A Year of Rainstall (1 on PBC, 12 on Beta, 1 on Smogon) by Porii Sames

[Porii Sames]

I probably overlooked something while playing this team. Opinions welcome.

OK, so due to the overwhelming popularity of Rainstall on Beta when I was laddering there, I wanted to try it out and kinda see how it worked. Could I play it? Did it deserve the hype? And, most importantly, what would be on it? At first I began to take part's of peoples' teams (including DJ Hezzy, Gangstarr, Chomp29, Rainman, and Ereno) just to mess around with what I thought was best.

Since I was playing RAIN stall, I wanted to start with a defensive Toed. Since late 2010, I had been playing with a specially defensive Politoed. It seemed to be much more useful overall and ate even STAB Tbolts with its impressive bulk.



With the "Rain" part of my Rainstall finished, I looked to the next Poke. What were the biggest stall Pokes in the game? None other than Chansey and Skarmory.



I had used a Skarm/Chans/Tenta core in Ubers (like everyone else thanks to my good friend Donkey), so I said "Hey, it works when everything hits even harder, so it probably should work here." Tenta has yet to dissappoint.




With the main defensive core finished, I felt as though I needed some sort of grass type to hold the team together. The regular player would have looked towards Celebi or perhaps Ferrothorn. I, however, remembered the horrors of playing against good Amoonguss players. While basically useless in Standard, Dream World gives the shroom an impressive tool in REGENERATOR. Instant healing means you don't have to use Leftovers, which gives you the Shed Shell option which is always nice.



Now, on both PBC and Beta, Rainstall was HUGE. While I felt I had a great team and I was an above average player, I knew there were plenty of better players who knew their rainstall better than me. What broke Rainstall? I had used it before to great success and felt it should work here. In goes Lum Keldeo.



Now, I laddered this team to great heights. It was solid. EXCEPT there were certain stallbreakers that just caused it to have use issues unless I played on the offense with Keldeo immediately or just spammed Scald. The two big ones were Sub-Gyarados and SubCM Rachi. What beat both of these? Well, for SubCM Rachi, the only truly solid counter was Gastrodon.




In addition, Gastrodon was a hugely useful opponent to random things like Crocune if Toed was down, and with HP Electric not even Sub or Taunt Gyarados could stand in its way before it was swiftly 2HKOd (or OHKOd with a Storm Drain boost).

CURRENT RAINSTALL TEAM <3 <3 <3

Politoed (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 248 HP / 64 SAtk / 196 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Scald
- Protect
- Encore
- Perish Song

My original Toed set was none other than the standard 252 HP/252 Sp.D/4 Speed Calm, with Scald/Toxic/Tect/Encore. After a while, I wanted Scald to hit a bit harder, and there were a few set up sweepers (such as Latias) which I wanted a reliable "get out" move. As such, I added Perish Song over Toxic and pumped in 52 Sp.A EVs, which OHKO's Excadrill but also is nifty for a multitude of other events and is all around useful. Perish Song + Encore is very useful for set up sweepers, normally Special Sweepers. It's also useful for some offensive NP Ninetales so you can take a +2 or +4 Energy Ball and OHKO back in the rain. I chose not to run Toxic as I feel that I can normally just use a decently powered Scald or threaten things with Perish Song, and I also have Toxic Spikes.

Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 5 HP / 252 Def / 252 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Softboiled
- Stealth Rock
- Seismic Toss
- Heal Bell

I didn't want to fit a Stealth Rock user on my team anywhere as I thought the typing would overlap Skarm's too much, so I went ahead and added on a Chansey. Everything that has been said about this poke has been said. It eats special hits and even physical hits (for example, +4 Landorus EQ without LO doesn't OHKO). Softboiled is for the obvious recovery, and Wish is absent because the majority of my Pokes have some sort of recovery (bar Politoed who must rely on Protect). SToss is for reliable damage, and Heal Bell is exceedingly helpful against other stall teams or Jellicent. The EVs maximize the defense gained from Eviolite.

