(Gym) [ELECTRIC] - Dogfish44 vs Imanalt

Frosty · Feb 8th, 2013, 4:54:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Imanalt

"I AM HERE TO PUT AN END IN YOUR VICTORY STREAK FOGDISH! NOW GET READY TO LOSE!

I won't accept lame challenges, so consider this a suggestion

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Dogfish44

"Well then, let us see what you can withstand!"

3v3 Gym Singles (Challenger PMs the Referee 3 Mons, the Leader PMs 6)
1 Day DQ (Player)
3 Day DQ (Referee)
Banned Moves: N/A
Restricted Moves: Max 5 Chills Per Pokemon ; Max 2 Recovery Moves per Pokemon ; Restricted moves as per Arena
Arena: Bolt Beach
Switch: OK
Items: ON
Abilities: ALL
Substitute Orders: 2

Arena

Hello folks and welcome to the wet Bolt Beach! I swear sometimes I think there is more water here than in the water gym.

Anyway, we are here once again as witnesses to yet another challenge against the Electric Gym Leader, Dogfish44!

The Electric Gym Leader is the most popular of them with 10 battles and the most sucessful with 9 victories. He came from a very close victory against Texas Cloverleaf and has an impressive streak of 7 victories, more victories than any other Gym Leader have TOTAL. Those are very impressive statistics I must say and are enough to strike fear in any opponent's heart. For today's battle pay close attention to Murena the Eelektross. While Short Fuse is the signature pokemon, Murena is the most versatile of them all and will prove to be, in this ref's opinion, one key element of this match!

The challenger is someone...not well-known on the Gym Industry. Imanalt only had one challenge before this and against an inactive Gym Leader so we didn't get to see his potential. BUT if you see his profile, we will notice why he chose Dogfish, of all leaders, to challenge and why he has a fighting chance! Imanalt specializes in ground mons and brought a team of 3 Ground Pokemon. Pay special attention to Gastrodoom. Aside from being his signature pokemon, Gastrodoom doesn't mind the rain and is one of the few pokemon capable of defeating Cyclohm one-on-one on this enviroment.

BUT ENOUGH OF THIS! LET'S GET THE SHOW ON THE ROAD!

Gym Leader Team

Emolga (F) (*)

Electivire (M)

Rotom-F (N/A)

Cyclohm (M)

Eelektross (F)

Krillowatt (M)

Challenger Team

Gastrodoom

tusks

Whale?

Order of Operations:
Heads: Leader starts
Tails: Challenger starts

(Heads)

Dogfish44 sends out mon with item
Imanalt sends out mon with item and orders
Dogfish44 gives orders
I Ref.

Dogfish44 · Feb 8th, 2013, 5:08:37 PM

"IF WE CANNOT SHOCK, WE WILL SIMPLY TEAR YOU TO THE GROUND!"

Cyclohm @ Expert Belt

Imanalt · Feb 8th, 2013, 5:15:25 PM

go mamoswine @life orb
light screen, ice beam, earth power
IF bide, use substitute that action and push down
IF double team clones are up when you would attack a2 or a3, use blizzard

Dogfish44 · Feb 8th, 2013, 5:22:05 PM

"Hmm... Lead an attack Nimbus."

Weather Ball ~ Surf ~ Weather Ball

Frosty · Feb 8th, 2013, 6:06:18 PM

Hp: 110
En: 100
1/4/5/3/80
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

Hp: 110
En: 100
5/2/4/2/80
Other:
Item: Life Orb

Round 1

And round 1 has started!

The Leader sends out Nimbus the Cyclohm with Expert Belt! Fun fact: that same opening (with items and all) was used by Dogfish44 in 7 of his 10 matches thus far. I guess being unpredictable isn't one of the reasons of his good record.

The challenger counterattacks with Tusks the Mamoswine with Life Orb. Some of you may question: "why not Gastrodon? it worked for IAR!". Well, Nimbus changed his Hidden Power from Ground to Grass just for Gastrodon ever since that match AND Gastrodoom is Imanalt's main card, so it would be very risky to use it on a round where he orders last. Also, Mamoswine is a sexy beast, don't you think? [/glacier]

To begin this match, Nimbus attacks with Weather Ball using the incredibly convenient Rain to his advantage. The Ball hits Tusks squarely on his face right before he finished erecting a Light Screen to protect itself. I guess luck can be a bitch.

