Zoroark

[Luigi player]

Originally Posted by Fat DraggonKnight

I was thinking about running the Nasty Plot set while hiding behind Gengar. The most common attacks to a Gengar are Psychic, Dark, and Ghost. Zoroark resists 2 and is immune to one. No idiot would explode on a Gengar, so he's safe from exploding leads too. Also, his two weaknesses, Bug and Fighting, deal 0.25 and 0 times damage to Gengar, so he'd be pretty well covered....

I had exactly the same idea xD

It didn't work out too well though, but maybe because I was just stupid and put a choice specs on it... I wanted to have enough power so that he can really KO the surprised Pokes, but it was a dumb idea, because the enemy will of course switch to something that won't get too much damage from your attacks.

(I didn't use nasty plot because Zoroark isn't safe from scarfers and priority users, there's so many of them ~_~)

Another thing that helps him is Gengar and Zoroark both use Focus Blast. Too bad it always misses though lol.

[BurningMan]

Originally Posted by Fat Luigi player

I had exactly the same idea xD

It didn't work out too well though, but maybe because I was just stupid and put a choice specs on it... I wanted to have enough power so that he can really KO the surprised Pokes, but it was a dumb idea, because the enemy will of course switch to something that won't get too much damage from your attacks.

(I didn't use nasty plot because Zoroark isn't safe from scarfers and priority users, there's so many of them ~_~)

Another thing that helps him is Gengar and Zoroark both use Focus Blast. Too bad it always misses though lol.

using a Specs on him is imo not dumb.
I really think this could be his best set, because he just dont gets the Bulk to set up Nasty Plots and Sweep especially with Priority being so common.
he should use his disguise to fire off one or two strong attacks and get out after that and continue playing mind games with your opponent because everytime i see something uncommon using Nasty Plot i already know its high likely Zoroark so i just would switch in Something like Breloom or Ropushin to easily revenge/counter him.
Sure he easily gets up an NP but usually thats it, he should be used to soften up/KO the counters of some of your pokemon so they can sweep easier not trying to set up a sweep by itself that is almost imposible to pull off atm and is almost completly outclassed by Darkrai.

[PlatinumDude]

I think that a good idea to fool your opponent into thinking that you're not using Zoroark in the lead slot (if you are using Zoroark in the lead slot) is that the last Pokemon in your team could share 1 or 2 moves that Zoroark has (or the last Pokemon in your team is one that is known to use Substitute frequently).

[ungulateman]

PlatinumDude, way to point out the obvious there. We've been talking about that for pretty much the last several pages.

[Garchomper16]

lol, yeah, kinda

so...who has constructed a team AROUND zoroarks ability and wants to share?

[cosmicexplorer]

I know this is pretty late, but Gengar doesn't get nasty plot, so Zoroark can't imitate it while using Nasty Plot.

[Scarlet Spyder]

I think imitating Dragons is neat because they often lure in steel types (Nattorei) and you can easily destroy the switch-in with Flamethrower/Focus Blast. Also, Psychic imitations are great for setting, as people may think you're Pursuit-weak.

[PlatinumDude]

Originally Posted by Fat ungulateman

PlatinumDude, way to point out the obvious there. We've been talking about that for pretty much the last several pages.

I haven't been on this thread for long. >.>

I'm a bit lazy to go back into the thread, but would Pursuit be a good choice in the Choice Scarf set?

[Granstafer]

Originally Posted by Fat PlatinumDude

I haven't been on this thread for long. >.>

I'm a bit lazy to go back into the thread, but would Pursuit be a good choice in the Choice Scarf set?

It wouldn't do you much good. considering zoro's revenge killing abilities come from its sp. atk, you would have to lose some ev's in sp. atk to actually make pursuit viable. additionally, you wouldn't have much room. leave the pursuit using to T-tar.

[ungulateman]

@Garchomper:

My team relies on Zoroark removing bulky Waters and fast Ghost-types so that my real Infernape can sweep, Scizor can U-Turn everything to death, or Breloom can Technician his way to victory. It's fairly effective except against very well-played weather teams.

[Sharpedo]

Since Gengar doesn't get Nasty plot, it'll probably play out something like this:

FIRST TURN
"Gengar" uses Nasty Plot
Opponent uses lead move.
Opponent thinks "HMMmm... Gengars don't have nasty plot, this must be a Zoroark!"

