|Dec 8th, 2012, 4:55:53 PM||#1|
Join Date: Dec 2012
My First RMT (Try-Hard OU Rain) Please Help
After taking a long hiatus from OU because I didn't like the way weather was shaping the metagame, I have returned with my try-hard pants on. I decided to combat these weather shenanigans with rain of my own. My team is based around bulky support Dragonite, entry hazards, and eventually a DD Gyarados sweep. Rate this team?
Nature: Bold (+Def, -Att)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
- Perish Song
- Ice Beam
Every rain team needs a toed. Mine is defensive, providing it with optimal survivability. Scald is there for obvious reasons, and Ice Beam is there to punish Gliscor and Landorus, or any Dragon that attempts to switch into it. Perish Song and Protect are there to stop any boosters from setting up too much while I get my hazards up.
Ability: Iron Barbs
Nature: Sassy (+SpD, -Spe)
EVs: 252 HP / 72 Def / 186 SpD/ 0 Spe IVs
- Leech Seed
- Gyro Ball
Only Jirachi is more annoying than Ferrothorn in the rain. Without that pesky 4x weakness to fire, Ferro finds plenty of opportunities to switch in and set up Spikes. Protect is to scout choice locked pokes, and if they predict a switch it often means a free layer of Spikes. Leech Seed is for recovery and forcing switches, and Gyro Ball is there so I'm not completely shut down by Taunt or Magic Bounce.
Nature: Impish (+Def, -SpA)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Att
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock
Because neither my Dragonite nor my Gyarados particularly enjoy rocks damage, I decided it was a good idea to include a spinner on the team. Donphan fills this role spectacularly, and as an added bonus, sets up rocks and can use roar to phaze out boosters.
Nature: Careful (+SpD, -SpA)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Def
- Dragon Tail
- Thunder Wave
After my hazards are set up this guy is a real nightmare. He's bulky as hell, and with multiscale can easily take even ice type moves and phaze the opponent out to take more hazards damage, or use T-wave to slow them down for my sweepers. I use this Dnite to get as much damage as possible on the opponent's pokes before sending in my sweepers at the end of the match.
My defensive core has extremely good synergy, particularly Dragonite / Ferrothorn / Toed. They all cover each others' weaknesses well, which provides them with plenty of opportunities to set up hazards or phaze the opponent. Having phazing or pseudo-phazing moves on all 4 helps as well, since I cannot afford to let opponents set up as I do the same. It also helps entry hazards damage rack up. Some trainers have so much trouble breaking this sturdy core that they don't even get the chance to see my sweepers.
Genesect @Choice Scarf
Nature: Naive (+Spe, -SpD)
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 4 Att
- Ice Beam
This was originally a scarfed Thunderus-T with STAB Thunder to abuse the rain, but I had so much trouble with Ferrothorn (Focus Miss pissed me off too much) that I decided to switch him with Genesect. Genesect switches in on standard Ferro and gets a SpA boost, threatening him out with Flamethrower even in the rain. Moreover, if Spikes and Stealth rocks are up, Ferro can't afford to keep switching in and out.
Choice scarfed Genesect is Choice scarfed Genesect. He's incredibly hard to play around without protect, and is a very efficient scout for my team. He does work as a late game sweeper, but I prefer to use him as a scout and a Ferrothorn check.
Gyarados @Lum Berry
Nature: Jolly (+ Spe, - SpA)
EVs: 252 Att / 252 Spe / 4 Def
- Dragon Dance
- Stone Edge
This is the poke that my team is based around. Gyarados likes to switch in on a weakened foe, like Latios after a Draco Meteor, and set up a Dragon Dance. Pokes choice locked into not very effective moves are good set-up fodder as well. Running Perish song on my toed has given him a free turn to set up many times. He can also set up in the faces of slower pokes that will most likely try and status him, due to his having Lum Berry. I was originally running Life Orb offensive DD Gyarados, but did not like the recoil damage or the fact that he was completely shut down by any status. I run a Jolly nature because in the rain after a DD, Waterfall hits hard enough, and I run Moxie to gain attack boosts after picking off enemies weakened by entry hazards. Running a Jolly nature also allows me to outspeed Timid Jolteon after a DD.