On the second turn it was Tusks's time to be a bit faster as it attacked with Ice Beam right before Nimbus's almost-to-surf wave crashed on his foe.

Finally. Nimbus manages once again to "fire" a rain-boosted Weather Ball right before Tusks counterattacks with Earth Power.

The rain and the first speed tie gave the Leader an advantage, but not a big enough advantage, so he still needs to be careful. If Complications vs Rediamond taught us anything is that one wrong move can sure remove any "not that big advantage" one may have.

data

Hp: 59
En: 79
1/4/5/3/80
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

Light Screen for 4a

Hp: 33
En: 78
5/2/4/2/80
Other:
Item: Life Orb

Dogfish44's turn!

Dogfish44 · Feb 10th, 2013, 6:43:59 PM

"Hmmm..."

Initiate Switch Phrase

Cyclohm out.
Eeletross @ Expert Belt in.

Imanalt · Feb 10th, 2013, 9:50:24 PM

Switch to gastrodon@rare candy
Surf, earth power, surf
If damaging grass move use mirror coat that action
If non combo bounce use counter that action

Dogfish44 · Feb 11th, 2013, 7:27:53 AM

"Hmmm... that mirror coat is going to be a bugger to deal with."

Brick Break ~ Giga Drain ~ Giga Drain

Frosty · Feb 12th, 2013, 1:59:21 PM

Hp: 100
En: 100
4/3/5/3/43
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

bench

Light Screen for 4a

Hp: 110
En: 100
3/3/5/3/33
Other:
Item: Rare Candy

bench

Round 2

After a good first round, the Gym Leader probably doesn't want to push his luck and prefers to retreat Nimbus and send out Murena the Eelektross with Expert Belt.

Imanalt responds with a switch of his own and calls back Tusks the Mamoswine and sends out his A-player: Gastrodoom the Gastrodon with Rare Candy.

Murena is the first to act and attacks with Brick Break to remove the Light Screen. Maybe it wasn't such a good move as it left Murena wide open for Gastrodoom's Rain-and-Rare-Candy-boosted-STAB-Critical-Hit-Surf, which dealt quite some damage for a non-supereffective move.

On the following couple turns, Murena goes offensive with two Expert-Belt-Boosted Giga Drain, which were both reflected by Gastrodoom's Mirror Coat. Not much else to say here.

While the Leader was victorious on the first matchup, the challenger gets the second one, even ordering first. Though the second and third rounds had equal end damage to both parties involved, thanks to the recovery from giga drain, that mighty surf and Gastrodoom's superior health, the challenger has the momentum here (not a real advantage just yet). Now let's see if he can maintain it!

data

Hp: 38
En: 66
4/3/5/3/43
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

bench

Hp: 61
En: 58
3/3/5/3/33
Other:
Item: Rare Candy

bench

Dogfish's turn!

Dogfish44 · Feb 12th, 2013, 2:03:33 PM

"Murena, I'll need your services later. Return!

Cyclohm, get back out there!

Imanalt · Feb 12th, 2013, 4:00:22 PM

go colossoil @ expert belt
dragon tail, earthquake, protect
IF substitute when you would use dragon tail, use taunt that action and push back
IF successful protect when you would use dragon tail, use substitute (15) that action and push back

Dogfish44 · Feb 12th, 2013, 4:11:56 PM

"If I was a gambling man I'd say there's something you've overlooked..."

Surf ~ Weather Ball + Weather Ball ~ Cooldown [Hydro Pump]

Frosty · Feb 16th, 2013, 7:23:52 AM

bench

Hp: 59
En: 79
1/4/5/3/80
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

Hp: 120
En: 100
5/3/2/3/110
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

bench

Round 3

The Leader once again calls back Murena and sends out Nimbus the Cyclohm. The challenger takes the bait and sends out Whale? the Colossoil with Expert Belt.

Nimbus is the first to act here by using the rain to fuel a highly powered Surf at the Narwhal. Whale? counterattacks with a more strategic move and DOESN'T force a switch with Dragon Tail.

On the second turn, Whale? goes offensive and attacks with Earthquake, which was slightly weakened by all the sand. The Nimbus exploited the Colossoil's low guard and smashed it with a Combo of Weather Ball + Weather Ball for insane damage!

Finally, Whale? erects a protective barrier for naught while Nimbus cools down.

