Smogon's First "Create a Pokemon": Poll 14 (the ACTUAL last poll)

Cooper · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:26:42 PM

Jesus frickin' Christ, people. Just because YOU don't like Spikes doesn't mean we should have an ability devoted to coming in safely. Whatever, another two days of polling to shut you all up is fine with me [/kidding].

Fine, because a certain person decided to complain, I'm going to settle this once and for all with a poll 14. This poll will serve two purposes: it will give me a chance to point out how broken Ice Shell is once it wins, and it will allow for discussion about the pre-evo. But for the poll at hand, here are the abilities in question:

Ice Shell: Syclant takes no indirect damage for the turn it switches in (specifically from Spikes, Toxic Spikes, and Stealth Rock).

Mountaineer: This pokemon takes no indirect or direct damage from Rock type attacks upon switching in. This doesn't block additional effects.

Vote.

On a different note, I'm going to point out a few things about the pre-evo that we should all know:

It will have the same movepool as Syclant, but will learn everything sooner. Standard.
Come on, do we really need a new sprite for this? There have been plenty of links to Cyzir's page of pre-evos, and as I recall, everyone agreed to use them. The first is the only on that works for that purpose.
The name needs to relate to Syclant. We can't have something Bugarc (Bug + Arctic) evolve into Syclant. I'm leaning toward Sylar myself.

This poll will close in two days. Hopefully we can end this then.

Sunday · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:28:07 PM

I'd just like to say good work Cooper for going through all of this. Lets put a bullet in the brain with a vote for Mountaineer!

Cooper · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:30:12 PM

Take a guess at what I voted. And here's why:

Ice Shell = Wonderguard
Mountaineer = Honey Gather

Which do you think Nintendo is more likely to accept on a fan submission?

latinoheat · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:30:32 PM

they are both insanely broken traits imo who let them pass, it should just negate stealth rock damage.

Purple Jesus · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:30:51 PM

Threw up a vote for mountaineer. Ice Shell is starting to almost sound like magic guard and it just doesn't really fit in my eyes. But switching into a stone edge and not taking damage is pretty dumb, if you predict poorly you should be punished. I dont really like either but immunity to all spikes is closing in on wonder guard too much for me.

Cooper · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:31:19 PM

Defend your answer, latino. Why is negating the one offensive Rock type that people use metagame broken?

**Mario With Lasers** · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:33:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Cooper

Take a guess at what I voted. And here's why:

Ice Shell = Wonderguard
Mountaineer = Honey Gather

Which do you think Nintendo is more likely to accept on a fan submission?

I'd say Ice Shell = Wonderguard and Mountaineer = Levitate (really), but whatever, voted for Mountaineer.

TaiwaneseDude · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:33:27 PM

Blah.. I really think it should've just been "Syclant takes no indirect damage from Stealth Rock."

I really think Stone Edge immunity on the turn is just a bit too much.

Then Ice Shell is just like additional Spikes immunity, (TS immunity doesn't make sense here) which doesn't make AS much sense but it's more sensible than Mountaineer.

Andren · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:42:31 PM

Mountaineer.

It gives an ability to those that aren't specifically Shell-wearing Ice-types, so things like...mountain Pokemon can get it, too.

Kingdrom · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:44:11 PM

I voted Mountaineer because Ice Shell would be too broken. Really, do you need immunity to every field effect? Your explanation of Ice Shell also makes me think that if you use toxic or will-o-wisp on Syclant, he will not take damage.

**sandman** · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:44:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Cooper

The name needs to relate to Syclant. We can't have something Bugarc (Bug + Arctic) evolve into Syclant. I'm leaning toward Sylar myself.

How about "Artick" like Antartica + Tick.
Edit: also out of the two abilities, i think Ice shell makes the most sense i mean come on, no rock damage on the switch in? What the hell is that? they will obviously see where trying to get around Stealth Rock and Ice shell is a better ability anyway.

Lugiatina · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:45:23 PM

Definately Mountaineer. It would get rid of his 4X weakness to rock somewhat. However, I would still be cautious around tyranitar with this thing.

sanjay120 · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:52:49 PM

Mountaineer, because Ice Shell is ;/ I mean really, immunity to Toxic Spikes makes no sense.

Yoko Rains · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:54:11 PM

Voted Ice Shell, I found it more useful overall. Both traits defend it from Rock attacks on switching, but Ice Shell protects it from set-ups. That would render all Stealth Rock setuppers and Spikers useless. Sounds a bit broken, but hey, its useful.

Mountaneer is awesome, but seriously, Ice Shell is more useful IMO.

Gothic Togekiss · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:54:17 PM

Blah...this is a hard decision to make here. one hand Ice Shell and it's immuntiy to all spikes like shit is great but on the other hand it a bit broken. Mountaineer also sounds good with it's No Rock and SR damage upon switching in but getting hurt by spikes and Toxic spikes seem weird too since it's fucking floating, and don't say Magazone since he's obivously pulling spikes onto itself with his magents.

