Smogon Shoddy Server Statistics - March 2009 - Page 3

**kd24** · Apr 6th, 2009, 6:41:26 PM

if forry sets up toxic spikes you switch to lucario or rayquaza and get a free sd / dd

if forry sets up spikes you go to rayquaza

if your only sweeper is groudon and forry sets up toxic spikes, just use safeguard.

i love switching wobb into forry, it usually means i get a free ko or two.

***Jibaku**** · Apr 6th, 2009, 6:54:00 PM

I'd much rather switch Lucario/Ray directly into Forry rather than wasting two turns to get Spikes in. While Ray could eat a Gyro Ball it can threaten Forry away with Overheat. Lucario threatens Forry anyways unless it has EQ, which I don't believe is used. The rare Reflect could get in the way for Lucario, but only I use Reflect on Forry so it doesn't matter much.

In many of my battles swapping Wobb into Forry usually puts me at a large advantage later in the game when they realize they start taking 37.5% every time they swap something in. For one free KO they could do their whole team is now crippled, and something could easily take advantage of that (like Kyogre). Of course this is coming from someone who plays with a defensive team so set ups don't phase me as much as it would against a frail team. I think Theorymon would back me up on this since he has experienced firsthand of what happens when you Encore Forry's Spikes.

auramaster · Apr 6th, 2009, 6:56:32 PM

Great job Doug, always look forward to new stats.

Rotom-A was used 56,118 times, which puts him 15th, behind Gengar.

Looks like the RSE trio is back, Lucario is now Uber strong:), but brought his Partner in Crime with him:(.

**Theorymon** · Apr 6th, 2009, 6:57:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Jibaku

Also speaking of Wobbs why do people send them in against Forry? I find that to be a terrible option as it gives Forry free three layers of Spikes, which will hurt the Wobb side more in the long run as opposed to a single turn of free set up.

I must agree, sending Wobbuffet into any spiker is just asking for trouble. I guess people send Wobbuffet in because they think Wobbuffet is the best switch in to support pokemon, which is not the case for spikers like Forry and Skarm.

I am also surprised that Mewtwo's usage went down, as its a great answer to Wobbuffet thanks to taunt.

I'm very surprised that many people are not using Wobbuffet with wish support, it really makes him a lot harder for most teams to handle in my experience.

ultimifier · Apr 6th, 2009, 7:00:51 PM

but the thing is most teams that have forry i.e. stallish teams, have a SUREFIRE check to SD quaza/luke. one of my stall teams has a scarf dialga that completely screws over those 2 sweepers. another one has a scarf mew that simply explodes on rayquaza or trickscarfs lucario into ES who is then walled by giratina.

creative thinking can get around a set up and then 3 layers of spikes are present, which is very helpful for a stall team

**locopoke** · Apr 6th, 2009, 7:11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Jibaku

Also speaking of Wobbs why do people send them in against Forry? I find that to be a terrible option as it gives Forry free three layers of Spikes, which will hurt the Wobb side more in the long run as opposed to a single turn of free set up.

Well, I agree, but the situation may differ depending on the teams and what Pokemon are left. If Wobbuffet lets Forretress set up 3 layers of Spikes, but then SD Rayquaza comes in and the other player has nothing to defend against it, it's gg.

Random Pizzaman · Apr 6th, 2009, 9:45:58 PM

Wait a sec:
45-Ninetales
49-Houndoom

Why is Ninetales above Houndoom? 'Doom does NP so much better

LoveDensity · Apr 6th, 2009, 10:18:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Paranoid212

What? DDMence can OHKO it. 240/216 Relaxed Swampert can be OHKO'd by DDOutrage.
Yes, it can, but what can't it ohko or seriously denting after a DD. Either way, your denting/killing a Swampert or Suicune breaking things mid-game or leaving your Swampert or Suicune to be revenge killed. In my experience, my Swampert is a reliable check while it DDs it if I have above 87%. Kill my Swampert and you are just asking to be revenge killed by other pokes. Only once did DDMence swept my current team late-game.

It isn't that uncommon.
You just stated to me with your comment that Grass is uncommon. Just not as uncommon at its low point o.o.

Most electrics go Grass>Ice and the 5th most used pokemon uses it alot.

Yea, HP Grass just for Swampert which tells us how good Swampert is. Seriously though, why would Swampert switch into Infernape unless its a Stealth Rock lead or Physical Sweeper. Stealth Rock lead rarely run Grass Knot anyways.

