The First Smogon Council - Salamence

[The Pokemon Pimp]

I've been lurking on this thread, not posting, in fear of being trolled :P

A couple points:

We should only post relevant posts. I've been seeing a lot of people on this thread so far posting stuff that could be answered in the Ask a Simple Question thread. Additionally, I've been seeing some posts that just don't make sense...I've seen a couple people reference Electivire as an OU threat. Not trying to hate on people, but this thread should not be the first thread to post in if you haven't played the metagame in a while, or are new to competitive battling. Again, I am not trolling on anyone, but trying to help this thread for what it was made for.

Another point: I think a lot of this thread is people voicing their opinions, which is awesome. However, we can only post different opinions so much; eventually, this becomes a broken record.

As always, you may use this thread to make comments and describe your experiences.

This is what I interpreted this thread as. Of course post opinions and stuff, but also post your experience as battling in both Standard and Suspect. I am not trying to get myself trolled or whatever, but I just want to try to clean up this thread, which is a lot of people trolling each other and making arguments that have been repeated many times.

Finally, I think most users that come to Smogon to contribute are pretty intelligent people. This means that we all have some pretty intense opinions on this issue, but it also means that our opinions are not likely to change at all. My point being that you can argue with users on here constructively, but if you're trying to change someone's mind, it very rarely will happen.

[Meru]

Originally Posted by Fat deluge

A well played Salamence can aid in this process with it's natural firepower but I have seldom seen it act as a one-man army blowing through entire teams without support.

I don't play OU but if you're going to comment, you should probably read this thread.

Most people are complaining about MixMence punching holes for other sweepers to act as that one-man army that blows through entire teams, NOT his ability to sweep.

[Quataaaa]

Originally Posted by Fat Meru

I don't play OU but if you're going to comment, you should probably read this thread.

Most people are complaining about MixMence punching holes for other sweepers to act as that one-man army that blows through entire teams, NOT his ability to sweep.

True, but I believe that originally, though it feels like a long time ago, it was nominated for suspect testing for both its offensive and support characteristics. And it only needs to be too good at offense OR too good at support to be uber, and I'm sure the voters will consider both....

[SJCrew]

You guys are really underestimating DDMence. I played a bunch of battles with it today, and you'd be surprised at all the shit you could beat just spamming Outrage. It's getting to the point where I don't even hold back; if you see something in front of you that needs to die, just use it. No two DDs or any of that bullshit, just raw attacking power right in your face. There may be a lot of common Steel types in OU, but there's usually only one or two per team, a lot of them Magnezone bait, which leaves 4 other Pokemon for Salamence to just Outrage the shit out of.

I think the reason a lot of people are experiencing failure with DDMence is either because their teams are overly reliant on it, or they're way too conservative with it. I don't mind cutting loose and losing Mence at all if I have a solid enough offensive core that can take advantage of everything Salamence kills/cripples. Bulky Waters are very popular switch-ins to Salamence, especially if they detect the DD variant, and once they're dispatched, Infernape can easily take advantage of the situation and clean up.

I'd say any team that isn't stall is immediately at risk of being destroyed by DDMence, since it can beat most of its checks with prediction and DD later. Even basic stall teams like Skarm/Bliss/Rotom/Bulky Water can be severely screwed with a well-timed Fire Blast or Outrage. The stakes are always high when you're facing Salamence, and if your prediction skills are up to par, you shouldn't have any problem destroying teams with any variant.

[Veedrock]

Can somebody actually provide some logs where Salamence is sweeping with ease? I've been playing standard all day and not once did my Salamence sweep, nor did I get swept by one. You guys can theorymon (or rather exaggerate) that Salamence can do this and that and that he meets whatever criteria, but can any of you actually put it into practice? If it isn't evident by now arguing clearly isn't changing any opinions and the council decision will not be swayed by anything said here, so why not provide evidence to support your claims if you feel so strongly?

[shrang]

Originally Posted by Fat Veedrock

Can somebody actually provide some logs where Salamence is sweeping with ease? I've been playing standard all day and not once did my Salamence sweep, nor did I get swept by one. You guys can theorymon (or rather exaggerate) that Salamence can do this and that and that he meets whatever criteria, but can any of you actually put it into practice? If it isn't evident by now arguing clearly isn't changing any opinions and the council decision will not be swayed by anything said here, so why not provide evidence to support your claims if you feel so strongly?