Nimbus suceeded in taking a crapload of whale?'s hp with him. The challenger lost the third matchup and now how to get his game together if he wants to beat the Electric Gym Leader.

data

Regarding Dragon Tail and Shield Dust

NOTE: Okay, I did some research on Shield Dust blocking Dragon Tail and, while I didn't find anything conclusive, I found enough to get a ruling going on.

Most sites are generic and only say "blocks secondary effects" and what not, with no details. The only description that goes a bit beyond is:

From Veekun: http://veekun.com/dex/abilities/shield%20dust
"This Pokémon is immune to the extra effects of moves used against it.

An extra effect is a move's chance, listed as an "effect chance", to inflict a status ailment, cause a stat change, or make the target flinch in addition to the move's main effect. For example, ThunderShock's paralysis is an extra effect, but Thunder Wave's is not, nor are Knock Off's item removal and Air Cutter's increased critical hit rate."

The same definition is used on Pokemon Online.

If you look at a move list (http://veekun.com/dex/types/fighting), you will see many moves that are listed as "have a X chance of..." and moves with other secondary effects, but not a X chance of ... . Dynamic Punch is listed as having a 100% chance of confusion, while Circle Throw doesn't have chance shenaningans.

Here is the deal: If memory serves me right, you can't just say "all secondary effects" are blocked and be done with it. All secondary effects usually associated with a chance yeah, but if you think about it Critical Hit enhanced moves, Knock Off, Thief, Pursuit, Dragon Tail, Circle Throw, Frost Breath, Storm Throw, Fire Spin, Clamp, Other trapping moves, Flame Burst, Wakeup Slap, Smellingsalt, Recoil moves etc all have secondary effects, but there aren't blocked by Shield Dust, or else it would be a broken ability. Also, Veekun differentiates well the "effect chance" and the other secondary effects.

Another proof that Shield Dust doesn't block the phazing effect is Sheer Force. Sheer Force boosts all moves with secondary "effect chances" (the same secondary effects affected by Shield Dust), but if you check the list of affected moves from Bulbapedia (http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...orce_(Ability)), you won't see Dragon Tail or Circle Throw. In fact you will only see moves that:

- Inflict a status ailment
- Cause a stat change
- Make the Target Flinch

Like the Veekun description. Since they are different sites, I think this confirms that not all secondary effects are "effect chances" affected by Sheer Force and Shield Dust.

tl;dr: Shield Dust does NOT block Dragon Tail's switch effect.

As usual, if you get a ruling otherwise, I will change this, but I will only accept:

a) A Ruling from Deck Knight showing that he read my reasoning.
b) A Test ingame or on Pokemon Showdown. Preferably with the log.

K? k.

bench

Hp: 21
En: 40
1/4/5/3/80
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

Hp: 47
En: 83
5/3/2/3/110
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

bench

Dogfish44's Turn!

Dogfish44 · Feb 16th, 2013, 2:36:28 PM

Marty confirmed in-game that the switch isn't forced according to Imanalt (Feel free to ask him to confirm).

Imanalt · Feb 16th, 2013, 2:41:08 PM

yeah and upc agrees, unfortunate as it is... :(

from upc: "Generation V: No additional effects of attacks by other Pokémon can occur against this Pokémon. (Additional effects that don't affect this Pokémon are not prevented.)"

Frosty · Feb 16th, 2013, 3:00:17 PM

Fair enough. I edited the changes. Dogfish now orders. No Switch means that Imanalt ordering first makes no sense.

Dogfish44 · Feb 16th, 2013, 4:07:22 PM

"Krilowatt @ Expert Belt, let us prevent any more shenanigans!"

Imanalt · Feb 16th, 2013, 4:13:38 PM

lgi gastrodon

earth power, earthquake, earth power
IF damaging grass move, mirror coat that action and push back if earth power is replaced
IF your move is imprisoned when you would act, replace that action with mud bomb

Dogfish44 · Feb 16th, 2013, 4:15:29 PM

"OK then, we can match that."

Hidden Power ~ Hidden Power ~ Hidden Power

Frosty · Feb 17th, 2013, 4:02:02 PM

All this switching is getting rather annoying....

Hp: 125
En: 100
2/3/3/3/121 (+17acc)
Other:
Item:

bench

Hp: 61
En: 58
3/3/5/3/33
Other:
Item: Rare Candy

bench

Round 4

Dogfish initiated another switch and sends out to the field Formula the Krillowatt with Expert Belt. If anyone says that Expert Belts don't grow on trees, I'll probably direct them to this match.

