Pokémon BW2 In-game Tier List Mark II

[Antihaxxer]

I only use Lillipup is my first Japanese run, and it was decent. Intimidate is always useful, good stats, good moves (Earlier Return / Frustration). He gets Fire Fang earlier (very good for Steel Type in Chargestone Cave) than in BW1 and can learn Superpower.

He can nuke Elesa with a powerful Return.
Crunch can help in Clay's gym against all the Baltoy
Thunder Fang destroys Skyla's gym & Marlon's gym (Except against fast Scald users)
Ice Fang + Intimidate > Dragons (except Bulky Druddigon)
Crunch / Superpower can help him against Elite 4 too.

Stoutland has 6 interesting moves (Elemental Fangs / Return / Crunch / Superpower). You have to use these HeartScales for him and rotate the moves. If your team has already powerful elemental attacks, you don't need to rotate. He's High-material for me



I didn't use the others, but Audino and Onix without trade are Bottom tier for me

[Magcargo 2]

Emolga is nothing but low. If you are playing white two, electabuzz outclasses it completely. In black 2, there's still mareep, who gives emolga a run for it's money with it's higher defences and special attack. Emolga is rare and has mediocre stats across the board, so it really isn't worth it.

[celever]

Ugh, was going to do Muk's entry but my computer is so bad that it slows down when it has this and bulbapedia alone up. For reference, the tier I suggested was bottom, as it is good in just about elesa's fight and marlon, and not that good against NPCs.

[Alice in Strings]

Audino's actually a very solid Pokemon for early-mid game thanks to it getting Secret Power and all. I used one in a Black Nuzlocke, and I was pretty impressed with it (even shedding a few tears when it died to a crit from a Boldore, iirc). Granted, it doesn't get its true love (Grass Knot~) until post-game, but I'm perfectly willing to put it in Low. Considering you can find one of these little healers in any rustling Grass in the game...

Cottonee's actually really solid. The only thing it doesn't have that Lilligant has is Quiver Dance. Instead, he gets stuff like Giga Drain and Leech Seed, which is perfectly acceptable for in-game use (especially since it has a late-game gym it trashes). Mid Tier

Onix really kinda...you can actually get it before Burgh in the Relic Chamber place, but it has a pitiful 35 Base Attack and can't take special hits at all. It works against Elesa and Burgh, but everything else just destroys it Low

[SuperJOCKE]

Ok, so I was just sitting here, thinking to myself and it occurred to me. Three powerful Pokémon available in-game and allowed for tiering have not been mentioned once to my recollection. It just didn't seem right at all.

So I checked the OP and the list I posted earlier today, and I was indeed correct. Cobalion, Terrakion, and Virizion were missing from both. All three are available on Route 13, 22, and 11, respectively.

So I've added these three to their respective route in the OP, and present to you now the fully updated and correct list of Pokémon left:

...

---

Rattata
Magby (With trade)
Grimer
Roggenrola (With trade) *Can be bundled with the traded Gigalith in-game*
Timburr (With trade)
Maractus
Pansear
Panpour
Pansage
Shelmet (With trade)
Foongus
Karrablast (With trade)
Ferroseed
Nosepass
Basculin
Zebstrika
Banette
Absol
Lunatone
Cobalion
Virizion
Terrakion

I will update this post for every Pokémon on the list who gets mentioned, so hopefully it will be empty soon.

Don't let this stop from telling us about your experiences with Pokémon not on this list though. Please step forward and help us out if you want and can. It will be appreciated.

And now, as you were.

EDIT: Update #1

[atsync]

Don't really have any opinions regarding specific tier placements but I'll comment anyway.

I used Audino in a general Black playthrough once, and I imagine it is the same in Black/White 2 (maybe better because of the Fustration/Return TMs being obtained so early). Audino is pretty good early game thanks to impressive bulk, and 60 Attack being on par with most early game things. It lags towards the end though because its offenses and Speed just don't cut it. It can still take hits really well late game, but it still takes lots of damage because it gets outsped and can't kill things quickly enough. It actually doesn't sound that different from what Dunsparce goes through, and that is in Bottom at the moment (Audino is easier to find though).

