OU Cores in the BW2 Metagame - Page 12

Novaray · Dec 31st, 2012, 4:25:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat TheStriker

TerraZelf Offensive Core

Terrakion @ Choice Band
Justified
252 Atk | 4 SDef | 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
252 Atk | 4 SDef | 252 Spe

Cool stuff, like the use of Azelf but this core is easily beaten by CB Scizor who OHKO's both with Bullet Punch. What's the reason to use Scarf Azelf over something such as Scarf Latios other then the added Speed but at the cost of bulk and power? Is there anything vital that Azelf is outspeeding that Latios cannot?

Charro · Dec 31st, 2012, 4:53:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Sciztar

Im suppresed we haven't talked about Magnezone and Kingdra yet. I've been using these two Pokemon on my team recently and they are great together. They are good for countering rain teams and getting rid of steel types.

Kingdra @ Life Orb
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 24 Atk / 252 SpA / 232 Spe
Rash Nature
- Rain Dance
- Waterfall
- Hydro Pump
- Draco Meteor

Everyone who is running a rain team knows how deadly Kingdra can be because more than likely out speeds everything on their team. With Kingdra's STAB Hydro Pump you can expect a 2HKO to majority of your Pokemon unless resist water types. Draco Meteor can get rid of physical attackers and even Rotom-W with Stealth Rock damage. Only Jellicent and Blisset can take a Draco Meteor and retalite back with Thunder Wave, Will-O-Wisp. One way to counter is to Toxic stall Kingdra. With its Life Orb and Toxic Damage you can limit its sweep on your team. Ferrothorn and Jellicent can easily stop Kingdra in the rain as the both can sponge Kingdra's STAB moves. That's why Magnzone can get rid of these two Pokemon.

Chesto Rest Kingdra would be a nice alternative, just let the enemy provide the Rain and you're done, you can set up in front of both Jellicent and Blissey since rest + chesto will take care of status, and just let Mag take care of Ferro and Skarmory (who doesn't take a +1 waterfall under rain very well)

Trinitrotoluene · Jan 1st, 2013, 1:30:55 AM

Is it time to reveal another one of my favorite offensive cores? Yes, it is.

Latios @ Choice Specs | Levitate
Timid | 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe | 0 Atk
Draco Meteor | Surf | Psyshock | Trick

This core of three revolves around the powerful attacks the three can throw around, as well as the incredible synergy their typings are responsible for. What are the only Pokemon that can stop Scarf Keldeo from ripping teams apart? Celebi, Starmie, Latios, Latias, Slowbro / Slowking, Amoonguss. What do they all have in common? A vulnerability to CBtar's Pursuit and Crunch. After a Pursuit / Crunch from Tyranitar, the aforementioned Pokemon should either be KOed or in critical condition, unable to take an attack from Keldeo.

The third member of this core, Latios, is meant to serve as a more reliable counter to Amoonguss, as well as a wall-breaker and check to opposing Keldeo. It also helps that Latios gives trouble to sun teams, many of which cannot take a Specs-boosted Draco Meteor once their Heatran and / or Forretress have been weakened, a task which Tyranitar and Keldeo excel at. Sheer Force RP Landorus, a threat to Tyranitar and Keldeo, is also handily checked by Latios.

Now, despite how good this core looks, it does have its fair share of problems. For instance, offensive LO Volcarona is public enemy numero uno. It can grab a boost against Latios and Keldeo locked into the wrong move and proceed to wreak havoc against the core with its Fire / Bug STAB, and if it opts to use Giga Drain, then Keldeo cannot be used as a counter. Bulky variants can actually stomach a non-boosted Hydro Pump at +1 and continue to set itself up. SD Lucario is another problem if Keldeo and Latios have been weakened, since it can run through the core after a boost and prior damage on the two. Opposing Dragons are also a problem, necessitating the use of a Steel-type to help beat them down. Offensive SD Scizor is a problem if it can set itself up.