SECOND TURN
Opponent switches to a suitable counter
Zoroark uses Nasty Plot

THIRD TURN
Zoroak ruins opponents team with +4 special attacks that will tear through anything and everything

[Immaterial]

FIRST TURN
"Gengar" uses Nasty Plot
Opponent uses lead move.
Opponent thinks "HMMmm... Gengars don't have nasty plot, this must be a Zoroark!"

SECOND TURN
Opponent switches to a suitable counter
Zoroark uses Nasty Plot

THIRD TURN
Zoroak ruins opponents team with +4 special attacks that will tear through anything and everything

So... how come the opponent's lead isn't OHKOing? How is Zoroark getting through this "suitable counter"? Does the opponent have no other counters? What about Ditto? What if the opponent has a MH/fast Taunt lead? Etc, etc.

I've actually had someone come in on my Mach Punch-locked Breloom with a Zoroark disguised as a Gengar. I fell for it, of course. :( Still, it's a pretty good disguise for Zoroark. It doesn't necessarily have to imitate the moves of the 'mon it's currently disguised as. The typing is much more important.

[Jaroda]

Here is what I've been experimenting with. Zoroark@Life Orb + Spe/- Spd nature 252 Spe/252 Spa/4 At Focus Blast Flamethrower Dark Pulse Sucker PunchLet me tell you, the Sucker Punch is a life saver for scarf pokemon, and remember he has a base 105 At which is perfectly usable, thus I didn:t go with a Modest nature, plus it gets stab. So for the pokemon that switch into my attacks and happen to be faster, like Gengar, Infernape, Espeon, Starmie etc, Sucker Punch can keep you in the game for another round.The only problem with this set is if you manage to get attacks off and leave, your Life Orb singles you out as the Zoroark again. So I'm trying to think of a better item. Right now I'm having him imitate a Gengar that uses Choice Specs. I'm thinkg about switching the items around for better covert.
pardon the format. This computer wont let me use Return for paragraphs.

[Rackham]

Imo, zoroark's main use should be to lure out counters to your sweeper, and then to destroy it appropriately, allowing it to sweep. Luckily, once this has been achieved zoroark can still make use of himself and sweep due to his high sp. attack and speed. Other ideas tend to be alot less reliable at doing their job, wheras this basically just lets your sweeper sweep and works most of the time.

[Neutral777]

Originally Posted by Fat Scarlet Spyder

I think imitating Dragons is neat because they often lure in steel types (Nattorei) and you can easily destroy the switch-in with Flamethrower/Focus Blast. Also, Psychic imitations are great for setting, as people may think you're Pursuit-weak.

This.

I've raged all night because I am thinking "Oh, this guy will surely Outrage." I know several dragons carry a fire-attack for the obvious Steel-type check but Zoroark is the leading cause of my losses anyway. :[

Even when I figure it out, they've got free set-up as part of the deal.

I love the added mind games this thing can play.

[Isam]

OK, I haven't seen one yet, so, would someone be so kind as to post an anti-lead along with a scary lead for him to imitate?

[cosmicexplorer]

Would something like this work?

Zoroark@Life Orb/Focus Sash
Naive, 100 Atk, 152 SpA, 252 Spe (these EVs and Nature need to be tweaked, this is just off the top of my head)
-Sucker Punch
-Flamethrower/U-turn
-Focus Blast/U-turn
-Dark Pulse/Night Burst

And that could really be paired with any lead that hates dark/ghost moves or Taunt. As they Taunt you, attack, and Sucker Punch to KO next turn. I don't know whether Life Orb is necessary, but Focus Sash does let you always live a hit and is worth consideration, at the very least. U-turn lets you switch out but you do lose some vital coverage. It can also learn Taunt and Night Slash, both of which could work well, stopping hazards and giving it some nice physical STAB. Keep in mind that this is theorymonned out of nothing, so any criticism is welcome.

[Isam]

Originally Posted by Fat cosmicexplorer

Would something like this work?

Zoroark@Life Orb/Focus Sash
Naive, 100 Atk, 152 SpA, 252 Spe (these EVs and Nature need to be tweaked, this is just off the top of my head)
-Sucker Punch
-Flamethrower/U-turn
-Focus Blast/U-turn
-Dark Pulse/Night Burst

And that could really be paired with any lead that hates dark/ghost moves or Taunt. As they Taunt you, attack, and Sucker Punch to KO next turn. I don't know whether Life Orb is necessary, but Focus Sash does let you always live a hit and is worth consideration, at the very least. U-turn lets you switch out but you do lose some vital coverage. It can also learn Taunt and Night Slash, both of which could work well, stopping hazards and giving it some nice physical STAB. Keep in mind that this is theorymonned out of nothing, so any criticism is welcome.

