First OU Sandstorm team!

doomdg · Apr 15th, 2012, 6:44:34 AM

Hi All,

I've taken a break from competitive battling for 3 years now, and have only very recently returned to the scene. Here's what I've been running with for the last 2 weeks, and I'd like to seek some advice from more experienced players.

The core of the team is the sandstorm weather, which was essentially my old team in DPP, but it seems to be every bit as good as I remembered it to be.

To start off, every sandstorm team needs an enabler, and for that I've chosen hippowdon.

Hippowdon (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Roar
- Ice Fang
- Earthquake

The first thing you may notice is the lack of slack-off, which was originally in the set in the place of ice fang. Then you may notice the very offensive EV investment. I have originally tried the toxic/slack off tank build, but it was extremely poor against fast taunt users or substitute set-up sweepers. After some matches I decided to go for an offensive build that will sometimes let me surprise OHKO their leads.

To date, this set has done very well, even after getting burned I can OHKO a ninetales, and I can roar away most sub-setup sweepers before I stealth rock. Ice fang is incredible, hippowdon can switch into a dragonite with extremespeed and take ~44% damage, survive the next hit and OHKO with ice fang. It can also OHKO most dragons that try to dragon dance.

Salamence (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Moxie
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
- Dragon Claw
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Brick Break

Moxie Salamence feels like a completely new pokemon to me. To be honest, I have only used 3 moves in this set, with dragon claw never being the right choice, so there is a good chance that it could be a 4th coverage move. I just don't know what that should be.

Salamence's role is usually a revenge killer+sweeper, switching in on faster pokemon that would outrun him otherwise. Once outrage claims its first victim, nothing is safe. The moxie sweep has won me the most games out of my entire team.

Ferrothorn (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SDef
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Spikes
- Leech Seed
- Gyro Ball
- Power Whip

The spikes setup,physical tank, and bulky water check. Gyro Ball deals surprisingly large amounts of damage to fragile special attackers, such as Alakazam, Infernape and allows Ferrothorn to break subs when faster sub users are expecting leech seed. Powerwhip allows the team to take out bulky waters, and ice move users.

Gliscor (M) @ Flying Gem
Trait: Sand Veil
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Acrobatics
- Substitute

The other physical sweeper on the team, whereas salamence is a revenge killer, the flying gliscor comes in to tank a fighting move/earthquake and starts setting up. Sand veil is incredible as an ability, tilting many opponents and let me OHKO them back with a +2 165 base power Acrobatics. This scenarios happens most commonly with scarfed starmie, which will miss their hydro pump in the sandstorm and die on the hit, allowing me to complete the sweep. +2 Acrobatics hits even skarmory for 30+% and outraces them if they choose to hit back with brave bird. It is also very easy to predict the roost and use earthquake to 1 shot Skarmory.

The inclusion of gliscor allows the team to wall most physical threats in conjunction with ferrothorn. But this introduces the deadly weakness of ice shards, since the majority of my team relies on outspeeding my opponent.

Alakazam (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Magic Guard
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Shadow Ball

Alakazam is the special wall breaker in my team, easily KOing blissey and chansey, clears out almost all fighting types and ghost pokemon. Life orb not only provides that extra boost in OHKOing bulky ghosts, but it also lets you OHKO an opposing Alakazam(w/0 life orb shadow ball only deals 95% damage). He has saved me plenty of games by coming out really late and decimating low HP opponents. That said, this is pokemon that is next on the chopping board. Possibly for a mixed-attack infernape or something else that lets me check ferrothorn, swampert and mamoswine.

Starmie @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin

Starmie is a rapid spinner in name, but most of the time she provides incredible coverage with boltbeam and surf. Hydropump is deemed inconsistent enough in a sandstorm team. Often times surf lets you 2HKO spinblockers that switch in expecting you to rapid spin. Starmie is also a great check to mixed ghosts such as chandelure and jellicent.

Team matchups :

I have had mostly good matchups against other sand and sun teams. With the slow offensive hippowdon usually taking out ninetales and tyranitar. Baton passing teams are have troubles setting up the chain with roar on my weather lead. Other mixed teams are generally favorable as well, as long as there are not too many priority moves running around..

