Smogon's First "Create a Pokemon": Poll 5

[Cooper]

Poll 5 has begun. After another close match-up (in which my choice, once again, loses), it has been decided that the BST of our new pokemon will reside in the 540-559 region. So now it is time to vote of the spread. I've asked five of the most active and knowledgeable "Create a Pokemon" participants to create a spread, which you will now vote on. The five, surprisingly, fairly represent every end of the spectrum, ranging from a very frail, very fast sweeper to a somewhat bulky pokemon that can be expected to stat-up. So, here you go.

PLEASE DO NOT SUGGEST NEW STATS. The time for that is over, and I honestly don't want to be flooded with posts like "give it a 600 spread, because it will suck otherwise." That's just not true. This poll will close in three days.

In analyzing the explanations below, the order in which people are posted is the order of the stats. For example, eric the espeon's stat set is first on the list, and Mario with Lasers' is last.

Credits go to:
-eric the espeon
-Deck Knight
-Gothic Togekiss
-Hyra
-Mario with Lasers

The Creators' Explanations of their Stats:

eric the espeon:

its a fast (but not superfast) slightly bulky mixed sweeper with a bit more sp. attack than attack, its not a glass cannon because though bug/ice has some bag weaknesses it has a few good resists e.g. quakebeam

Deck Knight:

OK, I essentially want this to be a special attacker that can also break Blissey with 101 HP Subs + resistance to Ice Beam. It is reasonably durable and could still use things like Ice Shard and Megahorn, but it would be better suited to using special attacks. Also outspeeds Mence and friends.

Gothic Togekiss:

Didn't really give an explanation, but that's fine.

Hyra:

Okay, these Stats are meant for a Mixed Bug Sweeper with main moves of Megahorn, Blizzard, and Earthquake. I obviously am designing for something that will end up with Compound Eyes.

The HP is the lowest one for a fully evolved Bug yet, but it is higher than Dusknoirs. This reduces the effect Stealth Rock will have on its defences.

The attack averages a 2HKO with Megahorn on Max HP no defense Bronzong, without a boosting nature. Bronzong is probably the most defensive thing it will be hitting with Megahorn, everything else is weak to another move, resistant to Megahorn, or both. It also has a guaranteed 2HKO on Blissey with Megahorn, we don't want a physical Sweeper being walled by Blissey.

The Special Attack scores a guaranteed 2HKO on Skarmory with Blizzard, but will rarely 2HKO it with Ice Beam. Everything else Blizzard will be used on will be something weak to it, exceptions being Dusknoir and Weezing. It will never 2HKO Max HP Dusknoir, even with Blizzard. Weezing takes more damage than Skarmory.

Speed is an awesome little stat. This guy will either sit nicely above the 120 Speed group or the 115 Speed group. With 123 Speed, he could also run an attack boosting nature if desired, because it would sit at 345 with Max Speed.

Defenses are made to be even, and fit within the range of the Bug group. The little boost given to defense is incase this becomes immune to Stealth Rock, I want it to have some ability to switch in on Earthquakes.

Mario with Lasers:

HP: 70
Attack: 116 (being Naughty with 252 EVs, reaches 364, EXACTLY the needed to 2HKO Blissey (with 104 HP, Bold) with Megahorn)
Defense: 70
Sp. Atk: 114 (it's a mixed sweeper, anyway)
Sp. Def: 64
Speed: 121 (being Naive with 160 EVs, beats any Infernape)
Total: 555 (same as Arcanine's)

Link to art thread. If you have a submission for what our pokemon will ultimately look like, post it there.

[Mario With Lasers]

Here it is. Sorry for the format, I will fix it if anyone says it's horrible to read >_>

I've made some offensive calcs, should I send them to you too?

The Sp. Attack may be a little low, but that's needed if you want to stop the fiery monkey. Its set is:

EVs: 252 Attack / 96 Sp. Attack / 160 Speed
Stats: 329 Attack / 288 Sp. Attack / 347 Speed
Nature: Naive

~ Blizzard
~ Megahorn
~ Earthquake
~ Bug Buzz/Hidden Power [Fire]/Discharge

The Speed is needed to beat the damn monkey. Megahorn and Blizzard are here for the STAB, Earthquake is for the Steels and Infernape. Bug Buzz comes here for... Well, because I don't know how will be its movepool. Discharge is specially for Gyarados (although, as I've just said, I'm not sure about the movepool), and HP Fire is for Scizor and Forretress.


It can survive a Band'ed Earthquake from Garchomp, taking 64-76% damage. Not good enough, due to SR weakness. So, this guy is going to be either a lead, or something which will need a huge Rapid Spin support. But at least Blissey is a goner.

Aerodactyl is faster and has Rock Throw. Don't even try.

A 252 HP/0 Defense Metagross (Bander) takes 40-46% damage of Megahorn, while a 152 HP (Agility) takes 42-50%.

The least damage Tyranitar he takes from Megahorn is 61-72%, when Impish, max HP/max Defense.