As for teammates that support this core, Heatran seems to have worked as a great partner, since it deals with the issue of Volcarona, Scizor, and Dragon-types rather effectively. Also, if you use certain Heatran sets, then Heatran can also be used to provide SR support. Powerful late-game sweepers, such as SD Techniloom, Sheer Force Landorus, and Terrakion among others, also appreciate the strength this core brings, allowing them to clean up house in the end-game. All in all, while this core may have some problems, I think that it is a rather solid offensive core that does well against the majority of what is thrown at it.

Shokwav · Jan 1st, 2013, 1:41:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Trinitrotoluene

Is it time to reveal another one of my favorite offensive cores? Yes, it is.

This core looks very solid, but you still have Celebi issues. The standard Sp. Def Celebi can U-turn on Ttar for sizable damage, can take a Draco from Latios and Recover it off, and can laugh at anything Keldeo does. Though, Heatran would solve these issues if said Celebi is lacking Earth Power (which Sp. Defensive variants usually don't run).

...

EDIT: Lol, I thought your Ttar was Scarfed, ignore the uturn bit

LilOuOn · Jan 1st, 2013, 12:35:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Shokwav

This core looks very solid, but you still have Celebi issues. The standard Sp. Def Celebi can U-turn on Ttar for sizable damage, can take a Draco from Latios and Recover it off, and can laugh at anything Keldeo does. Though, Heatran would solve these issues if said Celebi is lacking Earth Power (which Sp. Defensive variants usually don't run).

...

EDIT: Lol, I thought your Ttar was Scarfed, ignore the uturn bit

Yeah, haha you confused with the scarf. Just some calcs so everybody can see that Banded T-tar works really nice in this core (my favorite too)

252 Atk Choice Band Tyranitar (+Atk) Pursuit vs 252 HP/0 Def Celebi: 109.16% - 128.47%
Guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tyranitar (+Atk) Pursuit vs 252 HP/0 Def Latias: 131.87% - 155.77%
Guaranteed OHKO

This calcs are made with the switch out of both pokes*

gengarsnemisis · Jan 1st, 2013, 4:47:53 PM

Espeon @

Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 Hp / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Timid
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Psychic
- Baton Pass

Lucario @

Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- ExtremeSpeed
- Bullet Punch/Crunch

These two mons work amazing together. Dual screens is actually a viable strategy in this meta and is incredibly underused, it can do amazing stuff like completely trolling a rain team with light screen and making your team substantially more bulky on both sides of the spectrum. Dual screens are actually easier to set up than you may think, as it easily is set up on walls, I can often set up multiple screens a game. The movesets are pretty simple, dual screens and light clay for long screens, pyschic for stab and baton pass to escape pursuit. Baton pass also lets you abuse lucarios justified ability to great affect, switching into pursuits to grab a free boost. Lucarios set is standard, bullet punch for if your team stuggles more with terrakion and gengar, or crunch for jellicent (im not a fan of ice punch). Lucario greatly appreciates the screens making setting up much easier and making him actually "bulky". Other members I like to pair with this core is dnite or scarfmence, as dnite becomes a behemoth behind screens and mence can run through teams and be less likely to be revenged, they also have great synergy with lucario, and benefit from espeons magic bounce. If you wanna try something different give this little core a shot!

TheStriker · Jan 2nd, 2013, 1:13:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat gengarsnemisis

Espeon @

Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 Hp / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Timid
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Psychic
- Baton Pass

Lucario @

Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- ExtremeSpeed
- Bullet Punch/Crunch

These two mons work amazing together. Dual screens is actually a viable strategy in this meta and is incredibly underused, it can do amazing stuff like completely trolling a rain team with light screen and making your team substantially more bulky on both sides of the spectrum. Dual screens are actually easier to set up than you may think, as it easily is set up on walls, I can often set up multiple screens a game. The movesets are pretty simple, dual screens and light clay for long screens, pyschic for stab and baton pass to escape pursuit. Baton pass also lets you abuse lucarios justified ability to great affect, switching into pursuits to grab a free boost. Lucarios set is standard, bullet punch for if your team stuggles more with terrakion and gengar, or crunch for jellicent (im not a fan of ice punch). Lucario greatly appreciates the screens making setting up much easier and making him actually "bulky". Other members I like to pair with this core is dnite or scarfmence, as dnite becomes a behemoth behind screens and mence can run through teams and be less likely to be revenged, they also have great synergy with lucario, and benefit from espeons magic bounce. If you wanna try something different give this little core a shot!