I can't see an unevolved Onix having much merit. I mean, I used it up until Chargestone Cave and it was fine considering I was eventually going to evolve it, but I'm not sure if I could have stuck with that thing the whole game, even if I used Eviolite and Sturdy. Aside from Elesa, its match-ups aren't really that great (it can take a few things out and serves as a physical punching bag but it is too weak to kill anything).

I used Emolga in a Black playthrough once (in the same run as Audino). It's actually a better battler than it seems on paper. It's fast and STAB no-item Acrobatics is insane, OHKOing a ton of stuff. However, it lags towards the end since it just can't hit hard enough anymore and it dies so easily. It is also annoying to catch (20% in shaking grass on Route 6, or slightly earlier at 10% in shaking grass, is the best you can do).

I haven't used Cottonee or Combee before. Combee seems bad though. You only have a 2.5% chance of encountering a female Combee, and if you are trying to get a nature that doesn't screw it over then it is even worse. Even if you do find it, Vespiquen is slow as hell and it has a bad type.

Originally Posted by Fat Alice in Strings

Onix really kinda...you can actually get it before Burgh in the Relic Chamber place, but it has a pitiful 35 Base Attack and can't take special hits at all. It works against Elesa and Burgh, but everything else just destroys it Low

Burgh has Razor Leaf on 2/3 of his team so Onix isn't a safe choice. It does beat Dwebble though, and it obviously tears Elesa to bits.

Originally Posted by Fat Magcargo 2

Emolga is nothing but low. If you are playing white two, electabuzz outclasses it completely. In black 2, there's still mareep, who gives emolga a run for it's money with it's higher defences and special attack. Emolga is rare and has mediocre stats across the board, so it really isn't worth it.

Why are people still using the "it's outclassed" argument?

[Magcargo 2]

Originally Posted by Fat atsync

Why are people still using the "it's outclassed" argument?

Whoops, didn't realize that. I was using that arguement to tell people that it isn't really worth the bother to capture emolga when there are things like electabuzz and ampharous, who are availible earlier than Emolga. Also, Emolga is way to rare and is only good early game. Then, it looses its usefulness around clay's gym. Mediocre stats across the board does't help the cause either.

[Alice in Strings]

Originally Posted by Fat Magcargo 2

Whoops, didn't realize that. I was using that arguement to tell people that it isn't really worth the bother to capture emolga when there are things like electabuzz and ampharous, who are availible earlier than Emolga. Also, Emolga is way to rare and is only good early game. Then, it looses its usefulness around clay's gym. Mediocre stats across the board does't help the cause either.

Emolga's best attribute is being able to keep momentum going using Volt Switch. This really needs to be considered in its tiering, especially considering Game Freak kinda intended this (it learns Volt Switch by Level Up, after all). It'll also usually outspeed the foe thanks to its just barely high enough speed.

[TM13IceBeam]

I won't say Emolga is terrible, per se. Having STAB Acrobatics is never a bad thing in this game, and it's not really too much of a burden against Clay seeing as it is immune to Bulldoze and can Static hax occasionally. Unfortunately that's to its extent of its usefulness.

the best use for Emolga in this game is to trade it for Gigalith, but that doesn't count so fuck it

[Magcargo 2]

Originally Posted by Fat Alice in Strings

Emolga's best attribute is being able to keep momentum going using Volt Switch. This really needs to be considered in its tiering, especially considering Game Freak kinda intended this (it learns Volt Switch by Level Up, after all). It'll also usually outspeed the foe thanks to its just barely high enough speed.

Volt switch is avalible to every single electric type after elesa's gym. Acrobatics is powerful, but will not do enough damage to the likes of flaffy and other electric types.
EDIT: Didn't know that emolga can be traded for a gigalith although that doesn't really matter.

[celever]

1) Acrobatatics? What move is that?
2) There are like 2 flaaffy in the game, who cares if it can't do loads to the 2!?

To be fair, emolga is pretty good at the start of the game, and come Skyla's gym (or just after, does pretty well against her) you can trade for an awesome gigalith!

Overall though, low.

