|Jan 20th, 2013, 5:27:32 PM||#1|
Join Date: Jan 2013
Hello Smogon and welcome to my first RMT and first post on this forum! Most of you don't know me, so I'll just give a brief intro of myself. I joined Smogon just a couple days ago, at the request of one of my friends. I thought I wouldn't fit in at first, but after a couple of days, I found it more comfortable when I noticed some of my friends from another forum also had accounts here. I'm not really into teambuilding, although I do have a couple teams that have had moderate success in the past, but I think this one is the best of them all. This team was born when me and my good friend, Dr Ciel decided to make this HO sun team, since we were tired of Rain and Sand running around, we decided to go against the norm with this team. Anyway, the focus of this team is the deadly QD Volcarona, one of the best Sun sweepers in the metagame today. The goal is to remove Volcarona's counters with support from its teammates. Stealth Rock support makes Volcaronas job much easier. Anyways, this intro is getting long, so sit down with your mint tea and let's get to the team!
Team At A Glance
In Depth Look
(Ninetales) (F) @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 132 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Sunny Day
Oh my dear Ninetales, how would this team preform its job without your everlasting sun? Anyways, Ninetales is the most obvious choice for a Sun team, since the everlasting sun it summons is needed for this team to preform well. I went with the Sunny Day set, because it's the most common set it runs, because of its great support movepool and ability to wall a couple of threats in the OU metagame. Okay, let me explain the EV's for Ninetales. The 124 Defense EV's allow Ninetales to survive an EQ from a Focus Sash Dugtrio. The EV's in Speed and a Timid nature allow her to outspeed Modest Hydregion and Adamant Haxorus, both of which are threats to this team. Flamethrower is obligatory STAB, as it is boosted in Sun, to add to it's average Base Power. Will-O-Wisp allows her to cripple many physical attackers, such as Haxorus and whatever other physical attackers may be lurking in the tier. Sunny Day is the crux of this set, as it takes the momentum right back from the switch-in of an opposing weather inducer, forcing your opponent to rethink their gameplan. Roar is for those pesky set-up sweepers, of course.
(Dugtrio) (F) @ Focus Sash
Trait: Arena Trap
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
IVs: 29 HP
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
Our good friend Dugtrio comes back from the dead as the teams trapper, another crucial role in this team. As I've said before, Dugtrio is my answer to Tyranitar and the always annoying Chansey and Blissey. The EV's are standard, but I'll explain them anyway. Max Attack for the obvious 3 attack set and the Speed EV's and a Jolly nature assures that it will get Stealth Rock up first 100% of the time. I use 29 HP EV's so that I can take 2 Seismic Tosses from Chansey/Blissey and survive with 1 HP and KO with Reversal. Reversal eliminates Tyranitar when it's at 1 HP, giving it a sure KO. Reversal is also used for KOing the blobs at 1 HP, as mentioned before. Earthquake is obligatory STAB, taking on fire types such as Heatran without Air Balloon, Infernape, and even opposing Ninetales. Stealth Rock is the crux of this set, and the most important move on this team, if I say so myself. Stealth Rock makes my sweepers jobs much much easier. Stone Edge is for KOing Volcarona, Dragonite, non-scarfed Salamence, and a whole bunch of pesky flying types.
(Terrakion) @ Choice Band
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Quick Attack
Up next, it's OU's behemoth and this teams powerhouse and revenge killer, Choice Band Terrakion. This thing is just absolutely devastating, and with it's base 129 Attack and with a Choice Band equipped, its attack reaches levels that go absolutely sky high, allowing it to KO a vast majority of threats in the OU metagame. I don't need to explain these EV's at all, but gor those that don't know, I shall. I use maximum Attack EV's for pure killing power and max Speed EV's to outspeed some of the common threats in OU. Stone Edge is a strong STAB move and is useful for KO ing Salamence, Dragonite and other Pokemon that are weak to it. Close Combat is Terrakions main STAB, and its strongest move. Clsoe Combat with a CB equipped can even 2HKO Max HP/Max Defense Skarmory with it. It's also for dealing damage to some other Steel types in the tier. X-Scissor is for KOing the Psychic types in OU, mainly Reuniclus and Celebi. Quick Attack is used for picking off weakened opponents, such as Latios, before it KOs with Psyshock.
