(Quality Control) Kyogre (Revamp) WIP

Icecream · May 17th, 2013, 7:44:09 PM

I'm not quite done with this yet, I know it needs a hell of a lot more content. I just want to get it down is all. Also, forgive me for any grammar or spelling mistakes, I wrote this up real fast.

King

[Overview]

The best Pokemon in the game.
Great stat spread across the board
Incredibly versatile and almost impossible to hard counter
Thanks to its phenomenal ability, Drizzle, it's responsible for making over a dozen pokemon viable in ubers
Mediocre Speed is its only flaw, really

[SET]
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Water Spout
move 2: Surf / Hydro Pump
move 3: Thunder
move 4: Ice Beam
item: Choice Specs
nature: Modest
evs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
ivs: 0 Atk

[SET COMMENTS]

One of the most feared sets in the game, so much that teams dedicate an entire slot for the sole purpose of countering it
Surf and Hydro Pump are acceptable stabs to be used when Kyogre's health weakens
Thunder and Ice Beam take care of water resists

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Arceus-Ground and Groudon pair well with Kyogre by beating dialga and sponging electric-type attacks.
While an adversary in their own right, both dialga and Giratina are excellent partners as well to take on electric- and grass-type attacks aimed at Kyogre.
Rapid Spin support is needed in order to keep Kyogre healthy and keep its water spout at full health. Defensive excadrill, tentacruel, and forretress all do an excellent job at providing rapid spin support. Forretress itself can even provide spikes support. Along with with tenacruel, Forretress can provide Toxic spikes support to break down opposing counters
Wish support from Jirachi and Chansey works well in keeping Kyogre healthy
Kingdra benefits from Kyogre’s ability to summon rain, as such it can use its Dragon-type stabs to destroy Palkia and Giratina
Tailwind support from Tornadus can give Kyogre a much needed speed boost, discouraging revenge killers, Tornadus can even use its stab flying-type attacks to destroy arceus-grass
Ferrothorn is also an excellent partner as it cover’s Kyogre’s weaknesses and can set up spikes and stealth rock
Finally, arceus-fighting is a useful teammate because of its ability to destroy both dialga and ferrothorn

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Water Spout
move 2: Surf
move 3: Thunder
move 4: Ice Beam
item: Choice Scarf
nature: Modest
evs: 8 HP / 248 SpA / 252 Spe
ivs: 0 Atk

[SET COMMENTS]

powerful revenge killer and late game sweeper
Water Spout OHKOes almost everything that doesn't resist it
Surf is a more reliable STAB to use throughout the match
Thunder and Ice Beam are obligatory coverage moves

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Works well with powerful wall breakers such as Rayquaza and Arceus-normal, as Kyogre can clean up against a weakened team
Entry hazard support and rapid spin support work well, Excadrill and Forretress can provide both, as well as having excellent synergy
Tyranitar partners well with Scarf Kyogre, as can pursuit trap Lati@s and set up SR
beartic functions well with Kyogre by eliminating Dragon-types and softening up the opposing team for Kyogre to take out
Scizor can also pursuit trap the lati twin, but it’s less reliable at doing so, however Scizor can revenge kill Skymin after SR, a major pain for Kyogre

[SET]
name: Offensive Calm Mind
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Surf
move 3: Thunder
move 4: Ice Beam
item: Leftovers
nature: Modest / Bold
evs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
ivs: 0 Atk

[SET COMMENTS]

The set’s aim is to accumulate a boost or, two than ravage the team mid-game with ridiculous power
Calm Mind makes this set possible, allowing Kyogre to boost it’s already impressive special stats
Thunder helps take out opposing water-types, while Ice Beam ravages through Dragons and Grass-types

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Works really with toxic spikes support, allowing it to outstall troublesome walls such as palkia and giritina
Tenta and Forretress can both provide T-spikes support, and spin away annoying hazards
Spikes support is great too, as it able to weaken Dialga and Palkia
Latias and other CM users are annoying, Tyranitar and to a lesser extent Scizor, do a good job at eliminating those troublesome CM users