The greatest issue to this team is ice shards, taking out Gliscor, Salamence, Alakazam and Hippowdon with ease. Other bulky ice-move users such as ice punch from Dragonite, Ice fang from gliscor are all extremely problematic. Bulky waters are a problem as well, since my only electric attack is thunderbolt on starmie, although I have often times powered through them with a stabb+2 acrobatics after a missed hydropump.

Please provide any feedback on my team or anything I've missed.

Cheers
Doomdg

doomdg · Apr 19th, 2012, 4:16:45 AM

Bump?

Rwhite84 · Apr 19th, 2012, 9:36:29 AM

Salamence cant have outrage and moxie... Give it fire blast

Tomahawk9 · Apr 19th, 2012, 9:42:19 AM

You have a rather noticable Terrakion weakness. It can rip your team apart with its powerful STABs if you're not careful. Your two Stone Edge resists both take a lot of damage from Close Combat, with Ferrothorn being OHKOed and Hippowdon being 2HKOed. Landorus also gives your team troubles, probably more than Terrakion, as it 2HKOes Hippowdon with Life Orb Earthquake. Gliscor isn't exactly the best counter either since Expert Belt has been rising in popularity a lot lately and Hidden Power Ice is the key move on that set.
Both of these problems have the same reason: your Hippowdon EV spread and its lack of Slack Off. Slack Off is the move Hippowdon should never go without as it provides reliable recovery which it can use in winning weather wars and taking on phyiscal attackers. Also, if you change your EV spread to 252 HP / 244 Def / 12 SpD, Hippowdon will have a much easier time taking on those threats. Terrakion won't be able to 2HKO Hippowdon with Close Combat, and Landorus fails to 2HKO with Life Orb Earthquake and Expert Belt Hidden Power Ice.

The QWAZ · Apr 19th, 2012, 11:13:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Rwhite84

Salamence cant have outrage and moxie... Give it fire blast

Um
Yes it can, it cant have moxie outrage and dragon dance at the same time

Braseg257 · Apr 19th, 2012, 11:29:42 AM

i don't see all this terrakion weakness, since if it's not scarfed alakazam, starmie, hippowdon and gliscor can hit him super effectively if they can't OHKO him, and if it's scarfed and it's locked into stone edge or close combact can easily be walled by ferrothorn or gliscor. i seen that volcarona can be dangerous, as it can set up on ferrothorn, alakazam or on a earthquake/brick break-locked salamence, a more spdefensive-oriented ev spread for hippowdon could be helpful.
edit: fire blast can be an option in the place of dragon claw

Rwhite84 · Apr 19th, 2012, 12:29:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat The QWAZ

Um
Yes it can, it cant have moxie outrage and dragon dance at the same time

Ah sorry my bad your right

GearFlow · Apr 19th, 2012, 2:37:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Rwhite84

Salamence cant have outrage and moxie... Give it fire blast

Ofcourse it can.

Pokemasta77 · Apr 19th, 2012, 3:52:57 PM

You arent really taking advantage of the sand at all. I would recommend choice band/scarf terrakion. This thing can wreck completely. I would use this moveset.
252 spd/att and 4 hp
X-Scissors
Stone Edge
Close Combat
Earthquake
I have used this thing and it is a beast!

Pokemasta77 · Apr 19th, 2012, 4:16:15 PM

Sorry forgot something else. I think ferrothorn is a good choice but you are using it incorrectly.The nature and evs are fine but I would give it rocky helmet indtead of leftovers. Also I would change power whip to protect and spikes to toxic. I found it more useful as a staller and it does even better as one in sandstorm because they also get sandstorm damage. This is just what I found better but it is all up to you

The QWAZ · Apr 19th, 2012, 4:21:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Pokemasta77

Sorry forgot something else. I think ferrothorn is a good choice but you are using it incorrectly.The nature and evs are fine but I would give it rocky helmet indtead of leftovers. Also I would change power whip to protect and spikes to toxic. I found it more useful as a staller and it does even better as one in sandstorm because they also get sandstorm damage. This is just what I found better but it is all up to you