This. A lot of posts in this thread take too much theory into account and not enough of a practical approach. I've given Mence a try and really, it isn't all that much easier to sweep with Infernape, or Gengar or whatever. I've also faced plenty of DD Mences, and probably <5% of battles would it actually kill more than one Pokemon on my team.

[Shizzle]

Thats the thing, rarely will Salamence sweep now because every single team has been developed to handle Salamence, its called over centralising the metagame. I almost never get sweeped by Salamence because I always create my teams in a manner that I can overcome most Salamence, then again the check or whatever can just get completely owned if I can't tell what set it is after its first move.

[Veedrock]

Except the argument of centralization has barely been touched on (if at all). Most every argument stems from "Salamence can do X, Y, and Z which makes him unstoppable." And most this assumes the centralization is in effect too! There's a difference between centralizing and overcentralizing and covering a threat does not indicate the latter. I'm going to take your quote out of context for a moment..

Thats the thing, rarely will POKEMON sweep now because every single team has been developed to handle POKEMON, its called over centralising the metagame

Do you build your team with Gengar in mind? Lucario? How are those not overcentralizing while Salamence is? And suddenly we're back to "well he can do this and that." 'Can' is a conditional term, 'doesn't' is more akin the reality of the scenario.

If you really want to argue centralization, make more comparisons to the suspect metagame rather than continuing to spit damage calcs and imaginary scenarios. I'm not specifically addressing you Shizzle, this goes for everybody.

[nesan]

Originally Posted by Fat Shizzle

Thats the thing, rarely will Salamence sweep now because every single team has been developed to handle Salamence, its called over centralising the metagame. I almost never get sweeped by Salamence because I always create my teams in a manner that I can overcome most Salamence, then again the check or whatever can just get completely owned if I can't tell what set it is after its first move.

But it's hard to counter a team based around Salamence! With little support Salamence causes havoc. I do agree with your point! I've been sweeped by Salamence once or twice! My teams always contain 1-2 counter !

[shrang]

Thats the thing, rarely will Salamence sweep now because every single team has been developed to handle Salamence, its called over centralising the metagame.

Centralisation is not a measure of if a Pokemon is broken or not. While Salamence has centralised the metagame to an extent, it hasn't limited team building all THAT much. Basically when I make a team, I carry one check for Salamence, and most of the time, that is enough. You basically do the same for Gyarados, Infernape, whatever. If a Pokemon is truly broken, the metagame would be on its ass trying to counter it, and it STILL rapes the metagame. This is what happened with Garchomp, but is not happening with Mence. The fact that he rarely sweeps is an indication that he does not fit the Offensive Characteristic. MixMence is slightly different, but isn't that much more dangerous than DD Mence anyway.

[Shizzle]

@veedrock
Thats the thing though, Gengar/Starmie and such can be walled by SpD walls rather well, namely Blissey, and they are always 100% predictable in terms of how they are going to attack, Gengar will always be specially offensive. Tyranitar can come into any of his moves bar Focus Blast [possibly the move Gengar is LEAST likely to use], and OHKO back rather easily, keep in mind Focus Blast has pathetic accuracy. Gengar is far easier to handle and prepare for than Salamence, as you can remove him rather well with a single check, such as Tyranitar OR Scizor, or Suicune, or anything that has decent HP / SpD.

Whereas Lucario gets walled by Gyarados, Gliscor, Rotom and the like, while retaining other functions. Salamence is unique in that it has both the Atk and SpA stat to hurt even the most dedicated walls, backed up by a better than perfect coverage, stopping him requires something different than Lucario/Gengar and other sweepers.

And we have touched on centralising before in this topic, guess it is lost under the pile of other stuff.

[FeFe]

I like Salamence in the metagame because it is counterable by many scarfed Pokemon with an ice attack or ice shard OR bulky Pokemon, which can take a hit and kill it. I think it`s just needed too keep the Metagame free of all these walls. One shouldn`t just ban a Pokemon because it`s good - one should ban it when it`s really UBER. And Salamence isn`t in my opinion.

[SJCrew]

Can somebody actually provide some logs where Salamence is sweeping with ease? I've been playing standard all day and not once did my Salamence sweep, nor did I get swept by one. You guys can theorymon (or rather exaggerate) that Salamence can do this and that and that he meets whatever criteria, but can any of you actually put it into practice? If it isn't evident by now arguing clearly isn't changing any opinions and the council decision will not be swayed by anything said here, so why not provide evidence to support your claims if you feel so strongly?

