The Everything NFL Thread: 2011-2012 Season (plus free agency I guess)

Well guys, it's official - Player reps will vote to approve the new CBA today, which means training camps start this week and the season will officially be underway! This means a frantic free agency period and possibly a shorter preseason.

So, let's get the NFL-related discussion rolling!

How does everyone feel about the terms of the new CBA? What problems do you think will arise in the near or distant future?

I honestly don't give a flying fuck. I just want my goddamned football.

RAIDERS!

rumors are that the Eagles are going to sign Ray Edwards and trade Kolb to Arizona for Rodgers-Cromartie

every other team in the NFC besides the Packers might be fucked if that happens, unless Vick gets injured (which is actually fairly likely)

good enough for me, good enough for me and bobby mcgee

just happy to have a fucking season, I like how they still had to destroy the preseason to decide how to divvy up the immense amount of profits that everyone gets to roll around in though

Kolb for Rodgers-Cromartie is a horrible trade IMO, if it's done straight up. Kolb is a mediocre QB at best, and will never win the Cards any championships or go deep in the playoffs. At best they'll have a chance to win the division and get a 4th seed playoff birth, but would likely be eliminated by whichever wild card team they faced. Rodgers-Cromartie, meanwhile, provides much more value to his team and is far more talented at his own position. The Cardinals would be foolish to give up R-C for Kolb. Maybe if they offered Rodgers-Cromartie for Kolb + mid round draft pick it'd be worth it, but straight up I'd say no.

YEAH FOOTBALL.

The Kickoff game should be good, Saints and Packers haven't played each other for 2 years I believe.

WHO'S READY FOR SOME FOOTBALL?!

DM said:

I honestly don't give a flying fuck. I just want my goddamned football.

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Pretty much what he said, inthe end it's all about how to split 9 fucking billion dollars, and all that happens is that the rich get richer. So yeah, who really gives a fuck in that regard, they're back to playing at least.

R-C for Kolb I also agree is horribad, R-C is like their best corner on an already iffy defense, there's nothing to be gained by trading him for Kolb, who at best is slightly above average. I personally think they should aim more for Bulger and hope he experiences a rebirth like Warner instead ofmaking a potentially Faustian bargain for Kolb.

While I definitely agree that R-C for Kolb is bad for the Cards in terms of player skill, in terms of value R-C has little to offer for the team. To put it bluntly, the best Corner in the game isn't going to win you any games, while a slightly above average QB (I'm not sold on the Kolb hype either, I think at best he'll be around the level of Kyle Orton or Eli Manning this past year) has the potential to win games and sell tickets. Hell, in that division he might even take them to the playoffs!

The alternative would be to keep R-C to make your bad defense appear average for the next 2-3 years until he bolts in FA, while (hopefully) drafting a QB of the future next year, which of course is always a gamble. Kolb might give them the chance to start winning now, which is always important in the NFL.

The R-C for Kolb trade probably will happen, the Cards are willing to trade him and the Eagles would be absolutely stupid to refuse.

Football? Football.

imo the raiders player rep should abstain from the vote (when it actually happens) just for the lulz

WaterBomb said:

Kolb for Rodgers-Cromartie is a horrible trade IMO, if it's done straight up. Kolb is a mediocre QB at best, and will never win the Cards any championships or go deep in the playoffs. At best they'll have a chance to win the division and get a 4th seed playoff birth, but would likely be eliminated by whichever wild card team they faced. Rodgers-Cromartie, meanwhile, provides much more value to his team and is far more talented at his own position. The Cardinals would be foolish to give up R-C for Kolb. Maybe if they offered Rodgers-Cromartie for Kolb + mid round draft pick it'd be worth it, but straight up I'd say no.

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The NFL has become arranged so that teams need a top 15 level quarterback to matter. Anything less, and you have to have an amazing defense to compensate. I can see how the knee jerk reaction is definitely "this trade does not make sense", and if it does not happen that would be why, but I think it would actually be a coup for the Cardinals who were ONE OF THE WORST TEAMS by far last year on both offense and defense!

