Equal BST Metagame - Page 5

Pikapwnd · Apr 25th, 2012, 10:26:46 AM

FYI for people worrying about blaziken, wooper will cockblock it so fast not even funny

blasphemy1 · Apr 25th, 2012, 10:38:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Pikapwnd

FYI for people worrying about blaziken, wooper will cockblock it so fast not even funny

I'm not sure Wooper can handle two +0 Hi Jump Kick, let alone HP Grass for mixed variants. There are definitely checks for each Blaziken set, but half your team might faint just to find out.

Acritter · Apr 25th, 2012, 2:12:25 PM

Slowpoke both has higher physical bulk than Wooper and resists HJK, and it only barely avoids getting 2HKOd with full investment into physical bulk. Wooper is NOT a Blaziken counter. Hell, I'm not even sure how well Slowpoke would do versus a set that dumps Protect for Shadow Claw: 70x2=140 base power is greater than 130/2*1.5=92.5 base power by enough that Slowpoke ought to suffer a clean KO. Sure, that's not as good against Scarf Krabby, but how are you supposed to know which to switch in? Pick wrong, and you lose a Pokemon.

As said before, Blaziken tore up OU despite having below-average stats (below 600 BST, for reference). It even works in Ubers despite having below-average stats. BST is not the reason it was overpowered. A great movepool, typing, ability, and stat distribution is why it was so good.

Any thoughts on how Kyogre will do in this meta? I think it'll probably be the rainsetter of choice for this meta, what with its Choice Specs set still being capable of laying down some harm. Nothing like in Ubers, though. Similarly, Groudon ought to be the sunsetter of choice simply because it has Stealth Rock. The weathersetters, at least, seem rather boring.

Sound · May 11th, 2012, 7:06:31 PM

Actually, Vulpix has some merits for sun-setting (I don't mean making the sun set, I mean causing the weather condition) as well. 100 speed lets it run a scarf to revenge kill most unboosted pokemon, something Groudon can't boast. Even though its special attack is low at 77, Sun + Stab will certainly help in that department.

Let's take a look a sun as a whole, shall we? We may have Magby breaking down walls with its great mixed stats, Sun and STAB boosted Flare Blitz and Fire Blast, 104 speed, and considering the fact that most walls have become one sided through this process (I'd include calcs, but I'm unable to download the calculator). Bulbasaur is going to be a deadly sweeper, although Ivysaur may be chosen so you're not outsped by Abra under sun. Bellsprout is a slower, but a lot more powerful version of Bulbasaur. Victrebell could be used for speed, but you really aren't outspeeding anything beyond Spearow, Swellow, and Sneasel (who should be packing priority anyway).

Oh, and a quick fun fact. Tropius, through this process, only loses a single point in HP. Maractus has absolutely no change whatsoever.

Mari · Jun 11th, 2012, 12:26:30 PM

Oh, I see great possibilities: Light Ball Pikachu, Meditite, Marill, Smeargle, Clamperl ...

bigbadbrownybadger · Sep 1st, 2012, 7:38:49 PM

This is seriously the best thread I've ever seen.
Bump for the love of God.
There's still interest!

zyrefredric · Sep 7th, 2012, 4:15:47 AM

Thanks bigbadbrownybadger. I rewrote the OP, and will be adding new content soon after.

IstheCakeReallyaLie · Oct 3rd, 2012, 4:03:00 PM

Anyone thinking of setting up a PS! server?

trulyElse · Oct 3rd, 2012, 10:56:50 PM

Spreadsheet from the OP 404s.

Iceking · Oct 9th, 2012, 1:46:12 AM

I frown upon this. Mainly, because this is impossible on the cartage games unless you were to hack it. Since every other metagame is possible in the actual Pokemon games, this should never be an official metagame due to the fact that this technically isn't Pokemon. Additionally, even with the same base stats, some Pokemon still will be sent into obscurity. Even though eveloutions have superior movepools, the improvements are varied.

I do, however, like the idea behind it, in attempting to give some Pokemon a second chance.

zyrefredric · Oct 22nd, 2012, 10:54:49 AM

Edited the OP, made it so much nicer..^^

@Iceking above, the fact that it "is impossible on the cartridge games unless you were to hack it" certainly didn't stop people from playing and enjoying Hackmon's, 6-moveslot battling and Street Pokemon. We can only hope this thread generates enough interest and we get the chance to play it in Pokemon Showdown somehow.

trulyElse · Oct 22nd, 2012, 10:45:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat zyrefredric

the fact that it "is impossible on the cartridge games unless you were to hack it" certainly didn't stop people from playing and enjoying [...] Street Pokemon.