There are 4 commonly used Electrics: Zapdos, Magnezone, Electivire and Jolteon. I wouldn't dead switch into Zapdos until I know if doesn't have HP Grass. Zapdos doesn't warrant much of a threat anways, so other things can come into it easy. Magnezone will rarely run HP Grass, it has much better options. Jolteon is the only thing to note. About 34% of Jolteon users run Specs, it wouldn't be too hard to predict a Thunderbolt. Even if it's something other than Specs, Jolteon isn't a hard pokemon to counter. If you can't counter it, you have serious other problems or just run a Offensive team that has one reliable check. Electivire is weak, dont ask.

Calm minds are very easy to set up on things like Celebi and Zapdos that try to "counter" you.

Seriously, why would people switch in Celebi or Zapdos unless its in OHKO range or dent it enough for something favorable to face Suicune. If those are your only counters it, someone has to call Team Rebuild.

Reliable checking (not a reason backed up by facts)
You just have bad experiences using Swampert... don't you. Swampert can pretty much counter the same things Suicune can. The thing I give credit to Suicune is the extra bulk to survive some things that set up. But of course, each got their own unique set of different counters, which makes it DIFFERENT. They both do different jobs, Swampert has different good sets and Suicune has different good sets. It's just not Stealth Rock Swampert that makes it good. There are other sets, too like there are other sets that make Suicune good.

Suicune is just an example. Slowbro says Hi (slack off).
Yea, let Slowbro say Hi to Gengar and T-Tar too.

Much better defenses.
I gave you credit for that.

Donphan and Physical Electivire are used, does that mean they are better than things like Starmie and Metagross, mence, etc. at doing their jobs?

LOL, thanks for making me look at different pokemon that do different jobs. Let's respect that Suicune and Swampert do different jobs.

panamaxis · Apr 7th, 2009, 5:27:42 AM

*waits for dusknoir to drop out of OU*

joshe · Apr 7th, 2009, 11:23:03 AM

I might be a little late, but Thanks Doug.

I'm a little surprised at why Aerodactyl and Ninjask were so high on the lead usage list. Metagross owns them.

Paltheos · Apr 7th, 2009, 3:25:28 PM

That's fine, Jib. I haven't played much this month (and my laptop's broken right now, so "even if"). You may find these figures helpful in your analysis (and hopefully everyone else also finds them interesting).

Diversity Trends (Overall Usage)

There were approximately 38.8% more uber battles this month.

Rank - February - March* - Percent Change
*- scaled down to actual usage*~.7205

1).......7136..........7261.2.......+1.8%
2).......5567..........5993.1.......+7.7%
3).......5475..........5237.3.......-4.4%
4).......5450..........5181.1.......-5.0%
5).......5184..........5155.9.......-0.5%
6).......4401..........4837.4.....+10.0%
7).......3588..........3359.7.......-6.4%
8).......3313..........3018.9.......-8.9%
9).......3198..........3005.9.......-6.0%
10).....2769..........2909.4.......+5.1%
11).....2536..........2267.4......-10.6%
12).....2465..........2242.9.......-9.0%
13).....2385..........2162.2.......-9.3%
14).....2324..........2013.8......-13.3%
15).....2249..........2009.5......-10.7%
16).....1944..........1876.2.......-3.5%
17).....1907..........1668.7......-12.5%
18).....1411..........1479.2.......+4.8%
19).....1301..........1441.7......+10.8%
--- OU cut-off point --- (February/March)
20).....1129..........1064.9......-5.7%
21).....1090............977.0.....-10.4%
22)......925............945.3.......+2.2%
23)......848............917.9.......+8.2%
24)......827............906.4.......+9.6%
25)......726............858.8......+18.3%

sbc · Apr 7th, 2009, 3:38:17 PM

Electivire usage greater than Suicune usage what the hell. I don't see why Ambipom is so high in UU, especially with Mismagmius, Spiritomb, Registeel and Steelix so common.

EvilMario · Apr 7th, 2009, 4:05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat sbc

Electivire usage greater than Suicune usage what the hell. I don't see why Ambipom is so high in UU, especially with Mismagmius, Spiritomb, Registeel and Steelix so common.

Indeed, I question all the Fake Out Ambipom leads as well. The most dangerous set, at least against me, is a surprise Baton Pass Ambipom lead.. because my instinct is always to switch to my mono-attacking Spiritomb.

Cost · Apr 7th, 2009, 5:06:44 PM

Not one person ran knock off on their Sandslash and Venosaur movesets. o_o

How come?

edit: Nvm, some people ran knock off on their venusaur, but knock off should still be one of sandslash's main moves o_x

Veedrock · Apr 8th, 2009, 12:32:02 AM

It really says something about how centralized Ubers is when a Pokemon gets all but 200 of its usage from leading and still makes the top 10.

ninja1357 · Apr 8th, 2009, 6:23:58 PM

Seeing the difference in rank between standard Ludicolo and suspect Ludicolo makes me lol

Thanks Doug.

