Platinum/HG/SS Battle Frontier and DP Battle Tower Records

[spweasel]

Originally Posted by Fat CBshuckle

^If you want to use a Ninjask BP team, just BP some speed to Breloom and it can take out teams with spore subseeding.

I hate digging up old posts, but I have to question - do you mean Leech Seed or Seed Bomb when you say "subseeding"? I've been running Breloom in the Plat Singles Tower and can't say I've ever thought to myself "I really wish I had Leech Seed right now".

I've actually had moderate success with the following build:
Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Poison Heal
204 HP / 52 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly
-Seed Bomb
-Bulk Up (previously Double Team)
-Spore
-Substitute

With +1 Speed from Ninjask, you can set up against a very large portion of the field. Once you have +6 Attack/Defense, most things that otherwise cause Breloom trouble die in 1-2 hits and/or have trouble killing the Substitute in one hit. The only times I've lost after setting up have been to significant hax (or, in one case, forgetting that Subs don't block Perish Song).

I've also been toying around with using Scizor as the team's Baton Passer, in which case I lower Breloom's Speed to 101, take out the 52 Attack EVs, and move the extra EVs into his defenses. The major advantage is that it makes switching in smoother, but unfortunately you can't Pass +Speed without Scizor taking a hit (unlike Ninjask). Now if Scizor had Speed Boost instead of Swarm, that would be kinda nice completely overpowered.

I don't see why it would be illegal for me to use a Belly Drum and Aqua Jet Azumarill when it can be bred with a Ditto and Azumarill in-game.

Because there is no way of legally having Ditto know those moves. If you allow that glitch for breeding purposes, there's no reason not to allow that glitch in other contexts (which would make too many Pokemon into super-powered Smeargles). Besides, I seem to remember that there are a couple of Pokemon who are only kept in check by not having access to all of their egg moves simultaneously.

[Zacchaeus]

Technician is a good portion of why Scizor is so good, it seems you're forgetting about it completely. And if the games allow us to do it without external cheating devices, I say it should be legal, but whatever floats your boat Smogon.

[spweasel]

Originally Posted by Fat Master Ball

Technician is a good portion of why Scizor is so good, it seems you're forgetting about it completely.

I'm talking about a Baton Pass set, where you shouldn't be spending much time spamming Bullet Punch. I was merely saying that Speed Boost would be a much more attractive alternative than Swarm if you were thinking about using a build that doesn't really capitalize on Technician. With Speed Boost, Baton Pass Scizor would play like a slower Ninjask only without the horrible typing and low defenses. I suspect that would be somewhat overpowered in the Tower.

Maybe I'll run a few sets with a hacked one and see how it goes.

If the transform bug were allowed, any Pokemon that can learn Mimic would suddenly have access to any three moves of their choosing. Mimic was a Tutor move in Generation 3 that could be learned by nearly everything. Allowing that exploit would break the metagame in so many ways it isn't even funny.

[Zacchaeus]

Originally Posted by Fat spweasel

I'm talking about a Baton Pass set, where you shouldn't be spending much time spamming Bullet Punch. I was merely saying that Speed Boost would be a much more attractive alternative than Swarm if you were thinking about using a build that doesn't really capitalize on Technician. With Speed Boost, Baton Pass Scizor would play like a slower Ninjask only without the horrible typing and low defenses. I suspect that would be somewhat overpowered in the Tower.

Maybe I'll run a few sets with a hacked one and see how it goes.

If the transform bug were allowed, any Pokemon that can learn Mimic would suddenly have access to any three moves of their choosing. Mimic was a Tutor move in Generation 3 that could be learned by nearly everything. Allowing that exploit would break the metagame in so many ways it isn't even funny.

Oh alright, but Ninjask is already a really solid Baton Passer if you can use it correctly

[Drathos]

I finally got my silver symbol in the Battle Factory, after more than half a year of off and on battling in the Battle Factory I finally got myself my last symbol needed for my collection so that makes my symbol count: 4 silvers and 1 gold (Battle Tower). I'm going to go for the golds in the other facilities, I have yet to get gold in before attempting the gold symbol in the Battle Factory. Here's how the battle went down, it was actually much easier than my previous run-ins with Thornton:

Thornton's Preemptive Percentage: 59%

Turn 1:

Factory Head Thornton sends out Altaria!

Player sends out Aerodactyl!

Aerodactyl used Rock Slide!

It's super-effective!

Foe's Altaria Fainted!