Skarmory (F) @ Rocky Helmet
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Brave Bird
- Spikes
- Whirlwind
- Roost

Rocky Helmet? Who goes there? Well, Chomp29 and I can testify to the serious amazingness of Rocky Helmet Skarmory. Against teams with Scizor and sometimes Genesect, Skarmory can easily come in on the Uturn and take about 5% while dishing out 17. This racks up with entry hazards; Scizor is limited to only 6 Uturns without even counting Rocks or however many Spikes I might have up. The EVs intend to maximize the obvious defense stat, and I wanted to outspeed some Skarm and Whirlwind them first, so I went ahead and put a few Speed EVs on. The rest of the set is mostly self explanatory; Brave Bird for good damage, Spikes for pressure, WW for phazing, and Roost to recover.

Tentacruel (F) @ Black Sludge
Trait: Rain Dish
EVs: 252 HP / 194 Def / 44 Spd / 20 SAtk
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic Spikes
- Scald
- Protect

Tentacruel is a very bulky and heavily overused Rainstall poke for many good reasons. Rapid Spin is the big use of Tenta; spinning away those pesky hazards is a must for any practical stall team. Toxic Spikes is in the same field; although only 1 layer is needed most of the time. Scald is useful for flying pokes immune to Toxic Spikes; such as Togekiss. Protect is very handy dandy for speedy recovery and 1/4 HP recovery in the Rain. It also racks up Toxic damage if necessary. The EVs are there to take even strong Earthquakes and also outpseed a good majority of Gliscor and a few other defensive pokes. The Special Attack EVs are to 3HKO Conkeldurr.

Amoonguss (F) @ Shed Shell
Trait: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Spore
- Clear Smog
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Giga Drain

Amoonguss is no joke whatsoever. Tanking even a +2 Terrakion LO Stone Edge and Sporing it proves its use against even typical stallbreakers. Amoonguss is about as much of a mixed wall as you can get; strong special and physical attackers are deterred by its good coverage, Clear Smog which prevent setting up from working, and even Spore to incapacitate a poke for a random amount of time. Even Chandelure can't do a thing to it as it easily switches out from the Tag. The big reason it is used is Regenerator. With such easy recovery, Leftovers is not needed. You can gain a huge chunk of the HP opponents knock out just by switching out of their counter. Amoonguss is also brilliant for breaking the common Rotom + Scizor core with Skarmory. Skarmory makes Scizor take damage from Uturning, while Amoonguss can just Regenerate the meager Volt Switch damage. Amoonguss=fantastic in DW.

Gastrodon (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 5 SDef
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Electric]
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Recover

Now, this is my newest member to my team and I'm very unsure of the EVs at the moment. I wanted to absorb physical hits but also have an extra oomph in special hits as well. Scald is great for all around burning in case you need to burn things (ya don't say?), Earth Power is great for things like fire types in the sun or Jirachi, and HP Electric is almost soley for Gyarados, which can rip this team apart if it gets going. Recover makes sure it can keep sponging water moves and helping the team. Overall Gastro isn't as useful as the rest of the m embers, and has the sole use of checking Rachi and Dos. That's basically the only reason why he is used, but it's a damn good one.



So, that just about covers it. Rate away, and maybe help with those Gastrodon EVs.

[Porii Sames]

Reserved for offensive threats:

Offensive Threats




Tyranitar:

• Choice Band -Skarm can generally dismember it, unless it is a fast one and Stone Edges and I get cocky. However, no matter what move it uses, I'll have something on my team to resist it fine.
• Choice Scarf -Since they are normally led with, Toed gets the rain up while they hit me with less power. Even if the rain isn't up, Skarm can take just about any of its hits.
• Dragon Dance -Again, Skarm can take nigh anything DD wants to throw at me, even moreso if rain is up.

Rotom-W:

• Choice Scarf / Specs -Amoonguss doesn't mind being Choiced too bad since it has immediate recovery, and it stands up to Rotom-W very well regardless. Or I can go to Chansey.