(Lilligant) (F) @ Lum Berry
EVs: 60 HP / 252 SAtk / 196 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Quiver Dance
- Sleep Powder
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire
Now, we come to my favourite sun sweeper of all time, the famous Quiver Dance Lilligant. Lilligant, as I said before, is our Chlorophyll sweeper, with Quiver Dance being one of the best boosting moves in the game today. I use Lum Berry over everything else, because you always want to avoid status that may hinder your Pokemon in the middle of sweeping your opponents team. The EVs may look odd, but allow me to explain. The 196 Speed EV's outspeed Scarf Latios in Sun, nuetral base 80s and positive base 70s without a boost. The EV's assure she will not be KO'd by Jolly Mamoswines LO Ice Shard. Quiver Dance, one of the best moves in the game, is obviously for setting up and do a mid-late game sweep. Sleep Power aids Lilligant in setting up, because it's basically a free boost or 2, which is always beneficial. Giga Drain is for those pesky bulky waters and also for regaining health. Hidden Power Fire is mainly for Scizor and Forretress.
(Starmie) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Def / 8 SpA / 224 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Rapid Spin
Now, we come to one of the teams most vital team members, Bulky Rapid Spin Starmie. Starmie is here obviously for clearing the field of hazards, paving the way for Volcarona to sweep. If I didn't have this guy, this team would basically fall apart. The EV's are made for Starmie to have as much speed as possible, because after the battlefield is cleared of hazards, Starmie can become a great choice for picking off weakened threats. Recover is obligatory for regaining health, allowing it to stay on the field as much as possible. Rapid Spin is obviously for clearing the field of hazards, which is absolutely needed, if Volcarona wants to sweep to its hearts content. Psyshock is for Toxicroak, Gengar, and is a good way of dealing damage to the pink blobs. Finally, Scald is a great way to cripple Physical attackers that may sweep my team. Overall, I think Starmie is the most important member of this team. Sun teams can't live without its Rapid Spinning abilities.
(Volcarona) (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Flame Body
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Rock]
- Bug Buzz
- Fire Blast
And finally, at last we come to the behemoth, the Pokemon that this team was built around, the great Offensive Quiver Dance Volcarona. Volcarona is the teams main sweeper, as with it's enormous Special Attack and decent speed stat, it's a prime candidate for a sweeper. EV's are standard, max Special Attack to give him as much power as possible and max Speed for outspeeding most of the uninvested metagame. Hidden Power Rock is for knocking out Dragonite, Salamence, opposing Volcarona and other Bug and or Flying typed Pokemon. Bug Buzz, the obligatory STAB is for hitting Psyshic types for supereffective damage, such as the Lati twins, Reuniclus and Celebi. Quiver Dance, the best boosting move in the game, is for setting up a sweep, and an important rule here, a Volcarona without Quiver Dance is not a legit Volcarona. Finally, Fire Blast is a very powerful STAB move that can KO so many threats in the OU metagame, that I cannot list them here.