Score:

Thornton: 2 Altaria--KO'ed

Player: 3 Aerodactyl--100%


Turn 2:

Factory Head Thornton sends out Magnezone!

Aerodactyl used Earthquake!

It's super-effective!

Factory Head Thornton's Magnezone Fainted!


Score:

Thornton: 1 Magnezone--KO'ed

Player: 3 Aerodactyl--100%



Turn 3:

Factory Head Thornton sends out Latios!

Aerodactyl used Rock Slide!

Latios used Thunder Wave!

Score:

Thornton: 1 Latios--Below 50%

Player: 3 Aerodactyl--100%; paralyzed


Turn 4:

Latios used Dragon Pulse!

Aerodactyl used Crunch!

It's super-effective!

Factory Head Thornton's Latios Fainted!


Final Score:

Thornton: 0 Latios--KO'ed

Player: 3 Aerodactyl--A little under 25%; paralyzed



As said before I thought the battle would be much harder although it did increase in difficulty when Thornton sent out Latios but as the battle shows I handled it fairly well although I forgot that it was part Psychic and didn't opt to Crunch it first but Aerodactyl survived the Dragon Pulse and KO'ed back like the beast it is:) Usually when I face Thornton I have come trouble taking down his first pokemon but this time I got lucky and he was using an Altaria which Aerodactyl proceeded to OHKO with Rock Slide. I'm just happy to have beaten Thornton finally, I don't know how long it will be before I get my gold symbol from the Battle Factory probably not for a while. Oh yes here are the rentals that were used by Thornton and me:


Thornton's Rental Team:

~812 | Altaria | Modest | White Herb | Draco Meteor | Air Cutter | Flamethrower | Ice Beam | SpA/Spe

~Magnezone--Unknown set as it didn't get a chance to use any moves

~905 | Latios | Calm | Focus Band | Psychic | Dragon Pulse | Thunder Wave | Calm Mind | SpA/SpD


My Rentals:

~715 | Aerodactyl | Adamant | Yache Berry | Giga Impact | Earthquake | Rock Slide | Crunch | Atk/Spe

~707 | Machamp | Adamant | Quick Claw | DynamicPunch | Earthquake | Stone Edge | Ice Punch | HP/Atk

~655 | Skuntank | Timid | Shuca Berry | Sludge Bomb | Dark Pulse | Flamethrower | Shadow Ball | SpA/Spe

[CBshuckle]

Hey, guys, I have a quick question, and although it's for gen. 3 battle tower, that board is sort of dead, so...

I'm using a latios for the singles tower, with the following moveset. Everything there is rather obvious except for one move.

Latios @ Lum Berry
Levitate
252 Sp. Att / 252 Speed / 4 Hp
Timid
-Calm Mind
-Thunderbolt
-Surf
-Psychic/Dragon Claw.

Obviously, calm mind allows me to set up, t-bolt and surf are for coverage, and the last move is for STAB. However, deciding between psychic and dragon claw is a tough decision. Psychic hits bug, electric, ghost, grass, ice, normal, poison, and fighting harder than dragon claw, while dragon claw hits dragon, dark, and psychic types harder than psychic. However, while psychic hits more things for more damage, the things that dragon claw hits harder are arguably more threatening (dragon, dark, psychic). Which should I use?

[EonADS]

^I'd say go for Dragon Claw, it'll deal more damage to Pokemon that threaten you and get excellent neutral coverage with Surf and T-Bolt. With a few CM's behind it, it won't really matter which one hits which Pokemon harder.

[alexix]

I remember when I used to beat Thorton once or twice a day before crashing out at Round 4 or 5. I always thought the second time you faced him would be at the end of the 6th round (because the first battle was at the end of the third) and when I got that far and there was no Thorton I nearly cried, lost my focus and my Suicine/Kingdra and something else got sweeped by a Hypno. Talk about off your game, holy shit.

Anyway I have an idea for Battle Tower Doubles using Follow Me. I haven't seen this idea posted before so I thought I'd post mine even though I haven't made it yet.
Pretty much you make a bulky Clefable, have it use Follow Me, this allows Garchomp to get behind a sub and start Swords Dancing. (I've never really played Doubles before so I'm not sure how long Clefable will survive. If it's a problem you can use 2 Follow Mes, but the second one would end up being a Furret or something D;)
Once Clefable dies Gengar is sent in and Garchomp starts Earthquaking. (Gengar takes care of flyers with either Thunderbolt or Focus Sash Destiny Bond.)
If you're only using one Follow Me poke the 4th Pokémon can be another failsafe all out attacker that absorbs EQ, Lati@s, legendary birds, Lake Guardians of choice.