Psyshock over psychic

Silk scarf over life orb

Y is there baton pass when there is nothin to pass use a diff move

LilOuOn · Jan 2nd, 2013, 1:23:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat TheStriker

Y is there baton pass when there is nothin to pass use a diff move

Batton pass is there to escape from Pursuit users like T-tar, otherwise, your espeon is fast food. gengarnemesis explained it here:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat gengarnemesis

pyschic for stab and baton pass to escape pursuit.

**Arcticblast** · Jan 2nd, 2013, 1:25:54 PM

@ TheStriker

Psyshock is more useful in the current metagame to hit Tentacruel and CM Keldeo, sure, but with Psyshock you lose to Conkeldurr and can't touch OU's array of physically bulky Pokemon. It's a matter of opinion, really.

Why would you ever use Silk Scarf on Lucario? The entire point of using SD Lucario is to spam that insanely powerful (2HKOes Skarmory!) LO Close Combat. With Silk Scarf you lose a ton of power, even on Extremespeed.

+2 252+ Atk Lucario Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 220-259 (65.86 - 77.54%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Lucario Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 286-337 (85.62 - 100.89%) -- 81.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Lucario ExtremeSpeed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tornadus-T: 266-315 (88.96 - 105.35%)
+2 252+ Atk Silk Scarf Lucario ExtremeSpeed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tornadus-T: 246-290 (82.27 - 96.98%)

Baton Pass avoids Pursuit, meaning Espeon doesn't get destroyed by CBTar and instead Lucario gets +1 (on top of the eventual SD boost) in exchange for 16% max damage.

Shokwav · Jan 2nd, 2013, 1:38:46 PM

Here's an offensive core that's great on rain teams.

Choice Specs
252 Sp. Atk/252 Spd/4 Hp
Timid

Thunder
Volt Switch
Shadow Ball
Hidden Power Ice

Specs Thunder Jolteon is so underrated on rain teams; besides being the fastest mon in the tier, it also has a good 110 Sp. Atk stat from which he can fire off Thunders with ease, which wrecks everything on a Rain team not named Ferrothorn. (Even a 252/252 Calm Rotom-W is always 2HKOd). If Ferrothorn is gone, though, it's basically game as not even Tornadus-t can outspeed Jolteon.

Choice Scarf
252 Sp. Atk/252 Spd/4 Hp
Timid

Surf
Hydro Pump
Secred Sword
Hidden Power Ice

I think we already know the beauty of this beast. She makes an excellent duo with Jolteon, as she takes out Ground-types like Gliscor, Landorus-t, etc. that threaten Jolteon, while Jolteon takes out opposing bulky Waters.

flea · Jan 7th, 2013, 11:44:59 PM

I've been using this offensive core that's a little bit counter-intuitive, but it actually works surprisingly well...Tyranideo?

Tyranitar @ Choice Band
Trait: Sand Stream
Adamant Nature (+Atk., -SpA.)
EV's: 180 HP, 252 Atk, 76 Spe
-Pursuit
-Stone Edge
-Crunch
-Superpower

Keldeo @ Choice Specs
Trait: Justified
Nature: Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
-Hydro Pump
-Surf
-Secret Sword
-Icy Wind

It's a pretty simple concept, really. Keldeo's main counters (Jellicent, Lati@s, Celebi) are very vulnerable to being checkmated by CB Pursuit T-tar. After those Pokes are gone, there is hardly anything that will enjoy eating specs Keldeo's dual stabs. The nuclear power of Specs Keldeo also helps you make rain teams tread a little more carefully around you. You still have to carry stuff that can beat Tentacruel, Amoonguss, etc., but the point is, this is a cool offensive combination and even without the rain Keldeo can be a very viable Pokemon (although I'm pretty sure a lot of people know that already).