[cant say]

I'm going to have to nominate Elekid (with trade) to sit along side it's no-trade counterpart in High
The Electrizer comes so late that the boost it receives for the E4 isn't worth it going to top tier (even though it was easily my MVP). It kills post-game though, although it doesn't count. The only reason I'd catch an Elekid in the first place is to eventually get an Electivire but it stays as an Electabuzz for so long it's pretty much the same. Itd have to be one of the better High-tier 'mons though

[HackerKing]

I know Mag is guaranteed Top right now.
I'm playing through Black 2 right now and since Magnemite gets both Supersonic and Thunderwave, I find that Para-fusion can incapacitate most opponents that my team has a problem with (like random Deerlings).

Has anyone used this, or is it better to just delete Supersonic?

[inanimate blob]

Originally Posted by Fat HackerKing

I know Mag is guaranteed Top right now.
I'm playing through Black 2 right now and since Magnemite gets both Supersonic and Thunderwave, I find that Para-fusion can incapacitate most opponents that my team has a problem with (like random Deerlings).

Has anyone used this, or is it better to just delete Supersonic?

I actually used Supersonic for most of my run. While Magnemite is amazing, it's movepool is...lacking, to say the least. It gets the right moves, though, and you're on the right track with parafusion, one of the many reasons to use it in-game. Honestly, your other two moves will most likely be Mirror Shot/Flash Cannon and a special Electric move, or maybe a Hidden Power if you luck out (I got a lufky HP Fire O.o).

[Jellicent*]

Moved a bunch of posts. Guys, this thread is for discussing the tiering of Pokemon in-game in BW2, not for general BW2 discussion. If you have questions about the game or just want to talk about it, do it here. Thanks.

[SuperJOCKE]

Yes, what Jelli said (made a little note about it in the OP as well).

Now that the thread is back on topic, I'm going to talk about the Pokémon I proposed a couple of days ago. After reading your posts, I will make these changes in a one or two days, maybe three if I think it's needed:

Audino to Low Tier
Onix (No trade) to Bottom Tier
Emolga to Low Tier
Combee to Bottom Tier

The only one I can't put into a tier due to the small ammount of input it got, is Cottonee. Right now, it's either Low or Middle Tier, so chime in on this, it would be really helpful.

Like I said, I'll leave this open for about 1-3 days, then I'll make the appropriate changes (except for Cottonee if the situation doesn't change). Back to discussion!

[celever]

Onix (no trade) for low.

The reasons:
Well, massive defense, like massive. It has pretty usable speed in that of 70, and while it can't do massive damage in large chunks, it can withstand a LOT of hits and keep chipping off the opponent's health. Couple this with the fact it makes use of eviolite and you're good to go.

Onix is by no means brilliant, or even great, however it doesn't deserve the tier of the combee and the dunsparce. I mean, come on, the defense stat is not something you can just dismiss, and it could be a major help in some of the major fights, weakening one of the pokemon your team would usually have trouble with for something to come in and wreck it.

[Alice in Strings]

Cottonee is most definitely Mid. It doesn't kill things super fast, but it can kill things just as fast as Lilligant thanks to Prankster Leech Seed and Giga Drain.

The problem with Onix is that his brilliant Defense is offset by pisspoor SpDef and HP. Seriously, 35 Base HP isn't helping at all, maxing out at 142 (considering 31 IVs and 252 EVs) at Level 50 and being as bad as 95 HP.

What the hell is Onix going to do with LOLworthy base 30 SpAtk and terrible Base 45 Attack. Especially when you get him, which is AFTER GETTING most of the other Rock types in the game. Simply implying that Onix can hurt (and hurting things isn't that big of a deal, anyone can do that) things enough for something else to come in and kill it solidifies its place in Bottom Tier. Dunsparce can Glare things and Parahax things to death, yet Onix can't kill things. If Onix goes Low, then so should Dunsparce, since Dunsparce can actually kill things fairly reliably.

Basically, if a foe has a Special Attack that doesn't have an Electric type, then Onix can't kill it. That's...not good, especially considering all of the Special Attackers in End-game. Onix ends up not being able to use its...questionable bulk.

[TM13IceBeam]

I'm hesitant to tier something that has offenses worse than Lillipup anywhere other than bottom especially when said object is stuck with the offenses for the entire game.

Combee is most definitely bottom: it doesn't have anything more notable than Attack Order and Acrobatics and has a typing which makes it crap for the following three gyms that come up. A thing to note that Combee gets Bug Buzz if you decide to keep it until L29, which makes Vespiquen a relatively early user of Bug Buzz. This is also the strongest move that Vespiquen can get, although it still doesn't do anything useful. Being a complete PITA to get and train as Combee doesn't help either.

