Theorymon: Don't troll me (give me the move that fits me)

[R_N]

Originally Posted by Fat UllarWarlord

Tell that to Crawdaunt.

EDIT: And Shiftry. and Tyrannitar. and Bisharp. and...I really feel I shouldn't go on.

It's...actually really weird that Hydreigon doesn't get Snarl.

If you check the learn lists you'll see that every other Dark type line gets it except Hydreigon's and the Cacturne line.
(Then all the canine Pokemon get it, then Mew & Arceus because duh, then....Druddigon....)

But Hydreigon is weirder because it gets Uproar, Hyper Voice, Roar, Round, Echoed Voice...pretty much all the loud sound moves.

[The Cicada]

Originally Posted by Fat Alice in Strings

Snarl is reserved for the dog-like Pokemon, iirc. Arcanine gets it, for example.

.-. you really need to do research before posting false stuff, you do that too much.

Anyway, I think Regigas should get belly dru cuz it has big belly.

[King Serperior]

+ Explosion

Stats: It has just good enough attack at Base 91 to make use of this move. Though its defensive stats at Base 63 each aren't the best, the base 104 Health can help soften the blows.

Typing: Its a Normal type, so it gets STAB. Its good enough as is.

Ability(s):
1). Soundproof: Eh....not gonna be of any use.
2). Scrappy: Yes, THIS is where things get interesting. The ability to make Ghosts think twice about switching in is always appreciated.

Design: Well, seeing as its name is a fusion of Loud and Explode, obviously it would be good for it. I can see this HUGE explosion of sound waves traveling at the speed of sound flattening everything around it.

Need: With all of its coverage, this move may not seem like a good one. However, if you need a LO Suicide sweeper with good Mixed stats and the ability to go out with a bang, then Explosion Exploud is your mon!!!

Please note that the Explosion Nerf really sucks for mons like him.

[TM13IceBeam]

Originally Posted by Fat The Cicada

.-. you really need to do research before posting false stuff, you do that too much.

I rest my case.

[The Cicada]

Originally Posted by Fat TM13IceBeam

I rest my case.

far more than just dogs get it.

[Daggerfall]

This is going to sound stupid at first, but bear with me.

Arceus should get Focus Punch and the three elemental punches. Its Diamond Dex entry reads "It is described in mythology as the Pokémon that shaped the universe with its 1,000 arms." Since it shaped the universe with 1,000 arms, why isn't it able to use those arms? Yes, it's a goat, and goats don't have arms. However, the goat is essentially God. If it can't use the thing on its center for creating arms, why can't it just Gate of Babylon it? Fightceus could use Focus Punch alongside Swords Dance and Sub to relatively good effect. The elemental punches would also be a decent addition to physical sets for a bit of extra coverage.

Also, the three GSC legendary animals are clearly cats. Raikou is a sabre-tooth cat, Entei is a lion, and Suicune is...well, not even Bulbapedia knows.

[Garud]

Suicine could be a blue Leopard.

In any case, my contribution to the topic:

+ Aura Sphere

Type / Stats: A special-based Fighting type attack would suit Alakazam perfectly, even though he already has one.
Ability: Doesn't apply here in this case.
Design: The move is an aura produced by a pokemon from pure energy and focus. Which I'm pretty sure Alakazam should be able to produce that sphere. He can produce a Focus Blast. I get it's sorta Lucario's signature move, but considering Darkrai and Togekiss both get it, I hardly see the restriction being too big of a deal. Hell Mewtwo gets it, and lets face it, Alakazam is pretty much a mini-Mewtwo anyway.
Need: I remember one game I had with an opponent where it came down to my Alakazam vs his Tyranitar. My Focus Blast would have OHKO'd had it successfully hit, but it didn't, and almost a 1 in 3 chance of missing is not small. That's pretty much everyone's nightmare when using Alakazam, that a critical Focus Blast could miss. He can't really afford to miss anyway, he's just so freaking frail, he needs to KO things before they can strike back.

[The Cicada]

Arceus should learn every move in the damn game.

[R_N]

Originally Posted by Fat Daggerfall

This is going to sound stupid at first, but bear with me.

Arceus should get Focus Punch and the three elemental punches. Its Diamond Dex entry reads "It is described in mythology as the Pokémon that shaped the universe with its 1,000 arms." Since it shaped the universe with 1,000 arms, why isn't it able to use those arms? Yes, it's a goat, and goats don't have arms. However, the goat is essentially God. If it can't use the thing on its center for creating arms, why can't it just Gate of Babylon it? Fightceus could use Focus Punch alongside Swords Dance and Sub to relatively good effect. The elemental punches would also be a decent addition to physical sets for a bit of extra coverage.

