ARMaldo (not done)

[lousy918]

underway



[SET]
name: ARMaldo
move 1: Swords Dance / Rapid Spin
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Stone Edge
move 4: Low Kick / Rapid Spin
item: Life Orb
ability: Swift Swim
nature: Adamant / Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p> Although Armaldo may seem like an inferior Kabutops, it does have a few advantages over its spinning buddy. For example, it has a higher attack stat, plus STAB X-Scissor to nail Arceus-Grass hard. At this point, you may ask, "Why not Beartic? It gets STAB Icicle Crash, which hits Grasseus on top of dragons!" The main reason is that Armaldo gets Rapid Spin, Beartic does not. Also, Armaldo may have crap speed, but it makes up for that by having a higher attack stat than either of them, along with greater bulk on the physical side and a handy resistance to Extremespeed.
</p>

• Kyogre is such an obvious partner I don't even. (sets up rain in case you can't tell)
• Jolly allows Armaldo to outspeed and OHKO Mewtwo, Darkrai and Shaymin-S
• If using Jolly, you can use an EV spread of 252 Atk / 32 Def / 224 Spe to outspeed neutral-natured Beartic and Deoxys-A.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

• hi

[OTHER OPTIONS]

• Rock Blast > Rock Slide because screw Sash and Substitute.
• Earthquake > Low Kick because some steels are light and others are neutral to Low Kick (Scizor, Jirachi).

[CHECKS AND COUNTERS]

• Choice Scarf users outspeed no matter what. Kyogre OHKOs with Surf, Dialga OHKOs with Draco Meteor, etc.
• If using Adamant, it gets revenged easily by Mewtwo, Darkrai and Shaymin-S as well.
• Outsped

[sammao]

Suggestion:
-Jolly nature is more or less needed, outspeeding Mewtwo and Darkari is kind of a big deal, Shaymin-S also. Max Atk Jolly Armaldo is only 1 attack point lower than Adamant Beartic anyway, while being quite a bit faster.

-Slash Earthquake with Low Kick, or at least mention it in AC

[Fireburn]

I really don't see the point in Armaldo. For one, its even slower than Beartic. Armaldo barely outspeeds Arceus with Adamant (Mewtwo is the minimum benchmark any decent Swimmer should outrun), and being forced to run Jolly takes away its primary niche over Kabutops - better Attack. Not that it really matters: Armaldo has even worse defensive typing than Kabutops (SR Weak, exactly two resists in Normal and Poison, both of which Kabutops still has), can't outrun Scarfers like Kabutops can, doesn't get that juicy double STAB Waterfall, and is generally just inferior all around.

Having slightly less trouble with exactly one Pokemon doesn't make up for Kabutops's more numerous advantages, IMO.

TR EDIT: Fireburn is back :]

[lousy918]

Originally Posted by Fat Fireburn

I really don't see the point in Armaldo. For one, its even slower than Beartic. Armaldo barely outspeeds Arceus with Adamant (Mewtwo is the minimum benchmark any decent Swimmer should outrun), and being forced to run Jolly takes away its primary niche over Kabutops - better Attack. Not that it really matters: Armaldo has even worse defensive typing than Kabutops (SR Weak, exactly two resists in Normal and Poison, both of which Kabutops still has), can't outrun Scarfers like Kabutops can, doesn't get that juicy double STAB Waterfall, and is generally just inferior all around.

Having slightly less trouble with exactly one Pokemon doesn't make up for Kabutops's more numerous advantages, IMO.

imo I don't really see the point in metagross because scizor, jirachi and genesect exist.

same applies to Heracross, not bring able to do a shit to Ghost types except what Terrakion does better, and having a Rest talker or a sleep talker is all around more useful.

venusaur is hard walled by like giratina, dialga and many others

[Tobes]

Originally Posted by Fat lousy918

imo I don't really see the point in metagross because scizor, jirachi and genesect exist.

same applies to Heracross, not bring able to do a shit to Ghost types except what Terrakion does better, and having a Rest talker or a sleep talker is all around more useful.

venusaur is hard walled by like giratina, dialga and many others

None of these Pokemon are even remotely relevant to a discussion about Armaldo (seriously what point could you have been possibly trying to make?). These Pokemon all have useful niches. Armaldo does not. Plain and simple.

QC Rejected: 1/3

[sammao]

Originally Posted by Fat Fireburn

I really don't see the point in Armaldo. For one, its even slower than Beartic. Armaldo barely outspeeds Arceus with Adamant (Mewtwo is the minimum benchmark any decent Swimmer should outrun), and being forced to run Jolly takes away its primary niche over Kabutops - better Attack. Not that it really matters: Armaldo has even worse defensive typing than Kabutops (SR Weak, exactly two resists in Normal and Poison, both of which Kabutops still has), can't outrun Scarfers like Kabutops can, doesn't get that juicy double STAB Waterfall, and is generally just inferior all around.

Having slightly less trouble with exactly one Pokemon doesn't make up for Kabutops's more numerous advantages, IMO.

For the most part, Kabutops is better, but Armaldo does has STAB X-Scissor on his side, allowing it to get past Grass Arceus. Beartic has all the problems that you mentioned also (slow, SR weak, no Stab waterfall). Jolly nature is the only nature Armaldo should be using, so that it can outspeed Mewtwo, and like I said previously, Jolly Armaldo is only 1 atk point less than Beartic, while being faster.