So here's this semi-stall team based around Offensive DD Gyarados sweeping. Any suggestions to improve my team's synergy, or bringing up anything in particular that is a problem for my team would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for reading everyone!
Last edited by Wilhelm Vanderkunt; Dec 8th, 2012 at 7:03:48 PM. Reason: Wrote down the wrong natures for 2 pokes
|Dec 8th, 2012, 6:46:59 PM||#2|
Join Date: Dec 2011
Nice team. Unfortunately Genesect is banned. Use a choice scarf jirachi in its place
Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
- Iron Head
- Ice Punch
- Fire Punch
B/W fc: 1979 8029 5204
|Dec 8th, 2012, 6:52:27 PM||#3|
Join Date: Dec 2012
So I've been playing on PO and have noticed a few things that my team is weak to. Breloom, if my Dnite isn't at high health, destroys my defensive core. If it comes in at the right time and sets up a spore, then an SD, even my Genesect can't revenge it (Mach Punch wrecks it). Rock Polish Genesect, when it comes in on my Ferrothorn, gets a SpA boost and threatens me out with Flamethrower, but instead uses Rock Polish. If it's running the same moves as my Genesect, it can do a huge amount of damage to my team if it doesn't sweep it outright. I'll try and find other glaring weaknesses but is there anything anyone else can think of?
|Dec 9th, 2012, 1:31:01 AM||#4|
Tyger Tyger, burning bright, In the forests of the night; What immortal hand or eye, Could frame thy fearful symmetry?
Join Date: Nov 2011
Hey Wilhelm Vanderkunt, nice team!
First of all, not a single pokemon on your team resists flying, therefore Tornadus-T can just come in on Politoed, Donphan, Genesect locked into Flamethower etc and spam Hurricane against your team, you'll often have to sac something every time it comes in. This is a very big problem, as Tornadus-T is a currently a very common threat. To help remedy this situation I suggest running a Specially Defensive Skarmory over your current Ferrothorn. Skarmory is a great answer to Tornadus-T, as it resists Hurricane, has a reliable recovery move, and isn't hit super-effectively by any of Tornadus-T's coverage moves (except for like Heat Wave outside of rain, but Tornadus-T is a rain threat and you run rain as well so I highly doubt it'll have Heat Wave in the first place and if it does the run will likely be up.) Skarmory is able to set-up Spikes for the team just like Ferrothorn and it has the added bonus of having a phazing move itself.
However, this does open a weakness to electric types, as half your team is now weak to electric. This opens up problems with Rotom-W, and both choiced Thundurus-T and Jolteon now has an easier time spamming Thunder, and double dancing Thundurus-T's now hit 5/6ths of your team for super-effective damage. You also mentioned a rather large weakness to Rock Polish Genesect, who can currently sweep your team rather easily if given a Special Attack boost. To help mitigame these problems I suggest running a SubRoost Hone Claws Kyurem-B over your current Dragonite. Kyurem-B resists both Electric and water, reducing Rotom-W's threat level, it also only takes neutral from Ice, and with Kyurem-B's great bulk you now have something that's great against the common BoltBeam combo. It also takes neutral / resisted damage from the common Rock Polish Genesect sets, so you can either phaze it out with Dragon Tail or stall out his LO damage with Roost. This Kyurem-B still performs a very similiar role to Dragonite, it phazes pokemon with Dragon Tail as they take mass damage from the hazards, while you sit there subbing, and roosting off any damage. Kyurem-B has the added bonus of not only having a higher attack stat than dragonite, but having the ability to boost Dragon Tail's power and increase it's accuracy, this allows Kyurem-B to even pull off sweeps at times and makes it incredibly difficult to be dealt with. You do lose Thunder Wave Support, but your sweeper is pretty fast in the first place, so you don't really need it too much.
You mentioned a weakness to Breloom, and replacing Dragonite with Kyurem-B just magnifies this weakness. To help remedy this situation I suggest running Bounce over Earthquake. This allows you to OHKO Breloom, Gyrados is a pretty good check to Breloom due to fighting resistance and Lum Berry, meaning, if it comes down to it, you can switch in Gyrados on Spore and still beat Breloom 1 on 1. The loss of the coverage Earthquake brings may be irritating, but Bounce gives you STAB and coverage on grass-types and it's worth it to stop such a big threat from plowing through your team.
