Salamence

[JSND]

i wonder why everyone forget mence.
When i use its mixed set, its not as massive as say gen 4 mence, but mixmence is still darned effective altogether.
Meaybe the number of terakion cause these ?

[jrrrrrrr]

Originally Posted by Fat JSND

i wonder why everyone forget mence.

Salamence is really outclassed in a metagame full of Dragons who aren't weak to SR and Sandstorm. There really isn't much reason to use Mence when you can use Latios, Latias, Garchomp...even Dragonite is giving it some legitimate competition this gen with Hurricane, ExtremeSpeed and MultiScale.

That's not even getting into the troll Speed tiers making 100 base Speed not as impressive anymore. Landorus, Voltolos, Terakion, Doryuuzu in Sand, Swift Swim users (before the recent ban)....BW added a ton of revenge killers for Salamence that weren't around in gen 4

I doubt Mence will ever become UU but it lost quite a bit this generation because of how powerful everything else is.

[Dr. Alex]

Mence this gen isn't good enough to be banned like it was at the end of last gen, but he'll still be a huge force in the OU game.

Mixed Salamence w/life orb is the way to go

[TM13IceBeam]

Originally Posted by Fat Dr. Alex

Mence this gen isn't good enough to be banned like it was at the end of last gen, but he'll still be a huge force in the OU game.

Mixed Salamence w/life orb is the way to go

IIRC Mence was banned because Latias was banned, and Latias was its best check.

Although the Dragon-banning spree only started because some idiot at GF thought that putting an Outrage move tutor would be kewl 4 all.

[Mario With Lasers]

Originally Posted by Fat TM13IceBeam

IIRC Mence was banned because Latias was banned, and Latias was its best check.

Although the Dragon-banning spree only started because some idiot at GF thought that putting an Outrage move tutor would be kewl 4 all.

The Outrage tutor only really affected Salamence, as Garchomp already learned it (and had been banned a month before Platinum) and... well, the Lati would be banned anyway. Lol Outrage Latias.

[Destiny Warrior]

With Salamence getting a big kick, I wonder if its possible that it might be UU for a single phase...

Wishful thinking I guess.

[TM13IceBeam]

Originally Posted by Fat Destiny Warrior

With Salamence getting a big kick, I wonder if its possible that it might be UU for a single phase...

Wishful thinking I guess.

I think they are gonna suspect test it immediately if it drops, then kick it to BL after 1 month.

tldr: too broken for UU

[Synth_Metal]

Salamence will remain in OU, since garchomp and Scarf Sazandora are more common in this gen

[Gairyuki789]

Originally Posted by Fat Thorhammer

The Attack boost of DD is only for one attack, but the Speed boost isn't.

Besides, most of the time, Outrage is the only attack you need.

what kind of ev spread would you use for such a mence?

[jrrrrrrr]

Originally Posted by Fat TM13IceBeam

I think they are gonna suspect test it immediately if it drops, then kick it to BL after 1 month.

tldr: too broken for UU

I don't know, with the way things are shaping up in BW, the UU tier is going to look nothing like that of gen4. We're talking things like Infernape, Latias, Gyarados, Lucario, Mamoswine, Kyuremu, Abomasnow, Metagross, Swampert, Flygon.....a whole lot of legitimate OU threats are going to be UU at first just because of the sheer volume of pokemon available. I wouldn't start making predictions about UU/BL yet, we don't even have usage stats yet =\

[Vp-Grim]

Excuse my language, but HOLY FUCK!
THAT'S ONE OP POKEMON!

[TM13IceBeam]

Nobody excuses language, you are free to curse and swear but no flames because Smogon lacks fire extinguishers or water-types.

