Pokémon X and Y Discussion

[Pokesal]

Oh, I didn't know that. I didn't go through every single page of the forum to see if my suggestion had been discussed. That would take to long.

@Jolteon Bandit

Oh. Well, it still has been a while since they released a new type.

[Pombo]

Originally Posted by Fat Upstart

I would love arena trap on the grass starter for dw. It would gaurentee him a place in ou. Grass starters deserce a shot at ou

lol venusaur

[shockwave527]

Originally Posted by Fat Pokesal

Oh, I didn't know that. I didn't go through every single page of the forum to see if my suggestion had been discussed. That would take to long.

@Jolteon Bandit

Oh. Well, it still has been a while since they released a new type.

I understand. Mainly was trying to let you know while not trying to start a whole nother conversation about it. We've already had the dark/psy/fight type triangle thing said about 20 different times and discussed over and over.

[Vemane]

Originally Posted by Fat -NLMRY-

Arena Trap seems OP (in-game) for a starter, but I like the idea of a specially based Technician user besides Roserade, assuming Fennekin is specially based.

It isn't like the opponent switches out... Like, ever. I don't see how it would be op in the slightest (in fact it would boarder on useless in a non-competitive environment)

[Jolteon Bandit]

Originally Posted by Fat Upstart

I would love arena trap on the grass starter for dw. It would gaurentee him a place in ou. Grass starters deserce a shot at ou

What are you talking about? There are only two starters in OU and one of them is Venusaur. Infernape is the other and deservedly so. Water types don't have an OU starter, but I forsee that this will change once Sheer Force Gatr comes out.

[Pokesal]

It would be nice if they put new unique ways for Pokemon to evolve. I also think they should have more to do in the post-game.

[shockwave527]

Originally Posted by Fat Jolteon Bandit

What are you talking about? There are only two starters in OU and one of them is Venusaur. Infernape is the other and deservedly so. Water types don't have an OU starter, but I forsee that this will change once Sheer Force Gatr comes out.

Well, don't forget the fact that Blaziken is in Ubers as well.

Originally Posted by Fat Pokesal

It would be nice if they put new unique ways for Pokemon to evolve. I also think they should have more to do in the post-game.

Idea: Second set of gym leaders. Either important people or retired leaders from the region, etc. You can meet them when traveling but they battle you after you beat the Champion, and give you a second badge case for the "Secret League".

[Dark Fallen Angel]

Speaking of Dark-types, I would really like to see a big upgrade to them, like those that Fighting-types received on Gen V. More powerful Dark-types, as well as Dark-type attacks with higher base power. Dark-type attacks have great neutral coverage, and it's easy to solve their coverage issues with a Fire- or Fighting-type attack.

A Dark-type attack about as powerful as Earthquake or Close Combat would be very appreciated. Unfortunately, current Dark-types like Tyranitar, and Hydreigon, are too slow to make an impact. But they are very powerful. I hope that they either make faster Dark-types, or make something to fix the speed issues that current Dark-types have (maybe a boosting move or item?)

[Bashfrog]

I kinda want to like ice types, but we never have seen their true potential in my opinion. Using my horribly dull newbie intuition, I would say that a weather condition that benefits one type would be dangerous, if they had the right abilities to abuse it. Have they ever altered weather conditions? If so, hail should be tweaked a little to make it more powerful, maybe weakening the power of a polar opposite or boosting stats. Also, add more abilities. Ice types, I don't believe, get stuff like sand rush or sand force, nor do they get swift swim, hydration,choryphyll, solar power, or any of the numerous boosts associated with some moves in weather. Perhaps they need more types that can sucessfully use it? Or maybe better, unique abilities that capitalize on their abilities? I'm not sure. I'm pretty sure the rise of the ice types will not come this gen, but someday, they're going to wonder "what would happen if we powered up hail?" and it would begin. I really don't want it to happen, but I'd like to see a hail team that can show up a rain team or even a sandstorm team.

[-NLMRY-]

Originally Posted by Fat Vemane

It isn't like the opponent switches out... Like, ever. I don't see how it would be op in the slightest (in fact it would boarder on useless in a non-competitive environment)

You're right. I wasn't thinking, lol. It's the exact opposite of what I said. It seems like it should be OP, but the AI sucks. And the games ignore fundamental aspects of the battling systems; i.e. single type gyms. I never understood how kids are supposed to learn when opposing teams are unbalanced. Maybe the first 3 or 4 could be single but by the time you're half way through the game gym leaders' teams should be more dynamic.

[TaiCrunch]

I've skipped around this thread quite a bit, but have we talked about the peripheral that'll undoubtedly come with X and Y? The Pokewalker was nearly perfect: it was simple, you could carry it with you, and gave us a reason to go out and do something without breaking the game. But Dream World was too much in my opinion. You had to take time out of your day to do it, it was way too tedious, and it was the only way to get Dream World abilities. And don't even get me started on Dream Radar.

