Philipe the Gyarados

[Fisherman JP]

The Fishermen in were always the coolest in the game, giving you rods and such. SOOO who's the pokemon you always hope to get from a super rod?
Gyarados of course, so here it is a team based off Bulky DD Gyaraaa

Team Process:


Bulky Gyarados is the focus of this team, of course sometimes its hard to choose between taunting or attacking for a 2hko



Obviously Gyarados attracts alot of electric attacks and Jolteon attracts alot of ground types so this duo was obvious at the time, so I put in a SubPass Jolteon.



Alot of the pokemon bullying Heatran are also the pokes Gyarados can switch in on, and I needed a guy to set up stealth rocks, so it was a good choice.



As I switch Jolteon in from a Choice Electric attack, Blissey or Snorlax come in to ruin the thunder dog's fun so, Breloom gets the SubPass and Spore+Sub+Focus Punch/Seed Bomb. Eventually Breloom turned into a Leech Seed variant to take care of some switch ins to the Spore Puncher.



I was reading the Lead Synergy article on the Smog and saw that ScarfLead Sleep Powder Roserade,saw its potential against popular leads, so I used it to stop those early Stealth Rocks.



I didn't really know what else to do with the team, so I added the Spiker Skarmory as a Physical Phazer and more entry hazard.



Holy Crap. Slowly the team turned into this. Sleep powder was sometimes unreliable and lost me momentum so I replaced her with Trick Froslass Lead to setup Spikes, replacing both Roserade and Skarmory. Sometimes, Jolteon couldnt always be the go to guy from gyarados, but Snorlax was, more of the time. Then I realized I had trouble with the Rain, and since Froslass replaced both Skarmory and Roserade, there was a slot left for a Tyranitar who's designed to kill breloom switchins. And, at last, a TrickScarf Metagross with SR replaced Heatran as I got swept by a Close Combat Thunder Punch Overheat Infernape. Maybe the initial team was better, but this team hasnt had much trouble. Sorry I stacked these guys together.


Metagross replaced with Jirachi, thanks to Aqueos. The switch kept Metagross's typing, role of getting SR up, and is a much more reliable revenge killer for the hole in my team.
In Depth:


Froslass @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Snow Cloak
EVs: 252 Spe/152 HP/100 SpA/4 Def
Timid
- Trick
- Spikes
- Destiny Bond
- Ice Beam
Has never disappointed me. If I don't get the scarf off, its a late-game Destiny Bond. Unlike explosion, it goes through substitutes, which I like -looks at Gengar-. Trick things: gaining sash, removing light clay, removing damp rock. Then Spikes on the switch or switch to Jirachi if they taunt her. The EVs are to add bulk while keeping its OHKO on 4x resists (other than Support or Cleric Dancer Dragonites)
Against some leads:
- Azelf: This guy makes me happy to see. I trick as it SRs, I get Spikes as it Switches. If it taunts/flamethrowers I switch to Ttar and pursuit. Sometimes Azelf gives me Colbur berries which saves me from pursuits and I get to keep Froslass.

- Aerodactyl: This guy also makes me happy. Similar to Azelf, I trick as it SRs, I get Spikes as it switches. If it taunts, I 2hko with Ice Beam. If it Rock Slides, I switch to Breloom who gets behind a sub and takes down Aerodactyl if it decides to stay. Or I could go to Jirachi and keep Aerodactyl from switching in alot earlier in the match.
- Swampert: Trick this guy on SR, spikes, and now hes left with two attacks hes stuck in for the rest of the match.
- Machamp: The reason why Roserade failed. So far I've been tricking this guy as it OHKO's my Froslass with payback and I switch to Breloom who sets up on it. Besides entry hazards, I get a good start with Breloom behind a sub at 100%.

-Metagross: I dont know what to call on this one. If I trick it, in the long run they have a scarf explosion running waiting in line. But I do get free spikes. Unless they Meteor Mash, then I get on my own metagross and trick(?). This would be a time where I miss my heatran, but darn those Infernape. EDIT: Normally I encounter Metagross who BP for 70% but today I ran into a 100% BP. early 5-6 with nothing down. CB?

