Smogon Advance Tiers - Page 2

***Mekkah***** · Feb 22nd, 2006, 3:12:47 PM

Dodrio is too fragile and attracts Metagross/Tyranitar/Gengar/Dusclops/Skarmory which are all quite common. It's above BL though.

0rz · Feb 22nd, 2006, 5:38:40 PM

There should probably be a seperate category for BL UUs (Cloyster, Machamp, Slowbro, etc.) and BL OUs (Tauros, Medicham, etc.) Then again, since y'all don't allow BLs in UU, I guess it doesn't matter too much. It's just kind of a broad thing.

also hariyama sux but thats just me :< I know it sucks in uu even as a normal poke and not as a bl.

zfs · Feb 22nd, 2006, 6:29:09 PM

Putting Kadabra in the BL list seems stupid to me. It's always banned in NFE tournies for good reason, but in UU? Sure, it *can* be unstoppable, but so can a lot of UU pokes, not to mention other unlisted NFEs. How many teams easily stop Pikahcu, Clamperl, Vigoroth, Pupitar, Metang, shit even Cubone and Meditite can dominate in UU if given a chance. Kadabra CAN be stopped in UU, hes got enough counters where banning him seems excessive.

Kikuichimonji · Feb 22nd, 2006, 6:30:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Fool_Hi

i think it also has the strongest normal attack in the entire game as well, excluding explosion and selfdestruct.

Slaking CB DE says otherwise.

AJC · Feb 22nd, 2006, 6:35:00 PM

snorlaxs CB Selfdestruct still does more

Chronicles · Feb 22nd, 2006, 7:26:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Fool_Hi

i think it also has the strongest normal attack in the entire game as well, excluding explosion and selfdestruct.

OmastarLover · Feb 22nd, 2006, 8:59:30 PM

IMO:

Steelix should be in the BL (currently Standard)
Dodrio in Standard (currently BL)
Hitmontop in NU (currently UU)
Tentacruel in BL (currently UU)

MagusII · Feb 22nd, 2006, 10:05:55 PM

Relicanth and some important unevolved pokes (Pikachu, Clampearl, Vigoroth) are missing from the list.
Anyone found any other pokes missing?

noobster · Feb 22nd, 2006, 10:20:04 PM

kadabra removed, relicanth added.

lol dodrio is not that common, it's staying in borderline.
steelix is staying overused, it's a lot more common than you think. personally, i've never had tentacruel sweep me ever in uu, and not many people use it do to the commonness of earthquake. hitmontop stays in uu.

clamperl, pikachu, and vigoroth would be unnecessary additions ;/

david stone · Feb 22nd, 2006, 10:40:58 PM

But why not add them? They are, in my opinion, "distinct Pokemon" (as I like to call them), different enough from their evolved counterparts to merit placement, if that placement is above NU. Then simply say that all unevolved Pokemon not listed (and say which ones were listed) are allowed in all metagames. Problem solved.

Pikachu, for example, is too powerful for NU (I think, I'm not much of an NU expert), but if it's not listed, people might think it's allowed. Or people might think that Vigoroth is not allowed anywhere, as it's not on any of the tiers.

Basics · Feb 22nd, 2006, 10:52:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat zfs

Cubone

IIRC Cubone doesn't get Thick Clube boost.

My opinion on pre-evos is simply that they all be considered UU. Kadabra may be slightly better than the average UU, but he doesn't hold a fucking candle to beasts like Tauros or Dodrio. =/ Chansey i just, yeah, a mini-Blissey. I still don't think it would be like ridiculous in UU, though. I dunno, I might make my own version of this some time, but yeah. This is very good for what it is, and I commend you.

Dan Dan · Feb 23rd, 2006, 2:28:43 AM

Cubone does get Thick Club boost, which is why it's banned in NVE/UE matches.

Wasn't Deoxys-E downgraded from Uber a while back?

Hipmonlee · Feb 23rd, 2006, 2:37:18 AM

Not Very Effective Matches..

..Surprisingly accurate typo.

Have a nice day.