I think X and Y should go back to the PokeWalker concept with the 3DS's built-in pedometer. Maybe use it with an external (free) app that you can send a Pokemon to, go out and do your thing (I would give no fucks about going out for a run with a huge bulky game system), and do some sort of full-display interactivity with it when you come back.

[Jolteon Bandit]

Originally Posted by Fat shockwave527

Well, don't forget the fact that Blaziken is in Ubers as well.

I didn't, I was just talking about OU. Believe me, you can't ever really forget a hodge podge like Blaziken. It's a fiery chicken with fists of fury that somehow manages to get faster the longer it fights...

[Mario With Lasers]

Originally Posted by Fat shockwave527

(...) each type resists 2 and is super effective against 2.(...)

Complicated as sin. Due to the nature of rock-paper-scissors, you can't count self-resists or self-weaknesses to form the circle, which restricts things a lot BUT, at the same time, you can't simply ignore these types; otherwise, there wouldn't even be enough options. Let me see...


rock (only one resistance besides poison and fire, which cannot be chosen)
water (only one resistance besides itself and steel and ice, which cannot be chosen)
electric (only one weakness)
grass - (only one resistance besides water, electric and ground, which cannot be chosen)
psychic (only one weakness besides ghost and dark, which cannot be chosen)
poison (SE against only one type)
fire (only one weakness besides water and ground, which cannot be chosen)
ground (only one resistance besides poison, which cannot be chosen)
flying (only one resistance besides bug and fighting, which cannot be chosen)
bug (only one resistance besides ground and fighting, which cannot be chosen)
normal (lol)
ghost (only one weakness besides itself AND dark cannot be chosen)
fighting (only one resistance besides rock and dark, which cannot be chosen)
steel (SE against only one type besides ice, which cannot be chosen)
ice (only one resistance)
dragon (SE against only one type)
dark (only one resistance besides itself)


...Fuck this

[Vemane]

Originally Posted by Fat Jolteon Bandit

I didn't, I was just talking about OU. Believe me, you can't ever really forget a hodge podge like Blaziken. It's a fiery chicken with fists of fury that somehow manages to get faster the longer it fights...

But your point was that most starters suck, thus blaziken should obviously be mentioned.

Only paying heed to ou pokes is ridiculous when claiming such a thing

[Halcyon of Light]

Originally Posted by Fat Jolteon Bandit

What are you talking about? There are only two starters in OU and one of them is Venusaur. Infernape is the other and deservedly so. Water types don't have an OU starter, but I forsee that this will change once Sheer Force Gatr comes out.

Infernape is actually pretty "meh" in the rain-infested metagame. Empoleon on the other hand is underrated. The Agility Substitute Petaya set from Gen IV is actually pretty good on rain teams.

[Halcyon of Light]

Originally Posted by Fat Jarrod558

what do you people think of the Y legendary to be Fight/Flying?

It just doesn't really look like a fighting type to me, but I would accept it if it were. That type combo would be pretty awesome anyway.

[shockwave527]

Originally Posted by Fat Jarrod558

what do you people think of the Y legendary to be Fight/Flying?

Naw, not seeing it. Honestly, I think they need some kind of Hero pokemon for it. A fighting type thing with a cape. Maybe gen 7 legend. Pokemon Hero and Villain versions.


Haven't seen it here in a while, but one thing I have to say to any people saying "X and Y? Run out of colors already? How unoriginal.":
IT HAS NEVER BEEN COLORS

GENERATION 1: Colors
GENERATION 2: Metals (and a gemstone)
GENERATION 3: Gemstones
GENERATION 4: Precious objects (metals, gemstones, and valuables...?)
GENERATION 5: Shades
GENERATION 6: Axes

[blasphemy1]

Originally Posted by Fat Pombo

lol venusaur

He does have a point, though. You're looking at OU in terms of black and white; you're either in, or you're out, with no shades of gray to distinguish the likelihood of a Grass-type starter being used in OU. When you look at the usage statistics, it's pretty clear that Fire- and Water-type starters are used more often in OU (these stats are from December 2012; http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3476888):

Charizard: 1.958%
Typhlosion: 0.586%
Blaziken: omitted
Infernape: 8.208%
Emboar: 0.284%

Venusaur: 6.610%
Meganium: 0.142%
Sceptile: 0.797%
Torterra: 0.336%
Serperior: 0.336%

Blastoise: 1.529%
Feraligatr: 0.580%
Swampert: 2.143%
Empoleon: 1.193%
Samurott: 0.216%

Obviously, averaging these wouldn't be of use, so I didn't even bother, and of course Water-types will be the most used of the bunch for their typing alone. However, Fire is a much worse typing than Grass and yet stuff like Charizard with one of the worst possible types imaginable has higher usage than any grass sans Venusaur. Clearly, Grass-type starters aren't as competitive for a variety of reasons.

