The Next Best Thing

[youngjake93]

The idea of this set is to do Espeon's job without losing momentum. It comes in on the hazard setter, threatens with a OHKO(2HKO for deo-d) if it stays in, but will 2HKO bulky things like Tyranitar/Jirachi switching in to attempt to take momentum back and/or change the weather.
I've got HP Fire over HP Fighting to threaten Skarmory, Ferrothorn, Scizor, etc and because you shouldn't be trying to take on Tyranitar 1v1 anyway(grass knot KOs switch-ins).
With Modest you still outspeed +Spd base 95s.

Espeon @ Life Orb
Trait: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 Def
Modest Nature
- Grass Knot
- Hidden Power Fire
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball

______________
252+ SpA Life Orb Espeon Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tyranitar in sand: 179-213 (44.3 - 52.72%) -- 85.55% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Life Orb Espeon Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Deoxys-D: 166-198 (54.6 - 65.13%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Espeon Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Politoed: 211-250 (54.94 - 65.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Life Orb Espeon Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn: 333-395 (94.6 - 112.21%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Life Orb Espeon Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tentacruel: 359-424 (98.62 - 116.48%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Life Orb Espeon Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Jirachi: 221-260 (54.7 - 64.35%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Life Orb Espeon Psychic vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Dragonite: 208-247 (64.39 - 76.47%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock



Most of these sets being suggested for Espeon seem at least as useful as the on-site ones tbh.

[Asterat]

Espeon (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 228 Def / 28 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Psychic / Psyshock
- Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ground
- Calm Mind/Wish
- Baton Pass
These EVs allow espeon to take 2 gyro balls from ferrothorn (stolen from doughboy). However the set is very different. This set is calm mind passing or wish passing. Baton pass wish and calm mind are some of espeon's best moves. This set works ideally on a sun team allowing espeon to heal up ninetales, or whatever else. Wishes are not huge admittedly, but they can be very helpful. Calm Mind allows espeon to pass into something like venusaur for a sweep! Hidden Power fire with mixed venusaur and hidden power ground with special attacker, as a lure for heatran.

[Novaray]

Voting Period for Espeon starts now, here are links to each set you can vote for:

Milos
Onicon
Cyredax
Homeslice
ThePillsburyDoughBoy
Deglas
youngjake93
Asterat

For voting, just put the username of the person you wish to vote for in bold and a short 1 or 2 sentence explanation for why you chose that set. Voting will be open for 2 days! Feel free to VM or PM me any suggestions for the next test subject if you have any.

[youngjake93]

Youngjake93
Yawnspeon is cool though.

Oh plus I'm surprised no one made a fake tears set. It is the equivalent of scoring the 2hko on the switch in, but it eases prediction tremendously. I was going to suggest it, but I thought 3 coverage moves+STAB was more viable.

[Manitary]

Deglas

Yawn + BPass/Protect is an original way to grab momentum (and sometimes put an enemy pokémon to sleep)

[Lunar Fist]

Onicon

Imo his set is the most original while still having a good chance to work (in theory at least).

[Homeslice]

Homeslice
I can vote for myself right

[Aerophoenix]

ThePillsburyDoughBoy

[Halcyon of Light]

Onicon

Because putting even more pressure on an opponent that usual in the current metagame is key to winning. Couple this with hazards and you could easily dispose on a lot of threats.

[The Unlucky one]

Onicon
Works really well in an offesnive meta and espeon adding offensive pressure/momentum is nearly unheard of.

[scorpdestroyer]

Deglas, a phazing Espeon is cool

[Deglas]

Deglas
I am going to vote for myself. Onicon's is a very close second though. I think I might try fusing our ideas by using Future Sight over Psychic on my set. That could be a huge momentum thief. Use Future Sight then Yawn to sleep their switchin or make something else eat the Future Sight.

[Alexander.]

ThePillsburyDoughBoy

[Joeyboy]

youngjake93

All out offensive Espeon seems like a cool idea to me. The calcs he provided show that he can most definitely get by all of its usual counters, specifically Tyranitar and Scizor. Scizor is easily OHKO'd and Tyranitar had better be scarfed if it doesn't want to risk the 2HKO switching in. None of the other sets, besides maybe the CM one, get through Espeons common counters, they just do things like Yawn or Baton Pass out of them.

[Deluks917]

Doughboy

[gengarsnemisis]

Deglas

[stairwaytohell]

Deglas

I like the idea of Yawn + Protect, it should works great against espeon's common counters.

[youngjake93]

I didn't know we could vote for ourselves haha I thought you were supposed to vote for the best one that wasn't your own. Also, I was wondering if we were supposed to vote based on how viable or how cool the sets are because future sight, for example, is a lot cooler than it is viable.
Oh and I think Joeyboy's votes should count for extra since he won the vote twice :D

[Cherub Agent]

youngjake93

this dude's got it right, espeon's bulk is bad, and i much prefer using a pokemon according to its strongest stats. i wouldn't mess around with yawn and stuff when i can just KO my target. seems like an interesting idea to use modest nature actually, i never would have thought of that

[DarkBlazeR]

youngjake93

[Deglas]

youngjake, you can go back and edit your post if you wish. The vote must be bold to be counted though.

[ReddyGo]

youngjake93

Those calcs are seriously impressive and come as huge surprises to myself and I'm sure an opponent. The Yawn and idea sound cool, but I don't think that Espeon does Yawn any better than say Jolteon or another Pokemon with Yawn.

[TropiOUs]

youngjake93

[Novaray]

Voting is now closed and the winner is youngjake93's Life Orb Espeon set. This set will be added in the archive featured in the second post of the thread.

The next subject is everyone's favorite Grass pixie, Celebi!

Recently, Specially Defensive Celebi variants have started to rise up again as a check to Rain teams with the recent banning of Tornadus-T. In the past Nasty Plot variants were quite effective with solid coverage and a buffed Giga Drain in Gen V that allows Celebi to deal damage while healing herself. However, the set lost quite a bit of popularity during the Genesect and Tornadus-T eras. What are some creative Celebi sets you guys have used?

[Old Jack]

My favorite set for Celebi is definitively the offensive LO although the most common set currently is the specially defensive.
He can get rid of pursuit users such as ttar and scizor and doing massives damages to anything that underestimate his power.




Celebi @ Life Orb
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Satk / 200 Spd
Modest Nature (+Satk, -Atk)
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power Fire / Earth Power / Psychic
- U-Turn
- Recover

The EVs grant Celebi to outspeed max Spd Mamoswine, the rest go in Satk and bulk. Leaf Storm is a clean OHKO against any version of Politoed and kills CB Ttar with rocks up. (62.5% chance to OHKO without)
The second move comes to what your team need. HP fire deals with steels, earth power for heatran, jirachi and tentacruel and finally psychic is a cool second stab.
U-turn is the crux of the set to keep the momentum and recover allows celebi to come back more oftenly.