[SET]
name: Physically Defensive
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald / Surf
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
nature: Bold
evs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
ivs: 0 Atk

[SET COMMENTS]

Unlike the previous set, this one here attempts to accumulate as many boosts as possible
the evs are geared towards defense, as CM patches up SpD
Rest-talk keeps Kyogre healthy and allows it to continue to boost
Scald can potentially spread burn, thus patching up Kyogre’s physical defense
However, Surf is slightly stronger, allowing Kyogre to break through teams easier

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Just like the last set, opposing CM users are annoying, Scarf Genesect can deal with almost all of them, and so can Tyranitar
(Toxic-) Spikes works really well in breaking down the opposing team
Water-type resists and water-type immune Pokemon stop this set cold, Skymin and Scarf Chomp both do an excellent job at removing water- and dragon-types respectively

[SET]
name: Specially Defensive
move 1: Scald
move 2: Rest
move 3: Sleep Talk
move 4: Roar
item: Leftovers
nature: Calm
evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
ivs: 0 Atk

[SET COMMENTS]

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

[SET]
name: Thunder Wave
move 1: Thunder Wave
move 2: Surf / Hydro Pump
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Thunder
item: Leftovers / Lum Berry
nature: Modest
evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
ivs: 0 Atk

[SET COMMENTS]

This Kyogre functions a bit supportively
Thunder Wave slows down Scarf users, Swift Swim / Chlorophyll Pokemon, and fast pokemon in general such as Mewtwo and Darkrai
Surf and Hydro Pump are Kyogre’s best STABs, allowing it to smash through Pokemon who don’t resist it
Thunder and Ice beam both deal with Kyogre’s coverage

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Seeing as how this set’s aim is to slow down opposing teams, Slow Wall Breakers such as CB Rayquaza, Choice Specs Kyurem-W, dialga, and mixed attacker palkia all benefit from Kyogre’s support
Entry hazard support from the likes of Ferrothorn, Arceus, and Excardill is also useful
Chansey is major pain for this set as its heal bell can remove paralysis. B/c of that tickle wobba+pursuit users can help eliminate chansey

[SET]
name: ChestoRest
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Rest
move 3: Surf
move 4: Ice Beam / Thunder
item: Chesto Berry
nature: Modest
evs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
ivs: 0 Atk

[SET COMMENTS]

Functions as the middle child between mono-attacker and Calm Mind
With Calm mind kyogre can boost its special stats to insane levels
Rest+Chesto Berry is a reliable one time healing move, and work well after a few
CM boosts are attained
Thunder and Ice Beam are both excellent coverage moves, either one depends on what your team needs most

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Entry hazard support from Ferrothorn, and Forretress
Scarf Chomp support to eliminate dragons if not running Ice beam
If lacking Thunder Skymin can break through water-types.

[Other Options]

Roar for phazing
Toxic to break down walls and such
HP Grass for gastrodon
Icy Wind to get the jump on faster threats

[Checks and Counters]

Weaken Kyogre with entry hazards so that its Choice Specs Water Spout isn't at full power before you even begin to check it
Chansey/Blissey
Latias
Ferrothorn
Arceus-Grass
Ludicolo
Dialga
Palkia
Groudon, Tyranitar, Hippowdon, and Abomasnow can change the weather, allowing other teammates to take advantage of the weaker Kyogre
Latios can switch in to Kyogre at least once and kill it with GK
Powerful revenge killers such as Deo-A, Mewtwo, Genesect, Shaymin-S, and Zekrom
Priority moves from Arceus and Rayquaza
Kyurem-W and Giratina(-o) can check it
Kingdra

Melee Mewtwo · May 17th, 2013, 9:58:11 PM

Spdef????

The Unlucky one · May 17th, 2013, 10:06:50 PM

I think Genesect needs to be mentioned here as a partner as the U-Turning Scarf Gene into Kyogre has been a core that has been working for quite some time.
EDIT: I didn't see it in the mono-attacking set. Regardless, i believe it might fit better either in the Specs or the Scarf set. I'm not that great in ubers though so you may correct me on that.