(Ninetales) (F) @ Leftovers Trait: Drought EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 132 Spd Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Roar - Flamethrower - Sunny Day - Will-O-Wisp (Dugtrio) (F) @ Focus Sash Trait: Arena Trap EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd IVs: 29 HP Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk) - Reversal - Earthquake - Stealth Rock - Stone Edge (Terrakion) @ Choice Band Trait: Justified EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk) - Stone Edge - Close Combat - X-Scissor - Quick Attack (Lilligant) (F) @ Lum Berry Trait: Chlorophyll EVs: 60 HP / 252 SAtk / 196 Spd Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk) - Quiver Dance - Sleep Powder - Giga Drain - Hidden Power Fire (Starmie) @ Leftovers Trait: Natural Cure EVs: 252 HP / 24 Def / 8 SpA / 224 Spe Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Recover - Rapid Spin - Psyshock - Scald (Volcarona) (M) @ Leftovers Trait: Flame Body EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Hidden Power [Rock] - Bug Buzz -Quiver Dance - Fire Blast
Well, that's my team, I hope you enjoyed reading it. This is one of my favourite teams to use in today's metagame. I would like to thank Dr Ciel for all her help, and thank you guys for reading this RMT! If you like it, please leave a Luvdisc if you would.
|Jan 20th, 2013, 7:08:35 PM||#2|
Cause you keep me coming back for more
Join Date: Jul 2012
And I feel a little better than I did before
Hey, nice Sun team!
I've always loved Volcarona Sun, and your team looks very solid because of it. Nice job. Now, I think you might have a problen with DDance LumNite / Salamence. They will find multiple opportunities to come in and setup- since your Starmie, Lilligant, and Choiced Terrakion can't touch them. At +1, they can OHKO your whole team- you have nothing that can take a hit. To solve this problem, I would replace Lilligant's HP Fire with Hidden Power Ice. With HP Ice, you can use it to defeat Dragons that stand in your way- easing Volcarona's defensive pressure. You have many ways to beat Steel types anyway; Forretress / Scizor have almost no ways to significantly dent your team, in fact, they only buy Volc time to setup.
Other than that, you look pretty good. Again, if faster pokemon are problems, you can try Choice Scarf Terrakion, letting you revenge threats before they prevent your own sweep. However, Lilligant looks as if it can handle notable threats, so it's up to you.
|Jan 21st, 2013, 7:56:07 AM||#3|
Join Date: Sep 2010
Hi there! This is a really nice sun team! Lidvisc'd ;)
Anyway, the first thing I notice is that Starmie in the sun teams really lost a lot of potential because the sun which halves the power of his stab water and doesn't become a therefore threat to the opponent because of the little damage that would do the opponent can't switch, for this reason I want advise Xatu with magic bounce in the sun team works really well because it manages to get a peace of Tentacruel to repel toxic spikes without the risk of taking too much damage from scald because as I said in the sun power of water moves has halved.
Xatu also has access to uturn thanks to which it is able to give momentum to the team and in combo with Dugtrio may can trap Heatran, Tyranitar, Terrakion and stuff and consequently kill some very dangerous threat.
Speaking about Dugtrio I advise you to enter Memento > Stone Edge, so you can decrease by 2 the offensive statistics of the Pokemon that you have in front and forcing to switch because the statistics are too low and you can use this turn to stat-up with Lilligant or Volcarona and starting the sweep.
I've wanted to advise this change mainly 'cause sheerlandorus if he use rockpolish can give you a lot of problems, but with memento be able to weaken it enough to stat-up on him.
At this point I advise you to put HP Ice > Fire on Lilligant to gain a good revengekiller of Dragons 'cause one of this use DragonDance you don't have a weapon for fight him and accordingly could really cause you a lot of damages.
To hit the steel you still have the fire moves to Ninetales, Volcarona and Xatu so it's better to have a fast ice move.
Last thing that i want suggest is a quick change that can help you with traps Dugtrio: I'm talking about HP Fight > Sunnyday to Ninetales, so manage to break the baloon Heatran 'cause if you can't break the baloon you can trap him with dugtrio but also for hit x4 Tyranitar.
Sunny Day in your team is not essential because with Xatu you can prevents that the opponent setting too hazards in your field, so you can afford that Tales makes some switchs and then your clorophyller has quiver dance and can boost himself without the omnipresence of the sun on the field for starts the sweep.