Sorry but this is iffy to say the least, rocky helmet on ferrothorn is fairly good but toxic is useless as hazard stacking is what ferrothorn is used for and if any move were to be replaced with protect it should be gyro ball as that can easily be PP stalled, ferrothorn really should not have two attacking moves as it is primarily a wall and it takes up a slot that could be used on thunder wave or protect ect.
Hope i helped

Apr 15th, 2012, 6:44:34 AM	#1
doomdg Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 8	First OU Sandstorm team! Hi All, I've taken a break from competitive battling for 3 years now, and have only very recently returned to the scene. Here's what I've been running with for the last 2 weeks, and I'd like to seek some advice from more experienced players. The core of the team is the sandstorm weather, which was essentially my old team in DPP, but it seems to be every bit as good as I remembered it to be. To start off, every sandstorm team needs an enabler, and for that I've chosen hippowdon. Hippowdon (F) @ Leftovers Trait: Sand Stream EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk) - Stealth Rock - Roar - Ice Fang - Earthquake The first thing you may notice is the lack of slack-off, which was originally in the set in the place of ice fang. Then you may notice the very offensive EV investment. I have originally tried the toxic/slack off tank build, but it was extremely poor against fast taunt users or substitute set-up sweepers. After some matches I decided to go for an offensive build that will sometimes let me surprise OHKO their leads. To date, this set has done very well, even after getting burned I can OHKO a ninetales, and I can roar away most sub-setup sweepers before I stealth rock. Ice fang is incredible, hippowdon can switch into a dragonite with extremespeed and take ~44% damage, survive the next hit and OHKO with ice fang. It can also OHKO most dragons that try to dragon dance. Salamence (F) @ Choice Scarf Trait: Moxie EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def) - Dragon Claw - Outrage - Earthquake - Brick Break Moxie Salamence feels like a completely new pokemon to me. To be honest, I have only used 3 moves in this set, with dragon claw never being the right choice, so there is a good chance that it could be a 4th coverage move. I just don't know what that should be. Salamence's role is usually a revenge killer+sweeper, switching in on faster pokemon that would outrun him otherwise. Once outrage claims its first victim, nothing is safe. The moxie sweep has won me the most games out of my entire team. Ferrothorn (F) @ Leftovers Trait: Iron Barbs EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SDef Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd) - Spikes - Leech Seed - Gyro Ball - Power Whip The spikes setup,physical tank, and bulky water check. Gyro Ball deals surprisingly large amounts of damage to fragile special attackers, such as Alakazam, Infernape and allows Ferrothorn to break subs when faster sub users are expecting leech seed. Powerwhip allows the team to take out bulky waters, and ice move users. Gliscor (M) @ Flying Gem Trait: Sand Veil EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Swords Dance - Earthquake - Acrobatics - Substitute The other physical sweeper on the team, whereas salamence is a revenge killer, the flying gliscor comes in to tank a fighting move/earthquake and starts setting up. Sand veil is incredible as an ability, tilting many opponents and let me OHKO them back with a +2 165 base power Acrobatics. This scenarios happens most commonly with scarfed starmie, which will miss their hydro pump in the sandstorm and die on the hit, allowing me to complete the sweep. +2 Acrobatics hits even skarmory for 30+% and outraces them if they choose to hit back with brave bird. It is also very easy to predict the roost and use earthquake to 1 shot Skarmory. The inclusion of gliscor allows the team to wall most physical threats in conjunction with ferrothorn. But this introduces the deadly weakness of ice shards, since the majority of my team relies on outspeeding my opponent. Alakazam (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Magic Guard EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Calm Mind - Psyshock - Focus Blast - Shadow Ball Alakazam is the special wall breaker in my team, easily KOing blissey and chansey, clears out almost all fighting types and ghost pokemon. Life orb not only provides that extra boost in OHKOing bulky ghosts, but it also lets you OHKO an opposing Alakazam(w/0 life orb shadow ball only deals 95% damage). He has saved me plenty of games by coming out really late and decimating low HP opponents. That said, this is pokemon that is next on the chopping board. Possibly for a mixed-attack infernape or something else that lets me check ferrothorn, swampert and mamoswine. Starmie @ Leftovers Trait: Natural Cure EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Surf - Ice Beam - Thunderbolt - Rapid Spin Starmie is a rapid spinner in name, but most of the time she provides incredible coverage with boltbeam and surf. Hydropump is deemed inconsistent enough in a sandstorm team. Often times surf lets you 2HKO spinblockers that switch in expecting you to rapid spin. Starmie is also a great check to mixed ghosts such as chandelure and jellicent. Team matchups : I have had mostly good matchups against other sand and sun teams. With the slow offensive hippowdon usually taking out ninetales and tyranitar. Baton passing teams are have troubles setting up the chain with roar on my weather lead. Other mixed teams are generally favorable as well, as long as there are not too many priority moves running around.. The greatest issue to this team is ice shards, taking out Gliscor, Salamence, Alakazam and Hippowdon with ease. Other bulky ice-move users such as ice punch from Dragonite, Ice fang from gliscor are all extremely problematic. Bulky waters are a problem as well, since my only electric attack is thunderbolt on starmie, although I have often times powered through them with a stabb+2 acrobatics after a missed hydropump. Please provide any feedback on my team or anything I've missed. Cheers Doomdg

