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#51 |
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 473
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Metagross has far better stats besides Defense and can actually stomach super effective hits. Head Smash does not a good Pokémon make; otherwise Aggron, Rampardos, and Archeops would actually be known quantities in OU. They are not, despite my deepest wishes that Archeops would get Rock Head and Brave Bird in BW2.
Okay, I'm going to be honest and say I don't know why I replied to this post. Like, I get that Metagross is "bad" outside extreme niche conditions which he just so happens to fulfill in my team. But Aggron?
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FaceFaceFace: "Genesect is like the Terminator. Scary when he's coming after you, absolutely lovely with ridiculous punch-lines when he's on your side." |
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#52 | |
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 85
(´・ω・`)
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Your argument is invalid.
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I go by the name of "Not Lavos Spawn" on PS &Hugendugen: who is this Hugen Dugen? &Mikel: a skank who think she's pretty &Mikel: and is rather large |
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#53 |
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 208
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I'm not even sure Aggron is exclusively bad because those pesky 4x weaknesses for Fighting and Ground... But also it's weak against the incredible common Water type!
Most pokemon will be hardpressed not to have coverage that pwns Aggron. Unless they are oddballs like electric types or Volcarona. |
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#54 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 263
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Bays, Aggron has Rock Head. So Head Smash is just like Stone Edge with an extra Choice Band boost. You said that Metagross is bad outside of extremely niche situations which include tanking Outrage and Hurricane. Why not use a pokemon that would perform better in those extremely niche situations if that is the only reason to use Metagross in the first place? Does it matter if it is even worse in other situations? You don't plan to use it for that anyway. Edit: YES I KNOW METAGROSS IS A LOT BETTER THAN AGGRON. The point is, the only reason to find a team slot for Metagross in OU is for things that Aggron can do better. Therefore, it makes sense to use Aggron for those things. Last edited by youngjake93; Feb 2nd, 2013 at 4:01:10 AM. |
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#55 |
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neither metagross nor aggron are good choices for ou. don't derail the thread.
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#56 | |
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 85
(´・ω・`)
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After you deal with this "outrage locked dragon", Aggron is extremely easy to revenge kill due to people optimizing for head smash, which fighting resists. Not to mention, Mach Punch from a lot of pokes can easily kill. In that regard, Metagross can hit for neutral damage with Zen Heatbutt or Meteor Mash, while taking neutral damage from mach punch. Edit: ^^ I'm fully aware both suck in OU, but seriously. Metagross > Aggron
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I go by the name of "Not Lavos Spawn" on PS &Hugendugen: who is this Hugen Dugen? &Mikel: a skank who think she's pretty &Mikel: and is rather large Last edited by MapleDoom; Feb 2nd, 2013 at 3:52:50 AM. |
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#57 |
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 473
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Even ignoring the fighting weakness, you have the fact that 199 Pokemon can learn Earthquake from TM26. Even goddamn Mantyke and Seviper get that move. And you know what? Seviper can OHKO with CB or Life Orb. Physical attacking Mantyke can easily 2HKO with a choice band. That is a serious flaw. Sure, you can run Air Balloon, but that removes your choice item from the equation, and things go from bad to worse for poor Aggron.
(That said, Aggron looks pretty rad and is one of my favorite Gen 3 Pokemon. It's possibly based on Pulgasari, of all things.) |
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#58 |
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 208
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Aggron is as good in battling as Pulgasari is in mainstream culture.
Anyways, I'm very happy Latias is finally getting the attention it deserved, and certainly not surprised to see Espeon so high -being the BP staple that it is-. Alakazam is overplayed without a doubt, and imo Reuniclus could stay in OU given that it has a proper niche. Haxorus almost dropping is not exactly a surprise considering the competition it gets from Kyurem-B... In UU it would get competition from Flygon, who actually outspeeds him, so it may not be a wreckball waiting to happen. |
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#59 | ||
Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,603
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Quote:
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(and seriously, go read that thread, your numbers are ridiculously off)
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Last edited by Mario With Lasers; Feb 2nd, 2013 at 9:55:11 AM. |
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#60 |
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 335
Ridgefield Park, NJ
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Thank you Antar for the monthly stats.