Anyway UU is relatively volatile right now. I'm merely stating my opinion in the event that Mence is dropped from OU. In order to get banned from UU you need to either be used a lot in OU, or get yourself banned. >_>

[JSND]

Originally Posted by Fat jrrrrrrr

I don't know, with the way things are shaping up in BW, the UU tier is going to look nothing like that of gen4. We're talking things like Infernape, Latias, Gyarados, Lucario, Mamoswine, Kyuremu, Abomasnow, Metagross, Swampert, Flygon.....a whole lot of legitimate OU threats are going to be UU at first just because of the sheer volume of pokemon available. I wouldn't start making predictions about UU/BL yet, we don't even have usage stats yet =\

gyara is still OU imo. but the rest cant help it. I mean, with something as insane as say Golurk, DW variants OR not in UU i cant see why wont something insane like luke(at least last gen) becoming UU soon.

Also BW meta tend to develop crucial changes in one night in a sudden. Look at Tornadus/Torneros(now a top threat previously bashed for its outclassed crap), Virizion(Cm virizion is now a game changing set while previously no one want to use this guy). so theres till hope

[Darusare]

Mence did lose a lot this gen
but he definately cant go to uu
hes going to be in BL with a bunch of others
probably snorlax, lucario, .... gen 4 threats
it will kind of be like gen 3 where BL was massive

EDIT though i did just think if theres an outrage tutor again
with his dream world ability it would be ridiculous[FONT=Verdana][/FONT]

[Poppy]

You're missing 100 EVs in the OP set, I think 3, or at least 2 sets should be up there, rather than a bunch of slashes, it's simply too confusing. I do believe that salamence has a lot potential this generation, overconfidence is a great ability, but the loss of outrage is FML.

Furthermore, I believe a very effective tank set can be used, with max hp, enough speed to outrun max speed tyranitar (there are other benchmarks, but that is the one I use), and a Bold nature (if you use flamethrower, dragon claw can also be used), with the rest of EVs in defense.

Salamence @ Leftovers, Intimidate 252 HP, choice of speed benchmark (may choose to run timid/jolly/naive), and with the rest in defense.
Flamethrower/Dragon Claw
Roost
Dragon Tail
Substitute / Dragon Claw / Substitute (not entirely sure about this last slot, but I personally use sub)

[Thorhammer]

Originally Posted by Fat Darusare

Mence did lose a lot this gen
but he definately cant go to uu
hes going to be in BL with a bunch of others
probably snorlax, lucario, .... gen 4 threats
it will kind of be like gen 3 where BL was massive

EDIT though i did just think if theres an outrage tutor again
with his dream world ability it would be ridiculous[FONT=Verdana][/FONT]

Gen 3 BL was massive because no one bothered limiting it to what actually needed to be there. If Pokemon like Salamence and Lucairo wind up in Gen 5 UU - and it seems likely that they will - they'll most likely balance each other out, like the Pokemon in Gen 4 UU did when BL was purged, and result in a metagame that mixes aspects of Gen 4 OU, Gen 4 UU, and various new Pokemon and strategies from Gen 5.

[min min]

The thing is that with good Dragons in UU we need good steels to take the hit. And good steels that can safely take down Dragons are already looking to be solid OU (see: Jirachi, BalloonTran, Nattorei, Skarmory) because of their general awesomeness out of countering Dragons.

So that leaves the inferior steels like the ant thing which has crap special defence, and Aggron, who also has crap special defence. Send in a SpecsMence with Draco Meteor and you're quite set.

Also, Flygon's Draco Meteors don't count.

[Mario With Lasers]

Originally Posted by Fat min min

The thing is that with good Dragons in UU we need good steels to take the hit. And good steels that can safely take down Dragons are already looking to be solid OU (see: Jirachi, BalloonTran, Nattorei, Skarmory) because of their general awesomeness out of countering Dragons.

So that leaves the inferior steels like the ant thing which has crap special defence, and Aggron, who also has crap special defence. Send in a SpecsMence with Draco Meteor and you're quite set.

Also, Flygon's Draco Meteors don't count.

Escavalier, Registeel, huhhh Empoleon, maybe Forretress...