SkaterTrainer · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:54:36 PM

Mountaineer is my choice.

**Mario With Lasers** · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:58:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Yoko Rains

Voted Ice Shell, I found it more useful overall. Both traits defend it from Rock attacks on switching, but Ice Shell protects it from set-ups. That would render all Stealth Rock setuppers and Spikers useless. Sounds a bit broken, but hey, its useful.

Mountaneer is awesome, but seriously, Ice Shell is more useful IMO.

Huh, no. Ice Shell only negates [Toxic] Spikes+Stealth Rock when Syclant switches in. He doesn't stop Bronzong and friends from setting-up Spikes/Stealth Rock.

Cooper · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:58:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Yoko Rains

That would render all Stealth Rock setuppers and Spikers useless. Sounds a bit broken, but hey, its useful.

The problem is, with Thunderpunch, Blizzard, and HP Fire, Syclant can at least 2HKO everything that would try and set up. That's really bad.

**Deck Knight** · Jan 14th, 2008, 7:59:36 PM

Mountaineer.

I don't want Magic Guard redux. If you want effective immunity to spikes be a levitating Ground type.

Rhykune · Jan 14th, 2008, 8:01:22 PM

Either trait would make it pretty broken but Mountaineer is the lesser of two evils.

Yoko Rains · Jan 14th, 2008, 8:03:09 PM

MwL, my bad, I meant that it would be unaffected by their setups.

pear · Jan 14th, 2008, 8:09:53 PM

If Mountaineer simply reduced damage from direct Rock attacks, it'd be fine, IMO.

Drew108 · Jan 14th, 2008, 8:11:21 PM

Voted Mountaineer. It's a lot less broken than Ice Shell and anyone who calls themself a good battler should be able to predict a switch after they have seen Syclant, so you can really say Mountaineer's broken.

And another thing. How does a shell of ice protect you from sharp and possibly poisonous spikes and floating pointy rocks. It doesn't make much sence if you ask me.

GengarCrysis92 · Jan 14th, 2008, 8:13:59 PM

Ok. i was thinking and "Sylar" isn't going to work as the Pre-evos name. Someone had suggested Sylax, and that seems reasonable. I think we should go with that, to avoid lawsuits aimed at Nintendo.

Cooper · Jan 14th, 2008, 8:15:15 PM

But why Sylax? To me, that doesn't make any sense flavor-wise. Would Syclar work? That was my first idea, before Sylar was suggested.

View Poll Results: Ice Shell or Mountaineer?
Ice Shell	79	32.24%
Mountaineer	166	67.76%
Voters: 245. You may not vote on this poll

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:26:42 PM	#1
Cooper Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,806 The sunny streets of Santa Barbara	Smogon's First "Create a Pokemon": Poll 14 (the ACTUAL last poll) Jesus frickin' Christ, people. Just because YOU don't like Spikes doesn't mean we should have an ability devoted to coming in safely. Whatever, another two days of polling to shut you all up is fine with me [/kidding]. Fine, because a certain person decided to complain, I'm going to settle this once and for all with a poll 14. This poll will serve two purposes: it will give me a chance to point out how broken Ice Shell is once it wins, and it will allow for discussion about the pre-evo. But for the poll at hand, here are the abilities in question: Ice Shell: Syclant takes no indirect damage for the turn it switches in (specifically from Spikes, Toxic Spikes, and Stealth Rock). Mountaineer: This pokemon takes no indirect or direct damage from Rock type attacks upon switching in. This doesn't block additional effects. Vote. On a different note, I'm going to point out a few things about the pre-evo that we should all know: It will have the same movepool as Syclant, but will learn everything sooner. Standard. Come on, do we really need a new sprite for this? There have been plenty of links to Cyzir's page of pre-evos, and as I recall, everyone agreed to use them. The first is the only on that works for that purpose. The name needs to relate to Syclant. We can't have something Bugarc (Bug + Arctic) evolve into Syclant. I'm leaning toward Sylar myself. This poll will close in two days. Hopefully we can end this then.

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:28:07 PM	#2
Sunday Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 5,193 Australia	I'd just like to say good work Cooper for going through all of this. Lets put a bullet in the brain with a vote for Mountaineer! __________________

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:30:51 PM	#5
Purple Jesus Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 170	Threw up a vote for mountaineer. Ice Shell is starting to almost sound like magic guard and it just doesn't really fit in my eyes. But switching into a stone edge and not taking damage is pretty dumb, if you predict poorly you should be punished. I dont really like either but immunity to all spikes is closing in on wonder guard too much for me. Last edited by Purple Jesus; Jan 14th, 2008 at 7:39:54 PM.