104 HP (Double Status) Gengar takes 70-82% from Blizzard. Strange...

Infernape falls to Earthquake. You just need to be faster (you are.) and come in a Nasty Plot. Or let it switch in on you.

Max/max Bold Suicune takes 29-35% from Megahorn.

Ninjask MAY survive an Ice Shard (lol), but it needs at least 28 HP EVs. Ok, not that much.

Lucario is 2HKO'ed by Earthquake, if it's the Bulky Dancer version. Otherwise, it's an OHKO.

Steelix is 2HKO'ed by Blizzard (53-62%), so fuck this snake.

Bulky Gyarados takes 72-85% of Discharge. If we won't give it to him, then we have a Gyara weak, which can be resolved on the topic that will be created for its movepool.

Heracross, Togekiss, Claydol, Porygon-Z, Machamp, Jolteon, Shaymin, Cradily, Slaking, Snorlax, Skarmory, Porygon2, Lanturn and Scrappy Miltank are 2HKO'ed either by Blizzard or Megahorn.

Raikou may be a problem (38-45% on the Sleep Talker, 43-50% on the Calm Minder), along with Starmie (it's OHKO'ed, but may be faster than this EV spread I gave to the Ice/Bug pokémon).

Hariyama takes 40-47% with 76 HP/252 Defense, Impish from Megahorn. Blizzard would be a good option, but there's always the risk of facing a Hariyama with Thick Fat.

Calm Zapdos is the only version this pokémon needs to be aware of (takes 66-78% from Blizzard). The other ones... Heh. OHKO.

Swampert is on the verge of a 2HKO most of the time. You need to discover its Nature and EV spread to 2HKO him properly.

Scizor needs 140 EVs in HP to survive HP Fire. The problem is, the Support, Baton Passer and Dancer Orb all have more than just 140 EVs...

The standard Forretress dies to HP Fire, while the "No Magnezone Fear" set survives with ONE HP. Bitch.

Dusknoir is a bitch, taking only 35-40% from Blizzard.

Bold 216 HP/252 Defense Slowbro takes 75-88% from Bug Buzz, and 64-75% from Megahorn.

Careful max HP/max Defense Regirock takes 32-37% damage from Blizzard, and has Rock Throw. WATCH OUT!

Heatran might survive an Earthquake... With a huge EV investment on HP and Defense. So, it's an OHKO.
If you don't have Earthquake (please...), Heatran stops the Ice/Bug guy completely.

Max/max Bold Cresselia has a, huh, <1% chance to survive two Megahorns. Die, bitch.

Calm max HP/max Sp. Defense Regice takes 40-46% from Megahorn. And has Thunder Wave.

Max HP/max Defense neutral Registeel takes 33-39% damage from Earthquake, and has Thunder Wave/Toxic. Now THAT'S a problem.

The Standard Jirachi (Impish, 240 HP/76 Defense) takes 43-50% damage from Earthquake. And it has Reflect and Wish... At least he isn't faster.

Max HP/max Defense neutral Empoleon takes 45-53% from Earthquake, while a 252 HP/0 Defense (which is much more common) version takes 58-68% damage.

Careful 252 HP/112 Sp. Defense Spiritomb is is 2HKO'ed by even Blizzard (56-66% damage).

Hippowdon is OHKO'ed by Blizzard if it doesn't have any EVs on the Sp. Defense. Otherwise, we have a 2HKO.

Uxie and Mesprit go down to Megahorn. Pretty simple.

Max HP/Max Defense Bold Milotic takes 39-45% from Megahorn. On the verge?

252 HP/98 (Sp.) Defense, + Nature Bronzong takes 27-31% from Bug Buzz, and 40-47% from Megahorn... Ok, I think we have a counter.


The truth is, if you give it either a Specs or a Nasty Plot/Calm Mind, Compoundeyes and Blizzard, you're set for the majority of the Standard metagame.

[blastoiselover100]

Originally Posted by Fat 864today

I think you forgot the poll...

Yeah. What is going on? It says poll 5 but no poll. By the way, what is this poll going to be for, the ability? I say Snow Warning.

[Gothic Togekiss]

Wow...you needed an explation for the Base stat spread we submitting, crap...I would have given you one but I couldn't think of one at the time ^^;

[Cooper]

Gothic: No, it's fine. It doesn't really matter anyway. People will probably be judging based on comparisons to the other stats anyway.

The poll is up, people! If you've ever tried to post a poll before, you'd know that they submit your thread while you fill out the poll. Simple, no?

[Superbro]

The last one is going to win just because it has the highest total. That is all the less pro people are going to see.

[TaiwaneseDude]

I voted Gothic's 545. It was really similar to Eric's 550, but I think this guy should be really fragile, but still hardhitting.

[Jenigmat]

Originally Posted by Fat Superbro

The last one is going to win just because it has the highest total. That is all the less pro people are going to see.

You know, if the last one had 10 less Base HP, it'd have a comparatively lower total. And I'd still vote for it. The differences between the total are like, 10 at most, and that isn't gonna affect anyone's vote. I like the distribution of Attack, Special Attack and Speed, as well as having a low defense to make it a bit frailer because I like that idea.

