Smogon's First "Create a Pokemon": Poll 3

[MegaMewtwo]

Originally Posted by Fat ultimatefreshness

Slack Off Infernape is extremely viable in OU, nobody sees it coming

lol. Infernape dies pretty fast. Slacking Off would give its opponent time to smack it with whatever they want, which the flaming monkey won't like. It'd probably end up with less HP than it had before Slacking Off, assuming it lives at all.

[blastoiselover100]

It needs Rapid Spin support, otherwise it cannot be a Choice user effectively. I say that it is a physical tank that learns Rapid Spin and gets a good recovery move to make up for the shittiest typing ever. Otherwise it will be useless.

[Gothic Togekiss]

Originally Posted by Fat MegaMewtwo

lol. Infernape dies pretty fast. Slacking Off would give its opponent time to smack it with whatever they want, which the flaming monkey won't like. It'd probably end up with less HP than it had before Slacking Off, assuming it lives at all.

Damn MM2, you must be psychic or something because that's what I was thinking. Also, I think the antennae x-scissor thing fit perfectly.

[MegaMewtwo]

Originally Posted by Fat Gothic Togekiss

Damn MM2, you must be psychic or something because that's what I was thinking. Also, I think the antennae x-scissor thing fit perfectly.

A bit off-topic, how do you put a quote in your sig? I want to put that guy's post in my sig because it's hilarious.

And just to make something a bit clearer, the little circles on the Pokemon's body (the Pokemon in the picture) are meant to be its hands.

[Cooper]

A bit off-topic, how do you put a quote in your sig? I want to put that guy's post in my sig because it's hilarious.

Just click the quote feature in the post, copy the whole thing, and paste into your sig.

Yay, finally a poll gets some actual discussion! I feel so proud. Anyway:

On the Shiver discussion: I'm not going to address this, since it seems to be over.

On the Magic Guard discussion: The only reason I'm supporting a new ability in the form of something that resists SR damage is because Life Orb on something with Magic Guard is too good. Clefable can get away with it, seeing as its Attack is 70 and it doesn't have an astounding physical movepool anyway, but people are suggesting a 100/115 split, each of which are amplified 50% by Orb. A bit broken, no?

On the Sprite art: Be patient. Although mixed sweeper is cleaning up at the moment, as we saw in Poll 1, something else could in theory catch up. As soon as this poll ends, I'll post in Smeargle's Studio to ask the artists to draw a preliminary sketch, which will then come up as a poll.

[Sunday]

Life orb is 30%, but everything else you said is sound.

[Cooper]

Damn, I wasn't sure about that one. Thanks.

[Gothic Togekiss]

30% power boost+ 102/112 atk/sp. atk+Magic Guard= LOL, Life Orb sweep.

Sorry, I just wanted to do that. I can somewhat understand what you're talking about with the Magic Guard/LO abuse thing, would be scary on a pokemon with 100+ atk/sp.atk.

Edit: ironically enough, still like the icy/buggy version of Magic Guard though XD

[Mario With Lasers]

ATTN: Somewhat-Uber post INCOMING

About the ability: No Magic Guard, please. This gy will end up being a mixed sweeper pokémon, and you want to give him a 30% boost item, with no drawbacks? 4x weak to SR is bad, but we can cancel it somehow... Shiver looked like a good idea, but maybe Fresh Powder is a better name.

About the pokémon: WTF, MegaMewtwo. That fairy was WAY too close to my concept of Himath. The difference is, your sister's has a resemblance with Butterfree, while mine was like Venomoth... And the snowflake wings are obligatory.

About what in hell will the pokémon be: Either Mantice or the frozen Butterfree. But, as I'm a sucker for Himath, I like the fairy better. And she'd be just special-based, but with some move made to cripple Blissey, the top-class Special Wall. Like Garchomp and his Draco Meteor.

About the movepool and stats: Well, here we go.

Three-stages pokémon: Himarva, Himacoon, Himath (kill me for the names);

Evolution method: Himarva at level 30 OR Himarva at level 20-25 holding Protector ==> Himacoon at lv.55 OR Himacoon at lv.40-50 holding Beautiful Skin ==> Himath.

Trait: Frozen Skin, a Ice-Type Flash Fire, and Levitate. That was the original idea. Now, I'm thinking about a Ice-Type Water Absorb, as Ice Beams and Shards and Punches are pretty overused. This would somehow compensate for the glaring SR weakness, but only restoring 25% HP. However, this doesn't solve the Ember and Rock Throw weaknesses...