Staying true to his love of ordering first (or whatever this is), Imanalt counterswitches by sending out Gastrodoom the Gastrodon.

And the lack of imagination continues as Formula hits Gastrodon, in every action, with Hidden Power (Grass) and the slime counterattacks with Mirror Coat. The highlight of this round was when the second Hidden Power got a Critical Hit, which meant a stronger mirror coat.

After the third Hidden Power, Gastrodoom fainted!.

The Gastrodon ended up dealing a total 133hp of damage, while received 110hp, so he earned his place as Imanalt's signature pokemon, and probably MVP of his team. But the other two pokemon will need to pick up their slack if they want a victory here!

data

Hp: 54
En: 73
2/3/3/3/121 (+17acc)
Other:
Item:

bench

Hp: KO
En: KO
3/3/5/3/33
Other:
Item: Rare Candy

bench

Imanalt sends out pokemon and then...
Dogfish's turn!

Imanalt · Feb 17th, 2013, 4:03:01 PM

colossoil comes out

Dogfish44 · Feb 17th, 2013, 4:12:58 PM

"Wash it away!"

Surf ~ Surf ~ Surf

IF Protective/Evasive, THEN Chill
IF Horn Drill AND in a combo AND Colossoil at more than 27 HP, THEN Protect

Imanalt · Feb 17th, 2013, 4:26:52 PM

fake out, earthquake, sucker punch + sucker punch

Frosty · Feb 18th, 2013, 7:03:53 PM

Hp: 54
En: 73
2/3/3/3/121 (+17acc)
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

bench

Hp: 47
En: 83
5/3/2/3/110
Other:
Item: Expert Belt

bench

Round 5

After losing his signature pokemon, the challenger tries to make due with Whale? the Colossoil once again. Maybe it will get luckier against Krillowatt than against Cyclohm.

And the Colossoil is the first to move, using a Fake Out to flinch Formula!

After using a moment to recover, Formula counterattacks with a rain-and-expert-belt-STAB-boosted-Surf. Again...more water than the water gym >_<;. Whale? doesn't stop though and continues to strike, that time with Earthquake.

Finally, using a good deal of trickery, Whale? gets behind Formula and BEATS IT DOWN with a combination of Sucker Punch + Sucker Punch. Krillowatt fainted!

The challenger finally draw some blood, but the Colossoil is now cooling down and the Leader still has 2 threatening pokemon. Looks like this will be over soon...

data

Hp: KO
En: KO
2/3/3/3/121 (+17acc)
Other:
Item:

bench

Hp: 20
En: 46
5/3/2/3/110
Other: cooldown for 1a
Item: Expert Belt

bench

Dogfish sends out pokemon
Imanalt gives orders
Dogfish gives orders
I Ref

Dogfish44 · Feb 18th, 2013, 7:07:32 PM

"Take the initiative, Eelektross!"

Feb 8th, 2013, 5:08:37 PM	#2
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"IF WE CANNOT SHOCK, WE WILL SIMPLY TEAR YOU TO THE GROUND!" Cyclohm @ Expert Belt __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 8th, 2013, 5:15:25 PM	#3
Imanalt RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,356 VT, USA	go mamoswine @life orb light screen, ice beam, earth power IF bide, use substitute that action and push down IF double team clones are up when you would attack a2 or a3, use blizzard __________________ ASB profile zfs: we are the knights who say nidoking http://pastebin.com/FrNB3Vg3 21:15 Cathy GreatSage is a known spammer

