Alomomola > Vaporeon?

Techniloom · Dec 15th, 2012, 1:31:21 AM

Welcome Smogonites

I would like to first point out that this only applies to Vaporeon with Water absorb and not Hydration, because in regards to hydration Vaporeon wins hands down.

Now today while having one of those amazing conversations that you do on Pokemon Showdown we got into a discussion about Luvdisc and Alomomola which turned into how crap Alomomola was of course. But after looking at Alomomola's stats and movepool I noticed a very big similarity to Vaporeon so was like huh, lets do some calcs on these bad boys, What I came up with actually shocked me. I found that this Alomomola set

Alomomola @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 236 Hp / 56 Def / 216 SpD
Nature: Sassy
- Wish
- Protect
- Scald / Refresh / Toxic / Magic Coat / Light Screen
- Scald / Refresh / Toxic / Magic Coat / Light Screen

Is fractional more bulky in each defense than Standard Vaporeon

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 Hp / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Nature: Bold
- Wish
- Protect
- Scald
- Roar / Ice Beam / Toxic

Damage calcs to prove this

...

Ok so with Alomomola being basicly just as bulky whats the point? Regenerator, it makes Alomomola ALOT better as a wall. Now by know I bet your saying oh but alomomola has no offense at all, it's taunt bait, well for one taunt is pretty much never used in OU, secondly so is Vapreon because the only taunt user that comes to might is jellicent who has Water absorb and Finally yes Alomomola hits about as hard as new born baby but I think Regenerator makes up for that because it's a defensive pokemon not an attacker.

So does it really make sense that one of these guys is OU when one is NU when they do the same things but with one more defensive and one more offensive. Alomomola should atleast be UU imo and it defiently has it's merits on non rain OU teams as a more bulky vaporeon.

Now with my small rant over I would Like you to post your opinions in posts down below and have fun. Oh and pls don't just go I love Vaporeon <3 <3, actually supply facts.

UltiMario · Dec 15th, 2012, 1:38:02 AM

Vaporeon can do damage back.

Alomomola can't.

That key difference is why even though Alomomola is a slight bit bulkier, it's not as good as Vaporeon. The difference is so insignificant that it's not worth using something that can't attack back to save 1% every 2 or 3 hits. Regenerator helps, but it means nothing if you can't do damage to what you're walling.

rileydelete · Dec 15th, 2012, 1:49:37 AM

You make an interesting point (or rant of you prefer), however, I see a few differences between Vaporeon and Alomomola.

1) Vaporeon has better options in terms of both supporting a team and going on the offensive. Scald is a valuable tool and Vaporeon's SpA is simply higher. Not to mention the fact that it can attack grass, flying, dragon, and ground types with ice beam. Plus, the addition of roar makes it a useful phaser if necessary. A role that Alomomola cannot fulfill.

2) Consider the number of roles Vaporeon can play. It can be a healer, a staler, an offensive and defensive threat eliminator (burn lowering attack, toxic killing walls), and even a baton passer. Alomomola can't perform this many jobs so well.

Vaporeon is the superior Pokemon, and this isn't even including its wonderful Dream World Ability, Hydration.

Diatom · Dec 15th, 2012, 1:55:09 AM

One important thing to note: Alomomola's non-DW ability is hydration. So any points about how hydration makes Vaporeon > Alomomola are not valid.

Superpowerdude · Dec 15th, 2012, 2:00:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Diatom

One important thing to note: Alomomola's non-DW ability is hydration. So any points about how hydration makes Vaporeon > Alomomola are not valid.

That point is still infact valid. A dream world ability can completely change a pokemon like it did to Breloom, Gothitelle, Amoongus etc and sometimes it takes time for dw abilities to be realesed. So Vaporeon with Hydration gives it a massive advantage over Alomomalo to avoid status while Alamomola is crippled by Toxic. Vaporeon also has much better offenses letting it run a Life Orb+Rest bulky attacker set quite nicely

TheFourthChaser · Dec 15th, 2012, 2:00:55 AM

specs vap lgi

Woodchuck · Dec 15th, 2012, 2:04:52 AM

0 SpA Alomomola Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Salamence: 180-216 (54.38 - 65.25%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 SpA Alomomola Scald vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp in rain: 73-87 (20.39 - 24.3%) -- guaranteed 5HKO

alomomola is piss weak. piss. weak.

yes, it has regenerator, but that just means it can live longer to be set up on more often?

**Pocket** · Dec 15th, 2012, 2:09:02 AM

Please use Short Question Short Answer thread for similar inquiries

***Birkal**** · Dec 15th, 2012, 2:57:59 AM

It's not even SQSA material, to be honest. The OP of this thread is pretty much flaunting information. Even though it's interesting, there is little room for discussion in this thread. And what little discussion there was to be had has already been said by users like UltiMario and rileydelete. Techniloom, if you have information to present in the future, I'd recommend putting it to use in the C&C forums. This particular issue (Vaporeon vs. Alomomola) isn't something I'd bring up there because it's a pretty insignificant difference. If you like writing and digging up calcs though, C&C might be for you.