PM or VM me for a OU Rate!
|Jan 21st, 2013, 8:29:26 AM||#4|
Join Date: Jan 2012
First of all, I agree with all Electrolyte's suggestions, they are all very good. Hidden Power Ice on Lilligant would work better than Hidden Power Fire because dragon-types like Dragonite and Salamence are quite problematic for this team otherwise steel-types like Scizor, Ferrothorn and Forretress aren't a problem for your team because they are setup fodder for Volcarona. Choice Scarf Terrakion fits well in this team too because it lacks one solid revenge-killer to deal threats like dragon-types, Volcarona, Thundurus-T and so on. If you decide to use Choice Scarf Terrakion, replacing your current one, I suggest you to replace Quick Attack into Earthquake because it's a useless move on a Choice Scarf user because it gives already speed to Terrakion in this case and so it doesn't need a priority move. Earthquake otherwise can be useful to hit Sword Dance Toxicroak but you can use Rock Slide if you hate the miss too. Finally, on Starmie I suggest you to use something different, replacing Scald, probably I'd use Hidden Power Fire to hit Ferrothorn, Forretress and Scizor and to support Lilligant. Scald is a bad move because of its fire power when sun is up so I suggest you to don't use it.
That's all I have to say about this team. Good luck!
Last edited by Alexander.; Jan 21st, 2013 at 8:43:29 AM.
|Jan 21st, 2013, 8:54:11 AM||#5|
Victors must always speak of the way the world should be, not the way it is.
Join Date: Oct 2012
lilligant and volcarona <3
As a fan of these two pokemon i have to give you a rate. In general, i think that ninetales appreciates more the special defense rather than defense, because it lets you take less damage from the omnipresent Politoed, also because dugtrio isnt even that common anymore, and it will be less common since tornadus-t is now banned. Now, in my opinion Hydreygon and Haxorus arent even that used to justify so many evs in speed, they will help you in like one battle , all you need is a steel type over something in your team, but ill speak about it later. For now, i think you can use a spread like this:
EVs: 248 HP / 164 SDef / 96 Spd with a Timid Nature, still lets you outspeed mamoswine if you think you need to, otherwhise you can even change it to the standard defensive spread to outspeed adamant breloom.
Now, as i said, you need a steel type. Latios, DDnite, DDmence, and basically any dragon gets a free kill everyturn, because you have no dragon resistors. Im also a bit worried about ground types in general, like Double booster Landorus-t or Polish Landorus, that with a single turn of boost against something liek dugtrio can be a problem for you. Btw i think the most replaceable member here is terrakion. For sure terrakion gives you a nice support, but its not a fondamental member. What i think you can try instead, its air baloon Heatran. Heatran provides you a nice switch in to Latwins, Dragonite, and most important Dd mence, being able to avoid Eq so that you can kill it with Hidden power ice. Heatran under sun still hits hard everything so you wont miss the power of cbkion. They also share some of their weaknesses, so you dont lose that much in the sinergy of your team. Now, for the fourth slot i think you can try Flame charge, which is a cool move to sweep once you have eliminated Politoed and others summoner (something that, with your team, its quite easy to do) or Metal sound, which is a cool move to catch blissey switching in, since without Terrakion you are probably weak to her (but honestly, blissey is like inesisten in this mg, so i think its fine anyway)
Now, to fix somewhat your weakness to offensive landorus, all i can suggest you is Memento over stone edge on dugtrio. It lets you drop their attack so that you can deal with them easier. All i can say is, just dont let it setup. Ninetales is still something that can be used as a setup fodder (even though you outspeed lando-t) for Special Landorus, so if you feel like its a problem you can even try air baloon over Leftovers, so that you can hit it with flametrhowr twice.
Thats it, hope i helped and luvdisc'd.