Feb 8th, 2013, 5:22:05 PM	#4
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"Hmm... Lead an attack Nimbus." Weather Ball ~ Surf ~ Weather Ball __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 8th, 2013, 6:06:18 PM	#5
Frosty Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 3,176	Hp: 110 En: 100 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 110 En: 100 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Round 1 And round 1 has started! The Leader sends out Nimbus the Cyclohm with Expert Belt! Fun fact: that same opening (with items and all) was used by Dogfish44 in 7 of his 10 matches thus far. I guess being unpredictable isn't one of the reasons of his good record. The challenger counterattacks with Tusks the Mamoswine with Life Orb. Some of you may question: "why not Gastrodon? it worked for IAR!". Well, Nimbus changed his Hidden Power from Ground to Grass just for Gastrodon ever since that match AND Gastrodoom is Imanalt's main card, so it would be very risky to use it on a round where he orders last. Also, Mamoswine is a sexy beast, don't you think? [/glacier] To begin this match, Nimbus attacks with Weather Ball using the incredibly convenient Rain to his advantage. The Ball hits Tusks squarely on his face right before he finished erecting a Light Screen to protect itself. I guess luck can be a bitch. On the second turn it was Tusks's time to be a bit faster as it attacked with Ice Beam right before Nimbus's almost-to-surf wave crashed on his foe. Finally. Nimbus manages once again to "fire" a rain-boosted Weather Ball right before Tusks counterattacks with Earth Power. The rain and the first speed tie gave the Leader an advantage, but not a big enough advantage, so he still needs to be careful. If Complications vs Rediamond taught us anything is that one wrong move can sure remove any "not that big advantage" one may have. data Speed tie (1=Cyclohm): 1 (Cyclohm), 2 (Mamoswine), 1 (Cyclohm) Cyclohm: Weather Ball: (10+3+4.5+2)1.5= 29.25 damage for 7 energy Crit: 13 Mamoswine: Light Screen for 10 energy Mamoswine: Ice Beam: (10+3+1.5+3)1.5= 26.25 damage for 6 energy Crit: 9 -2hp due to life orb Cyclohm: Surf: (100.5+3+4.5+2)1.5= 21.75 damage for 7 energy Crit: 14 Cyclohm: Weather Ball: (100.5+3+4.5+2)1.5= 21.75 damage for 7 energy Crit: 6 Mamoswine: Earth Power: (9+3+1.5+3)1.5= 24.75 damage for 6 energy -2hp due to life orb Crit: 9 Hp: 59 En: 79 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Light Screen for 4a* Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Dogfish44's turn! __________________ ASB Profile

Feb 10th, 2013, 6:43:59 PM	#6
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"Hmmm..." Initiate Switch Phrase Cyclohm out. Eeletross @ Expert Belt in. __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 10th, 2013, 9:50:24 PM	#7
Imanalt RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,356 VT, USA	Switch to gastrodon@rare candy Surf, earth power, surf If damaging grass move use mirror coat that action If non combo bounce use counter that action __________________ ASB profile zfs: we are the knights who say nidoking http://pastebin.com/FrNB3Vg3 21:15 Cathy GreatSage is a known spammer

Feb 11th, 2013, 7:27:53 AM	#8
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"Hmmm... that mirror coat is going to be a bugger to deal with." Brick Break ~ Giga Drain ~ Giga Drain __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 12th, 2013, 1:59:21 PM	#9
Frosty Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 3,176	Hp: 100 En: 100 4/3/5/3/43 Other: Item: Expert Belt bench Hp: 59 En: 79 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Light Screen for 4a Hp: 110 En: 100 3/3/5/3/33 Other: Item: Rare Candy bench Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Round 2 After a good first round, the Gym Leader probably doesn't want to push his luck and prefers to retreat Nimbus and send out Murena the Eelektross with Expert Belt. Imanalt responds with a switch of his own and calls back Tusks the Mamoswine and sends out his A-player: Gastrodoom the Gastrodon with Rare Candy. Murena is the first to act and attacks with Brick Break to remove the Light Screen. Maybe it wasn't such a good move as it left Murena wide open for Gastrodoom's Rain-and-Rare-Candy-boosted-STAB-Critical-Hit-Surf, which dealt quite some damage for a non-supereffective move. On the following couple turns, Murena goes offensive with two Expert-Belt-Boosted Giga Drain, which were both reflected by Gastrodoom's Mirror Coat. Not much else to say here. While the Leader was victorious on the first matchup, the challenger gets the second one, even ordering first. Though the second and third rounds had equal end damage to both parties involved, thanks to the recovery from giga drain, that mighty surf and Gastrodoom's superior health, the challenger has the momentum here (not a real advantage just yet). Now let's see if he can maintain it! data Eelektross: Brick Break: 8+1.5 = 9.5 damage for 6 energy Crit: 13 (no) Screens shattered! Gastrodon: Surf: 10+3+3+1+3+3 = 23 damage for 6 energy Crit: 1 (yes) Eelektross: Giga Drain: (8+3+2)1.5= 19.5 damage for 12 energy +9.75hp Crit:8 Gastrodon: Mirror Coat: 19.51.5= 29.25 damage for 16 energy Eelektross: Giga Drain: 19.5 damage for 16 energy +9.75hp Crit:9 Gastrodon: Mirror Coat: 29.25 damage for 20 energy Hp: 38 En: 66 4/3/5/3/43 Other: Item: Expert Belt bench Hp: 59 En: 79 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 61 En: 58 3/3/5/3/33 Other: Item: Rare Candy bench Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Dogfish's turn! __________________ ASB Profile