- Jirachi: Another time where I miss heatran. I can destiny bond here hoping it will iron head me. Usually I switch Gyara in and DD.

- Infernape: Trick on flamethrower/SR. Flamethrower: Switch to Snorlax and Sub. SR: Spikes.

- Ninjask: If they protect I gave them an extra turn. If they go straight to sub, I get the head-start on things.

-Roserade: Trick the sleep powder and switch to Jirachi for early SR.

- Hippowdon: Trick the SR and they're left with EQ/Stone Edge or Ice Fang
- Tyranitar(?): Never really faced a real leadtar, I think I'd Trick their Lum berry off and go to Breloom?

- Heatran: Trick the SR. If they go for the attack I get Snorlax behind a sub.

- Smeargle(?): Haven't faced many. Looking at the first set, I think I'd Trick and use Froslass as the sleep fodder. If it turns out to be another scarf user, go to Metagross and trick that switch in.

- Uxie(?): Haven't faced many. Looking at the first set, I'll trick. Another scarf makes me go Jirachi

- Starmie: Trick, switch to Snorlax and Sub if its a surf. I dont have any problems with it coming back to ruin Gyarados sweep because Snorlax takes it pretty well.
__________________________________________________ ______________
@ Choice Scarf
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spe/4 SpD
Jolly
- Iron Head
- Zen Headbutt
- Thunder Punch
- Stealth Rock
Replacement recommended by Aqueos, and a good replacement it is. No trick here to have another room for revenge killing, and to keep the scarf for that reason being. Added a now seemingly obvious Thunder Punch over Ice Punch in order to get them Bulky Waters out of Gyarados' way. Love the hax with this guy. I was recommended to throw trick over Zen Headbutt, but as it stands I'm not very convinced. Takes care of Infernape's with Thunder Punch/ Stone Edge trying to ruin my fun ):


Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 236 HP/248 Def/24 Spe
Impish
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Focus Punch
- Spore
I like sending this guy early, especially on Gyarados/ Kingdra think they can sweep. This guy also gets in by Froslass's tricks. Zapdos's like coming in on Breloom, but I leech seed them, switch to Snorlax, and sub.


Snorlax @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk/ 252 SpD/ 4 HP
Brave
- Substitute
- Body Slam
- Earthquake
- Crunch
I like this Snorlax. The EV's are for Special Attackers sent in on Breloom and Snorlax benefits from the Leech Seed more. Brave(+atk, -spe) gives me a pokemon to go to on trick room teams(slowbro, slowking, dusknoir, rampardos). I like substitute because it doesn't give ghosts a free switch if i decide to body slam, same with earthquake. Another thing about substitute snorlax is that it can turn 49.9% into 25%, which saves alot of HP.


Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spe/4 SpD
Adamant
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
Previously a bulky Gyarados has turned into the Offensive Gyarados, due to my playstyle with him saving it for late-game. As for the moveset, I don't like Stone Edge's 80% accuracy, but maybe people will convince me otherwise.


Tyranitar @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 4 HP/ 252 Atk/ 252 Spe
Adamant
- Dragon Dance
- Stone Edge
- Crunch
- Fire Punch
Thanks Faladran for recommending the DDTar. It replaced a Tyranitar who's sole goal in life was to make Brelooms everywhere sad for switching in. This set still completes the goal of finishing Breloom switch ins, OHKOing the Spore Puncher and doing a minimum of 93% on SubSeeder Breloom. I went with Adamant because I'm content with switching to Snorlax once Starmie comes.

Grats me on a good team, switch pokes, switch sets, everything. thanks :D

[Fisherman JP]

bump
Rate please? ):

[Rediamond]

If you notice problems have arose in several areas because Heatran's gone, why not bring it back? The lack of a solid revenge killer hurts, and a scarf Flygon might be able to fill the role of an Infernape killer. I have no idea what to sub it for, and I really don't have time for a full rate now. I might post more later.

[Fisherman JP]

Thanks rediamond, the old heatran was a lead set btw. I really hope you get to a full rate later.