| 13 | Keldeo| 11.48675% | 81733 | 8.598% | 61302 | 8.001% | Oh shit, this was probably boosted by the suspect ladder, but at least its getting usage is deserves finally. 22 | Landorus-Therian| 8.67255% | 62606 | 6.586% | 54159 | 7.069% | You know, I thought this thing would have a chance at falling to UU after seeing it's low usage last month, and now its getting even more love than Thundy-T. 28 | Latias| 7.34539% | 57202 | 6.018% | 44866 | 5.856% | Holy fuckballs this thing jumped in usage. Possibly because of the suspect Keldeo running rampant so I guess we will just have to wait and see how these two will do now that the spotlight isn't completely centered around using/countering Keldeo. 30 | Infernape| 7.18132% | 75695 | 7.963% | 60746 | 7.929% | 31 | Venusaur| 7.08539% | 66773 | 7.024% | 51400 | 6.709% | This sickens me. I am not an Infernape hater at all, but Venusaur's usage should be equal to Ninetales' usage. There is no reason to have a Venusaur outside of Sun and no reason to build a Sun team without V-saur. 40 | Cloyster| 6.21587% | 76972 | 8.097% | 59463 | 7.761% | what. the. fuck. I guess I'm the only player who doesn't hate on this damn thing. Granted, I haven't used it in forever but god damn it... 52 | Reuniclus| 4.25971% | 40334 | 4.243% | 31530 | 4.115% | 53 | Haxorus| 3.89987% | 41675 | 4.384% | 31412 | 4.100% | ![]() ^THAT is how I feel. Seriously, how the fuck did that happen? Reuniclus's Calm Room/Trick Mind/whateverthefuckyouwannacallit pwns everything to the point where you need to simply let Trick Room run it's course. Haxorus honestly would become BL. There is no way in the kingdom of fuckdom that it can stay in UU with pokemon like Ambipom. Base 97 speed is too fast since there's a ton of Base 95 speed stats down there. I don't want it to become BL though because Charizard will probably start seeing more use than the most powerful Outrage user -_______________- (not really but with Rivalry it can be stronger). 63 | Tornadus| 1.85984% | 15603 | 1.641% | 12073 | 1.576% | With it's Therian forme's banishment to Ubers, this should become OU again. 64 | Chandelure| 1.80123% | 22906 | 2.410% | 18408 | 2.403% | My dream of this ever being OU will probably never happen =/ it simply fucks over so many things with that typing though. 69 | Mew| 1.62351% | 17484 | 1.839% | 14620 | 1.908% | 70 | Darmanitan| 1.61538% | 15896 | 1.672% | 12713 | 1.659% | Is it me or did these 2 just drop in usage? Mew would be lol69. 86 | Charizard| 1.12861% | 19020 | 2.001% | 15146 | 1.977% | 87 | Scrafty| 1.12620% | 14251 | 1.499% | 11289 | 1.473% | 88 | Snorlax| 1.09556% | 17841 | 1.877% | 14474 | 1.889% | 89 | Azelf| 1.07027% | 9557 | 1.005% | 8571 | 1.119% | 90 | Sandslash| 1.01543% | 8112 | 0.853% | 5901 | 0.770% | Yea, um, whatthefuckbro? None of these pokemon should be lower than Charizard. I'm not the biggest fan of Scrafty but god damn this thing just went straight down in usage. It used to be OU for crying out loud. Azelf can be a threatening force with Nasty Plot and great speed, Sandslash has it's Sand Rush niche, and Snorlax can wreck shit whether its in Trick Room with or without Curse, or with a Choice Band. 112 | Sigilyph| 0.59913% | 7528 | 0.792% | 5839 | 0.762% | Another personal favorite of mine, but has it's usage always been around this area? I figured it would be a lot lower than 112. I would personally love to see this thing move up a tier or 2. 176 | Riolu| 0.19564% | 2774 | 0.292% | 2075 | 0.271% | Fuck all you trolls. 188 | Mandibuzz| 0.16042% | 2178 | 0.229% | 1734 | 0.226% | I'm pretty sure this moved up about 30 spots! Once Q3 starts I'm gonna spam the shit out of this bulky ass vulture to feast on the remains of noobs.