Feb 12th, 2013, 2:03:33 PM	#10
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"Murena, I'll need your services later. Return! Cyclohm, get back out there! __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 12th, 2013, 4:00:22 PM	#11
Imanalt RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,356 VT, USA	go colossoil @ expert belt dragon tail, earthquake, protect IF substitute when you would use dragon tail, use taunt that action and push back IF successful protect when you would use dragon tail, use substitute (15) that action and push back __________________ ASB profile zfs: we are the knights who say nidoking http://pastebin.com/FrNB3Vg3 21:15 Cathy GreatSage is a known spammer

Feb 12th, 2013, 4:11:56 PM	#12
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"If I was a gambling man I'd say there's something you've overlooked..." Surf ~ Weather Ball + Weather Ball ~ Cooldown [Hydro Pump] __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 16th, 2013, 7:23:52 AM	#13
Frosty Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 3,176	bench Hp: 38 En: 66 4/3/5/3/43 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 59 En: 79 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 120 En: 100 5/3/2/3/110 Other: Item: Expert Belt bench Hp: 61 En: 58 3/3/5/3/33 Other: Item: Rare Candy Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Round 3 The Leader once again calls back Murena and sends out Nimbus the Cyclohm. The challenger takes the bait and sends out Whale? the Colossoil with Expert Belt. Nimbus is the first to act here by using the rain to fuel a highly powered Surf at the Narwhal. Whale? counterattacks with a more strategic move and DOESN'T force a switch with Dragon Tail. On the second turn, Whale? goes offensive and attacks with Earthquake, which was slightly weakened by all the sand. The Nimbus exploited the Colossoil's low guard and smashed it with a Combo of Weather Ball + Weather Ball for insane damage! Finally, Whale? erects a protective barrier for naught while Nimbus cools down. Nimbus suceeded in taking a crapload of whale?'s hp with him. The challenger lost the third matchup and now how to get his game together if he wants to beat the Electric Gym Leader. data Cyclohm: Surf: (10+3+2+3)1.5= 27 damage for 7 energy Crit: 5/16 (no) Colossoil: Dragon Tail: (6+1.5+2)1.5= 14.25 damage for 4 energy Crit: 9/16 (no) Sends out (1-4 = Eelektross, 5 = Emolga, 6 = Electivire, 7 = Rotom, 8 = Krillowatt): 4 (Eelektross) NOTE: I am using the precedent from Orcinus vs Danmantincan here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3471944 Colossoil: Earthquake: (10-1+3+2+1.5)1.5= 23.25 damage for 6 energy Crit: 11/16 (no) Cyclohm: Weather Ball + Weather Ball: (102.25+3+2+3)1.5= 45.75 damage for 31.5 energy Crit: 5/16 (no) Colossoil: protect for 7 energy Cyclohm: cools down Regarding Dragon Tail and Shield Dust* NOTE: Okay, I did some research on Shield Dust blocking Dragon Tail and, while I didn't find anything conclusive, I found enough to get a ruling going on. Most sites are generic and only say "blocks secondary effects" and what not, with no details. The only description that goes a bit beyond is: From Veekun: http://veekun.com/dex/abilities/shield%20dust "This Pokémon is immune to the extra effects of moves used against it. An extra effect is a move's chance, listed as an "effect chance", to inflict a status ailment, cause a stat change, or make the target flinch in addition to the move's main effect. For example, ThunderShock's paralysis is an extra effect, but Thunder Wave's is not, nor are Knock Off's item removal and Air Cutter's increased critical hit rate." The same definition is used on Pokemon Online. If you look at a move list (http://veekun.com/dex/types/fighting), you will see many moves that are listed as "have a X chance of..." and moves with other secondary effects, but not a X chance of ... . Dynamic Punch is listed as having a 100% chance of confusion, while Circle Throw doesn't have chance shenaningans. Here is the deal: If memory serves me right, you can't just say "all secondary effects" are blocked and be done with it. All secondary effects usually associated with a chance yeah, but if you think about it Critical Hit enhanced moves, Knock Off, Thief, Pursuit, Dragon Tail, Circle Throw, Frost Breath, Storm Throw, Fire Spin, Clamp, Other trapping moves, Flame Burst, Wakeup Slap, Smellingsalt, Recoil moves etc all have secondary effects, but there aren't blocked by Shield Dust, or else it would be a broken ability. Also, Veekun differentiates well the "effect chance" and the other secondary effects. Another proof that Shield Dust doesn't block the phazing effect is Sheer Force. Sheer Force boosts all moves with secondary "effect chances" (the same secondary effects affected by Shield Dust), but if you check the list of affected moves from Bulbapedia (http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...orce_(Ability)), you won't see Dragon Tail or Circle Throw. In fact you will only see moves that: - Inflict a status ailment - Cause a stat change - Make the Target Flinch Like the Veekun description. Since they are different sites, I think this confirms that not all secondary effects are "effect chances" affected by Sheer Force and Shield Dust. tl;dr: Shield Dust does NOT block Dragon Tail's switch effect. As usual, if you get a ruling otherwise, I will change this, but I will only accept: a) A Ruling from Deck Knight showing that he read my reasoning. b) A Test ingame or on Pokemon Showdown. Preferably with the log. K? k. bench Hp: 38 En: 66 4/3/5/3/43 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 21 En: 40 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 47 En: 83 5/3/2/3/110 Other: Item: Expert Belt bench Hp: 61 En: 58 3/3/5/3/33 Other: Item: Rare Candy Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Dogfish44's Turn! __________________ ASB Profile Last edited by Frosty; Feb 16th, 2013 at 2:59:21 PM.