Icecream · May 17th, 2013, 10:15:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat The Unlucky one

I think Genesect needs to be mentioned here as a partner as the U-Turning Scarf Gene into Kyogre has been a core that has been working for quite some time.

R-e-a-d. It was in there somewhere before you posted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Melee Mewtwo

Spdef????

Right, I'll add that in a bit.

shrang · May 18th, 2013, 4:40:06 AM

Quote:

evs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 Spe

I don't see any particular need for Kyogre to run an odd number for HP, to be honest, and I'm not liking the 8 Spe purely because it's speed creep. Is there any particular that 248 HP does, otherwise can we just make it 252 HP / 252 SpA? The same applies for:

Quote:

evs: 8 HP / 248 SpA / 252 Spe

Quote:

evs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe

About the two mono-sets, I reckon they should just be called "Physically Defensive" and "Specially Defensive", while Calm Mind and Roar can be used interchangeably on both. SpD Calm Mind is actually a relatively good long term Ghost Arceus check, since you can Calm Mind alongside it and outdamage it most of the time, and it won't fail if Ghostceus is the last mon. So basically, you can have:

[SET]
name: Specially Defensive
move 1: Scald
move 2: Rest
move 3: Sleep Talk
move 4: Calm Mind / Roar
item: Leftovers
nature: Calm
evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD

and

[SET]
name: Physically Defensive
move 1: Scald
move 2: Rest
move 3: Sleep Talk
move 4: Roar / Calm Mind
item: Leftovers
nature: Calm
evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD

I also think I number of other sets should be included. SubCM is in the analysis but it seems you have put it in the offensive CM set. I'd almost be okay with this... except you have 248 HP EVs on that set, which means that you can't make 101 HP Subs any more, which kind of loses the whole purpose of SubCM, since you can set up on Blissey (however rare) with that. I'd personally make SubCM a separate set, since it does play very different from offensive Calm Mind, which I tend to run 252 SpA / 252 Spe Timid with.

Another set that I love using these days (courtesy of Poppy) is Calm Mind + Water Gem + Water Spout. I'm not too sure if this deserves a set all on it's own, but it does seem too much to mention as AC on its own, so I reckon it should get a separate set. Basically, with Calm Mind, Water Gem and Water Spout, you can OHKO Ferrothorn and Blissey, making it a fantastic lure for these threats. I have:

[SET]
name: Calm Mind + Water Spout
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Water Spout
move 3: Hydro Pump / Ice Beam
move 4: Thunder / Ice Beam
item: Water Gem
nature: Modest
evs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe

Even if you're not at high enough HP to use Water Spout, Hydro Pump is usually enough to blast at least 80-90% into Ferrothorn at +1 and Water Gem. You can have Groudon switch into Thunder as well, thinking that you can't kill it, only to take a Water Gem Water Spout and get OHKOed even in the sun. Even at +1, Ghostceus would be VERY hard pressed to take on a Water Gem boosted Hydro Pump as well. This is pretty much the Kyogre set I've been using on ALL of my teams because it's just so damn awesome.

Lastly, I know this is a gimmick, but please add Choice Band Kyogre to Other Options. It is actually funny watching stuff like Ghostceus think they can Calm Mind in your face when it does nothing to cushion Waterfall. It also lures out Blissey (if your opponent has one) and punch a huge hole into it. It also learns Earthquake and can 2HKO Dialga, so any Dialga thinking they have a free turn is in for a massive surprise. It's not good enough to warrant its own set, but OO is just right for it, IMO.

Hack He Must · May 18th, 2013, 5:50:42 AM

Quote:

[Overview]
The best Pokemon in the game.

Lol no.

Darknesscrusher · May 18th, 2013, 6:45:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Hack He Must

Lol no.

Pretty much, yes.