ClubbingSealCub · Jan 8th, 2013, 2:08:13 AM

Tyranitar + Keldeo is not counter intuitive at all lol, everybody is aware of its power at this point. It has been suggested 2 or 3 times in this thread already I think.

Halcyon of Light · Jan 8th, 2013, 2:11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat ClubbingSealCub

Tyranitar + Keldeo is not counter intuitive at all lol, everybody is aware of its power at this point. It has been suggested 2 or 3 times in this thread already I think.

Yep, it was mentioned on this page, in fact. It's a great pair, but I think it's pretty well known at this point.

flea · Jan 8th, 2013, 10:27:05 AM

Yeah lol definitely should've looked at the thread a little more. I suppose at the very least I found something that's good. Definitely will have to try Scarf Keldeo+ Specs Latios as well

mcdanger · Jan 10th, 2013, 8:41:52 PM

Been wanting to get some opinions about this core for awhile, may aswell post it here

Latios (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Surf

Terrakion @ Salac Berry
Trait: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge
- Substitute
- Swords Dance

Volcarona (M) @ Lum Berry
Trait: Flame Body
EVs: 60 Def / 252 SAtk / 196 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Quiver Dance
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Obviously it needs rapid spin support for volcarona, so top offensive threats for the team are scarfed terrakion tho it cant spam close combat or stone edge leaving it to predicting, and banded scizor, tho he can`t do much to volcarona, but volcarona`s terrible defense often makes it hard to come in and stop threats. Thus the best spinner is normally tentacruel, or switching latios for latias, as it does the same thing with more bulk, but less power.
Volcarona`s evs and movespread let him function late game like gensect but without the +2 speed, life orb can be used over lum berry so at +1 volcarona can OHKO tornadus and latios with stealth rocks

Takion · Jan 11th, 2013, 12:56:15 PM

What do you guys think?

Lucario (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Justified

EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd

Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Bullet Punch
- ExtremeSpeed

Jellicent @ Leftovers
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk

Calm Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Shadow Ball
- Recover
- Scald

Heatran @ Air Balloon
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
Calm Nature
- Earth Power
- Lava Plume
- Protect
- Roar

The team being built around Lucario, Jellicent and Heatran counter his weaknesses effectively. However, choosing the other teammates have been problematic...do you guys believe it being a problem with the Core or the members Im choosing?

Halcyon of Light · Jan 11th, 2013, 1:36:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Takion

What do you guys think?

Lucario (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Justified

EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd

Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Bullet Punch
- ExtremeSpeed

Jellicent @ Leftovers
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk

Calm Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Shadow Ball
- Recover
- Scald

Heatran @ Air Balloon
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
Calm Nature
- Earth Power
- Lava Plume
- Protect
- Roar

The team being built around Lucario, Jellicent and Heatran counter his weaknesses effectively. However, choosing the other teammates have been problematic...do you guys believe it being a problem with the Core or the members Im choosing?

Right off the bat I see a pretty huge weakness to Breloom. Maybe adding a physically defensive Celebi would help fix that.

Takion · Jan 11th, 2013, 2:25:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Halcyon of Light

Right off the bat I see a pretty huge weakness to Breloom. Maybe adding a physically defensive Celebi would help fix that.

Added. Should I add a sleep talker to counter spore absurers?

Intergalactic · Jan 11th, 2013, 2:42:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Takion

What do you guys think?

...

I wouldn't say it's a problem with the core, but it's not really helping itself out much with the main threat it fails to stand up against - Breloom, evidently. I don't think just having the remaining members of your team patch up a weakness that your core universally has works, personally - that goes for any core - so I'd say replacing something within would probably be for the best.

I'd say Jellicent is probably the most replaceable of the three, with Heatran doing a well enough job with spreading burns as Jellicent would (it lacks a recovery move, but Leftovers and Protect give it some staying power anyway). To help with Breloom, I'd suggest either a Latios over Jellicent for the power, or maybe an LO Tank Latias in the same spot.

Still works together well with Lucario, and both are able to take Breloom down relatively well - LO Tank Latias can probably do this better, having a little more bulk than Latios - and heal off damage that it takes.