Chronicles · Feb 23rd, 2006, 5:40:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Dan Dan

Wasn't Deoxys-E downgraded from Uber a while back?

yeah but then it got moved back, for good reason too

Hill · Feb 23rd, 2006, 8:46:15 AM

IMO Dragonite should be BL, since BLs aren't allowed in UU here and Salamence exists in OU.

giga · Feb 23rd, 2006, 8:46:23 AM

Kadabra loses to a common uu staple, quick attack :(

AJC · Feb 23rd, 2006, 4:39:35 PM

Deoxys e suffers mew's trouble..its too good for any thing outside of ubers yet it can't really do alot in ubers

Basics · Feb 23rd, 2006, 4:54:21 PM

Mew can do well in ubers, but it's just not as huge a threat as other Pokemon out there.

MagusII · Feb 24th, 2006, 1:29:02 PM

Quote:

clamperl, pikachu, and vigoroth would be unnecessary additions

They all have different roles than their evolved forms, and there are good reasons to use them over their evolved forms. Clamperl has DeepSeaTooth and DeepSeaScale, Pikachu has Light Ball, and Vigoroth does not have Slakoth and Slaking's Traunt trait.
If these pokes are not going to be included, then why is Trapinch ranked? Being in the NU Tier says that it is not particularly good, yet its Sand Stream trait gives it a possible reason to use it over Flygon.

OmastarLover · Feb 24th, 2006, 1:37:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Noobster

kadabra removed, relicanth added.

lol dodrio is not that common, it's staying in borderline.
steelix is staying overused, it's a lot more common than you think. personally, i've never had tentacruel sweep me ever in uu, and not many people use it do to the commonness of earthquake. hitmontop stays in uu.

clamperl, pikachu, and vigoroth would be unnecessary additions ;/

I guess u are right about Tentacruel.
But Steelix and Dodrio should at least be in the same place... Dodrio is more used than Steelix or at least more scary... if it isnt more used, its as used as Steelix... :/

But Hitmontop?? LOL... Hitmonlee overpower both Hitmonchan and Hitmontop i guess, but both Hitmonlee and Hitmonchan are much better than Hitmontop, he cant do anything, he doesnt even get Focus Punch, and if its because of intimidate, a LOT of crap pokes have it.

By the sake of god, Hitmontop is more NU than Ledian LOL :O

~~Hazerider~~ · Feb 24th, 2006, 1:45:00 PM

You don't know what you're talking about.

spies · Feb 24th, 2006, 1:51:17 PM

Hitmontop is great.

**gene** · Feb 24th, 2006, 1:52:34 PM

Hitmontop is more sturdy than lee and chan and can safely more or less bulk up.

Feb 22nd, 2006, 3:12:47 PM	#26
*Mekkah* pfbwowbfobwobwobfwowbf Administrator** Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,836 Most of them are good	Dodrio is too fragile and attracts Metagross/Tyranitar/Gengar/Dusclops/Skarmory which are all quite common. It's above BL though. __________________ onions videos cameras models steroids dinoturtlethings

Feb 22nd, 2006, 5:38:40 PM	#27
0rz Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 718	There should probably be a seperate category for BL UUs (Cloyster, Machamp, Slowbro, etc.) and BL OUs (Tauros, Medicham, etc.) Then again, since y'all don't allow BLs in UU, I guess it doesn't matter too much. It's just kind of a broad thing. also hariyama sux but thats just me :< I know it sucks in uu even as a normal poke and not as a bl. __________________ pawns like 0rz

Feb 22nd, 2006, 6:29:09 PM	#28
zfs The world will still be here when I open my eyes Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,160 Waking up from a dream Mentor	Putting Kadabra in the BL list seems stupid to me. It's always banned in NFE tournies for good reason, but in UU? Sure, it can be unstoppable, but so can a lot of UU pokes, not to mention other unlisted NFEs. How many teams easily stop Pikahcu, Clamperl, Vigoroth, Pupitar, Metang, shit even Cubone and Meditite can dominate in UU if given a chance. Kadabra CAN be stopped in UU, hes got enough counters where banning him seems excessive. __________________ ~ *I...AM...in a world of shit!*

Feb 22nd, 2006, 6:35:00 PM	#30
AJC Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 2,183	snorlaxs CB Selfdestruct still does more __________________ <Misty> NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH CHOICE BAND JIRACHI INQUISITION. <Surgo> when a man whips out a pink DS and pokemon, you know he's not afraid of anything. <capefeather> explosion got ruined by the bad economy