Yeah, no. I'm not going out of my way to appease you if you've contributed absolutely nothing to the discussion thusfar and can't come up with anything better than "sry he's not broken i don't see it more proof plz".

Furthermore, if you anti-Ubers supporters are going to insist on avoiding the affirmative stance to tell us why you don't think he's broken rather than dismissing all of our arguments, then at least bring some interesting perspective to the table. We've been through all of this before and it always ends with you guys pussyfooting around our arguments instead of actually making your own points.

Before you can demand more from the other side of the debate, you have to get on the same level. Give me an elaborate post clearly defining your stance on why you don't think he's broken, then maybe we can go somewhere with this discussion. If you can't even do that much, you don't have any place in this discussion.

[shrang]

Originally Posted by Fat SJCrew

Yeah, no. I'm not going out of my way to appease you if you've contributed absolutely nothing to the discussion thusfar and can't come up with anything better than "sry he's not broken i don't see it more proof plz".

Furthermore, if you anti-Ubers supporters are going to insist on avoiding the affirmative stance to tell us why you don't think he's broken rather than dismissing all of our arguments, then at least bring some interesting perspective to the table. We've been through all of this before and it always ends with you guys pussyfooting around our arguments instead of actually making your own points.

So here's a change of pace: give me an elaborate post clearly defining your stance on why you don't think he's broken then maybe I'll start giving a fuck about what you have to say.

You do realise by proving pro-Uber arguments wrong (May not have been achieved yet, but you know what I mean), then Salamence isn't Uber right?? It's fundamental in logic, if you want to prove something is equal to another (In this case, Salamence = Uber), you can either 1) Prove that a=b directly, or you can 2) Prove that a =/= anything else BUT b. This is especially true here, because if your arguments are proved wrong, then there is absolutely nothing to prove that Salamence is Uber. This is fundamental, if you don't understand this, you have no business arguing.

Veedrock is also making a very valid point. To prove something = another, you need evidence, and logs are probably the best form of evidence going around.

[SJCrew]

Just to clear up any confusion, I edited my post prior to Shrang's quote to make it seem less hostile, since I'm not angry at anyone, nor do I want this to start getting personal.

It's fundamental in logic, if you want to prove something is equal to another (In this case, Salamence = Uber), you can either 1) Prove that a=b directly, or you can 2) Prove that a =/= anything else BUT b. This is especially true here, because if your arguments are proved wrong, then there is absolutely nothing to prove that Salamence is Uber. This is fundamental, if you don't understand this, you have no business arguing.

k shrang, but you're missing a vital point here: "I don't see why this Pokemon is Uber" is not a valid argument, has been refuted a countless number of times with sound logic, and does nothing to address the points presented thus far by the pro-Ubers side. It seems that for every argument we give, it gets completely ignored by the next guy that jumps into this thread, reads absolutely nothing posted in the last few pages, and poses exactly the same question: "i dun get it gaiz how is mence uber?????"

It's been done to death and the arguments are still there, waiting to be addressed properly. If you want this discussion to go anywhere, raise the standard yourself and start telling us why you don't think Salamence is Uber. There has been a lot more supporting examples and relevant arguments for the pro-Ubers side, so I think it's fair to shove the ball in your court for once rather than respond to the same, tired arguments you guys seem to pull every single page.

[3v3rnoob]

Like Crew said, we can argue this to death, but the bottom line is that the suspect ladder, where Mence has been banned, has been more positively received than negative. So why let people whining that their teams need salamence stop it from becoming uber?

We shouldn't.

[remlabmez]

Originally Posted by Fat Veedrock

Can somebody actually provide some logs where Salamence is sweeping with ease? I've been playing standard all day and not once did my Salamence sweep, nor did I get swept by one. You guys can theorymon (or rather exaggerate) that Salamence can do this and that and that he meets whatever criteria, but can any of you actually put it into practice? If it isn't evident by now arguing clearly isn't changing any opinions and the council decision will not be swayed by anything said here, so why not provide evidence to support your claims if you feel so strongly?

i love you for posting this (no homo)

I would love logs as well, PROOFZ PLEAZE, as I already stated i played many games using stall and mence was lol, i had a hard time with other stuff that i wont mention because i dont want people using it ^_^

also I could have provided many logs of latias sweeping full teams and blowing holes through walls fyi

[Jaxx]

As remlabmez and veedrock has said I think this discussion will get no further if everyone is going off "facts" that aren't backed up. I would also like to see some logs because I have never been swept by Mence and my Mence has never swept anyone.

