Simple Questions & Simple Answers & General Resources (OU Edition) MK II - Page 5

alkinesthetase · Nov 12th, 2012, 1:56:51 PM

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Can a scarf Tyanitar outspeed a Dugtrio? I'm having trouble with sun offense and being trap by dugtrio means game over.

no probably not, i'm too lazy to go and calc it myself but i'm pretty sure scarftar is outsped by max speed base 117ish or higher (not that any 117s actually exist)

ClubbingSealCub · Nov 12th, 2012, 2:01:24 PM

Scarf TTar reaches 364 with a Jolly Nature, jolly Dugtrio has 372 speed so no, ScarfTar can't outspeed Dugtrio.

If Dugtrio is really fucking your Ttar over, the best option would be Shed Shell or simply reevaluate your team. If keeping sand up is so important for your team then you may want to consider using Hippo/Ttar dual sand stream.

Masamune · Nov 12th, 2012, 2:15:37 PM

What are all of the moves that increase an offensive/defensive stat by 3 stages? I know of Tail Glow and Cotton Guard, but I'm curious as to whether or not there are any more.

Somebody Anonymous · Nov 12th, 2012, 2:20:04 PM

That's it. Unless you count Coil and Quiver Dance.

Linneus · Nov 12th, 2012, 2:20:46 PM

An Air Balloon behind a sub cannot be broken, right? And is there any Pokémon who even uses this combo outside of Magnezone?

Chimpakt · Nov 12th, 2012, 2:28:17 PM

air balloon is popped whenever. and im not sure if ive ever seen magnezone on a balloon recently.

Linneus · Nov 12th, 2012, 2:32:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Chimpakt

air balloon is popped whenever. and im not sure if ive ever seen magnezone on a balloon recently.

If a pop can't be stopped by a sub, that's probably why it doesn't carry it... Otherwise it'd have double protection against its only double weakness, but I suppose that if that's the case, it'd be redundant to have both. Thanks for the answer.

Masamune · Nov 12th, 2012, 2:38:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Tri Attack

Deals damage and has a 20% chance to burn, freeze, or paralyze the target.

Does that mean a 20% chance to either burn, freeze or paralyze, or a 20% chance for each one? If the answer is the latter, how is the order of status decided?

alkinesthetase · Nov 12th, 2012, 2:44:59 PM

Quote:

Has a 20% chance to burn, freeze, or paralyze the target. One of these effects is selected at random; they do not each have independent chances to occur.

from veekun. judging by this description, the game first makes a roll on 20% to see if an effect is inflicted, then makes a second roll out of 3 to see which effect is chosen. however to be certain you'd need to examine the game code itself... things like these can be finicky.

Linneus · Nov 12th, 2012, 3:03:40 PM

So, I'm a big fan of Trick Room, and if there's one team I modify the most, it's my TR team. (I've gone from serious sets such as Escavalier to the bottom of the barrel of gimmickiness-- That's right. Scope Lens/Focus Energy/Sniper Octillery.) But no matter what, I always find myself having trouble with that absolute jerk Chandelure.

Literally everything that sets up Trick Room is weak to him. (I have three TR setters on my team; Bronzong, Jellicent and Lampent. Chose Lampent because I like to look beyond some of the most OU Pokémon out there most of the time, but that's beside the point.)

My question is... Who can brave Chandelure and set up Trick Room? I don't need to outright counter him; hell, I don't even to check him. Once Trick Room's up, I can leave that to my offensive members to stop it.

lokt · Nov 12th, 2012, 3:08:53 PM

Porygon-2 counters chandelure and sets up trick room. It can trace flash fire to absorb fire moves.

Masamune · Nov 12th, 2012, 3:11:28 PM

It's also immune to ghost type moves.

ClubbingSealCub · Nov 12th, 2012, 3:13:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat lokt

Porygon-2 counters chandelure and sets up trick room. It can trace flash fire to absorb fire moves.

Pretty much this. It's immune to both of Chandy's STABs, can toxic/paralyze Chandelure and recover-stall it or deal some neutral damage with thunderbolt (chandy is actually frail as sin).

Linneus · Nov 12th, 2012, 3:14:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat lokt

Porygon-2 counters chandelure and sets up trick room. It can trace flash fire to absorb fire moves.

I COMPLETELY FORGOT ABOUT TRACE.
I'd recently been thinking about a Zoom Lens/Analytic set for Porygon2 (which obviously isn't compatible with Trick Room), so I'd forgotten all about it. Time for some team building...

Of course, Trace is completely luck in doubles, but I'll take luck over getting destroyed by Heat Wave or Shadow Ball.