If you're adamant on keeping Jellicent for some reason, though I don't see why you would, changing your Heatran to a more offensive set - well, anything with Timid and max Speed investment - means you're able to outspeed Breloom and OHKO with insert Fire-type move here. Not a reliable way of beating it by any means, but it's a start.

Takion · Jan 11th, 2013, 3:07:41 PM

I see where your coming from, but is adding a lets say Choice Scarf Latios along with this core not enough to stop breloom?

Intergalactic · Jan 11th, 2013, 3:17:42 PM

It would help, but you'd be better off either working Lati@s into that three-member core or making sure there are at least two other Pokémon on the team that can handle Breloom well. Having to rely on Lati@s to take care of Breloom on the benefit of an entire core is a little too risky, don't you think. Either make sure there are a couple of options or replace a weak link inside it. With Jellicent and Heatran in that core so similar (ish), it seems more efficient. But just having a Lati in the team would be a great help, yes - just make sure it's enough.

LilOuOn · Jan 11th, 2013, 6:54:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Halcyon of Light

Right off the bat I see a pretty huge weakness to Breloom. Maybe adding a physically defensive Celebi would help fix that.

Celebi and Lati@s are really good counters for breloom but if you play right you can get a SD before loom comes out and OHKO with E-speed or KO without boosts if it is weakened.

Halcyon of Light · Jan 11th, 2013, 7:20:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat LilOuOn

Breloom and Lati@s are really good counters for breloom but if you play right you can get a SD before loom comes out and OHKO with E-speed or KO without boosts if it is weakened.

Yeah Lati@s can be a fantastic counter to Breloom, I just prefer Celebi because it doesn't mind being Spored, nor does it mind taking the occasional Focus Punch, whereas Latios does not. Either one is fine, really. And yeah, Extremespeed from Lucario can definitely be a way to deal with Breloom, but only after a Swords Dance or prior damage, which is never a good thing to rely on.

BKC · Jan 12th, 2013, 5:49:54 AM

Just wanted to mention that while Tyranitar + Keldeo has been around for a while, Tyranitar + RP Landorus is fairly uncommon yet absolutely brutal. Lando has two safe counters -- Latias & SpDef Celebi. Tyranitar completely rapes both of them. Basically this post is an attempt to raise awareness for CBtar + Scarf/Specs Keld + RP Lando, which is one of the strongest offensive cores in the metagame right now. It doesn't have the greatest of defensive synergy, however (Tornadus-T completely destroys it, for instance), so I like to back it up with a strong defensive 3-mon core. One of my better teams was CBtar/Specs or Scarf Keld/RP Lando/Scarf or SpD Jira/Amoonguss/LO Latias, to give an example. Give it a shot!

ClubbingSealCub · Jan 12th, 2013, 7:13:29 AM

^I've tried a very similar set up (I like a more defensive backbone though, so I've got Slowbro instead of LO Latias for physical attackers and Scarf Latios in place of scarf Keldeo for a better "catch-all" revenge killer) and I can attest to the effectiveness of CBtar + RP Lando.

Your team seems pretty weak to Terrakion, now that I think about it. None of your mons can switch safely into it. How do you play around him?