[Yoz]

Everyone is missing the point. We aren't going to ban Mence for x or y. There are broad guidelines which define an Uber.

Offensive Characteristic
A Pokémon is uber if, in common battle conditions, it is capable of sweeping through a significant portion of teams in the metagame with little effort.

Defensive Characteristic
A Pokémon is uber if, in common battle conditions, it is able to wall and stall out a significant portion of the metagame.

Support Characteristic
A Pokémon is uber if, in common battle conditions, it can consistently set up a situation in which it makes it substantially easier for other pokemon to sweep.

The ones raised are the Offensive Characteristic and the Support Characteristic.

Offensive:
In my opinion, common battle conditions are SR and perhaps SS. This, included with LO recoil which should be noted due to it's frequency being paired with Mence, would hamper his ability. Without all these conditions, I am sure he would fit the Offensive Characteristic quite easily. However if it can only 2HKO a specific poke, that would cause it to most likely to take too much damage and cripple it, unable to switch out. Also due to all this residual damage, it makes it extremely vulnurable to priority, most commonly Bullet Punch. I know it has Intimidate, but once that poke Mence switched in on is gone, it is practically null and void till he switches out again, which reduces his effectiveness.

Support:
Mence IMO fits this characteristic well, being able to remove the counters of say Ape or Gengar or Lucario, enabling them to sweep easily. Most commonly, bulky waters are sent out. They can handle Mence to an extent, however, this is not enough. Also, Mence, when it first comes in, could possibly destroy the enemy sweeper through the enemies fear of switching out and being 2HKO'ed or even 1HKO'ed. Even if Mence does not kill the said counter/check(s), it will definetely cripple it to the point the next pokemon can come in and finish it through either priority or outspeeding the poke. It is also unhampered by SS/SR/LO damage IMO as it does not have any need to get rid of several pokes, but usually only 1 or 2.

This clearly shows that Mence is Uber IMO, as it fills in the Support Characteristic quite well.

If you have any arguments against Pro-Uber, please refer to these two Characteristics. Also, if you are Pro-Uber, it would be good sense if you explained how it filled in any of these 3 characteristics.

Any other arguments like over-centralisisation are only bonus points and shouldn't directly dictate whether a poke is uber or not.

[Veedrock]

Made a long post, figured I'd be clearer with a shorter response. That and I want to address everyone rather than responding to particular persons.

I came here and posted my experience, I'm genuinely sorry if that's not the purpose of the test and this thread. Am I truly required to post long pointless viewpoints that have little to no backing? I asked if somebody could provide genuine incidents of the opposite happening since I'm clearly missing something it occurs as often as promoted. I don't think that's demanding too much; you don't even have to go out of your way, just play the standard ladder and rack up the logs if its as easy as continuously emphasized. The reason I'm questioning the Pro-Uber side is because their reasonings are made on paper, while the Pro-OU arguments are made in practice. This is why Pro-Uber players are more vigorous in their presentations here than the Pro-OU crowd; they don't have to be. Go play the standard ladder and you experience their arguments rather than reading them. They're not pussyfooting your arguments, they're simply providing a reality check.

I never stated whether I was pro-OU or pro-Uber. The fact of the matter is that I haven't decided. I'll keep as neutral a stance as I can until the end of the test when it matters, because the decision won't lie especially on Salamence's capabilities, but rather on his presence. This is why about posting your experiences and making metagame comparisons are so important; that is the true real purpose of this thread. Having an opinion on Salamence himself, much less a preconceived one dating back before the test, is foolish and completely counterintuitive to the process.

[Yoz]

I would also like to back Vee's point by asking people who are going to respond to my views using evidence (because what I wrote is obviously hypothetical). This would be for both Pro-Uber and Pro-OU. As you can easily show whether a poke it easy to take down or has a huge impact on the course of the game.

[capefeather]

Seconding Veedrock here. However, I think that SJCrew made a post earlier trying to diagnose what might be wrong with people's playing, which I think should compel us to use Salamence more in OU and see what happens.