Base Stats: Remember kids, I created Himath during the Garchomp overhype, and she was planned to be a special version of him. So, the stats are HP: 100 / Attack: 80 / Defense: 88 / Sp. Attack: 135 / Sp. Defense: 95 / Speed: 102 / Total: 600.

Movepool:

Physical movepool:
Body Slam
Icicle Spear
Reversal
Beat Up
Ice Ball (huh, what)
Bug Devour (what is the US name again?)
Wing Attack
Ice Shard
Rock Slide
U-Turn
Earthquake
Brick Break
Aerial Ace
Fling
Avalanche

Special movepool:
Silver Wind
Ice Beam (duh)
Bug Buzz
Discharge
Thunderbolt
Thunder (there was a good reason I gave her these moves... I think that was because she lived on top of the mountains, near to the clouds, and had some lightning control... I think only Discharge would be good enough, though.)
Focus Blast
Brine
Charge Beam
Flash Cannon

Support movepool:
Embargo
Baton Pass
Camouflage
Spider Web (huh, what)
Barrier (the cocoon form; seriously, maybe I went too far...)
Mirror Coat
Rapid Spin (OH YEAH DELIBIRD POWER)
Sheer Cold
Hail
Haze
Roost
Whirlwind
Featherdance
Agility
Nasty Plot
Light Screen
Rain Dance
Safeguard
Snatch
Thunder Wave
Swords Dance
Stealth Rock (lol)
Trick Room

Signature move:
Frozen Wind - Ice-Type Overheat.


... Okay. Now that was truly huge and unnecessary. Obviously, a fuckload of moves can be removed, and I'll start now.

First, only Discharge. She doesn't need Boltbeam, neither Thunder Wave. Discharge has that 30% paralysis chance, anyway.

Why the fuck are Ice Ball and Brine there. Go away.

And then, the support options... I thought I created her for a special-based role ._.
But anyway, Roost, Hail and Sheer Cold will stay, duh.
I don't see why Featherdance, Camouflage and Whirlwind should be removed.
Who cares about Rain Dance, Safeguard and Snatch.
Instead of Barrier, Reflect would be better, I think, to go along with Light Screen.
Spider Web + Baton Pass is a nice combo, but she isn't a spider...
Everyone learns Stealth Rock, anyway.
And Haze? Almost no one learns it, let a mountain pokémon learn it, just for a change.
I think Mirror Coat should get along well with this pokémon if we decide to give her Magic Guard, but I wouldn't miss this move anyway.
Rapid Spin on a pokémon 4x weak to SR is laughable, but does anyone see a problem with it?
Trick Room should go away too. Why would a 102 Base Speed pokémon use it...

Now, Baton Pass, Nasty Plot, Swords Dance and Agility. The four would be way too broken together (hi Mew), so I think they can be ditched. I like the Baton Pass fairy idea (hi Ledian; okay, not a fairy), so I'd keep it. She's fast enough to not really need Agility; Nasty Plot is almost obligatory, as she is a special-basd pokémon; and Swords Dance would be great for a mixed sweeper, maybe even instead of Nasty Plot.
As I'm going for a special sweeper, I'd say Baton Pass and Nasty Plot are the moves to keep.


So be it. Removing the retarded moves, we end up with a nice special sweeper, with a interesting but not really useful physical movepool, with a incredible special movepool, having pseudo-Boltbeam, Bug Buzz for the Psychics and Dark-Types, and Focus Blast and an Ice-Type Overheat for even more destruction and specially for Blissey, along with Nasty Plot, to ensure the fat egg's doom (Nasty Plot once, use Focus Blast when Blissey switches in, finish her with Frozen Wind). Not only that, but she has a reliable recovery move, Plotpassing, the somewhat random Rapid Spin, and even pseudo-hazing.

Yeah, pretty OU, I know, but this one was meant to be OU. Remember, Garchomp's special-based sister...

[DougJustDoug**]

If you add a bunch of snow to a rocky mountainside, you turn hazardous terrain into a recreational ski resort. What if we created an ability called "Ski Slope" that conveys immunity to Rock?

It would get rid of a cripplling 4x weakness and turn it into a nice advantage. It's no more gamebreaking than Levitate. It would allow this pokemon to treat SR like Levitators treat Spikes. It also gives this pokemon a legitimate defensive capability. I can imagine it being an all-purpose switch in for threats to Salamence with resistance to ice moves and immunity to the Stone Edges constantly thrown Mence's way. There's lots of stuff that hates rock, that would love this guy on their team. Sure, it will never be a defensive force with a 4x weakness to Fire and 2x weakness to Flying and Steel, but it could patch up the horrendous typing of this thing.