Steetmons is entirely possible on the cartridges.

zyrefredric · Oct 23rd, 2012, 3:40:21 AM

oops, my bad. read more into it and streetmon's IS playable in the carts. But the other examples can't, so the point's still valid.

Scarfwynaut · Oct 26th, 2012, 10:59:22 PM

I don't play this metagame, nor do I plan to, I just lurk because its dam interesting.

I think you can play this in game if you were to lower a pokemon's level in game to match another pokemon, I would not see the problem. For example a level 34 Arcues has almost the same stats as Sunkern.

Or course a level 34 arcues is impossible, but using it doesn't require changing game mechanics.

zyrefredric · Nov 14th, 2012, 6:05:28 PM

Finally, we can all play this meta! Those who want to try their hand at it, head over here http://play.pokemonshowdown.com/~~du...o-ip.org/lobby.

Choose Equal BST in the format. Also, when you are using the teambuilder, the changed stats are no reflected, but it does work. You can check out the new stats here. https://public.sheet.zoho.com/public...bst-metagame-1.

The Dark Hero · Nov 15th, 2012, 7:31:54 PM

Even with that speed, Magikarp is totally walled by Ghost types.

Numbuh 214 · Dec 10th, 2012, 4:54:44 PM

It has Bounce for Ghosts. Still gets walled by Rock and Steel, though.

In any case... the fact that formes don't share base HP irks me. As a result, I've elected to alter the distributions slightly on offenders to fix this; you can see these changes here. Feel free to critique, tell me things I missed, et cetera.

Apr 25th, 2012, 10:26:46 AM	#101
Pikapwnd Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 379 Logic Blows	FYI for people worrying about blaziken, wooper will cockblock it so fast not even funny __________________ This is pokemon, not life or death.

Jun 11th, 2012, 12:26:30 PM	#105
Mari Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 164 Aachen, Germany	Oh, I see great possibilities: Light Ball Pikachu, Meditite, Marill, Smeargle, Clamperl ... __________________ Challenge Cup 1 vs 1 - Torchic vs Arceus-Normal Challenge Cup - Trapinch VGC 2013 - 3-Turn-Win Balanced Hackmons - Arceus Home Run Challenge Cup 1 vs 1 - Epic: Magikarp vs. Zapdos Feel the power of Sub Magnezone Last edited by Mari; Jun 11th, 2012 at 12:45:35 PM.

Sep 1st, 2012, 7:38:49 PM	#106
bigbadbrownybadger Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 20 Lake Oswego, Oregon	This is seriously the best thread I've ever seen. Bump for the love of God. There's still interest! __________________ "[...]sarcasm hurts, man. Not my heart in particular, but it kind of hurts my right toe."

Sep 7th, 2012, 4:15:47 AM	#107
zyrefredric Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 522 Mandaue City, Philippines	Thanks bigbadbrownybadger. I rewrote the OP, and will be adding new content soon after. __________________ Want to PLAY a brand new metagame? Visit this Equal BST Metagame thread and tell us what you think. Ever tried A Monotype Take on the OU Metagame? Visit the thread and share your experience.

Oct 9th, 2012, 1:46:12 AM	#110
Iceking Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 10	I frown upon this. Mainly, because this is impossible on the cartage games unless you were to hack it. Since every other metagame is possible in the actual Pokemon games, this should never be an official metagame due to the fact that this technically isn't Pokemon. Additionally, even with the same base stats, some Pokemon still will be sent into obscurity. Even though eveloutions have superior movepools, the improvements are varied. I do, however, like the idea behind it, in attempting to give some Pokemon a second chance. __________________ It would probably take two Machamps, or one Chuck Norris/Dunsparce to play this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS8FEfhYvEo

Apr 25th, 2012, 2:12:25 PM	#103
Acritter Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 457	Slowpoke both has higher physical bulk than Wooper and resists HJK, and it only barely avoids getting 2HKOd with full investment into physical bulk. Wooper is NOT a Blaziken counter. Hell, I'm not even sure how well Slowpoke would do versus a set that dumps Protect for Shadow Claw: 70x2=140 base power is greater than 130/2*1.5=92.5 base power by enough that Slowpoke ought to suffer a clean KO. Sure, that's not as good against Scarf Krabby, but how are you supposed to know which to switch in? Pick wrong, and you lose a Pokemon. As said before, Blaziken tore up OU despite having below-average stats (below 600 BST, for reference). It even works in Ubers despite having below-average stats. BST is not the reason it was overpowered. A great movepool, typing, ability, and stat distribution is why it was so good. Any thoughts on how Kyogre will do in this meta? I think it'll probably be the rainsetter of choice for this meta, what with its Choice Specs set still being capable of laying down some harm. Nothing like in Ubers, though. Similarly, Groudon ought to be the sunsetter of choice simply because it has Stealth Rock. The weathersetters, at least, seem rather boring.