[PK Gaming]

Originally Posted by Fat SJCrew

You guys are really underestimating DDMence. I played a bunch of battles with it today, and you'd be surprised at all the shit you could beat just spamming Outrage. It's getting to the point where I don't even hold back; if you see something in front of you that needs to die, just use it. No two DDs or any of that bullshit, just raw attacking power right in your face. There may be a lot of common Steel types in OU, but there's usually only one or two per team, a lot of them Magnezone bait, which leaves 4 other Pokemon for Salamence to just Outrage the shit out of.

He's right:

Standard DDmence outrage vs Swampert: 49.3% - 58.2% (Basically 2HKO)
Standard DDmence outrage vs Suicune: 41.8% - 49.3%(2HKO with entry hazards)
Standard DDmence outrage vs Cresselia: 55.4% - 65.1% (Guaranteed 2HKO)

Whereas Dragon Dancing would let you be forced by these threats, simply outraging lets you *beat* your counters.

[Shizzle]

@PK Gaming, a post I made a while back with more calcs

Also there is no proper SpD Wall set for Milotic zZz
Bold Milotic 248 HP / 252 Def
Naive 240 SpA Draco Meteor vs Bold Milotic 248 HP / 0 SpD

Naive 16 Atk Outrage vs Bold Milotic 248 HP / 252 Def

=High chance for 2HKO, and thats not including leftovers because I ceebs working it out, but SR evens that out

Suicune 252 HP / 252 Def
Naive 240 SpA Draco Meteor vs Bold Suicune 252 HP / 0 SpD

Naive 16 Atk Outrage vs Bold Suicune 252 HP / 252 Def

Which is something like a 50/50 chance to 2HKO when you factor in Stealth Rock and one turn of Leftovers. It can't switch in on either of its STAB moves, Draco Meteor being the most likely one to be spammed first.

Choice Scarf Jirachi is defnitely NOT a counter, it can revenge kill, then again almost anything can revenge kill anything, so >.>, not to mention it takes SE from 2 of its 4 attacks.

Bronzong can work as a counter, however it still takes a LOT of damage from Fire Blast.
Naive 240 SpA Fire Blast vs Sassy Bronzong 252 HP / 92 SpD

[butterfingers158]

Here's a log I have. Match is from when I was around 1450 on the ladder, and my Salamence set is:

Salamence@Life Orb
Naive
4 Atk/252 SpA/252 Spe

Dragon Dance
Draco Meteor
Outrage
Earthquake

...