Check out team of the week!
|Jan 21st, 2013, 9:34:24 AM||#6|
Join Date: Sep 2011
Your team is solid, but it has some exploitable holes, especially because it's so reliant on your own weather being up. Sand and rain are undeniably more solid weathers, and you'll have a tough time facing them because your team is quite slow outside of the sun. Additionally, there are more optimal spreads that your team could be using to make it more effective. I'll start with your Terrakion: you're using a Choice Band set, and I assume you added it for more power on your team. The downside to using a Choice Band Terrakion is that your team is now even weaker to rain offense. Lilligant and Starmie resist Water, sure, but you can't guarantee that sun will be the weather condition throughout the match, and without sun, they are toast against any strong Water attack. With Stealth Rock support in the rain, both Starmie and Lilligant are OHKOed by Keldeo's Hydro Pump, at which point you'll have no Water resists and the game will basically be over. I'd honestly use a Life Orb Latias in its place, as Latias provides an ideal switch-in for Keldeo and gives you some Dragon-type offensive power. It also acts as another win condition against opposing sun, should Volcarona falter. I'd run a set with a spread of 80 HP / 184 SpA / 244 Spe, a Timid nature, and a moveset of Draco Meteor / Psyshock / Hidden Power Fire / Recover.
With that, you don't really have any more synergetic flaws, but there are some tweaks that would make your team better. For one, Dugtrio should be using a spread of 252 Atk / 252 Spe (with 0 HP EVs) and 21 HP IVs to ensure that it has 201 HP, just enough to take two Seismic Tosses and live with 1 HP to give Reversal maximum power. Investing in Dugtrio's HP does absolutely nothing except make it harder for Dugtrio's Reversal to power through opposition. Stone Edge is pretty unnecessary, as you'll almost never use it. In its place, you should give Memento a shot, as if opposing Rock Polish Landorus try and set up on you, you can simply use Memento and ruin their attacking stats. On Lilligant, you really should invest in extra power by using a Life Orb. You're not really going to be switching Lilligant into anything considering how frail it is, and you have Giga Drain to heal off damage that Lilligant has lost from taking Life Orb recoil, so it should just help you sweep more quickly, with less boosts under your belt. Those are all the changes I have, but you might consider in trying a Steel-type out, as you have no way to switch into Dragon-types. If they begin to be problematic, an offensive or Magma Storm Heatran might fit well over Volcarona. This is optional, as it sacrifices a lot of your offense to wall Dragons. Regardless, good luck. I hope I helped.
|Jan 21st, 2013, 10:04:51 AM||#7|
Join Date: Oct 2012
I tell you I'm a Tensai
Hi, someone called me so here I am :>
First, this is a nice sun team, this is not my favorite type of teams, but I can definitely see that this one is cool. Volcarona is a ridiculously powerful pokemon, able to break through so many teams, prepared or not.
Hooooooooooooooowever, I see some advices that I could give you based on the weaknesses that I saw :
- First, I don't like the use of Dugtrio with no "pivoting" power. You lack something with U-Turn, Volt-Switch, Baton Pass.. anything that could give to the Sun teams the "dynamism" they usually lack since the departure of Genesect.
- Second, you seem over focused on the Dragons, and I can see why. Sun teams hate Dragons with passion, and I see Latias bringing pain and destruction on this teams. Those HP Ice will help you.. but not so much. Obviously you got Bug Buzz Volcarona, but let's assume that SR are up and that you don't have the room to boost, Latias will just wall 5/6 of your team (yes, you can catch it with Terrakion, this is really risky and anyway Latias will outspeed you and land a KO).
On the top of this, you got no steel. So, Dragons can come easily, and you got nothing to take those powerful DracoMeteor/Outrage.
As previously said, you lack a way to revenge kill those Dragons aswell. Meaning that after 2 boosts (I don't see how you can prevent Dragonite from setting up if he comes on Ninetails because you risk to eat an EQ and to lose your weather, same goes for Starmie will you stay here, Scalding until you burn him ?). So if I had my Deoxys-D offense, I would bait this Starmie and switch to Dragonite as soon as you Rapid Spin. Then I got a pretty free DD and another one depending on what you decide to do.