Conceptually, we could pursue a Skiing Bug theme. Sounds hokey, but we already have a Boxing Pig-Monkey, right? Different variations could be snowboarding, sleds, toboggans, or even luge. All of these also convey the idea of speed, which is nice for a sweeper. With the right design, I think it could work.

I like the "Ski Slope" name, but other names like "Fresh Powder" or "Soft Snow" might work. Just another idea to help cover the typing problems that otherwise make this pokemon hopelessly unusable....

[Jenigmat]

Why is the concept of a 4x Stealth Rock weak that bad? I mean, yea, it takes damage switching in. Yanmega is a fairly OU Sweeper that has the same weak. Charizard doesn't have a 600 Base Stat Total and yet is still BL. All it takes to use something with a Stealth Rock weak is prediction and maybe a Spinner. No reason at all to give it an ability like Magic Guard JUST for Stealth Rock. Might as well give it Levitate(Bug's can fly). That way it takes its 50% from the Rocks without taking the extra from Spikes. Stealth Rock isn't that crippling if you have proper support.

[Gothic Togekiss]

^ Levitate could work if it look like it could fly? Be weird to see an ice ant looking thing with levitate.

[futuresuperstar]

I think it should just get an Ice-version of Water Absorb. So many ice attacks are used in the metagame, and it would manage to lessen the 50% to only 25%, a much more acceptable deal. It could also have an option for Ice Body, too, for healing while sweeping under hail.

[DougJustDoug**]

Originally Posted by Fat Gothic Togekiss

^ Levitate could work if it look like it could fly? Be weird to see an ice ant looking thing with levitate.

Giving Levitate to a pokemon already resistant to Ground is somewhat of a waste. Admitted, immunity is much better than resistance, particularly with spikes. But, this thing will already be strong vs ground. It has defensive resistance and an offensive SE STAB to Ground. Levitate is somewhat of a waste of a chance to use the ability to really enhance the pokemon.

[Hyra]

heyyy okay time to my ideas

Negating Stealth Rock weak: needed or else it becomes a little to close to yanmega for my liking. Shiver sounded cool, maybe just make it Stealth Rock instead of all spikes. Magic Guard would be awesome, but Life Orb + This Typing + Insane Stab moves = overkill.

Snow Warning: Hey, who doesn't like 100% accurate Blizzard?

Design: Basically a frozen Mothim, except this one actually does stuff besides die. Mantis was done with Scyther, plus there are actually Snow Moths.

Moves: Ice is a special type, don't mess with that. So Icy Wind, Ice Beam, and Blizzard are there. Bug Buzz sounds nice for this guy. Who doesn't like SDef drops? Finally, Close Combat sounds nice, even though it doesn't fit with a moth. Nor does Hi Jump Kick.... Maybe a Mantis will work better for movepool...

Stats: High speed is imperative. I would say we give this thing 135 Speed. This way, it doesn't take Electrodes place, but Aerodactly can't own it. Next, obviously make the Special attack higher, in the 120~ range. This is obviously being envisioned as a Special Attacker with enough of a physical movepool to kill Blissey, Snorlax and Regice (aka a good fighting move). Cressy and Cradily die to the Bug move of choice. put attack relatively close, maybe 90-100. That gives us a total of 355 with just the attacking stats. 30 / 85 / 85 defenses, to minimize the impact of stealth rock, and that has us tied with Arcanine for stat total. Some tweaking can be done, but I think that is the best we will get without making this a 600 BST.

Okay, that about sums up my thoughts.

[Drakhun]

Woah, woah, aren't we getting a bit ahead of ourselves here?

That said, it looks like mix-sweeper is the run-away favorite, so may as well >>.

Of the abilites and concepts listed so far I'm most perchant towards mantice, as we already have so durned many moth and butterfly pokes. Ski slope seems the best ability, magic-gaurd would be over the top, and 4x week to rock is utter fail, and the few pokes that get away with it are predominantly leads.

My suggestion was gonna be kind of like the bastard child of fortress and glalie with stats unlike either. It would have an ability called snowball, where it absorbed entry hazards.

[TaiwaneseDude]

Originally Posted by Fat MegaMewtwo

This is roughly what it looks like. She did this on Paint, ON A LAPTOP, and the colours are apparently a bit off. The wings are meant to be snowflakes. And it has cold air around its wings, like Articuno in the 3D games

I like that design, but it looks too "not final stage" for me. It looks like the 1st stage, or 2nd stage of the Pokemon.

I would expect the wings to be much larger.