That actually kind of leads right into my next question. this page (all the way at the bottom) lists the Zoom Lens' effect as

Quote:

Raises accuracy by 20% if the holder moves after the target.

Clicking on it, however, says this:

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If the holder moves after the target in the same turn, this item boosts the holder's accuracy by 30%.

What's the truth here?

alkinesthetase · Nov 12th, 2012, 3:26:50 PM

Quote:

I COMPLETELY FORGOT ABOUT TRACE.

be careful, UU players got wise to this a long time ago. chandelure has a hard time switching in on most shit anyway (at least, this is the case in singles... if you have competitive doubles in mind, you might wanna check out the VGC section) which is why many of the sets in the current analysis for UUlure now use flame body - porygon2 cannot counter flame body chandelure.

awkward about that zoom lens indiscrepancy, veekun declares it to be 20% and so does bulbapedia

Linneus · Nov 12th, 2012, 3:33:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat alkinesthetase

be careful, UU players got wise to this a long time ago. chandelure has a hard time switching in on most shit anyway (at least, this is the case in singles... if you have competitive doubles in mind, you might wanna check out the VGC section) which is why many of the sets in the current analysis for UUlure now use flame body - porygon2 cannot counter flame body chandelure.

awkward about that zoom lens indiscrepancy, veekun declares it to be 20% and so does bulbapedia

Extra awkward considering the entire item's analysis is based on the 30% assumption.

I will check it out, though, thank you. Gonna have to run some damage calcs on Porygon2@Eviolite vs. the strongest Chandelure can muster. Once Trick Room's around, I can get my momentum going again.

Lord of Bays · Nov 12th, 2012, 4:54:44 PM

Are you running your team in UU or OU? If UU, yeah, Chandelure will be an issue with Flame Body to screw with P2 (I actually did myself after a long time of P2 cockblocking me), but if you're in OU, Chandelure and P2 aren't common at all so any Chandelures you DO see will run Flash Fire to deal with Sun-boosted attacks.

TheSuperSaiyanBreloom · Nov 12th, 2012, 4:59:55 PM

I need a pokemon that can take water hits no problem (including tentacruel) and can deal with sub cm jirachi. I also want it to have a momentum move. I have celebi but can anyone tell me a good set for it? the current set I have is recover, giga drain, perish song and ,u-turn.

ClubbingSealCub · Nov 12th, 2012, 5:20:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat TheSuperSaiyanBreloom

I need a pokemon that can take water hits no problem (including tentacruel) and can deal with sub cm jirachi. I also want it to have a momentum move. I have celebi but can anyone tell me a good set for it? the current set I have is recover, giga drain, perish song and ,u-turn.

If you want it to deal with SubCM Jirachi, you're going to need Earth Power or else it'll set up all over you. Earth Power also lets it nail Tentacruel pretty well. If your team is particularly weak to Keldeo+Ttar; you can run Baton pass on Celebi instead of U-turn to always escape from Ttar.

***Haunter***** · Nov 12th, 2012, 5:24:00 PM

Perish song+recover+u-turn Celebi is quite possibly the best way to beat sub+calm mind Jirachi. Why do you want to change that set? Now that I think about it, storm drain Gastrodon with earthquake is another solid counter for both CM Jirachi and bulky waters in general. It doesn't learn momentum moves though.

TheSuperSaiyanBreloom · Nov 12th, 2012, 6:04:33 PM

Thanks for the help. Gastrodon is working much better.

PDC · Nov 12th, 2012, 6:06:41 PM

For beating Jirachi you shouldn't look any further that Specially Defensive Perish Song Celebi for a solid counter. It can gain momentum, constantly take it down and in addition cripple it to no end. However Jirachi can actually manage to Perish Sing stall out Celebi if you don't play your cards right. After your first Perish Song the opponent wil know that is your intent. U-Turn out the next time as your opponent will probably switch out knowing they won't be able to do much damage, giving you momentum. Gastrodon with Earthquake will also give you a great answer as it doesn't care about any move aside from Grass Knot.

Scarfwynaut · Nov 12th, 2012, 6:25:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat alkinesthetase

from veekun. judging by this description, the game first makes a roll on 20% to see if an effect is inflicted, then makes a second roll out of 3 to see which effect is chosen. however to be certain you'd need to examine the game code itself... things like these can be finicky.

I don't know about this, I was bored and decided to generate 2 sets of random numbers to see if it mattered. The first set I generated 0-4 to first determine the chance of status (1/5), then 0-2 to determine which status (1/3). When I generated random numbers using only the calculated chance of 1/15 (0-14) the numbers looks pretty much statistically the same. And from what I hear, the pokemon games generate random numbers through seeding time just like I did.