To be honest, I don't want to change the team so much, so I'll stick to one main change, and some minor ones.
Here I go :
- Scarf Jirachi.
With it, you have a security net against Dragons because you can take an Outrage and retaliate with Ice Punch. So basically, you get a decent Scarfer, and a way to revenge AND tank Dragons. I don't see many other pokemons in OU able to do that.
Terrakion was great to clean the pink blob. Jirachi is just the same, Trick, or just Iron Head spamming, will help you to break walls for your special sweepers.
The icying on the cake, Jirachi is a great momentum giver with U-Turn. This pokemon will perform great with Dugtrio to trap the Fires incoming to kill him or the Steels coming to wall him.
The other changes are minor, as I said, I could change Liligant for a Venusaur and all the classic stuff, but it's up to you, that's all about flavours.
The minor changes :
- Change Volcarona spread and item.
Give him less speed, he does not need it usually. Give him 176 speed to outspeed Deoxys-D max speed and put the rest in SpA and in SpD.
Let's assume you face a Deoxys-D team, you lead with Volcarona, Quiver Dance the first turn as he tries (they all do, because bulky Volcarona is slower) to Taunt you and kill him.
I'd also go for Giga Drain over your HP Rock. Volcarona is supposed to sweep in the late game, where walls are down. I prefer the coverage of Giga Drain along with Life Orb than a weak HP Rock along with Leftovers for this role (think about a god damn pony willing to stop your final sweep).
- I don't like Stone Edge on Dugtrio, give a shot to Rock Tomb (to not let Dragonite set a DD after you kill someone) or Memento. Stone Edge, while giving coverage, doesn't give utility to Dugtrio, and this is what he needs because he's weak at dealing damages.
- Give Starmie 232 Speed, this is needed now, because Tornadus-I is back !
- I'll also root for HP Ice Liligant or HP Rock
- That's all !
The sets :
We must not let daylight in upon the magic.
VM me for a rate in BW2 OU, my advices are free for now
*Check my last RMT -Friend's Prophecy- ! And give me your opinion !
|Jan 21st, 2013, 10:06:55 AM||#8|
When I walk these streets, A loaded six string on my back, I play for keeps, 'Cause I might not make it back
Join Date: Jun 2012
Brooklyn, New York
Okay guys, all these changes will be definitely tested and I'll edit this post with the results hopefully. Thanks for all the help!
PM or VM me for an OU rate!
|Jan 21st, 2013, 8:57:48 PM||#9|
Join Date: Mar 2012
Hey guys nice team!
As everyone has mentioned Dragon-types are a big problem for your team to face. You carry no Steel-type at all and your two sweepers Volcarona and Liligant are known to be walled by Pokemon such as Dragonite and Salamence. Also Choice Band Terrakion looks out of place on this team. It makes you weaker to rain offense for starters and your team doesn't need a physical wall breaker with the combination of Liligant and Volcarona destroying all physical walls and even a lot of special walls.
To help you against these dragon-type Pokemon I suggest Choice Scarf Jirachi>Terrakion Jirachi provides you with a Steel-type and with a Choice Scarf can revenge kill Salamence and Dragonite with Ice Punch. U-turn also works great on this Jirachi so you can trap Tyranitar easier, which is definitely a threat to this team due to it erasing your sun. You can also U-turn on Heatran and beat it with Dugtrio which is nice seeing as Heatran can counter Choice Scarf Jirachi. Jirachi's Fire Punch gets boosted in the sun making it quite powerful. The damage Fire Punch does to Steel-types is also welcome. Iron Head is the last move and is obviously there for stab and flinch hax. As I mentioned your team has no need for Choice Band Terrakion because you don't have to break physical walls with Liligant and Volcarona, while it also makes you weaker to rain teams. Jirachi on the other hand helps you against Dragonite and Salamence and it also provides great support for Dugtrio with U-turn.
Good luck with the team I hope I helped!
Edit: Also I see you like my RMT format ;)