As a few minor changes you may want to try Ice Shard over Roar on Donphan and Toxic over Ice Beam on Politoed. With Skarmory and it's access to Whirlwind, you now have 2 phazers, so the need for hazards is less urgent, Ice Shard allows you to Revenge kill dragons if they get out of hand and revenge the likes of Thundurus-T, who is still a large threat even with Kyurem-B. Ice Beam isn't too great on defensive Politoed, dragons aren't going to be switching in on Politoed as they fear the Scald burn / Perish Song and pokemon like Gliscor are taken out with super-effective double STAB Scald anyway. Toxic in conjunction with Protect helps Politoed stall out pokemon such as Rotom-W and Latios that usually like switching in on Politoed's water moves and it overall increases Politoed's effectiveness as a wall.
Anyway, I hope this rate helped and GL with the team :)
|Dec 9th, 2012, 2:02:09 PM||#5|
Join Date: Dec 2012
I will take your advice and run a specially defensive Skarm over Ferrothorn for a bit and that Kyurem-B over the Dnite that I love oh so very much. We'll see how they do.
I started out with Bounce on my Gyara, but found Stone Edge's accuracy to be too iffy against bulky water types and is ineffective against the rare but albeit still present Empoleon. Being able to OHKO Breloom was really the only positive to running it, as bulky grass types aren't all that common in OU and the ever-present Ferrothorn is hit hard by EQ. If I let it put my toed to sleep, I can switch in my Dnite provided it's still alive and there isn't much Breloom can do. I've had a much easier time predicting around him knowing that my team is pretty weak to him. Also, Skarm is just about as good of a Breloom counter as my Specially Denfensive Dnite, so I'm not too worried about him anymore.
I wish Donphan could have 5 moves, because I'll miss being able to set up rocks in the face of a Ninjask and roar him away after he subs. However, Skarm will be able to do pretty much the same thing with whirlwind, AND it will stop baton pass chains with Mr. Mime, something I wasn't really able to do before (Baton Pass is a surprisingly common strategy on PO).
You'd be surprised how many people would send in a Gliscor or Landorus in on my Politoed when it's in a weather other than rain, especially sun. I've smashed up a few that thought I wouldn't be able to do much to them. But having Genesect (which was earlier this week a Thunderus) and Gyarados means I probably shouldn't worry about Gliscor as much as I have to with teams that aren't in the rain. I'll switch it out for toxic.
Thanks for the help, I'll keep you posted on how the new additions do.
|Dec 9th, 2012, 2:50:50 PM||#6|
Join Date: Dec 2012
So I just had probably 10 battles and won all but a very stally weather war that ultimately came down to hax. But the fact that this team can stay alive for 50+ turns is definitely a good thing.
I love this Kyurem. It hits like a truck especially after a hone claws boost, and is still surprisingly bulky (the one thing I thought I would miss from that Dnite is that annoying Sub/Roost in someone's face while the sub stays intact, which this guy does). I have no qualms there, thanks for the suggestion.
Adding Specially defensive Skarm did, like you said, open up a huge weakness to electric type moves. So much so that my obvious switch-ins to Donphan (who is, besides Kyu, the only guy who can shrug off a T-bolt on my team) often are punished with Ice type moves. Although now that I understand just how bulky that SubRoost Kyurem set is, he is probably a much better switch-in. Probably just poor play on my end.
I'm not so sure how much I like Ice shard on Donphan. With no Attack investment it hardly does any damage, even if it's super effective, and I find myself switching out to my Skarm more and more to Whirlwind when I just want to Roar with my Donphan. I'll test it out more though to see in which situations it proves to be useful.
Toxic on Toed was a good idea. Nothing feels better than hitting a Cresselia on the switch-in with Toxic. The only instance I have found myself missing Ice beam is against Venusaur on sun teams. Many times people will switch their Ninetails out to Venusaur after I've sent in my Toed, and being able to take away a good chunk of HP with Ice Beam is something I miss. But I have other things to handle Venusaur, so it hasn't been missed too much.