Audino is fine in Low: it helps out earlygame with Regenerator making it an effective tank earlygame, 60 offenses with STAB return is pretty sweet fo a while. Then the power creep sets in and Audino gets shafted eventually. At the very least, he's still doing something early on.

[celever]

Oh jeez, I always forget to check HP when looking at bulk. Sorry guys, Onix belongs right in bottom.

Combee, I tried to use one. I even ended up with a (male) combee with hustle in the hidden grotto. I resided to using a female combee, but even vespiquen was extremely under-whelming, ending up as my flash slave in victory road once being replaced by a much-better skarmory. Bottom, definitely.

I'm leaning towards Audino for mid actually. Secret power early on can get that ever-so-helpful sleep in lots of areas, and due to its bulk can keep landing hits to try and get it. Then it gets that powerful return. It does begin to lag a bit end-game, but its amazing use mid and early in the game I think place it deservedly in mid.

[Dia]

Unfezant and serperior were BEASTS for me in-game.
Pidove- High tier
Availability- Very early. However, if you're looking for a specific gender, you'll have a bad time.
Stats:
High speed and attack and mediocre everything else. Pretty much the same as all the route 1 birds.
Movepool. Literally all you need is fly and return. Early on, you get stab frustration, which is really powerful for that point in the game. You can put in aerial ace or wing attack if you dislike the fact that fly takes two turns to work. I reccomend putting work out on it for the last move, since it doesn't have anything else to be doing.
Major Battles: Pretty neutral in most of them. If you're having trouble beating Ghetsis's hydreigon, you can try out a pretty interesting stall tactic, which includes using toxic first, then protect, and then fly. If you don't knock it out, just send a faster pokemon to finish it off. Remember, Unfezant's fly hits pretty damm hard, and you do a grand total of 42% damage from toxic. (6% the turn you use protect, 12% when you're in the air, and 24% after you hit it with fly) This works for pretty much any pokemon that's particularly hard to beat. Also, it enjoys pretty darn good matchups in the elite four, having an offensive advantage against Marshal and being inmune to Shauntal's ghost type moves. However, it can't do anything to colress or any team plasma boss (except ghetsis) for that matter.
Additional factors: Get super luck and a crit-boosting item for best results.

[sickweare]

I would argue Pidove for Mid tier instead. It has excellent speed (for in-game purposes), and a usable attack that can come in handy against the 2nd and 3rd gyms as well as some other important battles. Unfortunately, it suffers from a severely limited movepool to make use of that good attack. Don't let that fool you, though, because its STAB attacks in Return and Fly make pretty decent in-game moves that Unfezant can find its usefulness with. In my playthrough, it certainly wasn't my MVP, but it was very helpful along the way. The fact that it has a pretty sucky movepool is what keeps it in mid, as well as its lower stats compared to things like Mienshao and Darmanitan (who are notably frailer).

[Lucario_Guy]

Originally Posted by Fat sickweare

I would argue Pidove for Mid tier instead. It has excellent speed (for in-game purposes), and a usable attack that can come in handy against the 2nd and 3rd gyms as well as some other important battles. Unfortunately, it suffers from a severely limited movepool to make use of that good attack. Don't let that fool you, though, because its STAB attacks in Return and Fly make pretty decent in-game moves that Unfezant can find its usefulness with. In my playthrough, it certainly wasn't my MVP, but it was very helpful along the way. The fact that it has a pretty sucky movepool is what keeps it in mid, as well as its lower stats compared to things like Mienshao and Darmanitan (who are notably frailer).

Sucky movepool and only decent stats make it sucky. How the Pidove line fares compared to other Pokémon is irrelevant.

[Soul Fly]

Can't believe you haven't tiered the fantastic Riolu (lucario) as a Top Tier Pokemon.