Feb 16th, 2013, 2:36:28 PM	#14
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	Marty confirmed in-game that the switch isn't forced according to Imanalt (Feel free to ask him to confirm). __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 16th, 2013, 2:41:08 PM	#15
Imanalt RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,356 VT, USA	yeah and upc agrees, unfortunate as it is... :( from upc: "Generation V: No additional effects of attacks by other Pokémon can occur against this Pokémon. (Additional effects that don't affect this Pokémon are not prevented.)" __________________ ASB profile zfs: we are the knights who say nidoking http://pastebin.com/FrNB3Vg3 21:15 Cathy GreatSage is a known spammer

Feb 16th, 2013, 3:00:17 PM	#16
Frosty Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 3,176	Fair enough. I edited the changes. Dogfish now orders. No Switch means that Imanalt ordering first makes no sense. __________________ ASB Profile

Feb 16th, 2013, 4:07:22 PM	#17
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"Krilowatt @ Expert Belt, let us prevent any more shenanigans!" __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 16th, 2013, 4:13:38 PM	#18
Imanalt RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,356 VT, USA	lgi gastrodon earth power, earthquake, earth power IF damaging grass move, mirror coat that action and push back if earth power is replaced IF your move is imprisoned when you would act, replace that action with mud bomb __________________ ASB profile zfs: we are the knights who say nidoking http://pastebin.com/FrNB3Vg3 21:15 Cathy GreatSage is a known spammer

Feb 16th, 2013, 4:15:29 PM	#19
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"OK then, we can match that." Hidden Power ~ Hidden Power ~ Hidden Power __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 17th, 2013, 4:02:02 PM	#20
Frosty Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 3,176	All this switching is getting rather annoying.... Hp: 125 En: 100 2/3/3/3/121 (+17acc) Other: Item: bench Hp: 38 En: 66 4/3/5/3/43 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 21 En: 40 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 61 En: 58 3/3/5/3/33 Other: Item: Rare Candy bench Hp: 47 En: 83 5/3/2/3/110 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Round 4 Dogfish initiated another switch and sends out to the field Formula the Krillowatt with Expert Belt. If anyone says that Expert Belts don't grow on trees, I'll probably direct them to this match. Staying true to his love of ordering first (or whatever this is), Imanalt counterswitches by sending out Gastrodoom the Gastrodon. And the lack of imagination continues as Formula hits Gastrodon, in every action, with Hidden Power (Grass) and the slime counterattacks with Mirror Coat. The highlight of this round was when the second Hidden Power got a Critical Hit, which meant a stronger mirror coat. After the third Hidden Power, Gastrodoom fainted!. The Gastrodon ended up dealing a total 133hp of damage, while received 110hp, so he earned his place as Imanalt's signature pokemon, and probably MVP of his team. But the other two pokemon will need to pick up their slack if they want a victory here! data Krillowatt: Hidden Power (Grass): (7+2)2.25=20.25 damage for 5 energy Crit: 14 Gastrodon: Mirror Coat: 20.251.5 = 30.375 damage for 16 energy Krillowatt: Hidden Power (Grass): (7+2+3)2.25=27 damage for 9 energy Crit: 1 (yes) Gastrodon: Mirror Coat: 271.5 = 40.5 damage for 20 energy Krillowatt: Hidden Power (Grass): (7+2)2.25=20.25 damage for 13 energy Crit: 15 Gastrodon fainted! Hp: 54 En: 73 2/3/3/3/121 (+17acc) Other: Item: bench* Hp: 38 En: 66 4/3/5/3/43 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 21 En: 40 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: KO En: KO 3/3/5/3/33 Other: Item: Rare Candy bench Hp: 47 En: 83 5/3/2/3/110 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Imanalt sends out pokemon and then... Dogfish's turn! __________________ ASB Profile