Scizor:

• Choice Band -Skarm can take anything the Band throws at me and normally hit back with more from Rocky Helmet. Tenta can also take it very well, resisting all of its moves bar Pursuit.
• Swords Dance -^

Dragonite:

• Choice Band -With the rain up, Skarm takes Band without a problem, taking as little as 30% from even Fire Punch. Even without Rain, Skarm can take a hit and I can go to the appropriate poke.
• Dragon Dance -Skarm takes literally nothing from Dnite in the rain and promptly phazes it out or sets up hazards.
• Mixed -Now, this is somewhat more difficult, although Amoonguss can take basically anything and not be 2HKOd, while retaliating with Spore.
• Parashuffler -I have an electric immunity in addition to a Rocky Helmet user which takes practically nothing from Dtail.

Politoed:

• Choice Specs / Scarf -Chansey, Tenta, or Gastro can come in with little to no fear and, in the case of the former two, start setting up hazards.

Heatran:

• Standard -Toed takes little from any of its assaults and 2HKOs without a problem. With a couple of Rocks switch ins or Spikes, it is OHKOd.

Jirachi:

• Substitute + Calm Mind / Wish + Calm Mind -SubCM is dealty with promptly by Gastro, which is immune to its most common set. I havent dealt with Wish + CM yet, but Amoonguss isn't OHKO'd by almost anything, so it can normally come in and Spore. I also have Toed to burn if necessary. Havent seen much of these however, seems like it could be troublesome.

Latios:

• Life Orb -Chansey takes under 50% from Psyshock, so I can just stay in while it tries to widdle me down.
• Choice Scarf / Specs -Again Chansey, preferably predicting a Trick with Amoonguss. Specs is still bothersome however if it begins messing up my items.
• Calm Mind -Depending on what moves it uses, Skarm can phase it, Chansey can stay in and kill it, Amoonguss can Spore it and let something else deal with it, or Toed can just Perish/Encore/Scald burn. Still troublesome depending on the set.

Reuniclus:

• Calm Mind -Politoed lols at Calm Minds with a combination of Encore + Perish Song
• Offensive Trick Room -Toed takes little from Psychic and can use Protect to gain HP. With Psyshock, it is somewhat more difficult although doable.

Haxorus:

• Choice Scarf / Choice Band - lolol Skarm
• Dragon Dance -see above
• Double Dance -see above

Ninetales:

• Nasty Plot -Politoed can take nigh anything Tales throws at it, and reverse the weather too. Chansey also isn't threatened and can set up deadly Rocks while waiting.
• Choice Specs -Chansey or Toed depending on what move it uses (scouted by Tect on Toed).
• Special Attacker -See Nasty Plot

Conkeldurr:

• Bulk Up -Amoonguss can take on Conk one on one, and it is even easier if there are some Toxic Spikes down. Tentacruel can also do this for a while, although not as reliably.

Celebi:

• Nasty Plot Sweeper -This all depends on what its last move is. If it is Recover, Amoonguss can stay in most of the day and Skarm can normally Brave Bird or Phase less offensive ones. If it is Psychic, this becomes harder depending on how offensive it is. Skarm can normally do well or Chansey depending on circumstances. If Tspikes are down, it normally doesn't matter however.
• Tinkerbell -Never seen this ever, but Chansey can take it fine.
• Choice Specs / Choice Scarf -Chansey can take anything it attempts at trying to throw at it.

Terrakion:

• Double Dance -Amoonguss handles this with ease with a myraid of moves to use against it (Clear Smog to stop boosts, Giga Drain to heal off of it, or Spore just to incapacitate). Skarm can also handle it...sorta...
• Choice Scarf / Choice Band -Amoonguss can take any move it uses and then I can go to Gastro to take the Rock move or stay in (CC doensn't 2HKO Amoonguss) and either Giga Drain or Spore.

Gyarados:

• Offensive / Bulky Dragon Dance -Gastrodon takes this thing for a good while, 2HKOs it or OHKO if I can tempt a Waterfall.

Gengar:

• Substitute + Disable / Pain Split -SubDisable I normally just go to Chansey and wait for it to run out of Focus Blast, and then go out to Skarm and set up some Rocks. With Pain Split, it's harder, although Toed can handle it sometimes in a pinch.

Starmie:

• Life Orb -Chansey obviously takes it fine, as can Gastro or Amoonguss sometimes.
• Rapid Spin -Chansey can stay in all day, but Gastro can actually damage it.
• Choice Specs -Chansey takes whatever, although Trick is annoying.