This generation will probably continue the trend if those 'predictions' hold any truth. I don't see Fire/Psychic recovering from the typing, but Grass/Dark isn't much (if at all) better.

[RegiFlame150]

According to Bulbapedia, Yveltal's name may be based on Y, quetzal, and evil. Quetzals are a type of generally tropical birds whose name means "long feather" in a Native Central American language (Nahuatl). evil...that might suggest a dark or ghost typing, although you can certainly say some psychic types can be considered evil

Most of that last part came from Wikipedia and Sibley's guide to birds

[Basileus]

Originally Posted by Fat Vemane

Considering rage quit isn't even a real, defined term, I'm assuming that it is very possible to "rage quit yourself."

But don't take too much to it. It was, obviously, I had assumed, simply a snarky poke at the fact that you said the same exact thing to someone, before having an even larger "rage quit" yourself.

However, I was rage quitting for a good reason.

[Redjar]

Originally Posted by Fat shockwave527

GENERATION 1: Colors
GENERATION 2: Metals (and a gemstone)
GENERATION 3: Gemstones
GENERATION 4: Precious objects (metals, gemstones, and valuables...?)
GENERATION 5: Shades
GENERATION 6: Axes

[Halcyon of Light]

Originally Posted by Fat blasphemy1

He does have a point, though. You're looking at OU in terms of black and white; you're either in, or you're out, with no shades of gray to distinguish the likelihood of a Grass-type starter being used in OU. When you look at the usage statistics, it's pretty clear that Fire- and Water-type starters are used more often in OU (these stats are from December 2012; http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3476888):

Charizard: 1.958%
Typhlosion: 0.586%
Blaziken: omitted
Infernape: 8.208%
Emboar: 0.284%

Venusaur: 6.610%
Meganium: 0.142%
Sceptile: 0.797%
Torterra: 0.336%
Serperior: 0.336%

Blastoise: 1.529%
Feraligatr: 0.580%
Swampert: 2.143%
Empoleon: 1.193%
Samurott: 0.216%

Obviously, averaging these wouldn't be of use, so I didn't even bother, and of course Water-types will be the most used of the bunch for their typing alone. However, Fire is a much worse typing than Grass and yet stuff like Charizard with one of the worst possible types imaginable has higher usage than any grass sans Venusaur. Clearly, Grass-type starters aren't as competitive for a variety of reasons.

This generation will probably continue the trend if those 'predictions' hold any truth. I don't see Fire/Psychic recovering from the typing, but Grass/Dark isn't much (if at all) better.

Most of those guys (especially Charizard) are only used because they are starters. They are used by new players who simply want to use their favorites or their in-game team instead of a competitive one.

EDIT: The post above me scared the crap out of me. I was not prepared for Gimli, I'll tell you that.

[Jolteon Bandit]

Originally Posted by Fat Vemane

But your point was that most starters suck, thus blaziken should obviously be mentioned.

Only paying heed to ou pokes is ridiculous when claiming such a thing

I never said the starters suck, only that there are just two in OU. A good player can make most any pokemon viable in OU, it just takes a fair amount of skill. If anything, I was simply saying that the majority of Smogon thinks that the starters suck. Face it, without Speed Boost, Blaziken would probably still be UU. Same for Venusaur, without Chlorophyll, it would never see the light of OU.

This can be said for many pokemon however. I never saw a Frisk Gothitelle in OU. Swarm Scizor anyone? Oh I know, Shell Armor Cloyster. Maybe Unnerve Tyranitar? The list goes on.

[Basileus]

Originally Posted by Fat Redjar

I love that you made fun of your own post, massive props for that man.
“He who laughs at himself never runs out of things to laugh at.”

― Epictetus

[Jimera0]

Originally Posted by Fat RegiFlame150

According to Bulbapedia, Yveltal's name may be based on Y, quetzal, and evil. Quetzals are a type of generally tropical birds whose name means "long feather" in a Native Central American language (Nahuatl). evil...that might suggest a dark or ghost typing, although you can certainly say some psychic types can be considered evil

Most of that last part came from Wikipedia and Sibley's guide to birds

The Quetzal seems like it's right, but the "evil" is stretch a little. Forget what Yveltal looks like and just look at the name for a moment. That v isn't in a position to make anything close to evil. No, I suspect whoever wrote that on Bulbapedia shoehorned "evil" in there because well, Yveltal looks evil and uhhhh look a v! Next to an e! Even if they're in the wrong order! EVIL!

So I wouldn't take that name analysis as a good indicator of type. Remember, Bulbapedia is written by fans like us who are probably speculating just as insanely as we are. That bit about "evil" being part of the name is just as much speculation as anything we've put forward.

Of course Yveltal probably IS a dark type, but that's besides the point...

EDIT: Ok I post and then BAM GIMLI EVERYWHERE. That was a bit of a shock XD