Feb 22nd, 2006, 8:59:30 PM	#32
OmastarLover Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 159	IMO: Steelix should be in the BL (currently Standard) Dodrio in Standard (currently BL) Hitmontop in NU (currently UU) Tentacruel in BL (currently UU) __________________ http://www.ginomegelati.de/animierte/camerupt.gif http://www.woodus.com/den/graphics/bars/dd_bar4.png http://www.woodus.com/den/graphics/bars/firefox_bar.png __________________ MSN: lahfabri@hotmail.com e-Mail: lahagef@yahoo.com.br __________________

Feb 22nd, 2006, 10:05:55 PM	#33
MagusII Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 16	Relicanth and some important unevolved pokes (Pikachu, Clampearl, Vigoroth) are missing from the list. Anyone found any other pokes missing?

Feb 22nd, 2006, 10:20:04 PM	#34
noobster space cowboy Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,591 san diego	kadabra removed, relicanth added. lol dodrio is not that common, it's staying in borderline. steelix is staying overused, it's a lot more common than you think. personally, i've never had tentacruel sweep me ever in uu, and not many people use it do to the commonness of earthquake. hitmontop stays in uu. clamperl, pikachu, and vigoroth would be unnecessary additions ;/ __________________

Feb 22nd, 2006, 10:40:58 PM	#35
david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming. Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 5,152	But why not add them? They are, in my opinion, "distinct Pokemon" (as I like to call them), different enough from their evolved counterparts to merit placement, if that placement is above NU. Then simply say that all unevolved Pokemon not listed (and say which ones were listed) are allowed in all metagames. Problem solved. Pikachu, for example, is too powerful for NU (I think, I'm not much of an NU expert), but if it's not listed, people might think it's allowed. Or people might think that Vigoroth is not allowed anywhere, as it's not on any of the tiers. __________________ Previously obi. Technical Machine, a Pokemon AI. "Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat." - Sun Tzu

Feb 23rd, 2006, 2:28:43 AM	#37
Dan Dan Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 4,740 Ingerland	Cubone does get Thick Club boost, which is why it's banned in NVE/UE matches. Wasn't Deoxys-E downgraded from Uber a while back? __________________ [13:17:16] <BenVdd> i mean , if she wasn't my sister and i still lived in the same house as her i'd do her in her sleep

Feb 23rd, 2006, 2:37:18 AM	#38
Hipmonlee Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 7,299	Not Very Effective Matches.. ..Surprisingly accurate typo. Have a nice day. __________________

Feb 23rd, 2006, 8:46:15 AM	#40
Hill Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 167 Rain Forest	IMO Dragonite should be BL, since BLs aren't allowed in UU here and Salamence exists in OU.

Feb 23rd, 2006, 8:46:23 AM	#41
giga Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 3,350 new yawk	Kadabra loses to a common uu staple, quick attack :( __________________

Feb 23rd, 2006, 4:39:35 PM	#42
AJC Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 2,183	Deoxys e suffers mew's trouble..its too good for any thing outside of ubers yet it can't really do alot in ubers __________________ <Misty> NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH CHOICE BAND JIRACHI INQUISITION. <Surgo> when a man whips out a pink DS and pokemon, you know he's not afraid of anything. <capefeather> explosion got ruined by the bad economy

Feb 23rd, 2006, 4:54:21 PM	#43
Basics Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,716 Toronto, Ontario, Canada	Mew can do well in ubers, but it's just not as huge a threat as other Pokemon out there. __________________ I gots an overactive funk gland.

Feb 24th, 2006, 1:45:00 PM	#46
~~Hazerider~~ Banned deucer. Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,286 38º47'N 9º22'W	You don't know what you're talking about.

Feb 24th, 2006, 1:51:17 PM	#47
spies Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 1,392 Lima, Perú	Hitmontop is great. __________________ ロマンチスト - ROMANTIST

Feb 24th, 2006, 1:52:34 PM	#48
gene GENE Moderator Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2,715 Buffalo, NY	Hitmontop is more sturdy than lee and chan and can safely more or less bulk up. __________________ death to evan