Dec 15th, 2012, 1:31:21 AM	#1
Techniloom Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 107	Alomomola > Vaporeon? Welcome Smogonites I would like to first point out that this only applies to Vaporeon with Water absorb and not Hydration, because in regards to hydration Vaporeon wins hands down. Now today while having one of those amazing conversations that you do on Pokemon Showdown we got into a discussion about Luvdisc and Alomomola which turned into how crap Alomomola was of course. But after looking at Alomomola's stats and movepool I noticed a very big similarity to Vaporeon so was like huh, lets do some calcs on these bad boys, What I came up with actually shocked me. I found that this Alomomola set Alomomola @ Leftovers Ability: Regenerator EVs: 236 Hp / 56 Def / 216 SpD Nature: Sassy - Wish - Protect - Scald / Refresh / Toxic / Magic Coat / Light Screen - Scald / Refresh / Toxic / Magic Coat / Light Screen Is fractional more bulky in each defense than Standard Vaporeon Vaporeon @ Leftovers Ability: Water Absorb EVs: 248 Hp / 252 Def / 8 Spe Nature: Bold - Wish - Protect - Scald - Roar / Ice Beam / Toxic Damage calcs to prove this ... 252 SpA Choice Specs Latias Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Vaporeon: 318-375 (68.68 - 80.99%) 252 SpA Choice Specs Latias Draco Meteor vs. 236 HP / 216+ SpD Alomomola: 363-427 (68.49 - 80.56%) 252+ Atk Choice Band Haxorus Outrage vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 348-411 (75.16 - 88.76%) 252+ Atk Choice Band Haxorus Outrage vs. 236 HP / 56 Def Alomomola: 399-469 (75.28 - 88.49%) 252 SpA Choice Specs Tornadus-T Hurricane vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Vaporeon: 273-322 (58.96 - 69.54%) 252 SpA Choice Specs Tornadus-T Hurricane vs. 236 HP / 216+ SpD Alomomola: 312-367 (58.86 - 69.24%) 252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 288-339 (62.2 - 73.21%) 252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion Close Combat vs. 236 HP / 56 Def Alomomola: 328-387 (61.88 - 73.01%) Ok so with Alomomola being basicly just as bulky whats the point? Regenerator, it makes Alomomola ALOT better as a wall. Now by know I bet your saying oh but alomomola has no offense at all, it's taunt bait, well for one taunt is pretty much never used in OU, secondly so is Vapreon because the only taunt user that comes to might is jellicent who has Water absorb and Finally yes Alomomola hits about as hard as new born baby but I think Regenerator makes up for that because it's a defensive pokemon not an attacker. So does it really make sense that one of these guys is OU when one is NU when they do the same things but with one more defensive and one more offensive. Alomomola should atleast be UU imo and it defiently has it's merits on non rain OU teams as a more bulky vaporeon. Now with my small rant over I would Like you to post your opinions in posts down below and have fun. Oh and pls don't just go I love Vaporeon <3 <3, actually supply facts. Last edited by Techniloom; Dec 15th, 2012 at 1:53:02 AM.

Dec 15th, 2012, 1:49:37 AM	#3
rileydelete Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 52 The Great White North	You make an interesting point (or rant of you prefer), however, I see a few differences between Vaporeon and Alomomola. 1) Vaporeon has better options in terms of both supporting a team and going on the offensive. Scald is a valuable tool and Vaporeon's SpA is simply higher. Not to mention the fact that it can attack grass, flying, dragon, and ground types with ice beam. Plus, the addition of roar makes it a useful phaser if necessary. A role that Alomomola cannot fulfill. 2) Consider the number of roles Vaporeon can play. It can be a healer, a staler, an offensive and defensive threat eliminator (burn lowering attack, toxic killing walls), and even a baton passer. Alomomola can't perform this many jobs so well. Vaporeon is the superior Pokemon, and this isn't even including its wonderful Dream World Ability, Hydration. __________________ "I feel like I got hit with a Dracula, by King Kong." -BMO

Dec 15th, 2012, 1:55:09 AM	#4
Diatom Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 72 The ocean	One important thing to note: Alomomola's non-DW ability is hydration. So any points about how hydration makes Vaporeon > Alomomola are not valid. __________________ %Subject 18: Frizy is hosting a 32 man OU tournament! PM him to join! Subject 18 was banned by Frizy.

Dec 15th, 2012, 2:04:52 AM	#7
Woodchuck <Feranfell> punbot irl aka virginity protector Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,653 us best	0 SpA Alomomola Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Salamence: 180-216 (54.38 - 65.25%) -- guaranteed 2HKO 0 SpA Alomomola Scald vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp in rain: 73-87 (20.39 - 24.3%) -- guaranteed 5HKO alomomola is piss weak. piss. weak. yes, it has regenerator, but that just means it can live longer to be set up on more often? __________________

Dec 15th, 2012, 2:57:59 AM	#9
*Birkal We have the technology. Super Moderator** Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 3,017 The Mentor	It's not even SQSA material, to be honest. The OP of this thread is pretty much flaunting information. Even though it's interesting, there is little room for discussion in this thread. And what little discussion there was to be had has already been said by users like UltiMario and rileydelete. Techniloom, if you have information to present in the future, I'd recommend putting it to use in the C&C forums. This particular issue (Vaporeon vs. Alomomola) isn't something I'd bring up there because it's a pretty insignificant difference. If you like writing and digging up calcs though, C&C might be for you. __________________

Dec 15th, 2012, 2:09:02 AM	#8
Pocket Bakuman ;< Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 7,185 Bergenfield	Please use Short Question Short Answer thread for similar inquiries