Gliscor (BW2 Revamp) (QC 3/3)

[ginganinja]

Make Pockets change

move 1: Substitute
move 2: Toxic
move 3: Protect / Taunt / Roost
move 4: Earthquake

and then...


QC Approved 1/3

[alexwolf]

Can i get a good reason as to why we still haven't changed the EVs on the defensive set to 252/252+? And lol pls no ''to outspeed Breloom'' bs because:

1. Gliscor is a bad Breloom switch-in
2. Gliscor can't do much to Breloom anyway, as Ice Fang is not even slashed first, and even Ice Fang does a measly 41.37 - 49.04% to 0 HP / 0 Def Breloom. Outspeeding and finishing of Breloom with Gliscor should only be an option in desperate situations and an EV spread of a main set shouldn't be made to account for such situations
3. It is actually better to be slower than SubPunch Breloom, in order to be able to Roost and not get mauled by Focus Punch / Seed Bomb

Are we really going to throw away 72 EVs on a physical wall to outspeed a non-existent threat (max Speed Ttar) and a threat that Gliscor shouldn't be taking on in the majority of the time anyway? Not to mention that with a fully defensive spread Gliscor is now able to counter CB Terrakion and deal with SubSD Rock Gem Terrakion much better.

[Pocket]

I mean it certainly wouldn't hurt to be faster than min spe Tentacruel or Modest Politoed. Hell being faster than Adamant Breloom can be helpful, so it can Taunt it from setting up Swords Dance or Substitute, the moves that make it threatening in the first place. Being faster than Timid Magnezone is also noteworthy.

[alexwolf]

Originally Posted by Fat Pocket

I mean it certainly wouldn't hurt to be faster than min spe Tentacruel or Modest Politoed. Hell being faster than Adamant Breloom can be helpful, so it can Taunt it from setting up Swords Dance or Substitute, the moves that make it threatening in the first place. Being faster than Timid Magnezone is also noteworthy.

Why would Breloom attempt to set-up against Gliscor anyway? Gliscor is usually faster and carries Taunt, can possibly 2HKO with Ice Fang, and cannot be put to sleep, which is the way SD Breloom starts setting up 80% of the time anyway. If i had Breloom and i was facing a Gliscor in either a lead match-up or a double switch, i would never use Spore or SD. I would either go for the 2HKO with LO Bullet Seed or switch out, and being faster doesn't help in any case. What Modest Poltitoed are you talking about? Isn't Politoed running max HP and max SpA on the Specs and 3 attacks sets? And why is Gliscor staying in against Politoed anyway? Only case which you should stay in is against a heavily weakened Toed to OHKO with EQ, but you can still do that as Toed rarely uses Max Speed without Scarf. Timid Magnezone is easy to wall for stall teams, which defensive Gliscor is usually found in, not to mention that no sane Zone player would stay in against Gliscor.

Anyway i won't talk more in fear of becoming repetitive and tiring, but from my experience defensive Gliscor really appreciates the ability to deal with Terrakion much better, and in general have 19 more valuable Def points.

[Pocket]

Yea you have a point about RGem Terrakion. Its Stone Edge only does 85-100% to Gliscor after a SD, which is quite amazing.

I suggest the defensive spread to be changed to 252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Spe then! 16 Spe EVs allow Gliscor to be faster than Max Spe Adamant Scizor while not affecting the damage calc against RGem Terrakion.

[Electrolyte]

ok, I made Pocket's changes. Thank you Ginga for the approval!

I also added a tidbit about Gliscor facing competition with Lando-T. It has high defenses and a good typing as well, with more powerful attacks to boot. However, Gliscor is bulkier and lasts longer in the long run, so it's up to readers to decide who they want to use.

[Pocket]

Sorry this is an incomplete check I started 6 days ago, but you can start working on this part before I check the rest ;x

[Overview]

Tyranitar and Hippowdon, Pokemon with the Sand Stream ability are staple partners along with Gliscor.

~ re-phrase; staple implies an absolute must

Poison Heal ability gives it immunity to status.

~ More importantly you need to add that Poison Heal offers Gliscor 12.5% recovery in one turn, and a quarter health recovery in 2 turns, which is why Protect is so popular on Gliscor

Still has to deal with some 4MSS, especially with SR and Roost now in the mix.

~ Not quite sure if this is worth adding in the Overview

Huge usage of Rain teams and special attackers give Gliscor trouble. However, the ability to wall top-tier threats such as Terrakion, Lucario, and Conkeldurr will forever earn it a spot as one of the most useful Pokemon in OU.

~ Conkeldurr not so much since it now has Ice Punch

BW2 brought a fair share of counters and new uses- the popularity of Landorus-T and the reallowance of Garchomp give even more uses for Gliscor on teams.