May 11th, 2012, 7:06:31 PM	#104
Sound Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 162	Actually, Vulpix has some merits for sun-setting (I don't mean making the sun set, I mean causing the weather condition) as well. 100 speed lets it run a scarf to revenge kill most unboosted pokemon, something Groudon can't boast. Even though its special attack is low at 77, Sun + Stab will certainly help in that department. Let's take a look a sun as a whole, shall we? We may have Magby breaking down walls with its great mixed stats, Sun and STAB boosted Flare Blitz and Fire Blast, 104 speed, and considering the fact that most walls have become one sided through this process (I'd include calcs, but I'm unable to download the calculator). Bulbasaur is going to be a deadly sweeper, although Ivysaur may be chosen so you're not outsped by Abra under sun. Bellsprout is a slower, but a lot more powerful version of Bulbasaur. Victrebell could be used for speed, but you really aren't outspeeding anything beyond Spearow, Swellow, and Sneasel (who should be packing priority anyway). Oh, and a quick fun fact. Tropius, through this process, only loses a single point in HP. Maractus has absolutely no change whatsoever.

Oct 3rd, 2012, 4:03:00 PM	#108
IstheCakeReallyaLie Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 164 Unova	Anyone thinking of setting up a PS! server?

Oct 3rd, 2012, 10:56:50 PM	#109
trulyElse Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 56 Auckland, NZ	Spreadsheet from the OP 404s.

Oct 22nd, 2012, 10:54:49 AM	#111
zyrefredric Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 522 Mandaue City, Philippines	Edited the OP, made it so much nicer..^^ @Iceking above, the fact that it "is impossible on the cartridge games unless you were to hack it" certainly didn't stop people from playing and enjoying Hackmon's, 6-moveslot battling and Street Pokemon. We can only hope this thread generates enough interest and we get the chance to play it in Pokemon Showdown somehow. __________________ Want to PLAY a brand new metagame? Visit this Equal BST Metagame thread and tell us what you think. Ever tried A Monotype Take on the OU Metagame? Visit the thread and share your experience.

Oct 23rd, 2012, 3:40:21 AM	#113
zyrefredric Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 522 Mandaue City, Philippines	oops, my bad. read more into it and streetmon's IS playable in the carts. But the other examples can't, so the point's still valid. __________________ Want to PLAY a brand new metagame? Visit this Equal BST Metagame thread and tell us what you think. Ever tried A Monotype Take on the OU Metagame? Visit the thread and share your experience.

Oct 26th, 2012, 10:59:22 PM	#114
Scarfwynaut Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 2,082 PA	I don't play this metagame, nor do I plan to, I just lurk because its dam interesting. I think you can play this in game if you were to lower a pokemon's level in game to match another pokemon, I would not see the problem. For example a level 34 Arcues has almost the same stats as Sunkern. Or course a level 34 arcues is impossible, but using it doesn't require changing game mechanics. __________________ I am not Scarf Wynaut on Pokemon Showdown. I am PrincesoBubblegum

Nov 14th, 2012, 6:05:28 PM	#115
zyrefredric Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 522 Mandaue City, Philippines	Finally, we can all play this meta! Those who want to try their hand at it, head over here http://play.pokemonshowdown.com/~~du...o-ip.org/lobby. Choose Equal BST in the format. Also, when you are using the teambuilder, the changed stats are no reflected, but it does work. You can check out the new stats here. https://public.sheet.zoho.com/public...bst-metagame-1. __________________ Want to PLAY a brand new metagame? Visit this Equal BST Metagame thread and tell us what you think. Ever tried A Monotype Take on the OU Metagame? Visit the thread and share your experience.

Nov 15th, 2012, 7:31:54 PM	#116
The Dark Hero Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 57	Even with that speed, Magikarp is totally walled by Ghost types.

Dec 10th, 2012, 4:54:44 PM	#117
Numbuh 214 Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 133	It has Bounce for Ghosts. Still gets walled by Rock and Steel, though. In any case... the fact that formes don't share base HP irks me. As a result, I've elected to alter the distributions slightly on offenders to fix this; you can see these changes here. Feel free to critique, tell me things I missed, et cetera.