Matthew · Apr 8th, 2009, 8:28:26 PM

I think it's interesting that the RSE Trio have claimed the top three spots for the first time since November.

Peachfuzz · Apr 8th, 2009, 11:38:33 PM

Ambipom as the number one lead after Crobat's banning seems to be increasing in April. Every team I face has a god damn Ambipom lead. It completely ruins a lot of offensive teams just by switching in, Faking Out, and switching out.

The UU metagame seems to be fairly balanced between offense and defense. It is not as defensive/stall based some people are making it out to be. The biggest surprise to me was Honchkrow at 5th. I haven't seen it often, but it plays a similar role to Salamence in OU, who wrecks havoc on the opponent's defenses at the right moment and suicides (at least the ones I've seen).

It also makes me happy that four of the top 15 UU leads carry Stealth Rock (you can argue Nidoqueen, but I mostly see those setting up Toxic Spikes, which are still useless by the way). In OU it's all of them, which shows you how different the metagames are as well as the significance of Stealth Rock on pokemon usage. I don't want to see any Stealth Rock/Explosion Registeel or Steelix anytime soon please.

Just some thoughts. Thanks Doug!

Staraptor Call · Apr 9th, 2009, 12:28:02 AM

Completely inferior NFEs got 9759 uses in March, which puts them between #64 Arcanine and #63 Azumarill. And that doesn't even include other joke uses such as Luvdisc and Whiscash.

Scofield · Apr 9th, 2009, 3:03:29 AM

I keep thinking mence will take the top slot and it never does =(

Is there any reason why all of the Rotom-A aren't all combined into one? That would give a much more accurate reading of Rotom-A's frequency. I mean, it is how the tiering works for those forms, where if one is OU they are all OU.

Thorns · Apr 9th, 2009, 9:32:51 AM

ok guys please stop saying 'yeah half of those usages are mine' or I guess that's my fault' cause it's not. there are thousands of matches played and unless you're scizzy or some shit like that you did not play thousands of matches.

***RBG**** · Apr 9th, 2009, 9:37:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat scofield

I keep thinking mence will take the top slot and it never does =(

Is there any reason why all of the Rotom-A aren't all combined into one? That would give a much more accurate reading of Rotom-A's frequency. I mean, it is how the tiering works for those forms, where if one is OU they are all OU.

Because they have different sprites and that is how shoddy is programmed. Plus, with the stats this way, you can see the chance that a ROtom-a will not have its special move.

panamaxis · Apr 9th, 2009, 7:43:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Cost

Not one person ran knock off on their Sandslash and Venosaur movesets. o_o

How come?

edit: Nvm, some people ran knock off on their venusaur, but knock off should still be one of sandslash's main moves o_x

Stealth Rock is usually one of sandslashes main moves, Earthquake for STAB, Rapid Spin (which is why you would use him over other pokes in the first place) and something to hit ghosts (rotom and mismagius are immune to earthquake, usually stone edge goes here). One of sandslashes main roles is rapid spinning, and it needs at least two slots to cover that (which is probably why knock-off isn't popular).

Erazor · Apr 10th, 2009, 12:03:58 AM

Knock Off would actually help against Mismagius though, wouldn't it?

neato · Apr 10th, 2009, 12:13:58 AM

So i've been playing with this cool pokemon, and as asthetically pleasing as he is, I got to wonder why is he OU? His moveset is virtually identical to spiritomb except the elemental punches. But spiritomb can attack just as well by using his higher special stat and is a better CM user. Ghost/dark is also a better combination than just ghost. Furthermore, he can really only be used on a team with Blissey. Even then, rotom usually makes for a stronger spin blocker. I rarely see or face him. And if I do I usually kill him really quick or setup on him. He's the most suspect person of OU I think, even over some of the lesser used pokemon.

Am I missing something or am I using him wrong? Why is he so strong? Is he just useful on stall teams and so is keeping himself in OU strictly because of blissey?