Jan 1st, 2013, 1:30:55 AM	#278
Trinitrotoluene And we will never be alone again / 'cause it doesn't happen everyday / kinda counted on you being a friend / can I give it up or give it away... Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 721 np: Daft Punk - Instant Crush (feat. Julian Casablancas) Mentor	Is it time to reveal another one of my favorite offensive cores? Yes, it is. Tyranitar @ Choice Band \| Sand Stream Adamant \| 156 HP / 252 Atk / 100 Spe Crunch \| Pursuit \| Stone Edge \| Superpower Keldeo @ Choice Scarf \| Justified Timid \| 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe \| 2 Atk / 30 Def Hydro Pump \| Secret Sword \| Hidden Power \| Surf Latios @ Choice Specs \| Levitate Timid \| 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe \| 0 Atk Draco Meteor \| Surf \| Psyshock \| Trick This core of three revolves around the powerful attacks the three can throw around, as well as the incredible synergy their typings are responsible for. What are the only Pokemon that can stop Scarf Keldeo from ripping teams apart? Celebi, Starmie, Latios, Latias, Slowbro / Slowking, Amoonguss. What do they all have in common? A vulnerability to CBtar's Pursuit and Crunch. After a Pursuit / Crunch from Tyranitar, the aforementioned Pokemon should either be KOed or in critical condition, unable to take an attack from Keldeo. The third member of this core, Latios, is meant to serve as a more reliable counter to Amoonguss, as well as a wall-breaker and check to opposing Keldeo. It also helps that Latios gives trouble to sun teams, many of which cannot take a Specs-boosted Draco Meteor once their Heatran and / or Forretress have been weakened, a task which Tyranitar and Keldeo excel at. Sheer Force RP Landorus, a threat to Tyranitar and Keldeo, is also handily checked by Latios. Now, despite how good this core looks, it does have its fair share of problems. For instance, offensive LO Volcarona is public enemy numero uno. It can grab a boost against Latios and Keldeo locked into the wrong move and proceed to wreak havoc against the core with its Fire / Bug STAB, and if it opts to use Giga Drain, then Keldeo cannot be used as a counter. Bulky variants can actually stomach a non-boosted Hydro Pump at +1 and continue to set itself up. SD Lucario is another problem if Keldeo and Latios have been weakened, since it can run through the core after a boost and prior damage on the two. Opposing Dragons are also a problem, necessitating the use of a Steel-type to help beat them down. Offensive SD Scizor is a problem if it can set itself up. As for teammates that support this core, Heatran seems to have worked as a great partner, since it deals with the issue of Volcarona, Scizor, and Dragon-types rather effectively. Also, if you use certain Heatran sets, then Heatran can also be used to provide SR support. Powerful late-game sweepers, such as SD Techniloom, Sheer Force Landorus, and Terrakion among others, also appreciate the strength this core brings, allowing them to clean up house in the end-game. All in all, while this core may have some problems, I think that it is a rather solid offensive core that does well against the majority of what is thrown at it. __________________ Last edited by Trinitrotoluene; Jan 1st, 2013 at 2:09:03 AM.

Jan 1st, 2013, 4:47:53 PM	#281
gengarsnemisis Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 126	Espeon @ Magic Bounce EVs: 252 Hp / 4 Def / 252 Spd Timid - Reflect - Light Screen - Psychic - Baton Pass Lucario @ Justified EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def Adamant - Swords Dance - Close Combat - ExtremeSpeed - Bullet Punch/Crunch These two mons work amazing together. Dual screens is actually a viable strategy in this meta and is incredibly underused, it can do amazing stuff like completely trolling a rain team with light screen and making your team substantially more bulky on both sides of the spectrum. Dual screens are actually easier to set up than you may think, as it easily is set up on walls, I can often set up multiple screens a game. The movesets are pretty simple, dual screens and light clay for long screens, pyschic for stab and baton pass to escape pursuit. Baton pass also lets you abuse lucarios justified ability to great affect, switching into pursuits to grab a free boost. Lucarios set is standard, bullet punch for if your team stuggles more with terrakion and gengar, or crunch for jellicent (im not a fan of ice punch). Lucario greatly appreciates the screens making setting up much easier and making him actually "bulky". Other members I like to pair with this core is dnite or scarfmence, as dnite becomes a behemoth behind screens and mence can run through teams and be less likely to be revenged, they also have great synergy with lucario, and benefit from espeons magic bounce. If you wanna try something different give this little core a shot! __________________ PS name- uberscape