I don't have access to a Garchomp yet so I can't build it myself (initially I was thinking of using Rock Polish Rhyperior in Garchomp's place because I'm sick of relying on Garchomp every time I want to win something at Battle Frontier and using something else would be cool, but then I started thinking well I may as well use a Ninjask and set up any sweeper I quite like and it won't matter but I hated that idea too).

This idea seems really obvious so I'm sure it's been suggested somewhere, has it worked in the past? D;

[CPU]

I am so glad the early Battle Factory has garbage AI. I lead with Roselia on the end of the 2nd Run; I KO the Omastar with Mega Drain, but out comes Torkoal. I have a Scyther and Dusclops in reserve, so things aren't looking up. I plan to stall out Torkoal, so I use Toxic, and prepare for the Heat Wave... but it uses Earth Power and does a little less than half. I'm like "OK lol" so I use Mega Drain (which does a bit of damage), only for it to start charging Solarbeam. At this point I'm in gleeful shock, as I've got Black Sludge and my HP is steadily recovering while the foe's is draining away. It does almost nothing, and at last it uses... Sunny Day while I KO it. Seriously, I stalled a Torkoal with Roselia. The last Pokemon is the idiotic physical Chansey that I could have defeated with Scyther, so I probably would have won anyway, but lol.

Anyway, my current record in HG is 32 wins. I'm up to 28 in the current run; let's see if I can get past the 5th round now lol.

[Chinese Dood]

@yayalex:

This was a team I used back in Diamond:

Originally Posted by Fat Peterko

Top 10 Diamond & Pearl ORIGINAL Battle Tower Double Records (no tradebacks):
9. Chinese Dood (132) - Togekiss, Snorlax, Bronzong, Gyarados

The idea is similar to what you proposed. My idea was to have Togekiss use Follow Me while Snorlax Belly Drums and attacks. After Togekiss faints, Snorlax can protect while Bronzong Trick Rooms and then Psychs Ups to Snorlax's Belly Drum and also continue attacking.

Togekiss will probably work better with Garchomp, allowing Garchomp to freely Earthquake. Of course you will have to be extra careful about ice attacks.

[alexix]

I was thinking about using it for Belly Drum but the speed thing was a worry (and I really want the STAB EQ which is why I was thinking Rhyperior/Rock Polish or Garchomp/SD). Also I totally forget Togekiss got Follow Me, I'll totally try it now I know it works to some degree :D

[Phiddlesticks]

@Drathos: Congrats on the win :) Out of curiosity though, were you playing on Platinum or HG/SS when you beat Thorton?

@CPU: Just don't forget that the AI stops using random attacks and becomes exactly like the AI in the other facilities starting at battle 28 :p

[Zacchaeus]

In a day of playing Pokémon, i beat Thorton 3 or 4 times, because the bulk of what I do is Battle Factory. But I rarely get through the set after Thorton, and I always lose on 28 if I get to it. Every team is an almost perfect counter to my team whenever I get to that point, and it seems there's no way around it. I've tried Trick Room, I've tried stall, I've tried heavy offense, but nothing works. What is the key to the Battle Factory after Thorton?

Edit: Looking at the post right above me, I can tell you that that isn't the case for me. It seems they just have Pokémon that I either can't hurt, or it really doesn't matter what they use, they're still going to beat me, usually both combined

[CPU]

Originally Posted by Fat Phiddlesticks

CPU: Just don't forget that the AI stops using random attacks and becomes exactly like the AI in the other facilities starting at battle 28 :p

Oh, I know. The first rounds can be challenging due to the vast power difference in the final battles. After that, though, it's usually due to some crazy awesome Pokemon that the foe has that's capable of annihlating your team.

I lost on 32 again due to a Metagross and my inability to damage it, lol

[alexix]

The Battle Factory is just so bullshit and not fun. In every other stage you get to play with your best Pokémon which is super fun and it's why people get crazy streaks in the other facilities. Battle Factory is just stage after stage of choosing between horrible Pokémon with sucky moves, I often lose my focus and spam moves like a 5 year old and that's what causes me to lose sometimes. Then I'm back to the start after wasting an hour or two (Battle Factory has to be one of the slowest games as well) and I either don't feel like playing or feel like picking the first team I find with no thought and go back to move spamming again.

At least half of my 999 hours in Platinum was trying to get gold at this piece of shit, it's insane ihateitihateitihateit I just want it to be over :(

It's like my own personal Moby Dick..

