CAP 6 - Part 1 - Concept Poll 4

[Empoleon Guru]

I voted for Decentralizer.
I would also like say that I like the speed of this project.

[Not Scicky]

Originally Posted by Fat ferron

i dont see how anything i said takes away from it being a tank.

You said poll jumping takes away from the CAP, and tennis said it doesn't... neither of you said ANYTHING
about it taking away from being a tank

[gorm]

I think more importantly than don't take the great tank to be a dragon electric is do not take the decentralizer to be a sturdy tank. I know odds are that it's defensive stats will be high to be able to switch in to an extent, but we could also make a fast revenge killer that uses only it's typing to take a hit/switch in, or an offensive threat that can just mow the top 5 down.

voted decentralizer since a strictly metagame centric project is more interesting to me than a defensive/tank bias restriction.

[jagged_angel]

Originally Posted by Fat tennisace

And how exactly does poll jumping take away from CAP? I think its better since people know what they do and don't want early on, it makes everything go smoother.

Wait, it's Better to poll jump?

So I should suggest my perfect stat spread for the Dark/Psychic Decentraliser now? I already know the best Ability - Wonder Guard! Ok I'll stop being sarcastic but don't you see how broadcasting ideas ahead of the appropriate discussion thread ruins the democracy of CAP?

Poll jumping turns threads into a mess since if people poll jump they are randomly introducing their own ideas and trying to gain favour. If people did this freely every thread would be a clusterfuck going off at various tangents every time someone suggests a popular/hated idea.

Discussing the typing of the Great Tank of China is a great illustration of how one person's suggestion (Sikh Assassin mentioning Electric/Dragon in the OP) can be picked over and repeated until even if it isn't popular, it has a profound effect on the people reading about it.

Quite alot of people have now voiced concerns about the perceived predetermined Electric/Dragon typing so it would be much better if everyone would agree to stop discussing typing altogether, until the next thread.

[gorm]

Originally Posted by Fat j_a

Poll jumping turns threads into a mess since if people poll jump they are randomly introducing their own ideas and trying to gain favour. If people did this freely every thread would be a clusterfuck going off at various tangents every time someone suggests a popular/hated idea.

this. poll jumping is kind of disespectful of the process on a whole. save typing discussion for the typing thread. you'll remember it i promise!

edit: evil_lord please forgive darkie he is a speedy rookie ^_^;

[Coronis]

Voted decentralizer, for reasons already stated by others.
Darkie, poll 3 didn't go for long enough, keep in mind the different time zones.

[DougJustDoug**]

After the Concept Poll, the explanation will be completely eliminated from the concept. In future threads, only the official name and description will be posted.

So, if any of you are banking on elements of the concept comments swaying future votes -- don't be so sure. Yes, the comments may have put thoughts into peoples' minds during these concept polls. But, CAP projects have notoriously short memories. Once the comments are eliminated, you may be surprised how quickly people forget them....

[Madd Cribbage]

I really like both ideas, but yestarday I played for the first time in awhile and I noticed how many people were using unoriginal movesets for unoriginal pokemon. Frankly, I try to play UU as much as possible, because in OU crazy tactics or experimental movesets are outclasses by the ever common ScarfTran or Blissey. Something needs to shake things up a bit and add an edge to the people who arent being PokeTools. I believe that Decentralizer can and will do just that, and thats why I voted for it.

[foibles]

voted for tank. The decentralizer is a problem in my mind because it would soon overcentralize do to its ability to beat a wide range of popular pokes.

[gorm]

if you take a look at the server stats you'd see that we're already pretty centralized on the cap server =\
in my head, this decent. pokemon isn't going to be uncounterable at all. it's going to have exploitable holes like every pokemon, and presumably boost usage of those that will be able to exploit them. but thats still speculation.

the purpose of choosing such a concept, as far as i can see it is to attempt to "flatten a bump". it's kind of difficult to predict the movement of the metagame beyond "this pokemon will check top threats and hopefully decrease their usage". 5 isn't a really a "wide range", especially if you consider blisseys ability to wall, or gyara's ability to sweep =|

[Mekkah**]

went with decentralizer, agreeing with gorm and jagged angel. but also with doug.

more people should play though!

[rippersteveM5]

Voted for Tank again, nothing to say that I haven't already mentioned in previous posts.

Looks like Decentraliser has got this one though.

[eric the espeon]

I am still pro tank due to the confusion of trying to decentralise a different metagame from the one that the Pokemon will be used in (Scizor/Tran/Zappy are not so much of an issue in CaP, Tar and Mence yea, but not as much as the CaPs), but it looks like its a bit late really..

[DoubleUnderscore]

Voted Decentraliser, as some things are just getting way too common and I'd love to throw something in there to mix things up a bit and force people to be more original with their teams.