Ya, this set looks great to me. I'm probably gonna throw Taunt in on the last slot though, but I'm not sure yet. Thanks!

[Dracolosse]

TURN n
- X sent out Ononokus.
- Y switched in Skarmory.
- Ononokus used Swords Dance.
Ononokus's attack was sharply raised.

TURN n+1
- Ononokus used Flamethrower.
Skarmory lost 100 % of its health.
Y's Skarmory fainted.

[...]

TURN n+8
- Ononokus used Dragon Dance.
Ononokus's Attack was raised.
Ononokus's Speed was raised.

Y has left the room. X wins!



THIS is going to be the true purpose of Zoroark.

[Leman]

Originally Posted by Fat cosmicexplorer

Would something like this work?

Zoroark@Life Orb/Focus Sash
Naive, 100 Atk, 152 SpA, 252 Spe (these EVs and Nature need to be tweaked, this is just off the top of my head)
-Sucker Punch
-Flamethrower/U-turn
-Focus Blast/U-turn
-Dark Pulse/Night Burst

And that could really be paired with any lead that hates dark/ghost moves or Taunt. As they Taunt you, attack, and Sucker Punch to KO next turn. I don't know whether Life Orb is necessary, but Focus Sash does let you always live a hit and is worth consideration, at the very least. U-turn lets you switch out but you do lose some vital coverage. It can also learn Taunt and Night Slash, both of which could work well, stopping hazards and giving it some nice physical STAB. Keep in mind that this is theorymonned out of nothing, so any criticism is welcome.

I used a similar set which was something like 216 Atk/ 40 SAtk / 252 Spd Hasty Sucker Punch/Taunt/Flamethrower/U-turn disguised as Gliscor, and it worked decently, being able to catch faster special attackers/Steels off gaurd and keep the illusion going with Taunt/U-turn. I found it too weak and too frail overall, and disliked the fact that after the first or so kill, you don't really get any more. I think I would just stick to NP unless Darkrai drops.

[Tleilax]

I don't like the idea of a lead Zoroark. Why waste the chance for mind games later, when it can make a bigger impact. As has been said, his best bet is to fake that you are a sweeper, preferably something with Nasty Plot, and try to set up. Something like Infernape or Azelf would work well with it. They don't bring in the same counter as Zoroark, and they will not be tipped off by the Nasty Plot. You kill it, and you have removed their number one counter for your sweeper.

To be fair, I have not played on PO yet, so I could be off base, but using it as a lead seems to be wasting it's potential.

[SJCrew]

You can also pose as a wall to get a free switch for setup. No one's going to stay in on something that walls their sweeper.

[Dracolosse]

Originally Posted by Fat SJCrew

You can also pose as a wall to get a free switch for setup. No one's going to stay in on something that walls their sweeper.

It is highly unlikely that you will even have the perfect pokemon to wall your opponent's sweeper given the number of threats this gen, and that this wall is exactly in the right spot in your party (2nd pokemon I think) for Zoroark to copy it.

[ZeroHP]

Sorry, I couldn't read 10 pages...
it's too long.
So,can you tell me about this new illusion ability?
Is the ability copied as well? (In case it's Azumarill, or medicham...)
What about the item?
Does he keep his own moves?
How about stats?
Are Name / Nickname / The ball it was captured with, copied?
What happens if Zoroark is my only pokemon?
Does Stealth rock make the illusion fade? how about burn? spikes? Substitute? Poison damage? weather? (or is it depend on %'s of health?)

After you answer these question, it will be better if you sum it up in the first page... Sorry if I missed it, but I really couldn't find the answers.

[ungulateman]

Originally Posted by Fat ZeroHP

Sorry, I couldn't read 10 pages...
it's too long.
So,can you tell me about this new illusion ability?
You assume the appearance and name of the last Pokemon in your team.
Is the ability copied as well? (In case it's Azumarill, or medicham...)
No.
What about the item?
No.
Does he keep his own moves?
Yes.
How about stats?
Keeps his own.
Are Name / Nickname / The ball it was captured with, copied?
Yes.
What happens if Zoroark is my only pokemon?
It appears as Zoroark.
Does Stealth rock make the illusion fade? how about burn? spikes? Substitute? Poison damage? weather? (or is it depend on %'s of health?)
No. Only direct attacks from what I've seen playing with it.

After you answer these question, it will be better if you sum it up in the first page... Sorry if I missed it, but I really couldn't find the answers.

Thought I'd summarise for you.