[Zacchaeus]

Originally Posted by Fat yayalex

The Battle Factory is just so bullshit and not fun. In every other stage you get to play with your best Pokémon which is super fun and it's why people get crazy streaks in the other facilities. Battle Factory is just stage after stage of choosing between horrible Pokémon with sucky moves, I often lose my focus and spam moves like a 5 year old and that's what causes me to lose sometimes. Then I'm back to the start after wasting an hour or two (Battle Factory has to be one of the slowest games as well) and I either don't feel like playing or feel like picking the first team I find with no thought and go back to move spamming again.

At least half of my 999 hours in Platinum was trying to get gold at this piece of shit, it's insane ihateitihateitihateit I just want it to be over :(

It's like my own personal Moby Dick..

I think you're mad that you can't beat it, but will soon go back to try again, as will almost everyone else. If that's not the case, you could always cheat to get gold, although you would gain no respect for it and you would be stuck with a reminder that you cheated, or just ignore it completely. Nobody is required to ride their bike into the Factory

[Wizened One]

I want to put a Tyranitar in my Battle Hall team. (I'm not ready for a trick team yet.) Would it be crazy to use Rock Slide in place of Stone Edge? I'm not to keen on the Edge's 80% accuracy...

[Relictus]

In Jump's #1616 battle, how does ice beam keep missing? Mesprit never got a flash off on it, and Drapion didn't accupressure, so I'm wondering how he is avoiding half the ice beams.

[Team Rocket Elite]

Originally Posted by Fat Relictus

In Jump's #1616 battle, how does ice beam keep missing? Mesprit never got a flash off on it, and Drapion didn't accupressure, so I'm wondering how he is avoiding half the ice beams.

Mespirit did get a Flash off before going down.

[Relictus]

Originally Posted by Fat Team Rocket Elite

Mespirit did get a Flash off before going down.

Woops, my bad: I thought he just tricked then died. < tired from playing battle tower literally 12-16 hours a day for a week and still failing to get to 100.

[Cl0wn]

Originally Posted by Fat Relictus

Woops, my bad: I thought he just tricked then died. < tired from playing battle tower literally 12-16 hours a day for a week and still failing to get to 100.

what team are you using?!

[ashez]

i havent always got acces to a pc to check out the trainer moves and pokes for battle tower, so was wonering if there was any other way for me to try and expect/prepare for whats going to happen? because all guides i found way to long to print off :(

[Peterko]

I´m not sure what you´re talking about

if you copy-paste the list into a word document and play with the page aspects, the font & size, make columns, etc. to maximalize the info put on one page, then print on both sides of a paper...

well, my tower moveset list (for battles >50, which means 700 movesets) is on 3 pieces of paper in form of a table (in excel)

I could upload my modified list if people want it and are lazy

actually this one

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpos...36&postcount=2

is from the file I was talking about (I´ve calced the lv.50 stats manually)

I admit that this one

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpos...9&postcount=19

is a bit over the top, but experienced people know instantly what type of trainer they´re facing (what he uses), and also which trainers use 21 IV pokémon so they can just do a quick calc if needed...what I mean is that the first list should be enough if you play the tower often


I know it´s been said plenty of times, but seeing people post about how they lose before 49 with trick teams and other stuff...just use what´s been tested and proven to be effective, smack ´em with a (belt/LO)starmie + (sash)garchomp + 3rd poké (skarm/ttar/laxo) team, start using your actual team in the #43-49 round the earliest maybe...the reason is you´ll need less time and even if you lose to something like sheer cold spam, restarting doesn´t take so long

seriously, you don´t want to be stuck with your nodamage trickster against something like a wobba...trick-teams are for the latest stage, anyway

[ashez]

thank you thats really helpfully, although i have one last question probly so nooby its unreal, but kinda new to all these tables etc, but how do you no which number poke your going agaisnt?

for example

406, Abomasnow 1, Calm, Lum Berry, 197, 100, 95, 144, 115, 80, Giga Drain, Ice Beam, Water Pulse, GrassWhistle, HP/Sp.Attk

is the only way i no i'm facing this poke to wait and see 2moves/do calcs?

so i no this is totaly nooby :(

cheers for all the help

[alexix]

Yeah, pretty sure you have to wait for it to hit you to figure out it's moveset, but it's better than nothing. Similarly, is there a way to figure out it's ability or are they random each time? It would help against Bronzong and similar Pokémon.