Jan 2nd, 2013, 1:25:54 PM	#284
Arcticblast is going goat Moderator Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 2,976 #serperiors Mentor	@ TheStriker Psyshock is more useful in the current metagame to hit Tentacruel and CM Keldeo, sure, but with Psyshock you lose to Conkeldurr and can't touch OU's array of physically bulky Pokemon. It's a matter of opinion, really. Why would you ever use Silk Scarf on Lucario? The entire point of using SD Lucario is to spam that insanely powerful (2HKOes Skarmory!) LO Close Combat. With Silk Scarf you lose a ton of power, even on Extremespeed. +2 252+ Atk Lucario Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 220-259 (65.86 - 77.54%) -- guaranteed 2HKO +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Lucario Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 286-337 (85.62 - 100.89%) -- 81.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Lucario ExtremeSpeed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tornadus-T: 266-315 (88.96 - 105.35%) +2 252+ Atk Silk Scarf Lucario ExtremeSpeed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tornadus-T: 246-290 (82.27 - 96.98%) Baton Pass avoids Pursuit, meaning Espeon doesn't get destroyed by CBTar and instead Lucario gets +1 (on top of the eventual SD boost) in exchange for 16% max damage. __________________ New to Smogon? Afraid to jump into discussion? Introduce yourself! ------------------- Fail Cup \| Scramble! \| RMTs: Blistering Sands (BH) Night Stall (OU) \| ARcTicblast \| Demon Spawn \| signature art by Zracknel additional credit to Pocket and AccidentalGreed

Jan 2nd, 2013, 1:38:46 PM	#285
Shokwav Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 171 Location: Kyoto, Japan	Here's an offensive core that's great on rain teams. Choice Specs 252 Sp. Atk/252 Spd/4 Hp Timid Thunder Volt Switch Shadow Ball Hidden Power Ice Specs Thunder Jolteon is so underrated on rain teams; besides being the fastest mon in the tier, it also has a good 110 Sp. Atk stat from which he can fire off Thunders with ease, which wrecks everything on a Rain team not named Ferrothorn. (Even a 252/252 Calm Rotom-W is always 2HKOd). If Ferrothorn is gone, though, it's basically game as not even Tornadus-t can outspeed Jolteon. Choice Scarf 252 Sp. Atk/252 Spd/4 Hp Timid Surf Hydro Pump Secred Sword Hidden Power Ice I think we already know the beauty of this beast. She makes an excellent duo with Jolteon, as she takes out Ground-types like Gliscor, Landorus-t, etc. that threaten Jolteon, while Jolteon takes out opposing bulky Waters. __________________ B/W - 4040-8954-0549 Shokwav on #pokemon and #yugioh

Jan 7th, 2013, 11:44:59 PM	#286
flea Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 43 Suuuuuper Geeeenius	I've been using this offensive core that's a little bit counter-intuitive, but it actually works surprisingly well...Tyranideo? Tyranitar @ Choice Band Trait: Sand Stream Adamant Nature (+Atk., -SpA.) EV's: 180 HP, 252 Atk, 76 Spe -Pursuit -Stone Edge -Crunch -Superpower Keldeo @ Choice Specs Trait: Justified Nature: Timid (+Spe, -Atk) -Hydro Pump -Surf -Secret Sword -Icy Wind It's a pretty simple concept, really. Keldeo's main counters (Jellicent, Lati@s, Celebi) are very vulnerable to being checkmated by CB Pursuit T-tar. After those Pokes are gone, there is hardly anything that will enjoy eating specs Keldeo's dual stabs. The nuclear power of Specs Keldeo also helps you make rain teams tread a little more carefully around you. You still have to carry stuff that can beat Tentacruel, Amoonguss, etc., but the point is, this is a cool offensive combination and even without the rain Keldeo can be a very viable Pokemon (although I'm pretty sure a lot of people know that already). __________________ I've got my ACME rewards card.

Jan 8th, 2013, 2:08:13 AM	#287
ClubbingSealCub Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 385 Spheal @ Thick Club	Tyranitar + Keldeo is not counter intuitive at all lol, everybody is aware of its power at this point. It has been suggested 2 or 3 times in this thread already I think. __________________ RMT: Dune Walkers - Featuring Sandslash Tobes: Infernape is still #22 in standard OU. You all sicken me.

Jan 8th, 2013, 10:27:05 AM	#289
flea Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 43 Suuuuuper Geeeenius	Yeah lol definitely should've looked at the thread a little more. I suppose at the very least I found something that's good. Definitely will have to try Scarf Keldeo+ Specs Latios as well __________________ I've got my ACME rewards card.