Feb 17th, 2013, 4:03:01 PM	#21
Imanalt RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,356 VT, USA	colossoil comes out __________________ ASB profile zfs: we are the knights who say nidoking http://pastebin.com/FrNB3Vg3 21:15 Cathy GreatSage is a known spammer

Feb 17th, 2013, 4:12:58 PM	#22
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"Wash it away!" Surf ~ Surf ~ Surf IF Protective/Evasive, THEN Chill IF Horn Drill AND in a combo AND Colossoil at more than 27 HP, THEN Protect __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs

Feb 17th, 2013, 4:26:52 PM	#23
Imanalt RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON RHYDON Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,356 VT, USA	fake out, earthquake, sucker punch + sucker punch __________________ ASB profile zfs: we are the knights who say nidoking http://pastebin.com/FrNB3Vg3 21:15 Cathy GreatSage is a known spammer

Feb 18th, 2013, 7:03:53 PM	#24
Frosty Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 3,176	Hp: 54 En: 73 2/3/3/3/121 (+17acc) Other: Item: Expert Belt bench Hp: 38 En: 66 4/3/5/3/43 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 21 En: 40 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 47 En: 83 5/3/2/3/110 Other: Item: Expert Belt bench Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Round 5 After losing his signature pokemon, the challenger tries to make due with Whale? the Colossoil once again. Maybe it will get luckier against Krillowatt than against Cyclohm. And the Colossoil is the first to move, using a Fake Out to flinch Formula! After using a moment to recover, Formula counterattacks with a rain-and-expert-belt-STAB-boosted-Surf. Again...more water than the water gym >_<;. Whale? doesn't stop though and continues to strike, that time with Earthquake. Finally, using a good deal of trickery, Whale? gets behind Formula and BEATS IT DOWN with a combination of Sucker Punch + Sucker Punch. Krillowatt fainted! The challenger finally draw some blood, but the Colossoil is now cooling down and the Leader still has 2 threatening pokemon. Looks like this will be over soon... data Colossoil: Fake Out: 4+3 = 7 damage for 4 energy Krillowatt: flinch Krillowatt: Surf: (10+3+3+2)1.5= 27 damage for 6 energy Crit: 4 (no) Colossoil: Earthquake: (9+3+2+3)1.5= 25.5 damage for 6 energy Colossoil: Sucker Punch + Sucker Punch: (82.25+3+3)= 24 damage for 27 energy Krillowatt fainted! Hp: KO En: KO 2/3/3/3/121 (+17acc) Other: Item: bench* Hp: 38 En: 66 4/3/5/3/43 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 21 En: 40 1/4/5/3/80 Other: Item: Expert Belt Hp: 20 En: 46 5/3/2/3/110 Other: cooldown for 1a Item: Expert Belt bench Hp: 33 En: 78 5/2/4/2/80 Other: Item: Life Orb Dogfish sends out pokemon Imanalt gives orders Dogfish gives orders I Ref __________________ ASB Profile

Feb 18th, 2013, 7:07:32 PM	#25
Dogfish44 Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355 Deity of Misfortune	"Take the initiative, Eelektross!" __________________ CAPASB Team & Reffing Profile ASB Ruling? It might be here! 02:47:37 AM ~ <%Objection> i'm neutral on boobs