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TEAM FENNEKIN JAN BIRACHI |
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#61 | |
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 208
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#62 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 694
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You don't prepare for Cloyster, Cloyster sweeps your entire team. And even if you do prepare, an unluky damage roll from your priority user of choice and you still get swept. Don't underestimate Cloyster, ever. The only reason Cloyster dropped in usage is because Keldeo is used more now. But even Keldeo has to watch out from boosted Hydro Pumps in the rain, so it needs to be at full health to counter Cloyster. |
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#63 |
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 413
Hooters
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| 52 | Reuniclus | 4.25971% | 40334 | 4.243% | 31530 | 4.115% |
I must say WHY?? Genesect is gone, and once Scizor is out for the count, this thing is amazing! It's Trick Room set is better than it's CM set IMO because it can out speed the entire offensive part of the tier and has near perfect coverage with Psychic / Focus Blast / Shadow Ball. It's just so sad to see Reuniclus tearing apart teams with ease and not getting enough credit for it. This floating fetus needs more love. This is what everyone should be thinking:
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PM or VM me for an OU RMT Rate! Check out my YouTube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/TheGary2346 It's still in the works, but you get the point. |
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#64 |
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the reason reuniclus is down so much in usage is simply that everyone in january was running sdef wish rachi to check tornadus-t. this particular rachi set walls reuniclus all day, bar several focus blast crits. also, while it's true that once scizor is gone reuniclus can sometimes clean up easily, it's also not a very likely scenario. if i see reun in team preview and i know my only decent check to the thing is my scizor, i am not going to let sciz die until reun goes down first. that's basic threat management. finally, reuniclus often finds itself in a situation where it has a window to sweep, but it isn't powerful enough to ohko some stuff, and therefore its sweep is cut short. for example, max spa life orb quiet reun's shadow ball doesn't even ko latios after rocks, meaning it lives the hit and then fires off a specs draco meteor for the ohko on reun. not a winning strategy for the tr user.
in summation, reuniclus's day has come and gone. what once used to be an ou powerhouse can now barely function in the current metagame. sure, it has its niche uses, but they are few and far between. |
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#65 | ||
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,104
San Diego, CA
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Also, can I just say that "Don't look much different" =/= "Not at all different"? We don't know what those stats look like. For all we know, weatherless could have slightly less usage with differently weighted stats, and Scizor/Politoed could have slightly higher usage! So.... Let's not talk about stats with a different weighting when we don't know what they actually look like.
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"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand." - Milton Friedman |
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#66 | |
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King of Conquerors
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,616
Greece
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Also Lavos i really disagree with you about Reuniclus. The Trick Room set is still thretening as always, after its checks are weakened a bit, and with its great bulk and immunity to any kind of passive damage it can sweep even with a sliver of its life left. It is still a good failsafe Pokemon to use on offensive teams, as it can simply set up against too many Pokemon. It can set up on Keldeo's unboosted Hydro Pump in rain, +2 Venusaur, and Specs Tornadus's Hurricane, which shows how many setup opoortunities Reuniclus gets to clean weakened offensive and balanced teams. Not the best Pokemon in OU, but definitely not worse than Infernape, Metagross, and Donphan. 35-45 would be the best position for it. However, it is true that its former killer set, the CM set, is now almost impossible to use in this fast paced and hard hitting enviroment, where stall teams and setup opportunites are scarce.
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#67 | |
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 413
Hooters
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PM or VM me for an OU RMT Rate! Check out my YouTube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/TheGary2346 It's still in the works, but you get the point. |
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#68 | |
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Give me the number for 911!
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 539
USA
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![]() kawakimi: UR DUM kawakimi: N WEIRD Completed Analyses: 16 In Progress: 2 Last edited by Swamp-Rocket; Feb 2nd, 2013 at 4:36:34 PM. |
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#69 |
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 378
Argentina
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| 4 | Jirachi | 16.99764% | 132749 | 13.965% | 109403 | 14.280% |
Jirachi in 4th p_p, don't get me wrong, I f- love Jirachi, but the only reason why it was used so much was because of Tornadus-T, who ironically wasn't used that much, I guess people foresaw it becoming Uber and decided to not abuse it (almost every team I have seen that thing was the typical lame Latios, Rachi, Tentacruel, Thorna, Politoed staple) | 5 | Dragonite | 16.30085% | 152001 | 15.990% | 118567 | 15.476% I swear I never see this (incrediblyhandsomebestpokemonever) thing o_o | 6 | Heatran | 15.59981% | 128656 | 13.535% | 105070 | 13.714% | spD Heatran was a staple on my teams latetly, incredibly awesome thing, mine took a Surf from Starmie in rain at less than 80 % hp D: 35 | Celebi | 6.48850% | 52288 | 5.501% | 42857 | 5.594% | Hope this cute onion-headed fairy get used more from now on, NP is great 33 | Landorus | 6.93382% | 49763 | 5.235% | 38664 | 5.047% | This thing should be top 10, seriously, it wrecks soooo much shit, I got like 1700 cre in 1 day after two years without playing by just slapping Lando on one of my teams, it's so good.