Also, the three GSC legendary animals are clearly cats. Raikou is a sabre-tooth cat, Entei is a lion, and Suicune is...well, not even Bulbapedia knows.

The arms are metaphorical
I wouldn't be surprised if they were specifically talking about Judgement

The user releases countless shots of light.

with the shots of light being representative of the arms

[Antihaxxer]

Originally Posted by Fat kiddu

*imagines doing this with Arceus-Bug, even though it's obviously an exception*

XDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXD

Someone should draw up a comic of it. XD

Volcarona learns Fly, and I think Genesect too

[celever]

Originally Posted by Fat Daggerfall

Also, the three GSC legendary animals are clearly cats. Raikou is a sabre-tooth cat, Entei is a lion, and Suicune is...well, not even Bulbapedia knows.

They're called "the legendary dogs". Like how Kyogre, Groudon and Rayquaza are the weather trio. Hey, wait a second! Bulbapedia thinks they're called the legendary beasts! But I know that the term "legendary dogs" were used at least twice in Colosseum, pretty much a game modeled around them. Translation error into Colosseum? Anyway, you don't exactly talk about a sabr- no, well you do with a lion. Fine, they're cats...

[DarkBlazeR]

Interesting topic.

+ ExtremeSpeed

Type / Stats: STAB ExtremeSpeed is rather uncommon, and Ursaring is probably the Pokémon that screams out for it the most.

Ability: Guts + Extremespeed = gg

Design: This is one angry bear who doesn't fuck around. Brown bears are by no means sluggish in real life, so I really don't see why this would be a stretch to justify.

Need: Obviously inspired by its success in Glitchmons. Ursaring has always been an incredibly cool Pokémon that has the potential to destroy entire teams - its poor base 55 Speed prevents it from reaching that goal. ExtremeSpeed gives it the very tool it needs to be as dangerous as its appearance and base 130 Attack would suggest. Given ExtremeSpeed's +2 priority, it would be impossible to revenge kill it without a faster ExtremeSpeed. Although it still hits very hard unboosted, combined with +2 Attack from Swords Dance, ExtremeSpeed will be able to OHKO almost everything that doesn't resist it, and has good coverage options in Close Combat / Crunch / Elemental Punches to deal with the things that do. What's more is that Ursaring doesn't need to sacrifice its acceptable 90/75/75 bulk by running Flame Orb: it can run another item like Leftovers or Silk Scarf as it hits hard enough with +2 Attack alone. However, running Flame Orb gives it more immediate power. I think the addition of ExtremeSpeed would definitely be enough to at least put it solidly in UU, though I imagine it could also shake up the OU metagame as it is truly terrifying after a Swords Dance.

[MakaiMai]

Originally Posted by Fat celever

They're called "the legendary dogs". Like how Kyogre, Groudon and Rayquaza are the weather trio. Hey, wait a second! Bulbapedia thinks they're called the legendary beasts! But I know that the term "legendary dogs" were used at least twice in Colosseum, pretty much a game modeled around them. Translation error into Colosseum? Anyway, you don't exactly talk about a sabr- no, well you do with a lion. Fine, they're cats...

Just do what I do and call them gerbils, we ain't getting a clear answer anytime soon. :V

Anyway, here's something.

+ Doom Desire

Type / Stats: Makes good use of Volcarona's crazy Sp Atk.

Ability: Not much help here.

Design: Volcarona is essentially a sun in Pokemon form, Doom Desire has been described to use a burst of sunlight or a large amount of light to execute the attack.

Need: Competitively, it could have a very niche use, given the nature of this move and Future Sight (which I've never seen on a competitive level anyway), but it does make sense, doesn't it? Also, in case anyone missed it, it did get a buff in Gen V; 100 accuracy and 140 BP from 85 accuracy and 120 BP.

Side note: Ampharos could potentially get this move as well again due to the move description being "Two turns after this move is used, the user blasts the target with a concentrated bundle of light." Light Pokemon, I think we've been here before with the whole Luster Purge thing. :V

[Antihaxxer]

Steel type attack ? To attack what ? Rock Pokemon ?

[MakaiMai]

It hits harder than Flash Cannon or Iron Head, Volcarona need only scare an opponent to switch out to freely set it up, at which point you can potentially keep momentum going to force the opponent to take a hit from the current threat on the field, or risk the damage from Volcarona's earlier attack. Like I said, niche use, and I'm just theorizing.