Landorus:

• Rock Polish / Swords Dance -Skarm handles it fine, or Amoonguss can HP Ice it if it's Rock Polish.
• Choice Scarf -Skarm takes no damage from EQ, about 30% from Stone Edge, and Uturn gives Landorus recoil it doensn't enjoy.
• Substitute + 3 Attacks -Skarm generally, if it's Smack Down then Amoonguss sometimes.

Infernape:

• Mixed Attacker - Tentacruel handles nigh any Infernape set; Thunderpunch on mixed will only hit about 50% and Scald does massive damage.
• Nasty Plot / Swords Dance Booster - Again Tentacruel, although Swords Dance Thunderpunch will hit very hard. I don't have a hugely reliable SD Ape counter, but again, I haven't seen any.
• Choice Band - Tentacruel again, and then Gastro after a Tpunch.

Volcarona:

• Offensive Quiver Dance -I have a myraid of options; Toed doesn't take too much damage, or I can just go to Chansey and laugh.
• Bulky Quiver Dance -Read above
• Chesto Rest -NORMALLY Toed, although they can be troublesome if I act like an idiot or somethin.
• Substitute - Read Offensive & Defensive

Magnezone:

• Substitute -Well if it's vs Skarm, pray that they Sub and I can WW them out. If it's not trapping something, then Chansey or Gastro.
• Choice Scarf - Read above

Espeon:

• Calm Mind -Normally Toed, though depending on the set Chansey or Skarm.

Salamence:

• Dragon Dance -Amoonguss and Skarm both wall it nicely, although Skarm is risky if they pack Fire Blast.
• Mixed -Amoonguss takes it just fine under rain.
• Defensive -Uhh...well I havent seen too many, although Amoonguss seems logical.

Hydreigon:

• Offensive -Chansey eats its hits all day long, and Toed can handle it nicely although Draco's hit hard.
• Choice Specs / Choice Scarf -Read above.

Breloom:

• Sub Seed -Amoonguss + Skarm will beat this thing, and Chansey can Heal Bell off the sleep later.
• Sub Punch -Read above, although somewhat more annoying.

Latias:

• Calm Mind -Skarm can phase it, Toed can take a hit and Perish if its the last poke they have.

Toxicroak:

• Swords Dance -Handled by Skarm, although it can be quite troublesome depending on certain factors.
• Bulk Up -Skarm again, though this time partly Gastro as Skarm doesnt hit enough with Brave Bird. Still Whirlwindable.

Lucario:

• Swords Dance -Amoonguss takes +2 anything, as does Tenta, and they can both revenge in their own ways.
• Nasty Plot -Normally Tenta, although it depends. Can be troublesome, but I haven't seen too many.

Virizion:

• Calm Mind -Amoonguss can hit hard with Clear Smog or Spore it if I don't want to deal with it.
• Swords Dance -Read above, but Skarm can also be used.

Scrafty:

• Dragon Dance -Since Scrafty is awful, Skarm and Amoonguss take it perfectly fine.
• Bulk Up -Read above.

Venusaur:

• Special Growth -Annoying if I mess around and let it set up. Amoonguss, Chansey, and sometimes Skarm depending on the set. If I burn it with Scald after it switches in to Tenta, Gastro, or Toed, then it's basically useless.
• Mixed Growth -Since they don't invest enough Special Attack normally, it's Amoonguss.
• SubSeed -Amoonguss walls this easily.

Metagross:

• Stealth Rock -Tenta can spin it away and Scald for a burn, Skarm can just set up more hazards and Rocky Helmet recoil.
• Choice Scarf / Choice Band -Skarm takes even boosted Thunderpunches fine, as can Gastro if necessary.
• Agility -Read above.

Mienshao:

• All-Out Attacker -Amoonguss, Tenta, and Skarm can all somewhat cover it, although HJK is annoyingly powerful. Tenta can Protect on this however.
• Choice Scarf / Choice Band -If it is Banded, I can play around with Protect and good switching. Scarf is easier to cover.

