Victim of the Week: Week 6, Volcarona - Page 7

pom · Mar 10th, 2013, 3:53:12 PM

Keldeo @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Justified
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Surf
- Secret Sword
- Icy Wind
- Hidden Power [Electric]

252 SpA Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. +1 240 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 252-296 (67.92 - 79.78%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

or

252 SpA Keldeo Surf vs. +1 240 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 200-236 (53.9 - 63.61%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+1 252 SpA Volcarona Bug Buzz vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo: 123-146 (37.96 - 45.06%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

and worst case:

+1 252 SpA Volcarona Giga Drain vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo: 276-326 (85.18 - 100.61%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO

So unless Volca has Giga Drain, it will never get past Keldeo as long as you switch Keldeo in directly as it Quiver Dances. Even if it doesn't QD, and goes right for the Giga Drain, Keldeo will still win. Sun being up also makes it harder to check, but chances are you're running Keldeo with either Tyranitar or Politoed. Now, if Rocks are up, Volca has no chance whatsoever unless it gets to +3 or something ridiculous (Hydro Pump misses maybe?).

namehtmas · Mar 10th, 2013, 4:41:14 PM

Volcarona could just Quiver Dance a second time after the switch though, and would then be able to outspeed and OHKO (and probably do the same to the rest of your team, too).

Electrolyte · Mar 10th, 2013, 5:43:55 PM

Blissey @ Leftovers
Calm / 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpDef
Seismic Toss / Softboiled / Stealth Rock / Thunder Wave

Chansey @ Eviolite
Bold / 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Seismic Toss / Wish / Protect / Toxic

So the two blob sisters are back again to bring hell to any and all special attackers that lack physical coverage. They can both use their massive SpDef and HP stats to sit and wall Volcarona all day, even in the Sun, and gradually chip away at its health with Seismic Toss or status moves, all the while using their quick recovery support moves to heal themselves. Blissey can tank even +4 Bug Buzz and not even get 2HKO'd- giving it plenty of time to chip away at Volcarona's health with Seismic Toss. Softboiled also makes Blissey a tough blob to smush. Blissey can also set SR, which discourages Volcarona from switching out because it won't be able to work as effectively the next time it comes in. Chansey is very similar- though it doesn't have the same SpDef bulk as Blissey does, it can Toxic stall with much more ease as it passes itself wishes and protects every other turn. It too can Seismic Toss Volcarona to death, but Flame Body burns are annoying.

It's probably useful to note that it takes 4 Seismic tosses to take down 100% 0 HP Volcarona.
Here are some calcs:
Fire Blast:
+3 252 SpA Volcarona Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 322-379 (45.73 - 53.83%) -- 44.53% chance to 2HKO
+3 252 SpA Volcarona Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey: 294-346 (45.09 - 53.06%) -- 0.39% chance to 2HKO

Bug Buzz:
+4 252 SpA Volcarona Bug Buzz vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey: 264-312 (40.49 - 47.85%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+4 252 SpA Volcarona Bug Buzz vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 289-342 (41.05 - 48.57%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Fire Dance:
+5 252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 301-355 (42.75 - 50.42%) -- 1.17% chance to 2HKO
+6 252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey: 313-369 (48 - 56.59%) -- 33.2% chance to 2HKO

@ Kidogo: the movesets can vary and they often do. Because what the other moves are doesn't really effect how well they counter Volc as long as recovery / seismic toss are on there, I just slapped on what I usually use on my blob. But honestly, it doesn't matter; it depends more on the rest of your team, which isn't what we're worrying about right now.

And no, Max SpDef Blissey has more SpDef than min SpDef Chansey with Eviolite, not the other way around. Chansey should be used when having mixed bulk is more of a prioirty, while Blissey should be used when Special bulk is valued more. It's not always dependent on weather of moveset.

Kidogo · Mar 10th, 2013, 6:00:25 PM

Just wanted to say im kinda confused at the difference in movesets for the two blobs lol. IMO blissey is more likely to be running wish + protect since it also gets lefties recovery. And why is blissey more likely to have twave than toxic lol?
Also, chansey's SpD bulk >>> blisseys even with minimum investment iirc. Really, only use blissey if you're running attacks or have a damaging weather up a lot.

Deluks917 · Mar 14th, 2013, 11:09:59 AM

If both use 4/252/252 (and same nature) Chansey has about 38% more physical Bulk and 26% more special bulk. I honestly do not know how this compares to leftoves with hazards factored in. So if Blissey takes 50% from a special/physical atk Chansey takes 39.7/36.3 % on average.