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Taste the Rainbow Motherfucker! Black FC: 3611 0758 8565 |
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#70 |
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Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 27
123 Fake Street.
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1 | Scizor | 23.15972% | 191970 | 20.195% | 151871 | 19.823%
Not surprised. Can't use Sci for shit but I think this is completely deserved. | 30 | Infernape | 7.18132% | 75695 | 7.963% | 60746 | 7.929% Brb crying. 35 | Celebi | 6.48850% | 52288 | 5.501% | 42857 | 5.594% Needs moar. Love this lil onionhead. OH GNOZ BASE 170 ATK 42 | Kyurem-Black | 5.71378% | 49518 | 5.209% | 37469 | 4.891% ^^Yup, so scared. It's pretty good, It's just...so many flaws... 49 | Metagross | 4.43290% | 51659 | 5.435% | 42233 | 5.512% I love Meta, but...seriously. It's higher than Dugtrio, who is far more useful, imo. 52 | Reuniclus | 4.25971% | 40334 | 4.243% | 31530 | 4.115% This thing NEVER ceases to destroy me. It's usage is kinda good for me, but it should be higher. 60 | Weavile | 2.17637% | 23832 | 2.507% | 18614 | 2.430% Another thing that has low usage, yet pounds me at every given opportunity. People need to look into Weavile a little more, me thinks. 86 | Charizard | 1.12861% | 19020 | 2.001% | 15146 | 1.977% .....I...I don't even...how do I oxygen? 100 | Virizion | 0.81183% | 7433 | 0.782% | 5818 | 0.759% Wow. Such a fall. This saddens me. I think another "Brb crying" is in order. Anyways, enough of my opinions, any opinions on who actually deserved their usage?
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I just lost the game. :D |
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#71 | |
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King of Conquerors
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,616
Greece
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I don't like to reapeat myself but i have to:
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All those checks and counters, in addition to the lack of any special bulk, common weaknesses to Fighting and Rock type moves, which are everywhere, and SR weaknesses really prevent Cloyster from being more than a very situational Pokemon at best. I know it can work if you pair it with SubPass Gliscor (ask Ginga about it) and it can rarely work if you put it in a rain HO team with hazard support, but as i said before many Pokemon can perform admirably and even better than Cloyster with this much support. So while Cloyster is not bad per se, it is just a niche Pokemon that has unrightfully a lot of usage compared to its usefulness. Here are some Pokemon that are overall better than Cloyster in OU, but are below him in usage: Toxicroak, Lucario, Kyurem-Black, Hydreigon, Hippowdon, Victini, Xatu, and Dugtrio.
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#72 | ||
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 164
Unova
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oh god cancer is invading Smogon everybody run
Anyway: Quote:
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#73 |
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Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 156
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Surprised to see Hippo at 50, it's way too low IMO. I see Tornadus is at 63, I think it might get in 50 range by the next month.
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#74 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 694
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Still, this thing IS scary as hell and and if you look at the usage percentage and not at the ranking, it's actually being used more compared to the previous months. According to the moveset stats, 13% of Kyu-B users run Freeze Shock, which means it hasn't reached its full potential in OU yet. By the way, don't assume that Haxorus will be banned from UU when it drops there (which is practically guaranteed, every other dragon in OU outclasses it. Kyu-B was the final nail in the coffin) with all the physical walls like Registeel, Cobalion, Swampert and Bronzong running rampant. |
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#75 | |
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rip numeros
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I'm actually a little surprised Kyurem-B is so low; it's really good. Don't make fun of that Attack stat, you don't even need to invest in it for Kyurem-B to be powerful. It's really bulky too, with great defenses across the board. Don't forget its Fire neutrality, Ice neutrality, and Water resistance. The SubShuffler set in particular has been working best for me atm, as it can demolish slower teams and is overall a menace. Just slap on some hazards and you're good to go. It's almost impossible to phaze out without Roar Latias, and Dragon Tail is pretty powerful even with minimal investment. Celebi is also much too low, being one of the best rain checks in the market, not to mention the increasing Keldeo usage. It's got a massive niche in this metagame, and should have received a boost with the Tornadus-T banning. and @above on Haxorus... you do realize that Haxorus can demolish those Pokemon, right? With the exception of maybe Registeel (who is not at all good in UU) and Bronzong, CB Outrage demolishes pretty much the entire UU tier. However, I wouldn't be surprised if it dropped. Haxorus is by no means a bad Pokemon, boasting a devastating sweeping ability, but it's not what is used to be.
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C&C Work | 1k RMT | Contribute! | VM for an OU Rate! | gp member: vm/pm for a check | previously pokemon0078 / aka jew-cane
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