[The Agonist]

+ Nasty Plot / Aura Sphere (but mostly nasty plot)

Design: Gengar is a ghost that likes to plot nasty things. Its Pokédex descriptions literally say so. You can just tell by that fucking grin it always has. As for Aura Sphere, idk, it could condense part of itself and fire it at the opponent (ignore Shadow Ball when you think of this).
Need: Genger has good SpA, but not amazing. With Nasty Plot, that doesn't matter. After just one, its SpA jumps from 359 to 718, enough to destroy just about everything. Combine that with a never-missing Aura Sphere, and it no longer needs to fuck around with Sub or Disable to beat Ttar (although Sub would still be extremely useful), and it doesn't have to rely on Focus Misses accuracy to beat crucial enemies.

Something like this:

Gengar @ Black Sludge
Timid, 6 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Shadow Ball
- Aura Sphere

With just those two moves, Gengar has perfect coverage, and at +2 SpA, doesn't really have to worry about things blocking its sweep.

[Alice in Strings]

Originally Posted by Fat MakaiMai

It hits harder than Flash Cannon or Iron Head, Volcarona need only scare an opponent to switch out to freely set it up, at which point you can potentially keep momentum going to force the opponent to take a hit from the current threat on the field, or risk the damage from Volcarona's earlier attack. Like I said, niche use, and I'm just theorizing.

I thought the point of scaring a foe out was to get a free Quiver Dance boost?

[MakaiMai]

Well this gives Volcarona another option, doesn't it?

Also, I dug around and found this post here.

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpos...2&postcount=58

"The idea is to use Doom Desire as they bring in a counter to Jirachi, (say Heatran), then you bring in a pokemon that counters Heatran (like say, Terrakion) and now your opponent has to switch into something that beat beat a Terrakion that could attack, set up a Sub, set up a Swords Dance, or set up a Rock Polish, AND tank a Specs Doom Desire which is hitting pretty damn hard."

Replace Jirachi with Volcarona and respective checks and counters and there's the basic idea. Volcarona could theoretically have a good Specs set going here with this. You'd think most Volcarona would do the whole Quiver Dance thing, so who would see this coming?

[The Agonist]

The problems I see with that is that Steel isn't a great offensive type, it's not getting a stab on it, and getting a Quiver Dance is generally superior to using Doom Desire (especially since Doom Desire's new mechanics make it much easier to counter).

[TM13IceBeam]

Originally Posted by Fat MakaiMai

Side note: Ampharos could potentially get this move as well again due to the move description being "Two turns after this move is used, the user blasts the target with a concentrated bundle of light." Light Pokemon, I think we've been here before with the whole Luster Purge thing. :V

let's just make everything that learns flash learn doom desire

IT'S LIGHT
:V

[Chou Toshio]

Originally Posted by Fat DarkBlazeR

Interesting topic.

+ ExtremeSpeed

Type / Stats: STAB ExtremeSpeed is rather uncommon, and Ursaring is probably the Pokémon that screams out for it the most.

Ability: Guts + Extremespeed = gg

Design: This is one angry bear who doesn't fuck around. Brown bears are by no means sluggish in real life, so I really don't see why this would be a stretch to justify.

Need: Obviously inspired by its success in Glitchmons. Ursaring has always been an incredibly cool Pokémon that has the potential to destroy entire teams - its poor base 55 Speed prevents it from reaching that goal. ExtremeSpeed gives it the very tool it needs to be as dangerous as its appearance and base 130 Attack would suggest. Given ExtremeSpeed's +2 priority, it would be impossible to revenge kill it without a faster ExtremeSpeed. Although it still hits very hard unboosted, combined with +2 Attack from Swords Dance, ExtremeSpeed will be able to OHKO almost everything that doesn't resist it, and has good coverage options in Close Combat / Crunch / Elemental Punches to deal with the things that do. What's more is that Ursaring doesn't need to sacrifice its acceptable 90/75/75 bulk by running Flame Orb: it can run another item like Leftovers or Silk Scarf as it hits hard enough with +2 Attack alone. However, running Flame Orb gives it more immediate power. I think the addition of ExtremeSpeed would definitely be enough to at least put it solidly in UU, though I imagine it could also shake up the OU metagame as it is truly terrifying after a Swords Dance.

I have to disagree on this one. Yes, I am aware that E-Speed Ursaring is like the Jesus of Glitchmons, but honestly Ursaring's got absolutely nothing in its design that indicates it should get E-Speed except for a high ATK and being a Normal type. Guts and E-Speed have no special interaction because Guts boosts every physical attack... the only move Guts has truly special interaction with is Facade.