Apr 19th, 2012, 9:42:19 AM	#4
Tomahawk9 Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 1,439	You have a rather noticable Terrakion weakness. It can rip your team apart with its powerful STABs if you're not careful. Your two Stone Edge resists both take a lot of damage from Close Combat, with Ferrothorn being OHKOed and Hippowdon being 2HKOed. Landorus also gives your team troubles, probably more than Terrakion, as it 2HKOes Hippowdon with Life Orb Earthquake. Gliscor isn't exactly the best counter either since Expert Belt has been rising in popularity a lot lately and Hidden Power Ice is the key move on that set. Both of these problems have the same reason: your Hippowdon EV spread and its lack of Slack Off. Slack Off is the move Hippowdon should never go without as it provides reliable recovery which it can use in winning weather wars and taking on phyiscal attackers. Also, if you change your EV spread to 252 HP / 244 Def / 12 SpD, Hippowdon will have a much easier time taking on those threats. Terrakion won't be able to 2HKO Hippowdon with Close Combat, and Landorus fails to 2HKO with Life Orb Earthquake and Expert Belt Hidden Power Ice. __________________ C&C Work \| Smog Work

Apr 19th, 2012, 11:29:42 AM	#6
Braseg257 Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 407 Italy	i don't see all this terrakion weakness, since if it's not scarfed alakazam, starmie, hippowdon and gliscor can hit him super effectively if they can't OHKO him, and if it's scarfed and it's locked into stone edge or close combact can easily be walled by ferrothorn or gliscor. i seen that volcarona can be dangerous, as it can set up on ferrothorn, alakazam or on a earthquake/brick break-locked salamence, a more spdefensive-oriented ev spread for hippowdon could be helpful. edit: fire blast can be an option in the place of dragon claw __________________ Blaziken, you were born as OU, when Lucario and Infernape didn't exist yet. Then, these two make you UU. But now, no more Milotic, Altaria, Moltres for you, but Kyogre, Lugia, Ho-oH, and I think UU have lost its best sweeper. Now, a new challenge is waiting for you, and we will fight for the glory in Ubers together as always we've done BW FC: 3568 2467 3508 Braseg257 trade thread (NOW OPEN)

Apr 19th, 2012, 4:16:45 AM	#2
doomdg Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 8	Bump?

Apr 19th, 2012, 9:36:29 AM	#3
Rwhite84 Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 124 Why would i say my location?, I dont wanna get raped!	Salamence cant have outrage and moxie... Give it fire blast

Apr 19th, 2012, 3:52:57 PM	#9
Pokemasta77 Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 363 United States	You arent really taking advantage of the sand at all. I would recommend choice band/scarf terrakion. This thing can wreck completely. I would use this moveset. 252 spd/att and 4 hp X-Scissors Stone Edge Close Combat Earthquake I have used this thing and it is a beast!

Apr 19th, 2012, 4:16:15 PM	#10
Pokemasta77 Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 363 United States	Sorry forgot something else. I think ferrothorn is a good choice but you are using it incorrectly.The nature and evs are fine but I would give it rocky helmet indtead of leftovers. Also I would change power whip to protect and spikes to toxic. I found it more useful as a staller and it does even better as one in sandstorm because they also get sandstorm damage. This is just what I found better but it is all up to you