Jan 10th, 2013, 8:41:52 PM	#290
mcdanger Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 39 schroon lake	Been wanting to get some opinions about this core for awhile, may aswell post it here Latios (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Levitate EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Draco Meteor - Psyshock - Hidden Power [Fire] - Surf Terrakion @ Salac Berry Trait: Justified EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk) - Close Combat - Stone Edge - Substitute - Swords Dance Volcarona (M) @ Lum Berry Trait: Flame Body EVs: 60 Def / 252 SAtk / 196 Spd Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk) - Fire Blast - Quiver Dance - Giga Drain - Hidden Power [Ice] Obviously it needs rapid spin support for volcarona, so top offensive threats for the team are scarfed terrakion tho it cant spam close combat or stone edge leaving it to predicting, and banded scizor, tho he can`t do much to volcarona, but volcarona`s terrible defense often makes it hard to come in and stop threats. Thus the best spinner is normally tentacruel, or switching latios for latias, as it does the same thing with more bulk, but less power. Volcarona`s evs and movespread let him function late game like gensect but without the +2 speed, life orb can be used over lum berry so at +1 volcarona can OHKO tornadus and latios with stealth rocks

Jan 11th, 2013, 12:56:15 PM	#291
Takion Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 89	What do you guys think? Lucario (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Justified EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd Adamant Nature - Swords Dance - Close Combat - Bullet Punch - ExtremeSpeed Jellicent @ Leftovers Trait: Water Absorb EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk Calm Nature - Will-O-Wisp - Shadow Ball - Recover - Scald Heatran @ Air Balloon Trait: Flash Fire EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk Calm Nature - Earth Power - Lava Plume - Protect - Roar The team being built around Lucario, Jellicent and Heatran counter his weaknesses effectively. However, choosing the other teammates have been problematic...do you guys believe it being a problem with the Core or the members Im choosing?

Jan 11th, 2013, 3:07:41 PM	#295
Takion Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 89	I see where your coming from, but is adding a lets say Choice Scarf Latios along with this core not enough to stop breloom?

Jan 11th, 2013, 3:17:42 PM	#296
Intergalactic Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 52 Heroic.	It would help, but you'd be better off either working Lati@s into that three-member core or making sure there are at least two other Pokémon on the team that can handle Breloom well. Having to rely on Lati@s to take care of Breloom on the benefit of an entire core is a little too risky, don't you think. Either make sure there are a couple of options or replace a weak link inside it. With Jellicent and Heatran in that core so similar (ish), it seems more efficient. But just having a Lati in the team would be a great help, yes - just make sure it's enough. __________________ Unteachable \| Psychotic

Jan 12th, 2013, 5:49:54 AM	#299
BKC bringer of torture Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,235 Prague	Just wanted to mention that while Tyranitar + Keldeo has been around for a while, Tyranitar + RP Landorus is fairly uncommon yet absolutely brutal. Lando has two safe counters -- Latias & SpDef Celebi. Tyranitar completely rapes both of them. Basically this post is an attempt to raise awareness for CBtar + Scarf/Specs Keld + RP Lando, which is one of the strongest offensive cores in the metagame right now. It doesn't have the greatest of defensive synergy, however (Tornadus-T completely destroys it, for instance), so I like to back it up with a strong defensive 3-mon core. One of my better teams was CBtar/Specs or Scarf Keld/RP Lando/Scarf or SpD Jira/Amoonguss/LO Latias, to give an example. Give it a shot!

Jan 12th, 2013, 7:13:29 AM	#300
ClubbingSealCub Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 385 Spheal @ Thick Club	^I've tried a very similar set up (I like a more defensive backbone though, so I've got Slowbro instead of LO Latias for physical attackers and Scarf Latios in place of scarf Keldeo for a better "catch-all" revenge killer) and I can attest to the effectiveness of CBtar + RP Lando. Your team seems pretty weak to Terrakion, now that I think about it. None of your mons can switch safely into it. How do you play around him? __________________ RMT: Dune Walkers - Featuring Sandslash Tobes: Infernape is still #22 in standard OU. You all sicken me.