Its' a super slow-ass mon, and its design is slow looking too. Bears are fast animals don't get me wrong (Faster than humans anyway), but they are still slower than crap like domestic rabbits and giraffes. They're nowhere near the real runners like wolves and wildebeast, which in turn are no where near animals truly built for speed like the domestic-bred Grey Hound or Cheetahs.

Granted, E-Speed is given to Pokemon that are not that fast not fast looking (Dratini, Togekiss), so an E-Speed Ursaring is not implausible. But that's just because there is so little in common between the Pokes who get E-Speed that almost anything with E-Speed is plausible.

However, this thread is not for "not implausible," but rather for "it-fits-so-well-why-isn't-it-here???" I'd want to see more reasoning and synergy between design aspects and moves in this thread than "Pokemon x can rip the game in half with move y".




Similarly I'm not a big fan of "This Pokemon should get Aura Sphere because I'm sick of Focus Miss."


@Doom Desire Volcarona-- yeah, but did you read the part where it's no longer generic damage? Where it is now Steel-type damage? So unlike in DPP, it's resisted by all the Steel, Water, Electric, and Fire types in the game: (read: practically everything in the metagame except Dragons and sand pokes). Doom Desire Volc would be decidedly unimpressive.

[celever]

/ With spore.

Now, these guys would be a perfect fit for spore, it learns stun spore, poisonpowder, and sleep powder, why not spore?

Type/stats Grass type, that's immediately good since I feel spore should be grass-type exclusive, and with 5 pokemon learning it via level up and the fact that it's not a TM, I feel this would make the move better known and jumpluff better.

Design Is it just me, or are Jumpluff's hands spores? In the 3D games Jumpluff releases spores by rubbing those 2 "hands" together and releasing spores from them. And Skiploom releases spores from it's flower.

Need It needs it pretty damn bad. I see sets in NU which have this:
Sleep powder
Swords dance
Acrobatics
Seed bomb.

Now, this is a good set immediately, but it relies on putting the foes to sleep so that it can get 1, 2 or 3 swords dances in. I used to run this set, but sleep powder kept on missing! It would make Jumpluff so much better and might put Jumpluff in RU!

[Jimera0]

I'm pretty sure that Spore is actually reserved for Mushroom like Pokemon only. Basically it's the fungus version of Sleep Powder, and only mushroom Pokemon get it. Jumpluff is based on dandelion fluff, not a mushroom so it wouldn't make much sense for it to get it.

[R_N]

DID SOMEBODY SAY EXTREME SPEED BECAUSE OH BOY DO I HAVE THINGS FOR THAT

I have been wanting an ES tutor for years because there's a lot of bizarre omissions.
Off the top of my head there's Rapidash, Dodrio, Accelgor, Pidgeot, Ninjask, Yanmega...and I'm sure there are other Pokemon that are known for being fast either from their stats or their Pokedex entries (or both) that really have no reason not to get the move.

I don't think there's a lot of them that would particularly die for it (Dodrio might like it, I suppose) but it's always bugged me that Extreme Speed usually doesn't land in the movepools of Pokemon that are fast.

At the very least I'd like to see the Linoone line & the Legendary dog/beasts to get them naturally.

[Chou Toshio]

Originally Posted by Fat R_N

DID SOMEBODY SAY EXTREME SPEED BECAUSE OH BOY DO I HAVE THINGS FOR THAT

I have been wanting an ES tutor for years because there's a lot of bizarre omissions.
Off the top of my head there's Rapidash, Dodrio, Accelgor, Pidgeot, Ninjask, Yanmega...and I'm sure there are other Pokemon that are known for being fast either from their stats or their Pokedex entries (or both) that really have no reason not to get the move.

I don't think there's a lot of them that would particularly die for it (Dodrio might like it, I suppose) but it's always bugged me that Extreme Speed usually doesn't land in the movepools of Pokemon that are fast.

At the very least I'd like to see the Linoone line & the Legendary dog/beasts to get them naturally.

As I mentioned, E-Speed is a pretty back move for this thread because:

A) There are no abilities designed to work with it specifically
E-Speed is not weak enough for technician, it doesn't get a sheer force boost-- it doesn't have any special synergy beyond what any other physical attack would.

B) It is really vague as to what should get it design-wise
There's so little definable similarities between the Pokemon that have it, almost anything could plausibly get it.

That's why, with the possible exception of Linoone (who already has it), I wouldn't say there are any Pokemon specifically designed such that they ought to have e-Speed.

Originally Posted by Fat celever

/ With spore.

No.

Dandylions are seed-producing Plants. They have no way to make spores...



Hmmm... on that note I have a bone to pick in the other thread with Leech Seed Breloom...