Apr 6th, 2009, 6:41:26 PM	#51
kd24 Surprise Mother Fucker Moderator Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 4,769 HOME	if forry sets up toxic spikes you switch to lucario or rayquaza and get a free sd / dd if forry sets up spikes you go to rayquaza if your only sweeper is groudon and forry sets up toxic spikes, just use safeguard. i love switching wobb into forry, it usually means i get a free ko or two. __________________ My YouTube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/TheLemondrop7

Apr 6th, 2009, 6:54:00 PM	#52
*Jibaku [02:06] <DixieNormous> Rodan x pookar: Just Do It Super Moderator** Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 5,909 Foursquare, a sprained ankle, bottlecap ninjas, and wallball	I'd much rather switch Lucario/Ray directly into Forry rather than wasting two turns to get Spikes in. While Ray could eat a Gyro Ball it can threaten Forry away with Overheat. Lucario threatens Forry anyways unless it has EQ, which I don't believe is used. The rare Reflect could get in the way for Lucario, but only I use Reflect on Forry so it doesn't matter much. In many of my battles swapping Wobb into Forry usually puts me at a large advantage later in the game when they realize they start taking 37.5% every time they swap something in. For one free KO they could do their whole team is now crippled, and something could easily take advantage of that (like Kyogre). Of course this is coming from someone who plays with a defensive team so set ups don't phase me as much as it would against a frail team. I think Theorymon would back me up on this since he has experienced firsthand of what happens when you Encore Forry's Spikes. __________________

Apr 6th, 2009, 6:56:32 PM	#53
auramaster Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 764	Great job Doug, always look forward to new stats. Rotom-A was used 56,118 times, which puts him 15th, behind Gengar. Looks like the RSE trio is back, Lucario is now Uber strong:), but brought his Partner in Crime with him:(. __________________ † I trust Science, therefore I am a Christian † Proud host of three Mafia games.

Apr 7th, 2009, 5:27:42 AM	#59
panamaxis Allons-y! Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,692	waits for dusknoir to drop out of OU __________________ <am> shes p. hot not gonna lie <am> kinda reminds me of my mum fsr ------------------------------------- <am> if its for money its not gay

Apr 7th, 2009, 3:38:17 PM	#62
sbc Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,061 London	Electivire usage greater than Suicune usage what the hell. I don't see why Ambipom is so high in UU, especially with Mismagmius, Spiritomb, Registeel and Steelix so common. __________________ You Go?

Apr 6th, 2009, 7:00:51 PM	#55
ultimifier Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,095 toronto, canada	but the thing is most teams that have forry i.e. stallish teams, have a SUREFIRE check to SD quaza/luke. one of my stall teams has a scarf dialga that completely screws over those 2 sweepers. another one has a scarf mew that simply explodes on rayquaza or trickscarfs lucario into ES who is then walled by giratina. creative thinking can get around a set up and then 3 layers of spikes are present, which is very helpful for a stall team

Apr 7th, 2009, 3:25:28 PM	#61
Paltheos Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 68	That's fine, Jib. I haven't played much this month (and my laptop's broken right now, so "even if"). You may find these figures helpful in your analysis (and hopefully everyone else also finds them interesting). Diversity Trends (Overall Usage) There were approximately 38.8% more uber battles this month. Rank - February - March* - Percent Change - scaled down to actual usage~.7205 1).......7136..........7261.2.......+1.8% 2).......5567..........5993.1.......+7.7% 3).......5475..........5237.3.......-4.4% 4).......5450..........5181.1.......-5.0% 5).......5184..........5155.9.......-0.5% 6).......4401..........4837.4.....+10.0% 7).......3588..........3359.7.......-6.4% 8).......3313..........3018.9.......-8.9% 9).......3198..........3005.9.......-6.0% 10).....2769..........2909.4.......+5.1% 11).....2536..........2267.4......-10.6% 12).....2465..........2242.9.......-9.0% 13).....2385..........2162.2.......-9.3% 14).....2324..........2013.8......-13.3% 15).....2249..........2009.5......-10.7% 16).....1944..........1876.2.......-3.5% 17).....1907..........1668.7......-12.5% 18).....1411..........1479.2.......+4.8% 19).....1301..........1441.7......+10.8% --- OU cut-off point --- (February/March) 20).....1129..........1064.9......-5.7% 21).....1090............977.0.....-10.4% 22)......925............945.3.......+2.2% 23)......848............917.9.......+8.2% 24)......827............906.4.......+9.6% 25)......726............858.8......+18.3%

Apr 7th, 2009, 5:06:44 PM	#64
Cost Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 528 Pallet Town	Not one person ran knock off on their Sandslash and Venosaur movesets. o_o How come? edit: Nvm, some people ran knock off on their venusaur, but knock off should still be one of sandslash's main moves o_x __________________ <cost> wii was a waste of money <THE_IRON_KENYAN> you could say that * THE_IRON_KENYAN sunglasses <THE_IRON_KENYAN> it wasnt worth the cost Wanna make BW OU better? CLICK Last edited by Cost; Apr 7th, 2009 at 5:21:10 PM.