Ok but that's irrelevant we won't have UU for a long time so how about we don't try to theorymon it if we may end up with shit like Flygon NU, Sharpedo BL and Salamence losing to Raikou or whatever anyway.

[TM13IceBeam]

At least the ant thing can run Truant Befrie-*shot*

Aggron has Sturdy and Metal Burst, so eating Draco Meteors should be no prob for him, although any hazards kill him, really.

[Raikaria]

Just a suggestion, there aren't *that* many ice moves being thrown around in Gen 5 right now, but a significant amount of Dragon moves. This could make HabanMence useful.

[TLK]

Originally Posted by Fat Raikaria

Just a suggestion, there aren't *that* many ice moves being thrown around in Gen 5 right now, but a significant amount of Dragon moves. This could make HabanMence useful.

The problem is that the Dragon moves getting thrown about are usually Draco Meteor/Outrage from 130+ attack Pokemon like Garcomp and Latios. Mence also isn't as bulky as something like Garchomp that can take a dragon move with Haban.

I dread the thought of a UU with Mence and Ono running about as Dragon Dance partners. Mence would probably last as long in UU as Inconsistent did in OU :P

[CWW]

*shrug*

I still think Mence is a fantastic hit and run pokemon thanks to Intimidate and stellar Atk and SpA. Double Intimidate is fantastic to have on a team.

[MASTER-]

Originally Posted by Fat CWW

*shrug*

I still think Mence is a fantastic hit and run pokemon thanks to Intimidate and stellar Atk and SpA. Double Intimidate is fantastic to have on a team.

Agreed. i love using double intimi. Sally will always be OU . no matter what happens.

[shrang]

Originally Posted by Fat Merii

Agreed. i love using double intimi. Sally will always be OU . no matter what happens.

Hitmontop + Salamence is a great combo. Hitmontop can Rapid Spin away SR for Mence, while both can do a double Intimidate to make Doryuuzu completely useless. Basically:

Player 1 switched in Salamence!
Intimidate lowered Doryuuzu's Attack!
Doryuuzu used Swords Dance!
Doryuuzu's Attack sharply rose!
Player 2 switched in Hitmontop!
Intimidate lowered Doryuuzu's Attack!
+0 Rock Slide does jack shit!

[sax king]

This is a very effective mence set I've used, taken from an old RMT. Mence can fill a defensive role quite well. Here it is:

Originally Posted by Fat sax king

El Dragón (Salamence) (M) @
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 240 SAtk / 16 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Roost
- Dragon Tail
- Flamethrower
- Hydro Pump / Draco Meteor
This is my own, custom Salamence. The idea of it is to counter common pokemon while still being a threat and to be bulky enough to sponge hits and heal. Now, someone is going to say "WTF WHERE'S OUTRAGE AND DRAGON DANCE?!" I understand that Salamence gets both of those moves, but I think this Salamence suits the team better. Intimidate is incredibly useful and forces many switches. The switch in gets hit with Stealth Rock and multiple layers of Spikes, as well as a STAB Dragon Tail. Then the new, unwanted pokemon comes in and is hit by multiple layers of hazards. The damage starts to rack up quickly. Flamethrower is standard on Salamence for its ability to hit Ice, Grass (Breloom, Nattorei), and Steels hard. Hydro Pump is an often overlooked move on Salamence, but it is needed on my team for pokemon like Hippowdon, Blaziken, and Infernape. The EVs and nature are unusual. Max HP is for maximum bulk, and the 16 Speed EVs are to outspeed max speed Adamant Breloom. The rest is dumped into SAtk for a more powerful Flamethrower and Hydro Pump. Draco Meteor can be used over Hydro Pump as strong STAB, but I like Hydro Pump because Salamence tends to lure out pokemon like Heatran and Hippowdon. I understand tha a Modest Nature makes Dragon Tail less powerful, but Salamence has a base 135 Atk. Dragon Tail is still immensely powerful. I would like some help with the spread of this pokemon, though. I was considering Garchomp, but I liked Intimidate more so I chose Salamence.