EDIT: Just had troubles with skarmory ): miss you heatran, but who do i give the boot )<

Found myself a threat:

Celebiiiiii +2 Bulky gyara cant 2hko with stone edge ):, and it has thunderwave .____.
my tyranitar does 28% if it stays in and it does 53% w/ grass knot

gonna try 252/252 gyara with DD/waterfall/eq/icefang

[Aqueos]

Well, this is a pretty good team. Despite your attempts to patch up your infernape weakness it still stands. Sd ape with closecombat and stone edge/thunderpunch can run through you whole team. Nasty plot ape with the odd hp electric or grass know can sweep your team easily as gyrados always faints with sr in play, and fire blast will do a wopping 50% besides. Focus blast kos snorlax despite its investment. Luckily it is likely infernape will miss a focus blast but it could do some major damage. In order to remedy this you could switch you choice scarf metagross to a choice scarf jirachi with zen headbutt. Jirachi has all the features metagross had except explosion, and is much faster and capable of revenging many more threats. It can also run SR and trick if needbe. Flygon is another solid option but it changes your team around much more than jirachi. I don't know quite what to make of snorlax though, but I know it should be able to do a lot of damage and sponge special hits well.EDIT do not trick tyranitar, you should probably run for your life and avoid the stone edge/payback that will kill froslass.

[Fisherman JP]

Thank you Aqueos, Jirachi sounds like a great addition to the team. So do most TTar Leads lack pursuit? x:

EDIT: Not addition, replacement*

Keep the ratings coming guys I really appreciate it :3

[Aqueos]

Lead t-tar apparently got deleted..... However old fashioned lead t-tars did not. The only sets that run pursuit are scarf, and a lure tar, but the lure really shouldn't be used as a lead. The old lead tar set did not have pursuit though. So pretty much it depends on what your opponent is leading with. EDIT Pursuit probably would only be used to trap azelf which is a decent reason. EDIT However t-tar does not always do enough to kill even the standard with an unboosted pursuit in one hit so its kinda useless.

[Fisherman JP]

Thanks again Aqueos, what do you think of Changing Bulky Gyarados into Offensive Gyarados?

[Aqueos]

Well, its a good set. Dragonite does a similar job and has better attack, but gyara has better stab You could run the semi gimmicky move bounce. It does a lot to celebi, but it has 1 drawback (other than accuracy) you should know about. If your gyarados get fully paralyzed in the air, it will be unable to do anything for the rest if the time its in and will be unable to switch in.(this is a shoddy glitch) So if you can help it DON"T use bounce when your paralyzed unless you MUST use it. Ice fang is bit meh as it doesn't do much. I think gyara will do a better job late game with an offensive set. Try not to reveal it until late game so the opponent doesn't know its coming. by the way this is the best first post rmt I've ever read format wise.

[Fisherman JP]

Thanks, I had a tab looking at the RMT Enclose, Murcielago! and I dragged the lead pics to mine, lol. I felt that if i made it look better I'd get more rates. -stare-

[Aqueos]

It seems people who have no idea get more rates because it is so much easier to fix a badly made team as it is so out of balance it is much easier to improve without making major suggestions. (changing 2 3 pokes) If your tricking machamp you could just get rid of it with destiny bond, if you want, but subbing with breloom puts you at an advantage. Do what you will.

[Fisherman JP]

Thanks for the immediate responses and compliments Aqueos, these back and forth posts really help.

EDIT: Removed Metagross with Jirachi

Also, which elemental punch fills more holes or depressions in my team?

[Rediamond]

Hi, I'm rushed again, and Aqueos covered most things, but I can answer the last two questions.
If the point of the team is a Gyra sweep, by all means use Offensive Gyra. If you insist on using him earlier then late game, keep bulky. If you go with offensive, Gyra will hate Bulky waters. In that case, Tpunch is the best. Ipunch has nice coverage, but really only use it if you hate Gliscor. Fpunch eliminates steels, which your team doesen't really seem to have trouble with.
Hope I could help, GL.