NOMINATION
--------------

Name: Riolu. Nomination: Top Tier




Availability: Floccesy Ranch (Rare)



Stats: Riolu being a Prevolution has pretty decent Stats. It's evolution being friendship based you can expect an evolution to Lucario pretty early (no seriously just run in circles for a few minutes and then level up if you're really impatient) which will give it access to those Fantastic mixed attacking stats (110/115/90) for which it's so famous in BWOU



Typing: Fighting is generally an excellent STAB to have in the Unova region with so many Dark, Rock and Normal types we encounter In-Game, so it's easy to get it to grind. Plus as Lucario we get access to that steel typing which is invaluable so early in the game. Considering you face a normal type gym right after Catching Riolu, with a little bit of training it'll be an useful addition to your team right away. It defeats two of the Elite four (Marshall and Champion Cynthia) by the virtue of it's typing alone. Which is bloody fantastic for so early in the game.



Movepool: You will have to wait till level 15 to get Force Palm which is it's first STAB move with a decent Paralysis chance. Which shouldn't be that much of an extra grind considering your next Gym Battle has Pokemon levelled to 13~15. This preps you Immediately for Aspertia Gym which is up next.

From there your journey will be really easy.It can learn both Calm Mind and Swords Dance in-game so you have the flexibility to choose to make it a physical or a special powerhouse according to the needs of your team. Among it's other famous in-game level up moves we have the signature Aura Sphere and Close Combat. Bone Rush is a decent Ground type STAB which is very useful early game, until you get your hands on it's TMs.

Should you choose to Overlevel it a bit late-game it will learn the coveted Dragon Pulse and Extremespeed but IMHO they aren't really necessary ingame, unless you're solo-ing with a single pokemon or something like that.

Coming to TMs and Tutor Moves, it really gets access to the cream of the lot. It learns Dig which is very handy ingame. In Driftveil City, you can pick up either Ice Punch or ThunderPunch for 10 Red Shards each from the Tutor. This gives it access to a Physical BoltBeam combo which again just makes it more bloody useful and essentially makes it absurdly easy to level up. When you get to Humilau City, a great move for Lucario is Drain Punch for 10 Yellow Shards. While pricy, it hits for a solid 75 power and, most importantly, heals Lucario's HP by half of the damage dealt. That will ensure its HP remains high through long training sessions and while exploring new areas. This is also a great STAB if having your Stats dropped from Close Combat in middle of a match sound unappealing to you. (Aura Sphere is still better IMHO if you're not averse to it having a special move)

Other Notable Moves include Zen Headbutt, Work Up, Iron Tail, Rock Smash and Psychic so you're not short of options at all.



Major Battles: As mentioned earlier. By the virtue of it's typing alone it can single handedly defeat both Marshall and Champion Cynthia due to the prevalence of Dark, Steel, Ice and Rock types in their teams. It's STAB plus the BoltBeam combo just rips them apart. Gym battles are also a breeze. Especially since you face Aspertia (Normal) gym after capturing it.Burgh's super troublesome Crustle is now longer a problem. And you can just smash thorugh Driftveil, Opelucid, Mistralton (should you care to teach it Ice Punch) and Himalu city. All in all There will hardly be a major Battle where it doesn't take part. Team Plasma is a joke now considering they almost exclusively use Dark, Ice and Steel types so you can just plain out Spam your STAB moves and move on. I won't even list the individual battles. Not worth it. Rival Hugh though isn't particularly threatened by your team early on but just before the Elite four, in your final fight it's invaluable against that troublesome Bouffalant, which can potentially 6-0 your team if you're not ready.


Additional Comments: It's abilities Steadfast and Inner Focus are both valuable in a game infested with Liepards (plasma grunts *sigh*) using fake-out. Apart from that not much to be said.
All things considered, Riolu is one of those Pokemon you should absolutely consider for your team if you are fortunate enough to find one. Make sure you evolve it as soon as possible. But really, Lucario is just so amazingly good that it's hard to compare it to anything else. It is one of the best Pokemon out there and has no real flaws to it, other than a rather medium power STAB move until the later part of the game, which is what holds it back from its perfect rating. Trust me, it matters, but after that point, it is easily a perfect 5/5.

[Alice in Strings]

Originally Posted by Fat Lucario_Guy

Sucky movepool and only decent stats make it sucky. How the Pidove line fares compared to other Pokémon is irrelevant.

See: Whimsicott, Lilligant, Stoutland, Steelix, Magmar, among others. What you're saying is entirely theorymonning. Pidove is pretty good, and doesn't belong anywhere lower than Mid thanks to it getting the two moves it needs. It's like saying Raticate is terrible because it doesn't have bulk.