And if the Cards don't get Kolb, who do they go with at QB this season? Derek Anderson clearly isn't the answer. Skelton, Hall, Bartel are young and mediocre. Someone said Bulger, who would be a decent option for now, but he's not long-term. I don't see them getting Hasselbeck, and who knows how the Carson Palmer situation will end? I'd take Kolb over Vince Young, Donovan McNabb, or Tarvaris Jackson.

They have to get help at QB--someone stable, he doesn't have to be Kurt Warner--even if it means giving up a talent like R-C.

Go Ravens!

Yay. Football.

I'm going on record saying that this is the year Carolina wins it all. Just watch. Panthers over Patriots in Super Bowl 46.

Midnight Show said:

And if the Cards don't get Kolb, who do they go with at QB this season? Derek Anderson clearly isn't the answer. Skelton, Hall, Bartel are young and mediocre. Someone said Bulger, who would be a decent option for now, but he's not long-term. I don't see them getting Hasselbeck, and who knows how the Carson Palmer situation will end? I'd take Kolb over Vince Young, Donovan McNabb, or Tarvaris Jackson.

They have to get help at QB--someone stable, he doesn't have to be Kurt Warner--even if it means giving up a talent like R-C.

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I dunno, Kolb or McNabb is a push I think, McNabb is a bit older but has proven experience, and you basically have an ideal with what you're getting; he struggles in the bigger games for sure, but all-around is solid despite last year's train wreck, which is arguably just as much a fault of the situation he was put in. With Kolb, all you can judge him by are a mere handful of starts, with the better ones coming against not-as-good teams, and he can still develop either badly or good; it's still an unknown with him.

Palmer, eh, I dunno, not only is he more liable to carry through with his threat to retire if not traded (which the Bengals still deny they'll do), but you have to question his history of injuries and desire/commitment these days. Hasselback is old and injury-prone as well, not to mention Seattle will likely be looking to keep him for now. But yeah, Young is way too risky and diva-prone despite the decent numbers and w-l record, and Jackson is...well...just not that good.

Anyways enough of icky Cardinals talk, I'm still annoyed Harbaugh already wants to shoot himself in the foot with Alex Smith; hasn't he noticed both of his predecessors have had ZERO luck with him? I'd much rather see his ass out the door and spend another season losing with a non-proven or not ready QB instead of having to endure another losing season with him at the helm, even if it gives an excuse to bust out the pitchforks and torches.

Texas Cloverleaf said:

Go Ravens!

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I'm pretty excited to see the Week One Steelers at Ravens game--will be physical, to say the least.

By the way, anyone want to wager on how much James Harrison will be fined in total this season? I'm going with a conservative $70,000, but I guess it depends on how discipline is negotiated for this coming season.

Galladiator said:

I'm going on record saying that this is the year Carolina wins it all. Just watch. Panthers over Patriots in Super Bowl 46.

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Nah, man. Bills over Packers/Falcons/Eagles... Doesn't matter, Buffalo will beat 'em. :)))

Shinryu said:

I'm still annoyed Harbaugh already wants to shoot himself in the foot with Alex Smith; hasn't he noticed both of his predecessors have had ZERO luck with him?

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With that division as weak as it is, I'd start giving Kaepernick some snaps now. Maybe he can push the Niners past .500, which should be enough for a playoff berth. >.>

Marc Bulger has spent the last several years being a really terrible quarterback. I would not take a flier out on him unless I were positively desperate. Vince Young would also be a solid option, but I figure maybe they have some sort of pressure not to take the guy they could have just taken instead of Matt Leinart (who they should have tried instead of Derek Andersen in the first place). Anyway, Bulger = Andersen in terms of probable outcomes, that is anything but a solid choice. Kolb is taking a flier on a probable top 15 quarterback, which should lead to a probable 7-9+ season even with practically no other improvements. Additionally, given that the team got to the championship with a good quarterback (even two years out, roster turnover is so fast in the NFL these days), the team really might be fixed just by upgrading at quarterback.

I think the Panthers could use Bulger. Newton needs a veteran to help him acclimate to the NFL, even more so because of the lockout.