Linneus · Nov 13th, 2012, 12:12:38 PM

So, the addition of Porygon2 from yesterday made me completely overhaul my Trick Room team. It was previously Bronzong, Gigalith, Druddigon and Jellicent; it's been changed to Porygon2, Amoonguss, Heatran and Jellicent. The team covers each other surprisingly well-- if there's literally anything Porygon and 'moonguss can't handle defensively, then Heatran and Jellicent can handle it offensively. The only problem? None of these four are physical attackers. Walls may not be common in in doubles, but there is one thing in particular that absolutely ruins me...

Snorlax. Earthquake, Crunch, Superpower, Return. Thick Fat kills my Ice and Fire coverage moves. His base 30 speed overrides all of my speeds. It's like he was BUILT to screw this team over. How can I counter him? I'm currently using a Macho Brace Emboar with Hammer Arm (the only way to keep my fire coverage and outspeed him and KO on the second turn, and even then it's not a 100% guaranteed 2HKO).

(Keep in mind that, due to the 'Have a team of 6 and pick four of them to battle' nature of Wi-Fi battles, you can add to the team without replacing anyone. That said, if you think I SHOULD replace someone, feel free to suggest. As you can tell, complete team overhauls don't scare me.)

Onicon · Nov 13th, 2012, 3:35:07 PM

You may try something like ChopleBerry-Tyranitar with Unnerve (to circumvent Chople Berries) to 2HKO Snorlax with Low Kick. It doesn't have STAB Fire but has an overall great movepool both physical and special. It's jsut that you have to delay Trick Room for a few turns because you won't get to OHKO.
Another one that comes in mind is Hariyama who can OHKO most Snorlaxes with Close Combat even before Guts activates. Besides it has a good elemental coverage and some nifty Wifi moves like Detect and Wide Guard. Both of them are faster than Snorlax and slow enogh to utilize Trick Room to some extent.
If you prefer a more defensive approach you may have a look at Sableye who can burn Snorlax with WoW even under Trick Room thanks to Prankster. It is pretty splashable because it has no weakness but it still has a hard time against Fire types (immune to WoW) so you may send it out with Jellicent who poses a reasonable threat to them.

Nov 12th, 2012, 2:01:24 PM	#102
ClubbingSealCub Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 385 Spheal @ Thick Club	Scarf TTar reaches 364 with a Jolly Nature, jolly Dugtrio has 372 speed so no, ScarfTar can't outspeed Dugtrio. If Dugtrio is really fucking your Ttar over, the best option would be Shed Shell or simply reevaluate your team. If keeping sand up is so important for your team then you may want to consider using Hippo/Ttar dual sand stream. __________________ RMT: Dune Walkers - Featuring Sandslash Tobes: Infernape is still #22 in standard OU. You all sicken me.

Nov 12th, 2012, 2:28:17 PM	#106
Chimpakt Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 1,295 Cole World!	air balloon is popped whenever. and im not sure if ive ever seen magnezone on a balloon recently. __________________ My youtube channel [Pokemon Narrations, Let's Plays] VM me for OU/UU rates. wish i could change my username to chimpact :[

Nov 12th, 2012, 4:59:55 PM	#118
TheSuperSaiyanBreloom Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 59	I need a pokemon that can take water hits no problem (including tentacruel) and can deal with sub cm jirachi. I also want it to have a momentum move. I have celebi but can anyone tell me a good set for it? the current set I have is recover, giga drain, perish song and ,u-turn. __________________ [17:23:29] Snoobee: THIS IS FOR ALL THE PEOPLE WHO USE OU POKEMON, THEY ARE FUCKING GAY AND NOT ORIGNIAL, PLAY WITH YOUR FAVES YOU FUCKS, TAKE THIS [17:23:30] Snoobee: NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGG

Nov 12th, 2012, 6:04:33 PM	#121
TheSuperSaiyanBreloom Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 59	Thanks for the help. Gastrodon is working much better. __________________ [17:23:29] Snoobee: THIS IS FOR ALL THE PEOPLE WHO USE OU POKEMON, THEY ARE FUCKING GAY AND NOT ORIGNIAL, PLAY WITH YOUR FAVES YOU FUCKS, TAKE THIS [17:23:30] Snoobee: NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGGER NIGG

Nov 12th, 2012, 6:06:41 PM	#122
PDC A coward dies a thousand deaths, a soldier dies but one Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 609	For beating Jirachi you shouldn't look any further that Specially Defensive Perish Song Celebi for a solid counter. It can gain momentum, constantly take it down and in addition cripple it to no end. However Jirachi can actually manage to Perish Sing stall out Celebi if you don't play your cards right. After your first Perish Song the opponent wil know that is your intent. U-Turn out the next time as your opponent will probably switch out knowing they won't be able to do much damage, giving you momentum. Gastrodon with Earthquake will also give you a great answer as it doesn't care about any move aside from Grass Knot. __________________ Leave me a visitor message if you want me to rate your team!