Alexander. · Apr 24th, 2013, 5:17:12 PM

I noticed this thread died. I think it was a very great idea, especially for the new users who maybe don't know how deal with a specific threat. I'm asking a OU mod to restore this thread ;)

Mar 10th, 2013, 5:43:55 PM	#153
Electrolyte Cause you keep me coming back for more Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,054 And I feel a little better than I did before Mentor	Blissey @ Leftovers Calm / 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpDef Seismic Toss / Softboiled / Stealth Rock / Thunder Wave Chansey @ Eviolite Bold / 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe Seismic Toss / Wish / Protect / Toxic So the two blob sisters are back again to bring hell to any and all special attackers that lack physical coverage. They can both use their massive SpDef and HP stats to sit and wall Volcarona all day, even in the Sun, and gradually chip away at its health with Seismic Toss or status moves, all the while using their quick recovery support moves to heal themselves. Blissey can tank even +4 Bug Buzz and not even get 2HKO'd- giving it plenty of time to chip away at Volcarona's health with Seismic Toss. Softboiled also makes Blissey a tough blob to smush. Blissey can also set SR, which discourages Volcarona from switching out because it won't be able to work as effectively the next time it comes in. Chansey is very similar- though it doesn't have the same SpDef bulk as Blissey does, it can Toxic stall with much more ease as it passes itself wishes and protects every other turn. It too can Seismic Toss Volcarona to death, but Flame Body burns are annoying. It's probably useful to note that it takes 4 Seismic tosses to take down 100% 0 HP Volcarona. Here are some calcs: Fire Blast: +3 252 SpA Volcarona Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 322-379 (45.73 - 53.83%) -- 44.53% chance to 2HKO +3 252 SpA Volcarona Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey: 294-346 (45.09 - 53.06%) -- 0.39% chance to 2HKO Bug Buzz: +4 252 SpA Volcarona Bug Buzz vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey: 264-312 (40.49 - 47.85%) -- guaranteed 3HKO +4 252 SpA Volcarona Bug Buzz vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 289-342 (41.05 - 48.57%) -- guaranteed 3HKO Fire Dance: +5 252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 301-355 (42.75 - 50.42%) -- 1.17% chance to 2HKO +6 252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey: 313-369 (48 - 56.59%) -- 33.2% chance to 2HKO @ Kidogo: the movesets can vary and they often do. Because what the other moves are doesn't really effect how well they counter Volc as long as recovery / seismic toss are on there, I just slapped on what I usually use on my blob. But honestly, it doesn't matter; it depends more on the rest of your team, which isn't what we're worrying about right now. And no, Max SpDef Blissey has more SpDef than min SpDef Chansey with Eviolite, not the other way around. Chansey should be used when having mixed bulk is more of a prioirty, while Blissey should be used when Special bulk is valued more. It's not always dependent on weather of moveset. __________________ Stuff (Click!): l l l l l l l l l l VM me for an OU / LC team rate! MURKBRO MAFIA Last edited by Electrolyte; Mar 10th, 2013 at 6:19:12 PM.

Mar 10th, 2013, 6:00:25 PM	#154
Kidogo Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 425	Just wanted to say im kinda confused at the difference in movesets for the two blobs lol. IMO blissey is more likely to be running wish + protect since it also gets lefties recovery. And why is blissey more likely to have twave than toxic lol? Also, chansey's SpD bulk >>> blisseys even with minimum investment iirc. Really, only use blissey if you're running attacks or have a damaging weather up a lot. __________________ Check out my RMT (Baton) Passport to Victory (Peaked #2)! Want to read a warstory? Try this one: Dragons Dinos, and Donkeys (I mean ponies): an OU Warstory

Mar 14th, 2013, 11:09:59 AM	#155
Deluks917 Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 247	If both use 4/252/252 (and same nature) Chansey has about 38% more physical Bulk and 26% more special bulk. I honestly do not know how this compares to leftoves with hazards factored in. So if Blissey takes 50% from a special/physical atk Chansey takes 39.7/36.3 % on average. Last edited by Deluks917; Mar 14th, 2013 at 12:56:22 PM.

Mar 10th, 2013, 3:53:12 PM	#151
pom Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 20	Keldeo @ Choice Scarf Trait: Justified EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd Timid Nature - Surf - Secret Sword - Icy Wind - Hidden Power [Electric] 252 SpA Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. +1 240 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 252-296 (67.92 - 79.78%) -- guaranteed 2HKO or 252 SpA Keldeo Surf vs. +1 240 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 200-236 (53.9 - 63.61%) -- guaranteed 2HKO +1 252 SpA Volcarona Bug Buzz vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo: 123-146 (37.96 - 45.06%) -- guaranteed 3HKO and worst case: +1 252 SpA Volcarona Giga Drain vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo: 276-326 (85.18 - 100.61%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO So unless Volca has Giga Drain, it will never get past Keldeo as long as you switch Keldeo in directly as it Quiver Dances. Even if it doesn't QD, and goes right for the Giga Drain, Keldeo will still win. Sun being up also makes it harder to check, but chances are you're running Keldeo with either Tyranitar or Politoed. Now, if Rocks are up, Volca has no chance whatsoever unless it gets to +3 or something ridiculous (Hydro Pump misses maybe?).

Mar 10th, 2013, 4:41:14 PM	#152
namehtmas Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 53	Volcarona could just Quiver Dance a second time after the switch though, and would then be able to outspeed and OHKO (and probably do the same to the rest of your team, too).

Apr 24th, 2013, 5:17:12 PM	#156
Alexander. Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,136	I noticed this thread died. I think it was a very great idea, especially for the new users who maybe don't know how deal with a specific threat. I'm asking a OU mod to restore this thread ;)