Cloyster:

• Shell Smash -Tentacruel handles it fine, Scald does enormous damage after they shoot their Special Defense into the dirt.

Mamoswine:

• Physical Attacker -Skarm handles it well, although Banded Icicle Crashes are bothersome.

Darmanitan:

• Choice Scarf -In the rain, Tenta, sometimes Gastro. Out of the rain...still Tenta.

Tornadus:

• Rain Abuser -Chansey can buffer a few hits, but it's never pleasent. Tornadus is certainly a pain, although doable.

[Porii Sames]

Reserved for defensive threats

Defensive Threats


Tyranitar:

• Specially Defensive -Depends on certain factors, Toed can burn it and Tenta can spin away its rocks, normally depends on what set it's running.

Rotom-W:

• Standard -Amoonguss handles it just fine, taking little to no damage from anything. Burns can be healed off by Chansey later.

Ferrothorn:

• Standard -Skarm can just stay in and set up hazards if it just has Rocks, Amoonguss can Spore it and put it out for a while, and Tenta can spin away whatever it wants to.

Politoed:

• Defensive -Chansey takes it perfectly, as can Tenta. Both set up hazards while its hits bounce off.

Gliscor:

• Swords Dance -Amoonguss can HP Ice or Clear Smog, and if it lacks Taunt, Skarm laughs at it. Gastro can take +2 EQ and easily Scald.
• Substitute + Protect -Good Lord if this thing isn't annoying...normally. Good thing I have Skarm.
• AcroBat -A man named Skarm takes Gliscor fine.
• Defensive -Skarm, Amoonguss, Gastro, and even Toed take this set perfectly fine.

Heatran:

• Specially Defensive -Tenta, Toed, Chansey, and Gastro can all threaten it or just tank its hits, and Tenta can spin away its Rocks and is immune to Toxic.

Jirachi:

• Specially Defensive -Skarm takes it on generally, as neither Body Slam or Iron Head are doing anything to Skarm (and Rachi will take massive damage from Rocky Helmet if it attempts this). If it has Thunder or something, then Gastro handles it too.

Skarmory:

• Physically Defensive Spiker -Tenta can just spam Scald hoping for a burn, and also spin away whatever it does.
• Specially Defensive Spiker -Read above, only a bit more troublesome.

Ninetales:

• Specially Defensive -Toed laughs at it, as does Chansey, Gastro (depending on set), and Tenta, although the last can't really hurt it much.

Celebi:

• Physically Defensive -Depending on set, Skarm and Amoonguss can handle it nicely. Chansey handles non-Leech Seed versions fine.

Forretress:

• Physically Defensive Spiker -Tenta can just spam Scald and do some nice chunks and hope for a burn and spin when necessary.
• Specially Defensive Spiker -Above, but only a bit harder.

Gyarados:

• RestTalk -If it's the standard set, Gastro handles it without issues. Amoonguss and Skarm are also nice.

Jellicent:

• Utility Counter -If Toxic Spikes are up, then it's nothing. Otherwise, Toed can force it out until I set them up later. Can be troublesome at times, but there's always Amoonguss with Spore and Giga Drain if I'm desparate.

Tentacruel:

• Toxic Spikes -Use my own Tenta and Scald it until it burns. If I get burned, keep Scalding. When it burns, go to Chansey, Heal Bell, and begin Seismic Tossing.

Gastrodon:

• Tank -Amoonguss handles it fine, but setting up Toxic Spikes is always a nice precaution.

Espeon:

• Dual Screens -Spam Scald with Toed gogogogo.
• Baton Pass -Above, although Skarm can phaze if necessary. Can be bothersome depending on the Pass target.

Blissey:

• Support -Skarm can take whatever and 2HKO with Brave Bird depending on EVs. Toxic Spikes incapacitate it however. Otherwise, it can't really do anything so just set up hazards over time.

Vaporeon:

• Wish Support -Get up Tspikes and make this easy. Otherwise, depending on moves, Gastro, Chansey, Toed, Tenta, and Amoonguss can PP stall it for a while until I think of something better.

Latias:

• Support -Keep on Scalding for a burn, and WW with Skarm if it tries to Wishpass.