[Wyverii]

Careful with the decentralizer concept. 84% of battles within the CAP usage had Stratagem used because of his recent release causing him to be the most used Poke making it unknown if he is actually a centralizing force or not. If we go through with this we'll have to determine if it's worth picking the actual top five.

[Estranged]

Voted great tank, but it seems like decentralizer is going to win. It doesn't matter though, both are good options.

[Frosty]

I voted for the decentralizer, but I agree with Wyverii. With the release of Stratagem, several of battles done were either done by newcomers who wanted to test the new pokes (the five of them) or regulars testing the new poke. Using those stats will be very dangerous for the project, since they are quite unstable, IMO.

I believe in the end we should either use the top 5 from the SU Server or don't be so restricted to the description of the concept and focus more on it being a decentralizer.

[Gothic Togekiss]

Have to agree with Wyverii as well, Stratagem shouldn't really count for the top five status since it was just released a few weeks ago. Most of the reason it's within the listing is because of testing. If we excluded Gem from the list and replace it with the sixth place runner-up you would have: Zapdos, T-tar, Figdit, Revvy, and Syclant. I'm fairly sure most people want to create a pokemon that can at least check 3 out of the 5 Pokemon so so let see if they have any common weakness between them.

Zapdos&Figdit: Ice weak
Zapdos&Syclant: Rock weak
T-tar&Figdit: Water and Ground weak
T-tar&Syclant: Steel and Fighting* weak
Revvy&Syclant: Flying weak

* Syclant isn't techically weak to Fighting, but it's fragile defenses doesn't allow it to survive stabbed Fighting moves for very long.

[ferron]

Originally Posted by Fat Gothic Togekiss

Have to agree with Wyverii as well, Stratagem shouldn't really count for the top five status since it was just released a few weeks ago. Most of the reason it's within the listing is because of testing. If we excluded Gem from the list and replace it with the sixth place runner-up you would have: Zapdos, T-tar, Figdit, Revvy, and Syclant. I'm fairly sure most people want to create a pokemon that can check 3 or 4 out of the 5 here so let check common weakness.

Zapdos&Figdit: Ice weak
Zapdos&Syclant: Rock weak
T-tar&Figdit: Water and Ground weak
T-tar&Syclant: Steel and Fighting* weak
Revvy&Syclant: Flying weak

* Syclant isn't techically weak to Fighting, but it's fragile defenses doesn't allow it to survive stabbed Fighting moves for very long.

if we go purely by what their weaknesses are, aren't we making a counter instead of a check? shouldn't we also be considering their most common attacks so that we have an idea for typing and ability?

edit-wait, why are we discussing this before the poll is done?

[Infiltrator]

Voted Great Tank Of China.

[Wyverii]

Originally Posted by Fat ferron

if we go purely by what their weaknesses are, aren't we making a counter instead of a check? shouldn't we also be considering their most common attacks so that we have an idea for typing and ability?

edit-wait, why are we discussing this before the poll is done?

Not necessarily, it also depends on the stats and the typing of the counter/check in question. If it's OHKOed by the Poke it's supposed to counter upon switching in then it would count as a check even if it can OHKO back.

Regardless, the discussion does have some bearing on voting for the concept in question. Lets just don't get too far ahead of ourselves.

[Gothic Togekiss]

Originally Posted by Fat ferron

if we go purely by what their weaknesses are, aren't we making a counter instead of a check? shouldn't we also be considering their most common attacks so that we have an idea for typing and ability?

We'll do that later on in the project, for now we have to decide on if we're using CAP top five or SU top five.

Originally Posted by Fat ferron

edit-wait, why are we discussing this before the poll is done?

Why no, I mean is making a comment about the common weakness between five Pokemon is considered a bad thing? Any number of outcomes could happen throughout this project so no telling what would happened next. As long as we not mention specific details about said Pokemon like abilities, stat, move, etc... then we're fine.

[ferron]

Originally Posted by Fat Wyverii

Regardless, the discussion does have some bearing on voting for the concept in question. Lets just don't get too far ahead of ourselves.

well, if you want to look at it tht way, then the easies way to hit all would be a set with ground/rock/ice/flying, but would leave it open for water, dark, psychic, ghost and normal. at least before typing is considered. there are already pokes that can have a similiar set, so something different would have to be done to make it original.

edit:

Originally Posted by Fat Gothic Togekis

Why no, I mean is making a comment about the common weakness between five Pokemon is considered a bad thing? Any number of outcomes could happen throughout this project so no telling what would happened next. As long as we not mention specific details about said Pokemon like abilities, stat, move, etc... then we're fine.

i was just worried that we were getting on the track of poll jumping

[Avocado15]

Voted for Decentralizer because simply put, nothing decentralizes some of the top Pokemon in today's metagame than something DESIGNED to check some of the top Pokemon in today's metagame.

[dmlaw]

Decentralizer.

I still like the idea of creating a Pokemon that's designed to do something specific, rather than just to be a tank.