip: don't rely on Sand Veil, it doesn't turn out well 80% of the time (pun may or may not have been intended). SubSD Garchomp is the best set by far, not because of Sand Veil but because provided the opponent's checks/counters to Chomp are removed it will demolish. Not that it's broken, but it's definitely top-tier. __________________ C&C Work \| 1k RMT \| Contribute! \| VM for an OU Rate! \| gp member: vm/pm for a check \| previously pokemon0078 / aka jew-cane