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:33:27 PM	#8
TaiwaneseDude Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 958 Hogwarts	Blah.. I really think it should've just been "Syclant takes no indirect damage from Stealth Rock." I really think Stone Edge immunity on the turn is just a bit too much. Then Ice Shell is just like additional Spikes immunity, (TS immunity doesn't make sense here) which doesn't make AS much sense but it's more sensible than Mountaineer. __________________ Brawl FC: 0473-7480-4249 (Gary) * Let me know if you've added me! FC: 3179-3401-3486 (Gary) Shop Status: The Garage (temporary shop) I am EV-Training For You! Click for details.

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:30:12 PM	#3
Cooper Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,806 The sunny streets of Santa Barbara	Take a guess at what I voted. And here's why: Ice Shell = Wonderguard Mountaineer = Honey Gather Which do you think Nintendo is more likely to accept on a fan submission?

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:30:32 PM	#4
latinoheat Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,924	they are both insanely broken traits imo who let them pass, it should just negate stealth rock damage.

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:31:19 PM	#6
Cooper Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,806 The sunny streets of Santa Barbara	Defend your answer, latino. Why is negating the one offensive Rock type that people use metagame broken?

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:42:31 PM	#9
Andren Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,054	Mountaineer. It gives an ability to those that aren't specifically Shell-wearing Ice-types, so things like...mountain Pokemon can get it, too.

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:44:11 PM	#10
Kingdrom Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 381 Advertising services	I voted Mountaineer because Ice Shell would be too broken. Really, do you need immunity to every field effect? Your explanation of Ice Shell also makes me think that if you use toxic or will-o-wisp on Syclant, he will not take damage.

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:45:23 PM	#12
Lugiatina Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 535	Definately Mountaineer. It would get rid of his 4X weakness to rock somewhat. However, I would still be cautious around tyranitar with this thing.

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:54:11 PM	#14
Yoko Rains Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,947 Does it matter?	Voted Ice Shell, I found it more useful overall. Both traits defend it from Rock attacks on switching, but Ice Shell protects it from set-ups. That would render all Stealth Rock setuppers and Spikers useless. Sounds a bit broken, but hey, its useful. Mountaneer is awesome, but seriously, Ice Shell is more useful IMO. __________________ \| Destruction \| Breed for me! \| Friend Code \| UWX \| Get up to 12 Pokemon as reward for breeding for me! PM me about it!

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:54:17 PM	#15
Gothic Togekiss Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 4,486 PKMN Trainer Hijiri at your services	Blah...this is a hard decision to make here. one hand Ice Shell and it's immuntiy to all spikes like shit is great but on the other hand it a bit broken. Mountaineer also sounds good with it's No Rock and SR damage upon switching in but getting hurt by spikes and Toxic spikes seem weird too since it's fucking floating, and don't say Magazone since he's obivously pulling spikes onto itself with his magents. __________________ Diamond: Rinneth (3222 2619 1334) Platinum: Remilia (5328 9611 0881) *White: Hijiri (3138 5947 0732) I can clone in B&W now. PM/VM if you need any. Everything I ever RNG'd is here What you buying stranger?*

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:54:36 PM	#16
SkaterTrainer Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 458 New Bark Town	Mountaineer is my choice.

Jan 14th, 2008, 7:59:36 PM	#19
Deck Knight Jigen Makkoto Moderator Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 6,887 Massachusetts	Mountaineer. I don't want Magic Guard redux. If you want effective immunity to spikes be a levitating Ground type.

Jan 14th, 2008, 8:01:22 PM	#20
Rhykune Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 747 Avatar by Yamipoli	Either trait would make it pretty broken but Mountaineer is the lesser of two evils.

Jan 14th, 2008, 8:03:09 PM	#21
Yoko Rains Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,947 Does it matter?	MwL, my bad, I meant that it would be unaffected by their setups. __________________ \| Destruction \| Breed for me! \| Friend Code \| UWX \| Get up to 12 Pokemon as reward for breeding for me! PM me about it!

Jan 14th, 2008, 8:09:53 PM	#22
pear Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 270 Sillhouettes! In the sky! Wings are carrying me through the night!	If Mountaineer simply reduced damage from direct Rock attacks, it'd be fine, IMO. __________________ avatar spliced by YoshiToshi

Jan 14th, 2008, 8:11:21 PM	#23
Drew108 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 119 THE END HAS COME!!!	Voted Mountaineer. It's a lot less broken than Ice Shell and anyone who calls themself a good battler should be able to predict a switch after they have seen Syclant, so you can really say Mountaineer's broken. And another thing. How does a shell of ice protect you from sharp and possibly poisonous spikes and floating pointy rocks. It doesn't make much sence if you ask me. __________________ Avatar made by me.

Jan 14th, 2008, 8:13:59 PM	#24
GengarCrysis92 Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 512	Ok. i was thinking and "Sylar" isn't going to work as the Pre-evos name. Someone had suggested Sylax, and that seems reasonable. I think we should go with that, to avoid lawsuits aimed at Nintendo. __________________ Hai?

Jan 14th, 2008, 8:15:15 PM	#25
Cooper Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,806 The sunny streets of Santa Barbara	But why Sylax? To me, that doesn't make any sense flavor-wise. Would Syclar work? That was my first idea, before Sylar was suggested.