Moth would definitely be a great idea. I like the moth being similar to Mothim's wing design -- except white/blue. Shield Dust could be an ability if we're not planning on making a new one. I also think Compound Eyes would work. :)

[Gothic Togekiss]

Originally Posted by Fat Hyra

Close Combat sounds nice, even though it doesn't fit with a moth. Nor does Hi Jump Kick.... Maybe a Mantis will work better for movepool...

semi humaniod female snow moth? At least give it actual arms and leg to do some of the stuff.

Originally Posted by Fat Drakhun

My suggestion was gonna be kind of like the bastard child of fortress and glalie with stats unlike either.

God I can see this thing already, fugly ice ball with siphons. XD

[Jenigmat]

Shield Dust sounds like a really good idea. I mean, think about it. It makes sense. Again, just because it has a Stealth Rock weak does not mean we have to come up with an ability to fix it. We deal with it when we use Yanmega, we can deal with it here.

[MegaMewtwo]

Originally Posted by Fat TaiwaneseDude

I like that design, but it looks too "not final stage" for me. It looks like the 1st stage, or 2nd stage of the Pokemon. I guess it could stand to look more menacing, but why don't we have any real CUTE OU's? Most cute things are either NFE (stuff like Squirtle and Clefairy), UU (stuff like Pachirisu and Pikachu, who is also NFE) or uber (Mew and Manaphy). Forgive me if my tiers are wrong, but you get the idea.

I would expect the wings to be much larger. To be fair, I think they're a bit bigger than in the picture. My sister can't draw snowflakes, especially not in Paint.

Moth would definitely be a great idea. I like the moth being similar to Mothim's wing design -- except white/blue. Shield Dust could be an ability if we're not planning on making a new one. I also think Compound Eyes would work. :)

Bolded responses, can't really add anything constructive to the topic right now.

[Gmax]

Really, it needs either a brand new ~100 BP physical Ice move or Megahorn to succeed otherwise its not going to perform the role of Mixed Sweeper. And if you're not going to make it immune to SR, it'll be too similar to Yanmega. BTW, whats with all the Nintendo talk? We're just making it to include it in Shoddy at the maximum IIRC.

[Hyra]

Originally Posted by Fat jenigmat429

Shield Dust sounds like a really good idea. I mean, think about it. It makes sense. Again, just because it has a Stealth Rock weak does not mean we have to come up with an ability to fix it. We deal with it when we use Yanmega, we can deal with it here.

because then it would be doing the same thing that yanmega does, except it doesn't get speed boost or hypnosis, making it pretty inferior to yanmega?

Anyways, Snow Warning should be the ability if we decide to let it keep the Stealth rock weak. 100% accurate Blizzards have to count for something, right? Actually, naw, not Snow Warning. Give it Compound Eyes. That would help with some accuracy (90% acc. Blizzard is godly, see RBY) and allow for team variation. This might be a good Pokemon to go Tinted Lens with too. Nothing 4x resists both Bug and Ice that I can think of, except for Heatran, who the fighting move would kill anyways.

[Gothic Togekiss]

If we're going for moth look, how bout we base it's look on this: click.

Just got to modify it to look more pokemon-ish and not soo human moth thing XD

Originally Posted by Fat futuresuperstar

Megahorn

D:< *beat you to death for suggesting megahorn on something that most likely be a moth*

[futuresuperstar]

With Compound Eyes, here is how I could see it working out.

HP -- 55
Attack -- 95
Defense -- 70
Special Attack -- 125
Special Defense -- 65
Speed -- 120
Total -- 530

It could have access to Blizzard, Bug Buzz, Ice Shard, Megahorn, Ice Beam, Aura Sphere, and the like. Giving this thing Nasty Plot would just be too much.

EDIT: Oh, another ability to think about is Serene Grace. Bug Buzz would have a 20% of dropping the opponent's special defense. Plus, Blizzard would have a 60% chance of freezing, especially useful on a hail team (which most always carries Rapid Spin support, to begin with). It could get some moves to go along with Serene Grace, like Charge Beam or Dark Pulse with its 40% flinch rate.

A set of Charge Beam, Ice Beam / Blizzard, Bug Buzz, and Ice Shard / Megahorn / Aura Sphere / Dark Pulse with Serene Grace could be pretty neat.

[Hyra]

I'd still like it to be a little faster, but that's what I'm aiming for. Just remember, HP is pretty worthless on this, it loses half of it. So just go as low as you feel. I would stay above 20 though, don't take away Shuckle's Claim to fame.

Also, I'd like to make this playable outside of an Abomasnow setting. Hail teams are very rigid in what they can and can't include. a 4x Stealth Rock weak is something they like to avoid.