Nov 12th, 2012, 2:15:37 PM	#103
Masamune Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 1,486	What are all of the moves that increase an offensive/defensive stat by 3 stages? I know of Tail Glow and Cotton Guard, but I'm curious as to whether or not there are any more.

Nov 12th, 2012, 2:20:04 PM	#104
Somebody Anonymous Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 45	That's it. Unless you count Coil and Quiver Dance.

Nov 12th, 2012, 2:20:46 PM	#105
Linneus Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 10 Beyond the waves.	An Air Balloon behind a sub cannot be broken, right? And is there any Pokémon who even uses this combo outside of Magnezone?

Nov 12th, 2012, 3:03:40 PM	#110
Linneus Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 10 Beyond the waves.	So, I'm a big fan of Trick Room, and if there's one team I modify the most, it's my TR team. (I've gone from serious sets such as Escavalier to the bottom of the barrel of gimmickiness-- That's right. Scope Lens/Focus Energy/Sniper Octillery.) But no matter what, I always find myself having trouble with that absolute jerk Chandelure. Literally everything that sets up Trick Room is weak to him. (I have three TR setters on my team; Bronzong, Jellicent and Lampent. Chose Lampent because I like to look beyond some of the most OU Pokémon out there most of the time, but that's beside the point.) My question is... Who can brave Chandelure and set up Trick Room? I don't need to outright counter him; hell, I don't even to check him. Once Trick Room's up, I can leave that to my offensive members to stop it.

Nov 12th, 2012, 3:08:53 PM	#111
lokt Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 106	Porygon-2 counters chandelure and sets up trick room. It can trace flash fire to absorb fire moves.

Nov 12th, 2012, 3:11:28 PM	#112
Masamune Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 1,486	It's also immune to ghost type moves.

Nov 12th, 2012, 4:54:44 PM	#117
Lord of Bays Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 475	Are you running your team in UU or OU? If UU, yeah, Chandelure will be an issue with Flame Body to screw with P2 (I actually did myself after a long time of P2 cockblocking me), but if you're in OU, Chandelure and P2 aren't common at all so any Chandelures you DO see will run Flash Fire to deal with Sun-boosted attacks.

Nov 13th, 2012, 12:12:38 PM	#124
Linneus Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 10 Beyond the waves.	So, the addition of Porygon2 from yesterday made me completely overhaul my Trick Room team. It was previously Bronzong, Gigalith, Druddigon and Jellicent; it's been changed to Porygon2, Amoonguss, Heatran and Jellicent. The team covers each other surprisingly well-- if there's literally anything Porygon and 'moonguss can't handle defensively, then Heatran and Jellicent can handle it offensively. The only problem? None of these four are physical attackers. Walls may not be common in in doubles, but there is one thing in particular that absolutely ruins me... Snorlax. Earthquake, Crunch, Superpower, Return. Thick Fat kills my Ice and Fire coverage moves. His base 30 speed overrides all of my speeds. It's like he was BUILT to screw this team over. How can I counter him? I'm currently using a Macho Brace Emboar with Hammer Arm (the only way to keep my fire coverage and outspeed him and KO on the second turn, and even then it's not a 100% guaranteed 2HKO). (Keep in mind that, due to the 'Have a team of 6 and pick four of them to battle' nature of Wi-Fi battles, you can add to the team without replacing anyone. That said, if you think I SHOULD replace someone, feel free to suggest. As you can tell, complete team overhauls don't scare me.)

Nov 13th, 2012, 3:35:07 PM	#125
Onicon Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 696	You may try something like ChopleBerry-Tyranitar with Unnerve (to circumvent Chople Berries) to 2HKO Snorlax with Low Kick. It doesn't have STAB Fire but has an overall great movepool both physical and special. It's jsut that you have to delay Trick Room for a few turns because you won't get to OHKO. Another one that comes in mind is Hariyama who can OHKO most Snorlaxes with Close Combat even before Guts activates. Besides it has a good elemental coverage and some nifty Wifi moves like Detect and Wide Guard. Both of them are faster than Snorlax and slow enogh to utilize Trick Room to some extent. If you prefer a more defensive approach you may have a look at Sableye who can burn Snorlax with WoW even under Trick Room thanks to Prankster. It is pretty splashable because it has no weakness but it still has a hard time against Fire types (immune to WoW) so you may send it out with Jellicent who poses a reasonable threat to them.