[Faladran]

Notable Threats

• Infernape

Despite the fact that you're running Gyarados, opposing Infernape can currently sweep this team rather easily, considering many now use Thunderpunch or Stone Edge in their moveslots.

• Taunt Gyarados

Gyarados, especially varieties that use Stone Edge, are able to cause quite a lot of damage to your team. Many of your team members are shut down by Taunt, while a +1 Gyarados deals large damage to your team overall. Fortunately, Gyarados weaknesses are quite easily fixed.

Suggestions

• Use Thunderpunch on Jirachi

Ice Punch is generally inferior to Thunderpunch on Scarf Jirachi sets, so I'd recommend you make the change. This will also fix up your problems with Gyarados, giving you an easy way to revenge kill them after a Dragon Dance. I assume Zen Headbutt is there to hit Machamp, but I feel that Trick would be a much better option over it, depending on how much you need it. Trick is an all-around great move to have for crippling bulky stat-uppers and stall teams.

• Try DDTar over your current set

I'm not sure if the Tyranitar set you're currently running is necessary. The unique thing about this team is that you're making use of all standard sets. While the creativity is great, this approach works best when mixed with a few standard sets as well. This way, opponents will be kept guessing as to what you're using, rather than starting to expect "gimmicks."

The Tyranitar set that's currently on this team functions as a lure to Pokemon such as Scizor and Skarmory. Since your Gyarados already deals well with these two threats, I feel that using a standard Dragon Dance Tyranitar with Fire Punch to combat Steel-types would be more beneficial to your team, and give you some extra sweeping potential as well. Here is the set:

Tyranitar (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Stream
Jolly nature (+Spe, -SpA)
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
-Dragon Dance
-Stone Edge
-Crunch
-Fire Punch

Jolly is needed to outspeed threats such as Starmie and Azelf after a Dragon Dance. Stone Edge and Crunch provide solid dual STAB attacks, and Fire Punch gives you good coverage against opposing Steel-types.


Good luck with your team!

[Fisherman JP]

Skarmory likes coming in on Snorlax, and sets up on me. Don't ask me to drop sub, 'cause sub is cool.

EDIT:
Need to read Faladran's post 'cause I was typing this up when he posted the wall of text.

Faladran, Rediamond I'll throw thunder punch over ice punch.

Also, Faladran, the Zen Headbutt was for revenge killing Infernape. I guess I haven't ran into THAT stall team that will persuade me to use trick, so I'm not very convinced.

Also, I'll try the DDTar Set as soon as I can.

Thanks for posting Rediamond and Faladran.

Oh man, fixed the first post with the new sets. hope you read the more recent team over the initial team.

[SlottedPig]

252 hp evs over spA on froslass (ProLass) lets you take a machamp's payback as you trick it, outspeed it even with it's scarf, and set up a spikes. plus on your lead analysis i don't see you using ice beam very often.

edit: i dont see why your using mixed tar.. all the things it lures in and beats, Taunt Gyara beats anyway! scarfgar will solve your infernape problems - it revenges it brilliantly and even if it switches, spikes + sr + sandstream + life orb is killing it soon. this allows you to use something over zen headbutt on jirachi (Trick, U-Turn, Body Slam, even Wish), and speaking of which, i definitely recommend tpunch > ice punch. you already have frossy for dnite and scarftar is fast enough to kill those slowass dnites that use like 200 speed evs and adamant nature.

[Fisherman JP]

Uhh ThePowerWithin, thank you for your time to calculate the 252 HP evs because it's true, I really don't use ice beam all that often and if I get taunted I switch anyways, if only I had realized that sooner. As for ScarfTar, I think I'm going to try out Faladran's recommendation for a DDTar first to take advantage of the free switches Froslass provides. The compliment ScarfTar has with Jirachi is nice though, paralyzing switchins on Jirachi sounds great.

EDIT:
Uh I put in the calculations and Machamp does OHKO with Payback, even with the EVs.

SOOOOOO I am going to be using 152 HP/100 SpA/ 252 Spe/4 Def just for a OHKO on all dragonites except the Support and the Cleric Dancer.