In simple words, offensively speaking, Ice>Bug and Ice>Rock, but Bug+Rock are at least as good as Ice, IMO. Armaldo Stab hits Grass Arceus, Lugia, Lati@ super effectively like Beartic. It can't hit Giratina and Groudon, true, but it hits other key target such as Mewtwo, Reshirm, and Ho-Oh instead. Defensively, Bug+Rock at least provide a resistance to Extreme speed and is a bit better than Ice. If Beartic has an analysis, Armaldo should have one too, just that it should be using Jolly nature.

[lousy918]

Originally Posted by Fat Tobes

None of these Pokemon are even remotely relevant to a discussion about Armaldo (seriously what point could you have been possibly trying to make?). These Pokemon all have useful niches. Armaldo does not. Plain and simple.

QC Rejected: 1/3

I'm just saying that those are unviable/outclassed and still passed QC.

[trickroom]

Originally Posted by Fat lousy918

I'm just saying that those are unviable/outclassed and still passed QC.

That doesn't make any difference with the viability of the Armaldo ( It still sucks ). If those older pokemon who had analysis but are now considered unviable ( Lucario, Shedinja, Hydreigon, Heracross, some others), they will be removed later.

Here's why Armaldo is bad

-He's even slower than Beartic, ok you have Swift Swim, great but you can't even outrun Mewtwo without a Jolly nature.

-You are weak to every single hazard in the game, you have Rapid Spin, but getting past all the bulky spinblockers won't be easy, Giratina walls you flat out, and those bulkier Arceus-Ghost/Giratina-O will do the same. The horrible thing about Armaldo is you won't get many chances to setup Swords Dance, and you are piss slow. Beartic has shit typing too but it has Encore to grab some switch ins, Ice STAB to threaten Groudon. Groudon walls you completely and it can switch in on you all day. Beartic was pretty bad but it is good enough to deserve an analysis because it destroys quite a lot of defensive cores, and Encore does help a lot even with awful defenses by Ubers standards.

-Armaldo has 75/100/80 bulk, Kabutops has 60/105/70, that isn't a great difference at all, especially when Kabutops has a better typing, 4x fire resist is a good thing to have, great for coming in on Sacred Fire or even Blue Flare. At least Kabutops gets to come in on Ho-Oh as a last resort. Beartic? It has Encore to grab setup chances, you can come in on Arceus's Calm Mind, Recover or whatever and setup.

Not in a position to argue, given the overwhelming facts against Armaldo' viability


QC REJECTED 2/3

[lousy918]

Originally Posted by Fat trickroom

That doesn't make any difference with the viability of the Armaldo ( It still sucks ). If those older pokemon who had analysis but are now considered unviable ( Lucario, Shedinja, Heracross, some others), they will be removed later.

Here's why Armaldo is bad

-He's even slower than Beartic, ok you have Swift Swim, great but you can't even outrun Mewtwo without a Jolly nature.

-You are weak to every single hazard in the game, you have Rapid Spin, but getting past all the bulky spinblockers won't be easy, Giratina walls you flat out, and those bulkier Arceus-Ghost/Giratina-O will do the same. The horrible thing about Armaldo is you won't get many chances to setup Swords Dance, and you are piss slow. Beartic has shit typing too but it has Encore to grab some switch ins, Ice STAB to threaten Groudon. Groudon walls you completely and it can switch in on you all day. Beartic was pretty bad but it is good enough to deserve an analysis because it destroys quite a lot of defensive cores, and Encore does help a lot even with awful defenses by Ubers standards.

-Armaldo has 75/100/80 bulk, Kabutops has 60/105/70, that isn't a great difference at all, especially when Kabutops has a better typing, 4x fire resist is a good thing to have, great for coming in on Sacred Fire or even Blue Flare. At least Kabutops gets to come in on Ho-Oh as a last resort. Beartic? It has Encore to grab setup chances, you can come in on Arceus's Calm Mind, Recover or whatever and setup.

Not in a position to argue, given the overwhelming facts against Armaldo' viability


QC REJECTED 2/3

Hey guess what it can run a Jolly and outspeed Adamant Beartic, along with Mewtwo. Even with Jolly, its attack is still just one stat point lower.

Giratina walls me? I have a higher attack than Kabutops, and we both get Stone Edge. Sure, Beartic has Ice STAB to nail Groudon, but if Groudon runs 12 speed EVs, you just died.

You say it breaks stall cores? name some.

By switching into said moves, you just risked a 50% or 20% chance to get burnt, respectively.

[trickroom]

I said you CAN switch into those moves as a last resort lol. Also Kabutops can tank one Brave Bird easily. Also, yeah great higher Attack, but STAB Waterfall more than makes up for it. Next if you are comparing with Kabutops, you won't have higher Attack lol, because Adamant Kabutops still outruns Jolly Armaldo and is stronger.

Beartic can hit Groudon on the switch, weakening it can win you weather wars, also Stall cores? Here are some, Giratina + Blissey, Chansey + Lugia + Groudon, Resttalk Kyogre + Ferrothorn, Giratina-O + Ferrothorn/Chansey.

[Poppy]

reject 3/3
no niche
why would you ever use this

[trickroom]

Moving this.