~ Also add that Landorus-T now competes for the "Defensive Ground / Flying" spot, but can still hit like a truck

Recent ban of Sand Veil in OU has made the Substitutes a lot easier to stop- however, that doesn't make them less effective

~ change Substitute to AcroBat

[Substitute]

~ change the set order to the one I posted previously

~ also change the spread to 244 HP / 28 Def / 236 Spe; HP EVs make sure that Gliscor heals all health lost from Substitute after two turns (explain this in AC)

~ update your bullet points to reflect the set order changes (Toxic is a staple now)

~ Replace all alternative spread with 244 HP

[Defensive]

Typing provides handy immunities to Electric and Ground type attacks, as well as resistances to Fighting and Bug.

~ Add that its dual typing provides a neutrality to Rock, which is amazing when paired with resistances of Flying types.

[shrang]

If I remember correctly, the old 84 Speed EVs were to outspeed max Speed Tyranitar (I know it's rare, but getting Ice Beamed by fast Tyranitar is not fun).

[Pocket]

Defensive

~ missing ability: Poison Heal

~ Your EV spread and descriptions do not match the EV spread. Elaborate that with this defensive spread, it gives Gliscor maximum defensive capacity while being faster than max Spe Adamant Scizor. With this spread, it survives a +2 Rock Gem Stone Edge from Terrakion almost all the time (94%).

Typing provides handy immunities to Electric and Ground type attacks, as well as resistances to Fighting and Bug.

~ Add that its dual typing provides a neutrality to Rock, which is amazing when paired with resistances of Flying types.

AcroBat

~ Adamant first; Jolly second - it needs the power; plus your damage calcs are for Adamant Gliscor -_-

~ ability: Hyper Cutter / Poison Heal - Hyper Cutter is much less circumstantial and much more consistent; it'll certainly help when facing Landorus-T and even Intimidate Gliscor. Substitute blocks status anyways.

~ For calcs of Rotom-W use either the new bulky attacker spread (184 HP / 4 Def) or the specially-defensive set (max HP)

~ Remove Milotic and Porygon2 calc smh; this aint UU. Use more relevant calc like against Landorus-T (+2 thanks to Hyper Cutter), Hippowdon, Hydration Vaporeon, and Bulky Gyarados (again +2 thanks to Hyper Cutter)

~ Offer teammates that can switch into or set-up on Water- and Ice-type assaults. Pokemon like Keldeo is particularly dangerous.

SubPass

~ like the Substitute set change the spread to 244 HP / 28 Def / 236 Spe; HP EVs make sure that Gliscor heals all health lost from Substitute after two turns

~ missing ability: Poison Heal

~ Be consistent and use Agility > Rock Polish on the fourth slot

~ Remove Facade mention

Skarmory and Bronzong are huge threats to this set- Skarmory resists both coverage moves, is immune to Toxic, and can Whirlwind away the passed Substitutes. Watch out for taunt

Rephrase the part in red - "Gliscor with Taunt can successfully baton pass without being phazed, though"

Nearly anything that can outspeed, take a hit, and break the Sub can counter this set's function. Lati@s, Tornadus and Thundurus-T, and Genesect are all prime examples.

Remove Genesect / include Gengar; add that these fast threats (except Gengar) wont enjoy Toxic.

Checks and Counters

~ Gengar - immune to EQ and Toxic; warn readers about Acrobatics

~ Fast Taunt users, such as Sableye, Tornadus-I and Therian, and Aerodactyl

~ Rotom-W

~ Xatu cannot be poisoned

~ Tangrowth / Amoonguss

Bulky water types do a nice job- but many do not appreciate toxic

Special mention Hydration Vaporeon

Bronzong and Skarmory top the list by resisting all common moves and being able to beat it with either HP ice or Whirlwind

Mention Air Balloon Heatran here, which many Gliscor with Toxic cannot touch

Most Ice types can beat Gliscor- Cloyster can Icicle Spear past Substitutes, Mamoswine can Ice Shard/Crash/Spear, and Froslass can Taunt and then Ice Beam.

Replace Froslass with something more relevant like Abomasnow / Kyurem-B

[Princess Bri]

Substitute:

• Make the name SubToxic. The name Substitute implies that it is the only Substitute set.
• Mention a Jolly Nature with 220 Spe EV's to outspeed Deoxys-D leads. This also outspeeds the rare Jolly Lucario. This is recommended with Taunt since opposing Deoxys-D will not suspect such a fast Taunt with Gliscor. You can also get a Substitute before it Taunt's you, and this is helpful too.

SubPass:

• Get rid of Toxic entirely. It seems awkward on this set, and you can simply Baton Pass to something you would Toxic (e.g. Cloyster on Hippowdon).
• Slash Swords Dance. It's a fabulous move to Baton Pass, more so that Rock Polish imo. The order should be Taunt / Swords Dance / Rock Polish.

Also, mention the purpose of 244 HP.


Good job so far.




QC Approved 2/3

[AccidentalGreed]

3/3

Well, finally.