Bronzong:

• Tank -Scald spam with any of my bulky waters and try to burn it. Tenta can spin its rocks, Skarm can just set up Spikes while it cannot hit back.
• Dual Screens -Read above.

Swampert:

• Defensive -Dat Amoonguss, sometimes Gastro or Skarm if I need to.

Mew:

• Stallbreaker -Well, this thing is so diverse...If it's the standard WoW/Roost/Psychic/Rocks, then Toed can take it until it gets Burned, and then I have a myriad of switch ins. This thing can do so many things tho that idk normally.

Slowbro:

• Tank -If Tspikes are up, then it's no problem with Chansey. If they;re not, Perish Song with Toed and get them up ASAP. Amoonguss can also take it OK, if it doens't switch in on Ice Beam or a Psy move. Gastro also eats water moves fine.

Quagsire:

• Curse -Skarmory can phaze away its boosts, and Amoonguss can Giga if necessary.
• Specially Defensive -Amoonguss does massive damage with Giga Drain or just Spore it it's THAT bulky.
• Physically Defensive -Read above.

[Princess Bri]

I just love how you don't mention me in your introduction, as my Rain Stall was probably the one you lost to most, and I'm like 8-0 versus this team, lol.

Anyways, it's obviously a good team. You're not running full EV's on Skarmory, and your 5 EV'd pokes are lol.

Your team wants the following EV's:


Politoed:

EVs: 248 HP / 196 Def / 64 SAtk

Tentacruel:


EVs: 252 HP / 192 Def / 20 SAtk / 44 Spd

Skarmory:

EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 Spd

This is just sort of a filler rate, I'll edit it later. Politoed's EV's let it KO Excadrill, Tenta's let it 3HKO Conk and outspeed defensive Gliscor, and Skarmory's allow it to outspeed most other Skarm and Wobbuffet.

[Porii Sames]

thx brah lol. and yeah, that was pre-gastro and stuff. could the toed evs not be done specially defensive tho? cuz then i'd have a total of 3 defensive waters and that seems excessive.

[DartMonkey29]

Great team you have there. I am personally 1-2 against it myself, and I must say its very solid.

I love the new Gastrodon tech, and can't wait to play against that variant. The team still struggles a little bit with CM rachi who has Psyschock>Water Pulse, but you can obviously handle it if you predict correctly.

Overall its an excellent team, I don't have much to add because frankly, it can't get much better. Keep it up and get to #1 already XD.

[Porii Sames]

Yeah, it is solid. Havent seen any CM Rachi's that run anything different, so yeah. Should get to 1 sometime this week (at 4 atm).

Also updated with pretty fonts, and changes I make will be in bold.

[Porii Sames]

Bumpin' it up there, peaked at 1 yesterday with a 1540 rating!

[coughing]

This is a really nice team! I can see why it's number one it could blow my team out the water (pun not intended). It's a shame you got to the top and less people take notice since it's dream world. It was difficult to pick holes, I was going to mention Sub CM Rachi could give you problems which you have already addressed with gastrodon, I think if you see jirachi on a rain team you may have to be careful but you can play around that. Congrats on getting number one!

[The Truth]

To adress Sub-CM rachi with Psyshock, you could just change Gastrodon to Sassy and use Earthquake over Earth Power. This lets you beat stuff like Rachi after it's set up CMs. It also lets Gastrodon hit Ttar and other rock-types in Sand for higher damage, circumventing the spD boost. It's not that much of a change, but it helps with a couple little things.

Gastrodon could also use a spread of 252 HP/ 80 Def/ 176 spD with a +defense nature. This lets it always survive a CB Terrakion Close Combat and KO back with earthquake, which is invaluable. CB terra can cause many stall teams problems, so that's a nice thing to have. Keep in mind, gastrodon still won't be able to switch in on its attacks. That spread would also make the (admittedly very rare) Psyshock Rachi easier to beat if it's set up.

[Porii Sames]

Originally Posted by Fat The Truth

To adress Sub-CM rachi with Psyshock, you could just change Gastrodon to Sassy and use Earthquake over Earth Power. This lets you beat stuff like Rachi after it's set up CMs. It also lets Gastrodon hit Ttar and other rock-types in Sand for higher damage, circumventing the spD boost. It's not that much of a change, but it helps with a couple little things.