May 17th, 2013, 7:44:09 PM	#1
Icecream Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 246 Somewhere over the rainbow	Kyogre (Revamp) WIP I'm not quite done with this yet, I know it needs a hell of a lot more content. I just want to get it down is all. Also, forgive me for any grammar or spelling mistakes, I wrote this up real fast. King [Overview] The best Pokemon in the game. Great stat spread across the board Incredibly versatile and almost impossible to hard counter Thanks to its phenomenal ability, Drizzle, it's responsible for making over a dozen pokemon viable in ubers Mediocre Speed is its only flaw, really [SET] name: Choice Specs move 1: Water Spout move 2: Surf / Hydro Pump move 3: Thunder move 4: Ice Beam item: Choice Specs nature: Modest evs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe ivs: 0 Atk [SET COMMENTS] One of the most feared sets in the game, so much that teams dedicate an entire slot for the sole purpose of countering it Surf and Hydro Pump are acceptable stabs to be used when Kyogre's health weakens Thunder and Ice Beam take care of water resists [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] Arceus-Ground and Groudon pair well with Kyogre by beating dialga and sponging electric-type attacks. While an adversary in their own right, both dialga and Giratina are excellent partners as well to take on electric- and grass-type attacks aimed at Kyogre. Rapid Spin support is needed in order to keep Kyogre healthy and keep its water spout at full health. Defensive excadrill, tentacruel, and forretress all do an excellent job at providing rapid spin support. Forretress itself can even provide spikes support. Along with with tenacruel, Forretress can provide Toxic spikes support to break down opposing counters Wish support from Jirachi and Chansey works well in keeping Kyogre healthy Kingdra benefits from Kyogre’s ability to summon rain, as such it can use its Dragon-type stabs to destroy Palkia and Giratina Tailwind support from Tornadus can give Kyogre a much needed speed boost, discouraging revenge killers, Tornadus can even use its stab flying-type attacks to destroy arceus-grass Ferrothorn is also an excellent partner as it cover’s Kyogre’s weaknesses and can set up spikes and stealth rock Finally, arceus-fighting is a useful teammate because of its ability to destroy both dialga and ferrothorn [SET] name: Choice Scarf move 1: Water Spout move 2: Surf move 3: Thunder move 4: Ice Beam item: Choice Scarf nature: Modest evs: 8 HP / 248 SpA / 252 Spe ivs: 0 Atk [SET COMMENTS] powerful revenge killer and late game sweeper Water Spout OHKOes almost everything that doesn't resist it Surf is a more reliable STAB to use throughout the match Thunder and Ice Beam are obligatory coverage moves [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] Works well with powerful wall breakers such as Rayquaza and Arceus-normal, as Kyogre can clean up against a weakened team Entry hazard support and rapid spin support work well, Excadrill and Forretress can provide both, as well as having excellent synergy Tyranitar partners well with Scarf Kyogre, as can pursuit trap Lati@s and set up SR beartic functions well with Kyogre by eliminating Dragon-types and softening up the opposing team for Kyogre to take out Scizor can also pursuit trap the lati twin, but it’s less reliable at doing so, however Scizor can revenge kill Skymin after SR, a major pain for Kyogre [SET] name: Offensive Calm Mind move 1: Calm Mind move 2: Surf move 3: Thunder move 4: Ice Beam item: Leftovers nature: Modest / Bold evs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe ivs: 0 Atk [SET COMMENTS] The set’s aim is to accumulate a boost or, two than ravage the team mid-game with ridiculous power Calm Mind makes this set possible, allowing Kyogre to boost it’s already impressive special stats Thunder helps take out opposing water-types, while Ice Beam ravages through Dragons and Grass-types [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] Works really with toxic spikes support, allowing it to outstall troublesome walls such as palkia and giritina Tenta and Forretress can both provide T-spikes support, and spin away annoying hazards Spikes support is great too, as it able to weaken Dialga and Palkia Latias and other CM users are annoying, Tyranitar and to a lesser extent Scizor, do a good job at eliminating those troublesome CM users [SET] name: Physically Defensive move 1: Calm Mind move 2: Scald / Surf move 3: Rest move 4: Sleep Talk