Apr 8th, 2009, 12:32:02 AM	#65
Veedrock Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 2,777 Location: Alaska, USA Occupation: Gamer Gamerscore: 84319	It really says something about how centralized Ubers is when a Pokemon gets all but 200 of its usage from leading and still makes the top 10. __________________ Now playing: Minecraft, Street Fighter x Tekken Last edited by Veedrock; Apr 8th, 2009 at 1:07:46 AM.

Apr 8th, 2009, 6:23:58 PM	#66
ninja1357 Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 19	Seeing the difference in rank between standard Ludicolo and suspect Ludicolo makes me lol Thanks Doug. __________________ 65c816

Apr 8th, 2009, 8:28:26 PM	#67
Matthew I love weather; Sun for days Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 3,573 Where the Sun finally sets	I think it's interesting that the RSE Trio have claimed the top three spots for the first time since November. __________________ ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻ What bitgamer tehconnection popcorn last.fm

Apr 8th, 2009, 11:38:33 PM	#68
Peachfuzz Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 303 California	Ambipom as the number one lead after Crobat's banning seems to be increasing in April. Every team I face has a god damn Ambipom lead. It completely ruins a lot of offensive teams just by switching in, Faking Out, and switching out. The UU metagame seems to be fairly balanced between offense and defense. It is not as defensive/stall based some people are making it out to be. The biggest surprise to me was Honchkrow at 5th. I haven't seen it often, but it plays a similar role to Salamence in OU, who wrecks havoc on the opponent's defenses at the right moment and suicides (at least the ones I've seen). It also makes me happy that four of the top 15 UU leads carry Stealth Rock (you can argue Nidoqueen, but I mostly see those setting up Toxic Spikes, which are still useless by the way). In OU it's all of them, which shows you how different the metagames are as well as the significance of Stealth Rock on pokemon usage. I don't want to see any Stealth Rock/Explosion Registeel or Steelix anytime soon please. Just some thoughts. Thanks Doug!

Apr 9th, 2009, 12:28:02 AM	#69
Staraptor Call Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 1,422 Avatar by Lorak	Completely inferior NFEs got 9759 uses in March, which puts them between #64 Arcanine and #63 Azumarill. And that doesn't even include other joke uses such as Luvdisc and Whiscash. __________________ ∩_∩ ¼_¼ φ_φ

Apr 9th, 2009, 3:03:29 AM	#70
Scofield Ooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhhhhh, Kate........mmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmm Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,180 By Kate's side	I keep thinking mence will take the top slot and it never does =( Is there any reason why all of the Rotom-A aren't all combined into one? That would give a much more accurate reading of Rotom-A's frequency. I mean, it is how the tiering works for those forms, where if one is OU they are all OU. __________________ Kate Beckinsale is the sun who makes me shine ~ALPHA RUINED~

Apr 9th, 2009, 9:32:51 AM	#71
Thorns Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 4,290 outrun my gun	ok guys please stop saying 'yeah half of those usages are mine' or I guess that's my fault' cause it's not. there are thousands of matches played and unless you're scizzy or some shit like that you did not play thousands of matches. __________________ [19:01:02] <pookar> can u go 30/12/20 with karthus? fuckhead [19:01:26] <@LonelyNess> I can die more than that if I put my mind to it [19:01:43] <@LonelyNess> in fact I can die more than that even if I don't put my mind to it

Apr 10th, 2009, 12:03:58 AM	#74
Erazor ✓ Just Doug It Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 1,657 Never never land	Knock Off would actually help against Mismagius though, wouldn't it? __________________ Credit to Legacy Raider for the awesome Avatar. Check out my Archived Warstory between me and Lemmiwinks MkII

Apr 10th, 2009, 12:13:58 AM	#75
neato Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 37	Why is Dusknoir OU? So i've been playing with this cool pokemon, and as asthetically pleasing as he is, I got to wonder why is he OU? His moveset is virtually identical to spiritomb except the elemental punches. But spiritomb can attack just as well by using his higher special stat and is a better CM user. Ghost/dark is also a better combination than just ghost. Furthermore, he can really only be used on a team with Blissey. Even then, rotom usually makes for a stronger spin blocker. I rarely see or face him. And if I do I usually kill him really quick or setup on him. He's the most suspect person of OU I think, even over some of the lesser used pokemon. Am I missing something or am I using him wrong? Why is he so strong? Is he just useful on stall teams and so is keeping himself in OU strictly because of blissey?