Gastrodon could also use a spread of 252 HP/ 80 Def/ 176 spD with a +defense nature. This lets it always survive a CB Terrakion Close Combat and KO back with earthquake, which is invaluable. CB terra can cause many stall teams problems, so that's a nice thing to have. Keep in mind, gastrodon still won't be able to switch in on its attacks. That spread would also make the (admittedly very rare) Psyshock Rachi easier to beat if it's set up.

tbh Terrakion isn't a huge issue with Amoonguss, I think i'll go Relaxed with EQ. Thanks man, great idea! :D

[Porii Sames]

Yeah, Manaphy was definitly a hugeeee issue. I know a CM Cune is as solid as a Manaphy counter as you can get, but I dont really want to replace anything for it...MAYBE CMCune>Gastro, but that's stretching it.

Also curses for being my first loss of 41 wins!

Edit: also I'm partly just waiting until it gets banned because damn is that thing annoying!

[Takeo Otori]

Originally Posted by Fat Porii Sames

Also curses for being my first loss of 41 wins!

Bragging for having a good win record in DW is like punching your wife in the face and saying you won a fight.

Anyhow cool team, but CM Reuniclus and CM Manaphy both decimate you.

Sub Calm Mind Chandelure sets up on Chansey and just ends the game. In fact Scarf or Specs Chandelure also can be an issue. Even its it only takes out Skarmory it's putting your team under enormous stress from Outrages.

Anyway I was going to post help but I've sort of lost interest and this team is legit solid, so I don't think I could help much if I tried. CM Manaphy is kind of the game ender for Rain stall, hard to say what can help here besides a Ferrothorn over Amoongus (but that opens you up to a lot of worse threats).

[Porii Sames]

Originally Posted by Fat White Queen

Bragging for having a good win record in DW is like punching your wife in the face and saying you won a fight.

Anyhow cool team, but CM Reuniclus and CM Manaphy both decimate you.

Sub Calm Mind Chandelure sets up on Chansey and just ends the game. In fact Scarf or Specs Chandelure also can be an issue. Even its it only takes out Skarmory it's putting your team under enormous stress from Outrages.

Anyway I was going to post help but I've sort of lost interest and this team is legit solid, so I don't think I could help much if I tried. CM Manaphy is kind of the game ender for Rain stall, hard to say what can help here besides a Ferrothorn over Amoongus (but that opens you up to a lot of worse threats).

lol, I'm cocky I don't deny it.

CM Reun isn't all that bad; Toed can encore CM whenever and Perish when it needs to.

SubCM Chandy is quite uncommon and this fails if TSpikes are down. I can still switch in Skarm to Outrages; since I have Rocky Helmet, they can take anywhere from 35ish to 50%. When they're done, I can just switch out (plus Amoonguss can take Outrages).

CM Mana rapes me hard.

[Harsha]

Just a thing about Manaphy, it'll OHKO Ferrothorn at +6 regardless, so there's really nothing a rainstall team can do about it.

[Porii Sames]

Originally Posted by Fat harsha2014

Just a thing about Manaphy, it'll OHKO Ferrothorn at +6 regardless, so there's really nothing a rainstall team can do about it.

On my Sand team I run an offensive Water Abrosb CUne with HP Grass which easily counters Manaphy. However that's hard to fit on and wouldnt be very useful outside of that.

atm I'm just rank sniping people and waiting lol.

[Razza]

Your weaknesses to manaphy are solved by the use of a stockpile quagsire over gastrodon, this also has the added bonuses of checking cm jirachi's and gyarados. I must stress that the spread you use will be very important as you cannot keep gyarados and manaphy in check with one spread before a stockpile.

This will also serve to solve your cm reuniclus weakness, who can slowly wear down politoed over the course of the match and then 6-0. Encore has limited pp and perish song is only a temporary solution to reuniclus.

Alternativley you could simply run clear smog on gastrodon too, which patches up your cm manaphy and reuniclus weakness pretty nicely unless they run toxic in which case ammonguss walls it nicely.