item: Leftovers nature: Bold evs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD ivs: 0 Atk [SET COMMENTS] Unlike the previous set, this one here attempts to accumulate as many boosts as possible the evs are geared towards defense, as CM patches up SpD Rest-talk keeps Kyogre healthy and allows it to continue to boost Scald can potentially spread burn, thus patching up Kyogre’s physical defense However, Surf is slightly stronger, allowing Kyogre to break through teams easier [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] Just like the last set, opposing CM users are annoying, Scarf Genesect can deal with almost all of them, and so can Tyranitar (Toxic-) Spikes works really well in breaking down the opposing team Water-type resists and water-type immune Pokemon stop this set cold, Skymin and Scarf Chomp both do an excellent job at removing water- and dragon-types respectively [SET] name: Specially Defensive move 1: Scald move 2: Rest move 3: Sleep Talk move 4: Roar item: Leftovers nature: Calm evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD ivs: 0 Atk [SET COMMENTS] [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] [SET] name: Thunder Wave move 1: Thunder Wave move 2: Surf / Hydro Pump move 3: Ice Beam move 4: Thunder item: Leftovers / Lum Berry nature: Modest evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA ivs: 0 Atk [SET COMMENTS] This Kyogre functions a bit supportively Thunder Wave slows down Scarf users, Swift Swim / Chlorophyll Pokemon, and fast pokemon in general such as Mewtwo and Darkrai Surf and Hydro Pump are Kyogre’s best STABs, allowing it to smash through Pokemon who don’t resist it Thunder and Ice beam both deal with Kyogre’s coverage [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] Seeing as how this set’s aim is to slow down opposing teams, Slow Wall Breakers such as CB Rayquaza, Choice Specs Kyurem-W, dialga, and mixed attacker palkia all benefit from Kyogre’s support Entry hazard support from the likes of Ferrothorn, Arceus, and Excardill is also useful Chansey is major pain for this set as its heal bell can remove paralysis. B/c of that tickle wobba+pursuit users can help eliminate chansey [SET] name: ChestoRest move 1: Calm Mind move 2: Rest move 3: Surf move 4: Ice Beam / Thunder item: Chesto Berry nature: Modest evs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe ivs: 0 Atk [SET COMMENTS] Functions as the middle child between mono-attacker and Calm Mind With Calm mind kyogre can boost its special stats to insane levels Rest+Chesto Berry is a reliable one time healing move, and work well after a few CM boosts are attained Thunder and Ice Beam are both excellent coverage moves, either one depends on what your team needs most [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] Entry hazard support from Ferrothorn, and Forretress Scarf Chomp support to eliminate dragons if not running Ice beam If lacking Thunder Skymin can break through water-types. [Other Options] Roar for phazing Toxic to break down walls and such HP Grass for gastrodon Icy Wind to get the jump on faster threats [Checks and Counters] Weaken Kyogre with entry hazards so that its Choice Specs Water Spout isn't at full power before you even begin to check it Chansey/Blissey Latias Ferrothorn Arceus-Grass Ludicolo Dialga Palkia Groudon, Tyranitar, Hippowdon, and Abomasnow can change the weather, allowing other teammates to take advantage of the weaker Kyogre Latios can switch in to Kyogre at least once and kill it with GK Powerful revenge killers such as Deo-A, Mewtwo, Genesect, Shaymin-S, and Zekrom Priority moves from Arceus and Rayquaza Kyurem-W and Giratina(-o) can check it Kingdra Last edited by Icecream; May 18th, 2013 at 2:45:11 PM.

May 17th, 2013, 10:06:50 PM	#3
The Unlucky one Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 505 Philippines	I think Genesect needs to be mentioned here as a partner as the U-Turning Scarf Gene into Kyogre has been a core that has been working for quite some time. EDIT: I didn't see it in the mono-attacking set. Regardless, i believe it might fit better either in the Specs or the Scarf set. I'm not that great in ubers though so you may correct me on that. __________________ 252+ SpA Choice Specs Magikarp Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 84 SpD Ho-Oh in rain: 228-270 (54.93 - 65.06%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock you may know me as "superwii64cube" too Last edited by The Unlucky one; May 17th, 2013 at 10:19:19 PM.