---

Rules: Ladder Match, Sleep Clause, Freeze Clause, OHKO Clause, Evasion Clause, Species Clause, Strict Damage Clause, Soul Dew Clause
gary oak 2009 sent out Orton (lvl 100 Infernape ?).
butterfingers158 sent out Jirachi (lvl 100 Jirachi).
Jirachi used U-turn.
It's not very effective...
Orton lost 7% of its health.
butterfingers158 switched in Starmie (lvl 100 Starmie).
Orton used Fire Blast.
It's not very effective...
Starmie lost 32% of its health.
Starmie was burned!
Starmie was hurt by its burn!
Starmie lost 12% of its health.
---
gary oak 2009 switched in Afroborike (lvl 100 Tyranitar ?).
Afroborike's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!
A sandstorm brewed!
Starmie used Surf.
It's super effective!
Afroborike lost 50% of its health.
The sandstorm rages.
Starmie is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Starmie lost 6% of its health.
Starmie was hurt by its burn!
Starmie lost 12% of its health.
---
Afroborike used Crunch.
It's super effective!
Starmie lost 38% of its health.
butterfingers158's Starmie fainted.
The sandstorm rages.
---
butterfingers158 switched in Jirachi (lvl 100 Jirachi).
gary oak 2009 switched in Poreotix (lvl 100 Zapdos).
Poreotix is exerting its pressure!
Jirachi used Trick.
Jirachi obtained Leftovers!
Poreotix obtained Choice Scarf!
The sandstorm rages.
Poreotix is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Poreotix lost 6% of its health.
---
Poreotix used Discharge.
Jirachi lost 43% of its health.
Jirachi used Stealth Rock.
Pointed stones float in the air around the foe's team!
The sandstorm rages.
Poreotix is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Poreotix lost 6% of its health.
Jirachi's leftovers restored its health a little!
Jirachi restored 6% of its health.
---
Poreotix used Discharge.
Jirachi lost 41% of its health.
Jirachi used U-turn.
It's not very effective...
A critical hit!
Poreotix lost 21% of its health.
butterfingers158 switched in Swampert (lvl 100 Swampert ?).
The sandstorm rages.
Poreotix is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Poreotix lost 6% of its health.
---
gary oak 2009 switched in Orton (lvl 100 Infernape ?).
Pointed stones dug into Orton.
Orton lost 12% of its health.
Swampert used Roar.
gary oak 2009 switched in Poreotix (lvl 100 Zapdos).
Poreotix is exerting its pressure!
Pointed stones dug into Poreotix.
Poreotix lost 25% of its health.
The sandstorm rages.
Poreotix is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Poreotix lost 6% of its health.
---
Swampert used Protect.
Swampert protected itself!
Poreotix used Hidden Power.
Swampert protected itself!
The sandstorm rages.
Poreotix is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Poreotix lost 6% of its health.
---
butterfingers158 switched in Salamence (lvl 100 Salamence ?).
Salamence's Intimidate cut Poreotix's attack!
Poreotix used Hidden Power.
It's not very effective...
Salamence lost 9% of its health.
The sandstorm rages.
Poreotix is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Poreotix lost 6% of its health.
Salamence is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Salamence lost 6% of its health.
---
gary oak 2009 switched in PEW PEW (lvl 100 Starmie).
Pointed stones dug into PEW PEW.
PEW PEW lost 12% of its health.
Salamence used Dragon Dance.
Salamence's attack was raised.
Salamence's speed was raised.
The sandstorm rages.
Salamence is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Salamence lost 6% of its health.
PEW PEW is buffetted by the sandstorm!
PEW PEW lost 6% of its health.
---
Salamence used Earthquake.
PEW PEW lost 82% of its health.
gary oak 2009's PEW PEW fainted.
Salamence lost 10% of its health.
The sandstorm rages.
Salamence is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Salamence lost 6% of its health.
---
gary oak 2009 switched in Shiny Face (lvl 100 Salamence ?).
Shiny Face's Intimidate cut Salamence's attack!
Pointed stones dug into Shiny Face.
Shiny Face lost 25% of its health.
gary oak 2009 switched in Poreotix (lvl 100 Zapdos).
Poreotix is exerting its pressure!
Pointed stones dug into Poreotix.
Poreotix lost 17% of its health.
gary oak 2009's Poreotix fainted.
Salamence used Draco Meteor.
But there was no target!
The sandstorm rages.
Salamence is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Salamence lost 6% of its health.
---
gary oak 2009 switched in Batista (lvl 100 Machamp ?).
Pointed stones dug into Batista.
Batista lost 6% of its health.
Salamence used Draco Meteor.
Batista lost 94% of its health.
gary oak 2009's Batista fainted.
Salamence's special attack was harshly lowered.
Salamence lost 10% of its health.
The sandstorm rages.
Salamence is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Salamence lost 6% of its health.
---
gary oak 2009 switched in Afroborike (lvl 100 Tyranitar ?).
Afroborike's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!
Pointed stones dug into Afroborike.
Afroborike lost 12% of its health.
Salamence used Earthquake.
It's super effective!
Afroborike lost 38% of its health.
gary oak 2009's Afroborike fainted.
Salamence lost 10% of its health.
The sandstorm rages.
Salamence is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Salamence lost 6% of its health.
---
gary oak 2009 switched in Shiny Face (lvl 100 Salamence ?).
Shiny Face's Intimidate cut Salamence's attack!
Pointed stones dug into Shiny Face.
Shiny Face lost 25% of its health.
Salamence used Outrage.
Salamence went on a rampage!
It's super effective!
Shiny Face lost 50% of its health.
gary oak 2009's Shiny Face fainted.
Salamence lost 10% of its health.
The sandstorm rages.
Salamence is buffetted by the sandstorm!
Salamence lost 6% of its health.
---
gary oak 2009 switched in Orton (lvl 100 Infernape ?).
Pointed stones dug into Orton.
Orton lost 12% of its health.
Salamence used Outrage.
Orton lost 68% of its health.
gary oak 2009's Orton fainted.
butterfingers158 wins!
gary oak 2009 has left the room.
butterfingers158: gg