Also, anyone have any idea where D Will is gonna go? As a Panthers fan, I would like to see him stay, but I think they could also manage with a Stewart/Goodson platoon

dloosh13 said:

I think the Panthers could use Bulger. Newton needs a veteran to help him acclimate to the NFL, even more so because of the lockout.

Also, anyone have any idea where D Will is gonna go? As a Panthers fan, I would like to see him stay, but I think they could also manage with a Stewart/Goodson platoon

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Firstly, thank God I'm not the only Panthers fan here.

Secondly, I hadn't thought about it, but Bulger coming to Charlotte does seem interesting. Not sure if he's the ideal candidate, though. I'd personally prefer someone like Kolb who's actually somewhat decent.

Thirdly, I'm not entirely convinced Goodson will be involved very much at all. I'm guessing that either Stewart is the feature back, or he gets the majority of touches with Goodson doing third downs and some goal line work. (That's assuming D-Will gets traded, possibly somewhere like Houston to complement Arian Foster. I'd like him to stay too, but it isn't very likely.)

Panther fans are taking over this thread. Personally, I think the Panthers should just keep Matt Moore. He has proven that he can actually win games. He fits the mold of a backup QB. I don't buy into the whole "vet QB" thing. Isn't that what the QB coach is for?

As far as re-signing DeAngelo Williams goes, why waste the money on him? With Stewart, Goodson and Sutton available at RB, the money they would use on Williams could go to another need like CB/DT/OL.

Here is my dream scenario:

Cut Chris Gamble
Let Richard Marshall and DeAngelo Williams sign somewhere else

Sign Charles Johnson
Sign Nnamdi Asomugha
Sign Brandon Mebane
Sign any other mediocre CB to replace Marshall
Sign an offensive tackle because Jeff Otah is a lazy jerk
Sign Matt Moore

I think Kolb would be great, but the cost is way to high. The Panthers need to keep their future draft picks for once. Cardinals are probably going to get him anyway. Other options for QB are Hasselbeck, Orton (if the Broncos cut him), McNabb (who probably will get cut), and Delhomme (gag)

They absolutely need to resign Johnson. He had a career year last year and is only 25.
I would love Nnamdi, but he has said that he wants to play for a winning team. And he will cost a lot.
I'm really not sure about Moore. He is the only QB on their roster with any experience, but he has been pretty inconsistent, which fits the backup role...but there's still Clausen who I doubt they would give up on.

The thing working most in their favor is the salary cap. Currently, they are around 35 million below, so they have room to make some big signings, although that hasn't been their style the last few years. And with the new rules, they are required to spend up to about 10 million below, so they have at least 25 million that they have to spend.

I am pretty sure there are more Panthers fans on this website than any other team I've seen. Awesome!

Anyway the problem with taking Kolb is he's just not a long term solution. Too often in this league teams are overly focused on the short term and they never end up going anywhere beyond a decent 10-6 season with an early playoff exit. Long term thinking is the reason franchises such as the Patriots, Giants, Steelers, Colts, and Eagles have been so consistently successful year after year. Downer seasons are going to happen whether you like it or not, and too many teams don't have the backbone to endure a few bad years while truly rebuilding. I think the Lions are honestly on the right path in this regard, as they have been slowly rebuilding through the draft and trades over the course of several years. This is how you build serious contenders that will compete for extended time rather than a one-and-done team that spends all its mojo on one good season and super bowl.

Perpetuating the Panthers following amongst those that frequent this thread, what are they going to do with Clausen? Especially if they keep Moore or go after Bulger. Do you think that there are any teams interested in him and can they expect to actually get anything for him?

BiGGiE said:

Perpetuating the Panthers following amongst those that frequent this thread, what are they going to do with Clausen? Especially if they keep Moore or go after Bulger. Do you think that there are any teams interested in him and can they expect to actually get anything for him?

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I think it is too early to give up on Clausen. He will probably be the #3 QB behind Newton and whatever veteran they bring in. If Newton is horrible in preseason, Clausen might have a chance to win the starting job. After last season's horrible performance, he has no trade value, so he will have to show something at some point to make other teams want him.