[tdub13]

I went with MWL's list since it's more balanced.

[Yoko Rains]

I picked the second to last one (4th choice). Higher speed, seems to work well as a sweeper. The last may seem better due to the higher HP, but even 70 base isn't really that high, and won't be able to take any excessive damage.

[Jenigmat]

Originally Posted by Fat Superbro

The last one is going to win just because it has the highest total. That is all the less pro people are going to see.

You know, if the last one had 10 less Base HP, it'd have a comparatively lower total. And I'd still vote for it. The differences between the total are like, 10 at most, and that isn't gonna affect anyone's vote. I like the distribution of Attack, Special Attack and Speed, as well as having a low defense to make it a bit frailer because I like that idea. Don't just assume that people are gonna vote for higher Base Stat Totals.

[Gothic Togekiss]

Wow...already it looks like MWL is going to win XD

[sandman]

Deck Knight: Quote:
O

K, I essentially want this to be a special attacker that can also break Blissey with 101 HP Subs + resistance to Ice Beam. It is reasonably durable and could still use things like Ice Shard and Megahorn, but it would be better suited to using special attacks. Also outspeeds Mence and friends.

a lot of blissey's are carrying flamethrower now so i don't nkow if this is a good stat distribution for what ever our little bug thing is going to be, i like hyra's the best.

[Goodbar]

I picked eric's, but now I'm liking MWLs...I would have liked hyras had it been one base point higher, so it could outspeed max speed + nature infernape with a neutral speed nature

[Asch]

I had a really hard time choosing between Hyra's and Mario with Lasers's, but I ended up liking Hyra's more due to the better offense.

[Drakhun]

I like Deck Knights Base 105 sub+punching. It looks bulky enough to take an occasional hit, unlike anything else here, and destroy all non-flamethrower bliss.

[Sir_Lu]

I chose Hyra's; it seemed fragile but fairly offensive. And I didn't scroll down to see MWL's calculations.

[COalex]

Definitely Deck Knight's bulky-ish spread. 101 HP subs or higher sounds great, especially with the possibility of this getting BP.

[eric the espeon]

i vote for me :-) but as gothic togekiss has almost the same spread (no stat is more than 10 diferent, and same speed) if he was ahead of me i would have voted for him.
by the way i dont like ether of the spreads that are wining, there both a bit too fast and hyra's is far to phy. based, MWL's pokemon is better but not much, I like DK's 101 subs idea and would have used it myself, but the phy. attack is just a bit too low, supose that 101 subs will beat bliss so attack is not so needed but i still prefer my or GT's idea

[Gothic Togekiss]

I voted for my own set as well because it needs love too D:

[eric the espeon]

gothic togekiss: since our sets are nealy the same and mine is in the lead wouldant it be a good idea for you to ask people to vote for mine rarther than yours? im sure we both would prefer to have a stat total close to the one we made win than hyra's or MWL's. if yours was in the lead i would do the same.

[Gothic Togekiss]

Originally Posted by Fat eric the espeon

gothic togekiss: since our sets are nealy the same and mine is in the lead wouldant it be a good idea for you to ask people to vote for mine rarther than yours? im sure we both would prefer to have a stat total close to the one we made win than hyra's or MWL's. if yours was in the lead i would do the same.

You do have a good point there but I still have an almost parent like bond with my idea. Freaky D:

[Suburvia]

I voted for Hyra's =D

Mainly because it's the fastest. It outspeeds standard mixape with a neutral nature, although I myself would run +Speed to beat out Gengar, Starmie, Ambipom, Azelf, Sceptile, Alakazam, and, most importantly, Dugtrio. Sure, MWL's can also do that, but I like that Hyra's is more physically oriented (its Megahorns hit just as hard as Heracross') to take down Blissey more easily. MWL's requires max attack and a boosting nature to 2HKO a Blissey with only 104 HP EVs (and most, if I'm not mistaken, carry more than that if not max these days). Hyra's can reach that with fewer EVs, or go for more to guarantee the 2HKO on Blisseys with more HP EVs. Taking down Blissey is extremely important for this guy, as he can easily sweep with BlizzBolt and all that speed (Now, I know his Sp. Atk. isn't spectacular at 105, but that's still damn powerful considering he's packing STAB Blizzard.)

Also, if he gets Compoundeyes, Megahorn becomes 100% accurate, while 70% accurate moves like Blizzard and Thunder (!!!) become 91% accurate. Could you imagine how powerful that would be? Dual 120 STABs (100 and 91 accuracy to boot) alongside 91 accurate Thunder! He'd be a fucking wrecking ball!!! WRECK. ING. BALL. Seriously, MAKE COMPOUNDEYES AN ABILITY CHOICE WHEN THAT POLL COMES AROUND!

There, I'm done. =]

[Logan]

When competitor comes out, someone should host a server with all the created pokemon added as well. That would be nifty.

[eric the espeon]

thats the plan it may be added to shoddy too