This team is really cool, its nice to see someone using ammonguss to its full potential rather than just spamming keldeo/breloom/garchomp/excadrill.

[Porii Sames]

If I were to do that (and it's a great idea btw), I would need a VERY effective spread. So...time to jack around on damage calc for a while. GREAT IDEA tho, thx man!

My only problem with Quag is that I'm kinda conerned how I'm supposed to actually beat Rachi. I can't Toxic it, won't do nearly enough to it with EQ, etc.

Tauntrados and Subdos would still be problematic, but I think I can give up my Manaphy rape for a Gyara weak (since playing well with Skarm + Amoonguss can sometimes take it out over time).

Lol CM Reun really isn't too bad if you predict well over the course of the match.

Yeah, Amoonguss is amazing, so good on stall.

[Princess Bri]

Originally Posted by Fat Porii Sames

If I were to do that (and it's a great idea btw), I would need a VERY effective spread. So...time to jack around on damage calc for a while. GREAT IDEA tho, thx man!

My only problem with Quag is that I'm kinda conerned how I'm supposed to actually beat Rachi. I can't Toxic it, won't do nearly enough to it with EQ, etc.

Tauntrados and Subdos would still be problematic, but I think I can give up my Manaphy rape for a Gyara weak (since playing well with Skarm + Amoonguss can sometimes take it out over time).

Lol CM Reun really isn't too bad if you predict well over the course of the match.

Yeah, Amoonguss is amazing, so good on stall.

Try a specially defensive spread, but I still think Manaphy 2HKO's with Surf in Rain.-.

[NahimC]

Nice Team, pretty solid but u put EQ on gastro instead of EP lol ninja eyes

[Unchained1]

Nice team porii, go for a more spec attacking gastro considering it will cause lots of switches(Like anything grass switching in) to modest 104 HP/ 152 Def /252 Spec att and hp elec for icebeam to get them dragons and grass poke scald at max spec att will troll gyara anyway and change earthquake to earth power :)

Hi Princess Bri <3

[Porii Sames]

I think you may be missing the point of Gastro.

Gastro is used STRICTLY for Gyarados and Rachi. Like, that's it. If it does something else, it rarely matters anyways. I have Skarm + Amoonguss + Rain, which handles just about any Dragon set whatsoever.

Thx tho, lol. Bromie.

[Kidogo]

Porii: this is a really hard team to play against, don't have much to add to it. One thing I wonder is if you might want a spinblocker, since if someone can trap or kill tentacruel/skarmory using dugtrio or chandelure and spin the hazards, that kind of ruins the whole strategy.

Also, when I played you the way I got past gastrodon was with chandelure energy ball. You might want to consider changing the EVs to 252 Hp, 156 Def, 100 SpD, which should let you live an energy ball 100% of the time if my calculations are correct. This is mostly important because of how prominent chandelure is and gyarados's danger to your team without gastrodon. Just a suggestion though.

Unchained: gastrodon's main purpose is to check gyarados, one of the biggest threats for rain stall, and switching to that EV spread means losing a ton of physical defense. And if you can predict the switch to a grass type, much better to double switch to an advantageous poke than to stay to get a hit in.

[Porii Sames]

Hey, i remembah you. Yeah, that's always annoying.

Spinblocker is always something I wanted....but never one I needed. Tbh it's only really helpful in stallwars vs. other rainstall teams that have a spinblocker, since I can generally outplay other rainstalls. Still, it would be nice to have and I always think about it a bit. You know, actually, Jelllicent w/ Water Absorb could be helpful as my Gyarados counter and Manaphy counter, in addition to being a spinblocker, but that leaves me open to Rachi again.

I'll definitely look at changing the EVs, I'm guessing nature is Relaxed, right?

So for now, for the final slot, I can have...

Gastro w/ new EV spread
Specially Defensive Stockpile Quagsire
Offensive Water Absorb Cune.
Some sort of Sp.D Jelly

[Kidogo]

OK, looks like I was a little off. The spread would actually be 252 HP / 144 Def / 112 SpD with a calm nature. Not sure if you want to lose that much defense though--but might be worth it given the prevalence of chandelure.